'Who created God' is an Illogical Question!

[gasgas]

Ndugu yangu nadhani umekosea kidogo hapo juu.Mungu sio kiumbe? He is a Being that why akatuumba kwa mfano wake(Nukuu ya kidini).

Unajua maana ya being?
Being maana yake ni "existence/uwepo"
maana yake siyo "kiumbe"
kiumbe ni "creation/creature"

Naomba upitie dictionary yako kuconfirm hili

So God exists si ndio, he is a being, He is a Spiritual being

Akatuumba sisi kwa mfano wake that means na sisi akatuumba in a spiritual being na akatupa na physical being

Spiritual being (man) + His physical body = Human Being

Na ndipo akamweka duniani

 

[gasgas]

Kama Assumption yangu haina uzito wowote,
basi na assumption yako ya dunia imeumbwa na mungu haina uzito wowote

Mimi nna reference, my reference is the bible
Na it is reference inayotumika na millions tunapomuongelea Mungu

Wewe assumption yako umeitoa kichwani mwako, i.e mawazo yako binafsi ambayo wewe peke yako ndiyo unayabeba, wewe peke yako ndiyo unayafahamu na wewe peke yako ndiyo unayaacknowledge kuwa ni sahihi kulingana na utashi wako


You see my point there?

 

[Iceman 3D]

If i may ask,
is evolution a continuous process?
Mbona haiendelei, what happened?
Why don't we see other species continually changing and adapting to different life forms?

Evolution si kitu cha siku moja ujue, lakini ni kitu endelevu. Ukiweza kuishi mpaka miaka elfu 50 ijayo ni ngumu kukuta watu wa miaka hiyo wana characters kama zetu kwenye kila kitu.
Dunia ina miaka takriban bilion 4 na nusu, hakuna binadamu ambaye aliishi akajikuta moja kwa majo yuko tofaut na wengine, mfano homo habils aliish miaka takriban milion 3 iliyo pita, kuna homo nienderthal aliishi miaka elfu 40 iliyo pita, kwa hiyo ili kutokea evolutuon huchukua makumi elfu na mamilion ya miaka, mabadiliko huwa ni madogo madogo mno kwa viumbe hao kujiona
Evolution ipo kwa viumbe wengi tuu, ndio maana simba na chui na dubu wote evolution yao inatokea kwenye jamii ya paka.
Yaan ukiisoma evolution bila kuweka bias inaeleweka mkuu

 

[Iceman 3D]

Mimi nna reference, my reference is the bible
Na it is reference inayotumika na millions tunapomuongelea Mungu
Wewe assumption yako umeitoa kichwani mwako, i.e mawazo yako binafsi ambayo wewe peke yako ndiyo unayabeba, wewe peke yako ndiyo unayafahamu na wewe peke yako ndiyo unayaacknowledge kuwa ni sahihi

Kwani mkuu bible nayo si ni mawazo ya watu binafsi waliishi zamani ila wewe ndo una waamini!!?
Si walikaa binadamu kama wewe wakapanga iwepo bible, iwe ina vitabu kadhaa, isomweje!!

 

[Kiranga]

Kiranga
I found answer for the first contradiction

There's a principle in the bible that any contradiction that is within the scripture is cleared out using the bible itself
Scripture is used to provide explain scriptures. That is why we rely on more than one sentence because we read the bible as a whole to get a clear picture and these tiny bits come together and bring forth a collective message

I am way too tired to type long passages now
What i will do
I will look up these explanations and if i believe/think the same i will post them Alright?

God's book should have no contradiction at all.

The fact that you even have a principle to resolve biblical contradictions acknowledge contradictions in the Bible.

This shows there are contradictions in the Bible.

This shows the Bible is not God's book.

Because God does not exist.

If God exists and the Bible is his book, why did God not prevent these contradictions to be in the Bible in the first place?
Isn't the Bible supposed to be his holy book?

Was God sleeping while these contradictions stacked up in the Bible?

 

[Kitombise]

Mimi nna reference, my reference is the bible
Na it is reference inayotumika na millions tunapomuongelea Mungu

Wewe assumption yako umeitoa kichwani mwako, i.e mawazo yako binafsi ambayo wewe peke yako ndiyo unayabeba, wewe peke yako ndiyo unayafahamu na wewe peke yako ndiyo unayaacknowledge kuwa ni sahihi kulingana na utashi wako


You see my point there?

Unatumiaje reference iliyojaa utata namna hiyo?

