Juu ya OIC na Mahakama ya Kadhi

[Mwanaluguma]

Kwahiyo unataka kusema nchi ambazo zinamahakama hii ya ki-islam kama vile kenya wananyanyasa raia wengine wasio kua waislam? nawakati wanaaihidi kuanzisha mahakama wakati wa uchaguzi, hawakuiona katiba ya nchi? Hebutoweni blabla zenu, wakati umefika we need changes

Nani amekuambia ilani ya uchaguzi ndio katiba ya nchi? Wewe jirani yako akijifunika shuka nyekundu na wewe ni lazima ufanye hivyo? Cant you be independent in thinking? Changes unazotaka ni kwa maslahi ya kikundi kimoja si taifa zima,hilo nalo linahitaji elimu ya chuo kikuu kutambua? Tuachieni amani yetuuuuu!!!!!

 

[Tumain]

Waislamu wanaomba mahakama ya kadhi serikalini,(baba yetu wote) hawajapeleka maombi kanisani kwanini wakristo watoe majibu

Ni kama kisa cha mtu wenye watoto wawili (A and B) "A anaomba anunuliwe shati kwa babake, B anasema kumwambia baba usimnunulie A shati" wapi na wapi?

Kinachotakiwa B afanye aombe naye anunuliwe shati siyo kukutaa A asinunuliwe na Baba yetu ...so kama kwa maaskofu wanataka mahakama go ahead put your case to goverment kuna tatizo gani hapo??? kwanini maaskofu washinikize serikali kwa jambo ambalo wao hawajaliomba?? wivu,chuki ujinga mkubwa kabisa kama wa huyo mtoto.

 

[Ngongo]

Wakati mwingine nashindwa kuelewa ndugu zangu waislam ni kwa nini tunagombea serekali ituanzishie mahakama ya kadhi ilihali mahakama ya kadhi haitaji hisani ya bunge wala huruma za wanasiasa.Wanazuoni wa heshima mara nyingi utawasikia wakilalamikia serekali imetuwekea/ imeanzisha Bakwata sasa ni kwanini tunataka serekali hiyo hiyo tunayoilalamikia ituanzishie tena mahakama ya kadhi.Mahakama ya kadhi ni sehemu ya ibada haina sababu ya msingi kuipeleka bungeni kuijadili wakati tunaelewa fika bunge letu na serekali havina dini.

Tuanzishe mahama ya kadhi ndani ya taasisi zetu kama Bakwata,tuache mambo ya kulalamika bila sasabu za msingi.Tuache kupanda chuki katika jamii yetu ya kitanzania.

 

[Tumain]

Mimi dini yangu ni tofauti na ukristo wala uislam ni budha hivyo kuunda mahakama ya kadhi kwa kuwalipa pesa za taifa hili ni dhuluma kwa taifa hivyo . Mimi nasema kuwa Waislamu wana haki ya kuunda mahakama ya kadhi na pia waunde bila ya kushirikishwa serikali katika Jambo hili

Hata wewe uko kwenye kundi hilo..kweli tunasafiri ndefu watu kutambua haki za wengine...

 

[KipimaPembe]

CCM wanaendesha religious politics knowning kwamba hii ni kinyume cha sheria na katiba. CCM waliamua kiungiza mambo ya kidini kwenye ilani ya uchaguzi yao, wakati wakijua kuwa hiyo ni kuvunja sheria ya vyama vya siasa inayokataza vyama vya kidini. CCM wanavunja katiba kwa kuleta mambo ya ibada ndani ya serikali.

Lakini CCM ni chama tawala. Wakati wanaweka mambo ya kidini kwenye ilani yao ya uchaguzi hakuna aliyepiga kelele. Sasa CCM wanaamini walishinda uchaguzi kwa sababu ya mambo hayo. Ndo maana kelele za waislam zimewaswing.

Kuna wanaosema hili lina uhusiano na kodi kwa taasisi za kidini. Misamaha ya kodi ilipofutwa taasisi za kikristo zilitoa sauti zaidi. Tafsiri yake ni kuwa taasisi za kikristo zinanufaika na misamaha ya kodi. Huo ulikuwa mtego!!

