Mafuriko mwezi ujao (September 2012)

[Iron Lady]

Mimi siamini kwamba mungu yupo. Sijapata ushahidi wa kuniaminisha kwamba mungu yupo.

Wewe unaniambia, ili kuamini nikasome biblia, kitabu ambacho mungu kakiakndika.

Several problems with this line of thinking.

1. Inabidi uniaminishe kwamba mungu yupo kwanza, kabla ya kutaka nisome kitabu chake kwa mtazamo wa kusoma kitabu cha mungu.

2.Halafu una assume tu kwamba sijasoma biblia. This is wrong. Biblia nimeisoma kuanzia Mwanzo mpaka Ufunuo, halafu nikaisoma kinyumenyume kutoka Ufunuo mpaka Mwanzo, by age 11!

Hizo habari rejareja za binadamu wa kwanza kuwa mweusi au mweupe hazijibu swala la kuwapo kwa mungu.

Halafu concept nzima ya "binadamu wa kwanza" ina betray lack of knowledge of science.

kiranga
hapa ulikuwa una maana gani?

 

[Kiranga]

Hmm....imani na kitanda vinahusianaje?

Imani kwamba kitanda kitakuhimili- na hakitavunjika na kukubwaga chini pindi utakapokilalia- ndiyo inayokufanya ukilalie kitanda.

Ukiwekewa gazeti juu ya matendegu ulilalie huwezi kulilalia kwa sababu hutaamini kwamba "kitanda" hiki cha godoro la layer moja ya magazeti kitakuhimili.

Kwa hiyo hata kukilalia kitanda tu kunahitaji imani.

Imani kwamba ukilala kitanda hakitaanguka.

Imani kwamba kitanda unachokiona ni cha kweli na si hallucinations zako... etc

Nionyeshe anayesema haamini kitu hata kimoja na mimi nitakuonyesha muongo hapohapo.

Tatizo sio kuamini, bali, unaamini nini?

Imani yako inatoa mwanya wa ku diverge kwenye ukweli kiasi kwamba haiwezi kupimika ina a Paulian "less than wrong" way au ina converge kwenye ukweli fulani kwa jinsi ambayo inapimika kama katika scientific process?

 

[Kiranga]

kiranga
hapa ulikuwa una maana gani?

Notion kwamba kulikuwa na "binadamu wa kwanza" ina betray a creationist bias kwamba binadamu aliumbwa in a day, and against the accepted best known scientific theory kwamba binadamu ali evolve.

 

[Kiranga]

kiranga
kama uliisoma kuanzia mwanzo to ufunuo halafu ukarudi kinyumenyume toka ufunuo hadi mwanzo ili uelewe zaidi au?and at that age ya miaka 11 ulikuwa na uelewa na ulichokuwa unasoma kwa tafakuri ya kina?
kama uliisoma katika hiyo age ya miaka 11 no wonder hukuielewa nashauri usome tena sasa ukiwa na akili nzuri iliyojaa mambo mengi yatakayokusaidia kutafakari vzr.

No wonder you take the bible literally kwamba ni kitabu cha mungu.

No imagination at all.

Zero comprehension.
No capacity for any artistic flair.

Halafu kusema nimeisoma nikiwa 11 haina maana kwamba sijaisoma tena baada ya hapo.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Imani kwamba kitanda kitakuhimili- na hakitavunjika na kukubwaga chini pindi utakapokilalia- ndiyo inayokufanya ukilalie kitanda.

Je kama kitanda changu ni godoro tu lililowekwa sakafuni?

Ukiwekewa gazeti juu ya matendegu ulilalie huwezi kulilalia kwa sababu hutaamini kwamba "kitanda" hiki cha godoro la layer moja ya magazeti kitakuhimili.

Sasa hapa sidhani kama hiyo ni imani. Ni suala la ufahamu/ujuzi tu hilo. Unafahamu/unajua kuwa wewe uzito wako na huo wa gazeti havilingani hata kidogo. Na unafahamu/unajua kuwa ukijiegemeza kwenye kitu chepesi sana lazima kitavunjika ua kushindwa kukustahimili kwa sababu umekielemea

Kwa hiyo hata kukilalia kitanda tu kunahitaji imani.

Hapana. Kukilalia kitanda ni ufahamu/ujuzi. Si una macho? Si una sense of touch? Si una akili ya kuweza kujua kipi ni hatari na kipi si hatari? Sasa kwa nini kulalia kitanda iwe imani? Imani inahusu visivyoweza au ambavyo havijulikani. Kitanda umekilalia nights kibao halafu bado unaelea kwenye imani tu? Hapana, huo ni ujuzi.

Imani kwamba ukilala kitanda hakitaanguka.

Ni ujuzi. Unajua kuwa kitanda chako kikoje na umeshakilalia sana na hata siku moja hakijawahi kukuangusha.