 

[gasgas]

Evolution si kitu cha siku moja ujue, lakini ni kitu endelevu. Ukiweza kuishi mpaka miaka elfu 50 ijayo ni ngumu kukuta watu wa miaka hiyo wana characters kama zetu kwenye kila kitu.
Dunia ina miaka takriban bilion 4 na nusu, hakuna binadamu ambaye aliishi akajikuta moja kwa majo yuko tofaut na wengine, mfano homo habils aliish miaka takriban milion 3 iliyo pita, kuna homo nienderthal aliishi miaka elfu 40 iliyo pita, kwa hiyo ili kutokea evolutuon huchukua makumi elfu na mamilion ya miaka, mabadiliko huwa ni madogo madogo mno kwa viumbe hao kujiona
Evolution ipo kwa viumbe wengi tuu, ndio maana simba na chui na dubu wote evolution yao inatokea kwenye jamii ya paka.
Yaan ukiisoma evolution bila kuweka bias inaeleweka mkuu

Yeah evolution is a theory ndiyo maana inaeleweka, kwa sababu a theory is inajaribu kuelezea phenomnon fulani, lakini it's not a fact(cheki comments zangu huko juu why)

Na analysts wameona kuwa theory hiyo pamoja na kuwa na Strengths zake, lakini ina weaknesses zake za kutosha

Na swali jingine, evolution is a process si ndiyo, inatokea taratibu, ndani ya hii miaka elfu mbili tungetegemea tuone badiliko hata kidogo katika form ya binadamu, just because inachukua muda mrefu hatutegemei binadamu akae hivyo hivyo kwa miaka 50,000 halafu ghafla abadilike, sijui kama unanipata

 

[Kiranga]

Basically hizo ni sheria zako on how Mungu alitakiwa aumbe ulimwengu

Mimi naona mapepo yana faida yake

Just as how adversities are important for something to grow

Kwa nini sheria ziwe hizo wakati zingeweza kuwa nzuri zaidi?
Kwa hiyo Mungu kashindwa kuumba ulimwengu ambao hauwezi kuwa na mabaya?

 

[gasgas]

Kwani mkuu bible nayo si ni mawazo ya watu binafsi waliishi zamani ila wewe ndo una waamini!!?
Si walikaa binadamu kama wewe wakapanga iwepo bible, iwe ina vitabu kadhaa, isomweje!!

Hizo ni assumptions zako mkuu
Soma Bible history,

Walioandika hawakukaa pamoja na kuanza kuandika biblia.
Waandishi wa vitabu vya biblia wapo wengi zaidi ya 40
Wengine kama Musa waliandika zamani sana thousands of years B.C, wengine waliandika decades A.D
Lakini the amazing thing ni kwamba they agree and are coherent.
Prophecy iliyotolewa na nabii wa Mungu 400 B.C inakuja kutimia 40 A.D
Na kuna baadhi ya vitu vinatimia sasa, vilikuwa revealed kwa kupitia manabii wa Mungu zamani

 

[gasgas]

Kwa nini sheria ziwe hizo wakati zingeweza kuwa nzuri zaidi?
Kwa hiyo Mungu kashindwa kuumba ulimwengu ambao hauwezi kuwa na mabaya?

Kiranga naona umerudi
Please do this, rudi kwenye the last page ulicomment and read the points that i have made since then hadi sasa

Because baadhi ya maswali unayoniuliza nilishajibu huko nyuma

Can you do that?

 

[gasgas]

Unatumiaje reference iliyojaa utata namna hiyo?

Sijui huo utata unaouzungumzia wewe uko wapi labda?

 

[Kiranga]

I would like to know your position, do you hold that God does not exist?is that your position?
I wanna have a constructive exchange on this timeless question which haunted human minds since the time of antiquity.

I have said time and time again that a God who is omnipotent, omniscient and omni benevolent could not have existed nd created this universe which permits evil.

The logic of that proposition has more holes than Swiss cheese.

The truth table of that story looks the same as that of a bad novel that employs a "deus ex machina" device for the resolution.

God does not exist, if he existed, there would be no doubt that he exists.

 

[gasgas]

God's book should have no contradiction at all.

The fact that you even have a principle to resolve biblical contradictions acknowledge contradictions in the Bible.

This shows there are contradictions in the Bible.

This shows the Bible is not God's book.

Because God does not exist.

If God exists and the Bible is his book, why did God not prevent these contradictions to be in the Bible in the first place?
Isn't the Bible supposed to be his holy book?

Was God sleeping while these contradictions stacked up in the Bible?