Serikali ilikubali kupiga U turn, watu wakasema serikali imenywea kwa maaskofu. Kwa hiyo Masheikh nao wanatumia moto huo huo. Ikiwa ilinywea kwa maaskofu na kukubali kurejesha misamaha ya kodi kwa nini serikali hiyo hiyo isinywee kwa masheikh?? Kwa hiyo mazingira ya victim's game yalishajengwa. Kwa hiyo kuingiza mahakama ya kadhi inakuwa ni haki ya mashekhe kama ilivyokuwa haki ya maaskofu kurejeshewa misamaha ya kodi. Hili hamjaliona??? Haka ndo kamchezo.

Lakini suala la msingi ni la kuvunja katiba, ambayo ilivunjwa mwaka 2005 kwa chama kuingiza dini kwenye election manifesto. Ikiwa CCM wataendelea na hilo iko haja ya vyama vingine vile vile kuanza ku-exploit dini ili kujijengea mazingira ya kupata kura. Sasa hili la kuvunja katiba kwa CCM ambao ndo wenye mpini nani atawaambia wamevunja katiba?

CCM kwa kuingiza dini kwenye election manifesto yao wanajua walichofanya. Ila kwa sababu waliona watu wako kimya, wanaendelea mbele. Kuna mengi waliyoahidi ambayo hawajayatekeleza. Lakini sasa hivi tunapoelekea uchaguzi, wanagusa yale wanayoona ndo yatakayowapa ushindi. Ndo maana nasema CCM ni sera yao na wanaona ni lazima waitekeleze.

Debate ingetakiwa kuwa ni kwa nini CCM wamesimamia dini wakati katiba na sheria zinakataza vyama vya kisiasa kusimamia hayo?

 

[Tumain]

Wakati mwingine nashindwa kuelewa ndugu zangu waislam ni kwa nini tunagombea serekali ituanzishie mahakama ya kadhi ilihali mahakama ya kadhi haitaji hisani ya bunge wala huruma za wanasiasa.Wanazuoni wa heshima mara nyingi utawasikia wakilalamikia serekali imetuwekea/ imeanzisha Bakwata sasa ni kwanini tunataka serekali hiyo hiyo tunayoilalamikia ituanzishie tena mahakama ya kadhi.Mahakama ya kadhi ni sehemu ya ibada haina sababu ya msingi kuipeleka bungeni kuijadili wakati tunaelewa fika bunge letu na serekali havina dini.

Tuanzishe mahama ya kadhi ndani ya taasisi zetu kama Bakwata,tuache mambo ya kulalamika bila sasabu za msingi.Tuache kupanda chuki katika jamii yetu ya kitanzania.

Kama ambavyo wewe huelewi waislamu na mimi siwaelewi ndugu zetu wakristo kabisaa! issue ndogo kama hii kafahamu umuhimu wake kwetu na jinsi ambavyo ingeleta amani..kwanini wakristo wantaka kuleta vurugu kwani wao serikali?? waache serikali itoe majibu bila wao kupiga kelele??
Nafikiri inahitajika open debate kati ya (masheikh,maaskofu na serikali) halafu anatafutwa "fair refareee" anaamua hii kesi two-three serious national debate itasaidia kuelewasha watu wasiofahamu kama wakristo

 

[Ntambaswala]

Duu hii ni kali sana Chikawe alipojenga hoja kutumia mfano wa South Afrika watu wamepinga kuwa asituletee mambo ya SA, lakini sisi kuhalalisha mahakama hizo tunatumia mifano ya Uganda, Msumbiji na Kenya, hapa naona Waislamu tunajichanganya na tunakuwa na vipimo viwili.

Jambo jingine linalotusumbua ni kuwa hatuna msimamo unaoleweka, leo BAKWATA ndio wako mstari wa mbele kudai hy mahakama na sisi sote tunawaunga mkono kesho sisi wenyewe utasikia BAKWATA sio chombo cha waislamu ni chombo maslahi cha serikali.

Hivi tabia yetu ya kulamimika kuwa tunaonewa hivi inatoka wapi, maana mara tunadai sisi ndo tuko wengi kuliko wakristo, wafanyabiashara wakubwa wote ni waislamu, CCM top layer wote ni waislamu sasa huko kuonewa kunatoka wapi jamani? Itabidi nifanye utafiti zaidi maana siku moja nilisikia yule AL Fayed wa Uingereza naye anadai anaonewa japo ni moja wa matajiri wakubwa Uingereza. Hata matajiri waislamu wakubwa walioko USA, SA nao utasikia tunaonewa vile ni waislamu. HII TABIA YA KUSEMA KILA JAMBO TUNAONEWA LINATOKA WAPI- tunahitaji kujitambua na kujiamini tuache mawazo ya kujidunisha kuwa tunaonewa.