Imani kwamba kitanda unachokiona ni cha kweli na si hallucinations zako... etc

Sasa hapa kwa msingi huu mtu unaweza kujenga hoja hata wewe mwenyewe inawezekana si wewe ila ni hallucinations zako tu zinazokufanya wewe udhani kuwa wewe ndiyo wewe.

Nionyeshe anayesema haamini kitu hata kimoja na mimi nitakuonyesha muongo hapohapo.

Hapa nakubaliana na wewe. Binadamu tuna ukomo wa ujuzi na ufahamu hivyo mambo mengi sana huwa tunategemea imani zetu tu.

 

[Ally Kombo]

Yaani thread nyingine bana ! Kichefu chefu tuuu.

 

[Kiranga]

Je kama kitanda changu ni godoro tu lililowekwa sakafuni?

Itabidi uamini kwamba godoro lipo kweli na huoni mawenge tu.

Sasa hapa sidhani kama hiyo ni imani. Ni suala la ufahamu/ujuzi tu hilo. Unafahamu/unajua kuwa wewe uzito wako na huo wa gazeti havilingani hata kidogo. Na unafahamu/unajua kuwa ukijiegemeza kwenye kitu chepesi sana lazima kitavunjika ua kushindwa kukustahimili kwa sababu umekielemea

Hakuna ufahamu au ujuzi usio imani. Ufahamu unatoka katika milango mitano ya fahamu. Maana yake ili kufikiri una ufahamu ni lazima kwanza uiamini milango yako mitano ya fahamu.

Unaweza kuona kitanda kipo, lakini process yako ya kulala ni lazima iwe na imani kwamba macho yako mawili yana uwezo wa ku-judge umbali, ama sivyo utaanguka kabla ya kukifikia kitanda. Imani tayari hiyo.

Hapana. Kukilalia kitanda ni ufahamu/ujuzi. Si una macho? Si una sense of touch? Si una akili ya kuweza kujua kipi ni hatari na kipi si hatari? Sasa kwa nini kulalia kitanda iwe imani? Imani inahusu visivyoweza au ambavyo havijulikani. Kitanda umekilalia nights kibao halafu bado unaelea kwenye imani tu? Hapana, huo ni ujuzi.

Again, hakuna ujuzi uso imani. Unaweza kufikiri kitanda hiki nakiona kumbe unaota ndoto, kitanda hakipo.

Ni ujuzi. Unajua kuwa kitanda chako kikoje na umeshakilalia sana na hata siku moja hakijawahi kukuangusha.

Hakuna kujua kusiko imani. Unaweza kuona kitanda hiki kizuri, kina shuka. Kumbe adui zako wamekata godoro na katikati kuna shimo, unalala unaanguka. Kwa hiyo inakubidi kuamini kwamba kitu kama hicho hakipo ili ulale.

Sasa hapa kwa msingi huu mtu unaweza kujenga hoja hata wewe mwenyewe inawezekana si wewe ila ni hallucinations zako tu zinazokufanya wewe udhani kuwa wewe ndiyo wewe.

Nishaiongelea sana hii hoja. Ndo maana nikasema ni lazima uamini kitu, kwa maana ukisema huamini chochote hata wewe mwenyewe unaweza kujikanusha kuwapo kwako. Wanafalsafa washaongelea sana hili.

Hapa nakubaliana na wewe. Binadamu tuna ukomo wa ujuzi na ufahamu hivyo mambo mengi sana huwa tunategemea imani zetu tu.

Siyo mambo mengi, mambo yote.

Ndo maana mi nasema sijui kitu.

Na ninashangaa wanaosema wanajua mungu yupo.

 

[Kiranga]

Yaani thread nyingine bana ! Kichefu chefu tuuu.

Ukiwa na uvundo mdomoni hata ukiwa katika bustani ya Akihito kipindi cha Spring utaona kichefuchefu tu.

 

[Bwana Mapesa]

Wakuu, I hope wote mko poa kabisa. Nataka kuwashirikisha jambo. Kuna hali ya mafuriko makubwa yanayokuja kutokea Tanzania mwezi ujao. Kuna watu ambao Mungu amesema nasi ili tuombe toba kwa ajili ya nchi ili hali hii isitokee na hasa kama itatokea basi isilete madhara ambayo yanaweza kutokea kama hatutaomba Mungu atunusuru na maafa.

Nchi yetu 'imemezwa na chatu'. Hii maana yake ni kwamba nchi hii imetumbukia katika uchawi na kumwabudu shetani as nyoka ni shetani as well as uchawi/ushirikina. Watu waliopewa dhamana kwenye taifa hili iwe serikalini au katika kanisa wamesahau wajibu wao na badala yake wanamkumbatia shetani na kazi zake zote i.e uuaji na umwagaji wa damu zisizo na hatia, uchawi, wizi, uongo na pia ukahaba umekithiri, uaminifu umepungua sana, ufisadi, upagani, ibada za mizimu, kuabudu shetani na mambo mengine yote yafananayo na hayo na kumchukiza Mungu na amekasirika. Mambo yote haya tunayaona day in day out. Na watu wanafurahia watu waovu na uovu kuliko uadilifu na watu wanaotetea haki.