They are not contradictions. They are verses that ought to be expanded more

The principle is not man made it is within the bible itself 2 Timothy 3:16
We use scripture to understand scripture, that's how we read, it's not a principle we have formulated, it is there in the bible itself

Because the bible tells us how it is to be read

And they are not contradictions, they are verses that support each other to bring one common truth because the knowledge in the bible is revealed knowledge, we read and compare to obtain the revealed knowledge

And i hope you understand that they are not contradictions and they were put purposely there because we are supposed to seek diligently, we are to pursue truth and appreciate truth after searching for it with diligence

 

[gasgas]

Kwa nini sheria ziwe hizo wakati zingeweza kuwa nzuri zaidi?
Kwa hiyo Mungu kashindwa kuumba ulimwengu ambao hauwezi kuwa na mabaya?

Sheria nzuri based on what?

Definition ya sheria nzuri ipi?
Is it ile ambayo inakupendeza wewe machoni mwako?

But God is not Kiranga, he makes his own rules,
He is sovereign

Wewe unaona ulimwengu kuwa na mabaya is a big deal sana eh?
Why is that?

 

[Iceman 3D]

Yeah evolution is a theory ndiyo maana inaeleweka, kwa sababu a theory is inajaribu kuelezea phenomnon fulani, lakini it's not a fact(cheki comments zangu huko juu why)

Na analysts wameona kuwa theory hiyo pamoja na kuwa na Strengths zake, lakini ina weaknesses zake za kutosha

Na swali jingine, evolution is a process si ndiyo, inatokea taratibu, ndani ya hii miaka elfu mbili tungetegemea tuone badiliko hata kidogo katika form ya binadamu, just because inachukua muda mrefu hatutegemei binadamu akae hivyo hivyo kwa miaka 50,000 halafu ghafla abadilike, sijui kama unanipata

Vingi nilivo viona umeandika nimeona hujaijua evolution vzuri.
Mkuu ni Scientific theory, siyo theory tuu, na imekuwa tested na ina proof, hii haijaribu tuu bali ina elezea. Weakness zake zinaendelea kuwa proved na watu wanazifanyia kazi.
Sasa miaka 2000 katika evolution ni miaka michache, too few to notice the changes, ni vizazi 40 tuu. Lakini proof ipo kuwa ubongo wa watu wa miaka 4000 iliyo pita ulikuwa mkubwa kidogo kuliko wa sasa, kwa hiyo kwa kuwa Evolution imeprove kuwa sisi na watu wa miaka elfu 40 iliyo pita hatukuwa sawa. Haiwezekani sisi na watu wa miaka elfu 40 ijayo tukawa tuko sawa tuu. Pia kwa kuwa vitu kama mazingira vina change life style zina change na life span zina change binadam wataendelea kuwa tofaut kwa ajili ya kukabiliana na changamoto hizo

 

[Kiranga]

Nimekuuliza kama ingeandikwa mungu yupo katika nyota hiyo ndiyo ingekuwa ni dalili tu ya kufanya watu waamini mungu?

Ingekuwa ni dalili ya wazi kiasi kwamba ubishi kwamba Mungu hayupo ungekuwa more illogical kuliko ubishi kwamba Farao aliyejenga mapiramidi na kuandika habari zake humo hakuwahi kuwepo.

Kwa nini Mungu hakuweka ushahidi kama huo?

Kwa nini hakufanya kila siku tuwe tinaona aya ya biblia aliyoichagua itokee angani kwa nyota kujipanga?

Angefanya hivyo nisingebisha biblia ni kitabu cha Mungu. Lakini kwa sasa naona kimeandikwa na watu tu.

 

[Kiranga]

Sheria nzuri based on what?

Definition ya sheria nzuri ipi?
Is it ile ambayo inakupendeza wewe machoni mwako?

But God is not Kiranga, he makes his own rules,
He is sovereign

Wewe unaona ulimwengu kuwa na mabaya is a big deal sana eh?
Why is that?

Sheria nzuri inatakiwa kuwa na logical consistency.

Mungu wako ana contradictions za wazi.

Kwa nini Mungu wako kaumba ulimwengu unaoruhusu umasikini, magonjwa, vimbunga etc wakati huo huo tunaambiwa ana uwezo wote ujuzi wote na upendo wote?

That is logically inconsistent, it shows that there is no God. This God idea is just an idea.