Ni hayo tu

 

[KipimaPembe]

Kama ambavyo wewe huelewi waislamu na mimi siwaelewi ndugu zetu wakristo kabisaa! issue ndogo kama hii kafahamu umuhimu wake kwetu na jinsi ambavyo ingeleta amani..kwanini wakristo wantaka kuleta vurugu kwani wao serikali?? waache serikali itoe majibu bila wao kupiga kelele??
Nafikiri inahitajika open debate kati ya (masheikh,maaskofu na serikali) halafu anatafutwa "fair refareee" anaamua hii kesi two-three serious national debate itasaidia kuelewasha watu wasiofahamu kama wakristo

Tumain, hapa mi sidhani ni suala la kutoelewa au la. Ni suala la principle kuwa serikali isijihusishe na dini kwa level ya mambo ya ibada au mambo ya kiimani. Msingi wa hii principle ni ukweli kuwa serikali later on itashindwa kushughulikia mambo haya kwa sababu serikali si custodian wa mambo ya imani na haina utaalam nayo na vile vile ni serikali yenye kuhusisha watu wa imani tofauti nyingi tu.

Ndo maana mi hata kwenye misamaha ya kodi niliiunga mkono serikali kuondoa misamaha hiyo. Ni principle tu kuwa kila mtu au taasisi anastahili kulipa kodi. Tunapoanza kujichanganya ndo tunafikia tulipofikia kuwa incentive kwetu ni misamaha ya kodi na matokeo yake tunakusanya asilimia sabini tu ya kodi. Tatizo tulisha compromise principle.

Na hii principle ikiwa compromised, kuna siku itaiwea vigumu kukatalia maslahi ya voting block nyingine ya kidini itakayotaka mambo yake yashughulikiwe na serikali.

Ni issue ya principple tu. .... dini ni dini .... utawala ni utawala. Unless iwe dini na utawala kitu kimoja. Kitu ambacho Tanzania hatuwezi kuguarantee.

 

[Orkesumet]

Ifikie mahali basi watanzania tuelewe kuwa taifa linaendeshwa kwa kuzingatia kanuni na sheria tulizoweka (ikiwamo katiba) na wala sio hisia na jazba zisizo na msingi wowote. Sifikirii kwa kipindi chote ambacho mahakama za kadhi hazikuwepo waislamu hakutendewa haki na mahakama zilizopo chini ya katiba. Na sidhani kama kuna mmomonyoko wa maadili kiasi hicho hadi wito wa kuanzishwa kwa mahakama ya kadhi. Kwa mtazamo wangu mambo ya kadhi si ya msingi kwa jamii yetu ambayo imesongwa na matatizo lukuki ambayo yanahitaji ufumbuzi kiasi cha kuibana serikali ili iwajibike. Ningeunga mkono ndugu zetu waislamu kama viongozi wao wangesimama kidete katika kufanya mabadiliko ambayo yataleta huduma bora kwa watanzania, kuongeza pato la taifa, nk. Tuwe na vipaumbele na mikakati bora tu yenye kulenga kuleta chachu ya maendeleo na ufanisi na tija katika taifa hili. Hebu anzisheni mabaraza ya usuluhishi katika madhehebu yenu na siyo kupoteza pesa za wavuja jasho kwa mambo yasiyo na msingi kwa taifa.

 

[Rufiji]

Hivi hawa Maaskofu wakifunga midomo yao watapungukiwa nini?

 

[Abdulhalim]

Hivi hawa Maaskofu wakifunga midomo yao watapungukiwa nini ?

Na wewe ukifunga mdomo utapungukiwa na nini?

 

[Tumain]

Tumain, hapa mi sidhani ni suala la kutoelewa au la. Ni suala la principle kuwa serikali isijihusishe na dini kwa level ya mambo ya ibada au mambo ya kiimani. Msingi wa hii principle ni ukweli kuwa serikali later on itashindwa kushughulikia mambo haya kwa sababu serikali si custodian wa mambo ya imani na haina utaalam nayo na vile vile ni serikali yenye kuhusisha watu wa imani tofauti nyingi tu.

Ndo maana mi hata kwenye misamaha ya kodi niliiunga mkono serikali kuondoa misamaha hiyo. Ni principle tu kuwa kila mtu au taasisi anastahili kulipa kodi. Tunapoanza kujichanganya ndo tunafikia tulipofikia kuwa incentive kwetu ni misamaha ya kodi na matokeo yake tunakusanya asilimia sabini tu ya kodi. Tatizo tulisha compromise principle.

Na hii principle ikiwa compromised, kuna siku itaiwea vigumu kukatalia maslahi ya voting block nyingine ya kidini itakayotaka mambo yake yashughulikiwe na serikali.

Ni issue ya principple tu. .... dini ni dini .... utawala ni utawala. Unless iwe dini na utawala kitu kimoja. Kitu ambacho Tanzania hatuwezi kuguarantee.

Principles ni hoja nzuri ili kukwepa tatizo...lakini unaona sasa umesema kuwa misamaha ya kodi walitakiwa walipe (principle) lakini hatuzingatia principles wakati wote kwanini? kwasababu huwezi kukwepa tatizo la wananchi wako ...

 

[MLEKWA]

IKiwa waislamu ni majority Tanzania nafikiri kuna umuhimu wa kulipigia kura suala hili kwani Kenya Waislamu ni Minority ila serikali imewapa Kadhi court , Zanzibar kuna Kadhi court as well. Vipi ndugu zetu wa Bara muwakatilie haki yao ya kiroho watanzania wenzenu wanaomini kuwa Mahkama ya sasa imeanzishwa kwa sysstem ya mkoloni ambayo haitoshelezi haki ya kiiimani ya Waislamu hasa kwenye suala la Urithi.
Jee Muislamu akifikishwa Mahakamani kwa Suala la Urithi akisema haitambui Mahkama ya sasa kwa vile haikubaliani na msahafu wa Kurani mutasema nini mtu huyu mutamlazimisha kukubali Mahkama ya sasa ambayo inaenda kinyume na imani yake ?
Watanzania ni matured people waulizeni ndugu zenu waislamu kwa nini munataka Kadhi court sio museme waislamu wanaleta udini ukweli ni kuwa sheria nyingi za nchi yetu tumerithi mkoloni na mkristo jee suala hili si bora watanzania wakalipigia kura ya ballot box ? Munasemaje waungwana.

 

[Abdulhalim]

IKiwa waislamu ni majority Tanzania nafikiri kuna umuhimu wa kulipigia kura suala hili kwani

STOOOOP HOLD UP RIGHT THERE!

Hizo takwimu kuwa wasilamu Tz ni majority umezipata wapi? Msilete stori zenu za vilabu vya pombe zisizopimwa humu jamvini ebo!

 

[Tumain]

Ifikie mahali basi watanzania tuelewe kuwa taifa linaendeshwa kwa kuzingatia kanuni na sheria tulizoweka (ikiwamo katiba) na wala sio hisia na jazba zisizo na msingi wowote. Sifikirii kwa kipindi chote ambacho mahakama za kadhi hazikuwepo waislamu hakutendewa haki na mahakama zilizopo chini ya katiba. Na sidhani kama kuna mmomonyoko wa maadili kiasi hicho hadi wito wa kuanzishwa kwa mahakama ya kadhi. Kwa mtazamo wangu mambo ya kadhi si ya msingi kwa jamii yetu ambayo imesongwa na matatizo lukuki ambayo yanahitaji ufumbuzi kiasi cha kuibana serikali ili iwajibike. Ningeunga mkono ndugu zetu waislamu kama viongozi wao wangesimama kidete katika kufanya mabadiliko ambayo yataleta huduma bora kwa watanzania, kuongeza pato la taifa, nk. Tuwe na vipaumbele na mikakati bora tu yenye kulenga kuleta chachu ya maendeleo na ufanisi na tija katika taifa hili. Hebu anzisheni mabaraza ya usuluhishi katika madhehebu yenu na siyo kupoteza pesa za wavuja jasho kwa mambo yasiyo na msingi kwa taifa.