 

[gasgas]

Vingi nilivo viona umeandika nimeona hujaijua evolution vzuri.
Mkuu ni Scientific theory, siyo theory tuu, na imekuwa tested na ina proof, hii haijaribu tuu bali ina elezea. Weakness zake zinaendelea kuwa proved na watu wanazifanyia kazi.
Sasa miaka 2000 katika evolution ni miaka michache, too few to notice the changes, ni vizazi 40 tuu. Lakini proof ipo kuwa ubongo wa watu wa miaka 4000 iliyo pita ulikuwa mkubwa kidogo kuliko wa sasa, kwa hiyo kwa kuwa Evolution imeprove kuwa sisi na watu wa miaka elfu 40 iliyo pita hatukuwa sawa. Haiwezekani sisi na watu wa miaka elfu 40 ijayo tukawa tuko sawa tuu. Pia kwa kuwa vitu kama mazingira vina change life style zina change na life span zina change binadam wataendelea kuwa tofaut kwa ajili ya kukabiliana na changamoto hizo

Vingi nilivo viona umeandika nimeona hujaijua evolution vzuri.
Mkuu ni Scientific theory, siyo theory tuu, na imekuwa tested na ina proof, hii haijaribu tuu bali ina elezea. Weakness zake zinaendelea kuwa proved na watu wanazifanyia kazi.
Sasa miaka 2000 katika evolution ni miaka michache, too few to notice the changes, ni vizazi 40 tuu. Lakini proof ipo kuwa ubongo wa watu wa miaka 4000 iliyo pita ulikuwa mkubwa kidogo kuliko wa sasa, kwa hiyo kwa kuwa Evolution imeprove kuwa sisi na watu wa miaka elfu 40 iliyo pita hatukuwa sawa. Haiwezekani sisi na watu wa miaka elfu 40 ijayo tukawa tuko sawa tuu. Pia kwa kuwa vitu kama mazingira vina change life style zina change na life span zina change binadam wataendelea kuwa tofaut kwa ajili ya kukabiliana na changamoto hizo

Mkuu cheki hii article
It's wikipedia but nikiweza i'll look for a better article

Strengths and weaknesses of evolution - Wikipedia

na


Objections to evolution - Wikipedia

 

[Iceman 3D]

Hizo ni assumptions zako mkuu
Soma Bible history,

Walioandika hawakukaa pamoja na kuanza kuandika biblia.
Waandishi wa vitabu vya biblia wapo wengi zaidi ya 40
Wengine kama Musa waliandika zamani sana thousands of years B.C, wengine waliandika decades A.D
Lakini the amazing thing ni kwamba they agree and are coherent.
Prophecy iliyotolewa na nabii wa Mungu 400 B.C inakuja kutimia 40 A.D
Na kuna baadhi ya vitu vinatimia sasa, vilikuwa revealed kwa kupitia manabii wa Mungu zamani

Mi nnacho jua mkuu ni kuwa biblia wali ipanga watu wa Roman Catholic na ndio walio amua itumikeje na iwe ina vitabu 72, halafu hata kina Nastrodomus, Baba Vanga, Rosseau na Jeonrch Heine walitabiri vitu vitakuja kutokea na vina tokea, hata babu yangu aliwah sema vitu vita tokea na vikatokea so hiyo bado haifanyi bible kuwa special mkuu

 

[gasgas]

Sheria nzuri inatakiwa kuwa na logical consistency.

Mungu wako ana contradictions za wazi.

Kwa nini Mungu wako kaumba ulimwengu unaoruhusu umasikini, magonjwa, vimbunga etc wakati huo huo tunaambiwa ana uwezo wote ujuzi wote na upendo wote?

That is logically inconsistent, it shows that there is no God. This God idea is just an idea.

Unajua may be it is because you view things from a different point of view ndio maana we disagree on this

To an athiest like you, life here on earth is all there is to it. Is the only thing there is.
Kwa hiyo whatever thing ambayo unaona ni negative hapa, you tend to have a more exaggerated view on it

Lakini to a believer there's a life after death and it is eternal,

What is eternity as compared to 70 years on earth

Some of things atheists view as vices are not vices in the realm of faith
Hardships are not a bad thing, they train the spiritual man to depend on God, to trust in God and to work hard, these attributes are being cultivated here on earth in a person so that once he comes to eternal life, he has acquired them and is able to manifest them. Because in heaven there is no hardship, sin is destroyed

Hardship apart from having a purpose in the life of a believer, it is also a consequence of man's disobedience.
God made man, gave him free will, revealed to him the right thing to do, and the wrong thing to do, and their consequences

Man chose the wrong thing and now he is bearing consequences

We define upendo differently, and uwezo wa Mungu differently

God uses his power to help man conform to how he wants him to be,
From the Bible i learned that God is more concerned upon eternity than these 70 odd years one lives here on earth, because eternity is much longer than the time on earth
This time on earth was purposed to be time for man to develop traits that he needs to have before transitiono eternal life

There are such traits such as Humility, Submission, Hope are learned through hardships

Carbon has to undergo plenty of pressure before it becomes Diamond Right?