Waambie Maaskofu wako waache kimbelembele hawajaombwa wao mahakama ni serikali??
kipindi chote yes tulinyimwa haki kwa miaka zaidi ya 20 baada mt.nyerere kuondoa mahakama ya kadhi..watoto, kina mama waliodhulumiwa haki zao katika mahakama zetu ni wengi sana data zipo..
kwakuwa hujafanya research usikurupuke...ndiyo maana kwa uvumilivu mkubwa waislamu wamedai mahakama for all those years, kwa kuwa wakristo hawana uvumilivu safari hii wafunge bakuli lao no retreat!!

 

[MLEKWA]

Jielemisheni kidogo kutoka Mahkama ya Waislamu ya Kenya

The Constitution of Kenya - Chapter 3 - The Parliament

 

[KipimaPembe]

Principles ni hoja nzuri ili kukwepa tatizo...lakini unaona sasa umesema kuwa misamaha ya kodi walitakiwa walipe (principle) lakini hatuzingatia principles wakati wote kwanini? kwasababu huwezi kukwepa tatizo la wananchi wako ...

Principle hazipo kwa ajili ya kukwepa matatizo. Principle zipo kwa ajili ya kutatua matatizo kwa njia ambazo hazitazaa matatizo mengine. Nadhani unaona hiyo misamaha ya kodi inavyotufanya omba omba! Je ni vizuri tuwe omba omba?

Kutofuata principle kwa madai eti unatatua tatizo ni kisingizio. Tunaostick kwenye principle tunajua hizi principle ndo njia bora ya kutatua matatizo bila kuzaa mengine. Sasa kwa kuwa tumesha compromise principle kwenye kodi, na huku vile vile tucompromise tu?

 

[KipimaPembe]

Jielemisheni kidogo kutoka Mahkama ya Waislamu ya Kenya

The Constitution of Kenya - Chapter 3 - The Parliament

Katiba ya kenya siyo mahakama ya kadhi peke yake. Inatamka na makabila vile vile. Sidhani kama kenya ni mfano bora wa utawala uliofanikiwa na siamini kama waislam wa kenya wanapata haki kuliko wale wa Tanzania. Ndo maana sioni haja ya kuiingiza hii mahakama tu kwa kuwa na kenya ipo!!

 

[Josh Michael]

STOOOOP HOLD UP RIGHT THERE!

Hizo takwimu kuwa wasilamu Tz ni majority umezipata wapi? Msilete stori zenu za vilabu vya pombe zisizopimwa humu jamvini ebo!

Nenda world CIA facts za Tanzania utaona kama siyo kweli. Kusema ukweli Waislamu ni wengi sana Tanzania ndio maana kunakuwa na tension kubwa sana Tanzania

 

[MLEKWA]

CCM ITIMIZE AHADI ZAKE KWA WAISLAMU

Tanzania Prime Minister, Mr Edward Lowassa, has kicked off a national debate over the introduction of Kadhi's courts in the country's judicial system.

The controversy echoes the situation in the other East African Community member states, especially in Kenya where the debate is at the centre of the presidential campaigns.

Lowassa's, almost inoffensive, remarks were in response to recent calls to parliament to give priority to the creation of the courts to arbitrate in exclusively Muslim disputes.

Justice and Constitutional Affairs minister, Dr Mary Nagu, pre-empted what would have been explosive national discourse when she said the legislature could not debate the issue as it was already in court. It is public knowledge that her response provided a temporary lull before a major storm.

That persistent Muslim grumbling is taking on a regional dimension and calls for a rethink of governments about how to forestall looming religious intolerance. Governments in the region have a responsibility to explain to Muslims why they cannot grant them their wish rather than burying their heads in the sand and hope the issue will fade away.

Religious extremism

East African Muslims have since independence been pushing for the recognition of their religious rights, one of which is to be allowed to operate what Christians perceive as a parallel judicial system anchored on the Islamic faith.

When he commented on the matter during a visit to Mbeya region last week, Lowassa appealed to Muslims to be patient as the state looks into their request.

At present, Islamic laws are parallel to secular ones in the semi-autonomous Zanzibar Island. Muslims want the courts introduced in the rest of the country.

The prime minister's remarks drew sharp reactions from Christians, who fear that the introduction of Kadhi's court's, which have been in existence in Kenya, is a precursor to the 'dreaded' sharia law.

Christian fears and resentment of the court were expressed through political maverick, Rev Christopher Mtikila's indictment of Lowassa last week.

"The remarks by Lowassa were totally wrong. He contradicted Nagu, who said it was contempt of court to refer the matter to parliament because the matter was already in court," Mtikila, who has twice ran for presidency, remarked.

Given the emotive reaction to the latter in countries such as Nigeria, where Christianity and Islam command nearly equal following, sharia has the potential to unleash religious extremism in a generally peaceful region as either religion attempts to outdo the other.

In its latest assessment of religious tolerance, in Kenya and by extension the rest of East Africa, the US State Department said in a report published on September 14 that the Kadhi's court is still a sensitive issue in Kenya and the neighboring countries.

The report read: "Muslim and Christian groups [in Kenya] remained engaged in a longstanding debate over whether special Islamic courts should be recognised in the country's Constitution. Muslim groups voiced concerns regarding a proposed Anti-Terrorism Bill, which they perceived as being against Muslims."

The same case applies to Tanzania where, during election campaigns, Zanzibar often explodes into religious-instigated violence as Muslims complain of discrimination and domination by Christian Mainlanders.

Mainlanders on their part revile the Islanders, whom they perceive as a threat to national security. It is therefore hardly surprising that the Civic United Front (CUF) party, in spite of coming up with election manifestos that touch the concerns of ordinary Tanzanians, lacks support on the mainland.

On the Isles, CUF enjoys almost fanatic following among Muslims. Prof Ibrahim Lipumba, despite his impressive academic and political record, lost the 2000 and 2005 presidential elections to Chama Cha Mapinduzi (CCM) candidates for contesting in the "wrong" party.

Most Muslims huddle in CCM for fear of reprisals and as a means of having a bite of the national cake without looking over their shoulders.

As the debate on Kadhi's courts raged, President Jakaya Kikwete, himself a Muslim, was last Monday forced to appeal for patience as the Law Reform Commission - which is looking into the recommendations of a committee that toured Kenya, Uganda and South Africa to study how the Kadhi's courts operate - concludes its work.

In countries where Kadhi's courts exist; they are 'subordinate' to secular magistrate's courts and the High Court. They serve Muslims in matters relating to marriage, divorce and administration of property.

The controversial Bomas draft constitution provides for the creation of a Kadhi's Court of Appeal, an issue Kenyan Christians have been opposed to. It is the same case in Tanzania.

Kikwete told Christians during the inauguration of Alex Malalusa as the Evangelistic Lutheran Church of Tanzanian Archbishop in Dar es Salaam:

"In the recent past, I have seen signs of growing religious intolerance and unless we remain vigilant the peaceful co-existence between Muslims and Christians may not last long."

"I would like to assure the entire country that the Government will not make decisions that do not take into account the interest of the country. Also, the matter will not be sneaked into our laws," he said, as he acknowledged the sensitive nature of the matter.

Like their Tanzanian counterparts, Kenyan Christians are suspicious that an attempt to create a Court of Appeal to exclusively serve Muslims would be a betrayal of sections of the Constitution that proclaim Kenya a secular state.

Tanzania has 'conventions' that provides for alternation of the presidency between Christians and Muslims. Founding Tanzania President Julius Nyerere was Christian, while successor Ali Hassan Mwinyi was a Muslim. Mwinyi handed power to Benjamin Mkapa, a Christian, who in turn passed on the baton to Kikwete.

The debate has gone beyond EAC and the State Department report on international religious freedom illustrates how religion is increasingly becoming central to regional politics.

It noted that, in Kenya, "Muslim and Christian groups remained engaged in a tussle over whether special Islamic courts should be recognised in the country's constitution…Muslim groups voiced concerns regarding a proposed Anti-terrorism Bill, which they perceived as being against Muslims."

It added, "Kadhis' courts, however, are 'subordinate' courts, meaning that the secular High Court has jurisdiction to supervise any civil or criminal proceedings. And any party involved in the proceedings may refer a question involving interpretation, or directly appeal a decision, to the High Court."

In spite of the Muslim displeasure with governments in the region, it noted: "There is generally a great level of tolerance among religious groups, although some Muslims perceive themselves to be treated as second-class citizens in a predominantly Christian country. Intermarriage between Muslims and Christians, although less frequent, is also socially acceptable."