Mungu anaipenda sana Tanzania lakini anachukia uovu huu ndio maana ameonyesha nini kinakuja ili tuombe toba atusamehe na atunusuru na hali hiyo na kama bado itatokea basi isilete madhara makubwa au yasitokee kabisa.

Picha ya mafuriko yanayokuja yanaonyesha mvua kubwa sana ya kutisha na nusu ya Dar ikiwa imemezwa na maji ambayo yamechanganyika na maji ya bahari. Hii inaashiria gharika au kimbunga chenye mvua kubwa.

Kwa yeyote mwenye mzigo wa kuliombea Taifa hili tafadhali omba toba kwa ajili ya nchi yetu na ufunge kwa siku tatu kawaida na sio tatu kavu (utachagua mwenyewe siku za kufunga) ili Mungu atuepushie na balaa hili. Tafadhali mshirikishe na mwenzio.
Nimewashirikisha ili isije kula kwetu tuliopewa huu ujumbe kama tutakaa kimya bila kushirikisha wengine pia waombe.

Usichangie kwa kukashifu na kama huna mchango au huamini basi wewe pita tu na Mungu atakubariki.
Mathayo 18:18, 2 Nyakati 7:14, Isaya 62:6, 45:11

haya mkuu SADAKA tunaweka wapi?

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Hakuna ufahamu au ujuzi usio imani. Ufahamu unatoka katika milango mitano ya fahamu. Maana yake ili kufikiri una ufahamu ni lazima kwanza uiamini milango yako mitano ya fahamu.

Unaweza kuona kitanda kipo, lakini process yako ya kulala ni lazima iwe na imani kwamba macho yako mawili yana uwezo wa ku-judge umbali, ama sivyo utaanguka kabla ya kukifikia kitanda. Imani tayari hiyo.

Sasa ni katika hatua ipi ambapo imani inageuka kuwa ujuzi/ufahamu?

 

[Ally Kombo]

Ukiwa na uvundo mdomoni hata ukiwa katika bustani ya Akihito kipindi cha Spring utaona kichefuchefu tu.

bora uvundo wa mdomo kuliko wa imani !

 

[Ally Kombo]

haya mkuu SADAKA tunaweka wapi?

tiGo pesa 0715365623, kila shida moja elf 10, tunanzia maombi 10, by Mzee wa Upako

 

[Kiranga]

bora uvundo wa mdomo kuliko wa imani !

Nakubaliana nawe.

Na kuamini mungu ni uvundo mkubwa sana wa imani.

 

[Iron Lady]

No wonder you take the bible literally kwamba ni kitabu cha mungu.

No imagination at all.

Zero comprehension.
No capacity for any artistic flair.

Halafu kusema nimeisoma nikiwa 11 haina maana kwamba sijaisoma tena baada ya hapo.

mimi siweZi sema cha mungu kwa maana kimeshuka toka mbinguni, ila ni kitabu cha mungu kwa maana kina stories zinazomuhusu mungu na inahitaji faith kukiamini na kukitumia kwa kazi za kiroho.

 

[Iron Lady]

Notion kwamba kulikuwa na "binadamu wa kwanza" ina betray a creationist bias kwamba binadamu aliumbwa in a day, and against the accepted best known scientific theory kwamba binadamu ali evolve.

kiranga
is this the best accepted theory? or famous theory?
unaamini sayansi kuwa binadamu alievolve? that was scientific failure of all times. sasa imekuwaje siku hizi hatuevolve tena na kuwa kitu kingine au hapa evolution imefikia mwisho? evolution ina mapungufu mengi sana.
mfumo wa jua na chanzo chake,chanzo cha mwanadamu katika dunia hii,perhaps na sababu ya kuwapo katika dunia,and everything that exist had a start na this scientist are trying and trying to explain but they have not come to consensus. hii tu inathibitisha kuwa majibu yao si sahihi ndio maana kila anayeona anaweza kueleza hili anaeleza na mwingine anampinga.
science haijajitosheleza kueleza vyanzo hizi ikaeleweka.

 

[Iron Lady]

unajua nimekuwa nikifwatilia haya matheory ya sayansi yanayoeleza chanzo cha kila kitu, eti wanasayansi wanabishana wenyewe kwa facts za kisayansi halafu wakishindwa wanasema well maybe there is super natural power but that power is not god. bcoz when we say it is god it will need us to prove scientific that there is god of which we cant but there is supernatural being.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Iron Lady]

sayansi inajitahidi kueleza mambo mengi but not everything.

 

[Kiranga]

mimi siweZi sema cha mungu kwa maana kimeshuka toka mbinguni, ila ni kitabu cha mungu kwa maana kina stories zinazomuhusu mungu na inahitaji faith kukiamini na kukitumia kwa kazi za kiroho.

Kama vile kitabu cha "Njama" kilivyo cha Willy Gamba.

 

[Kiranga]

kiranga
is this the best accepted theory? or famous theory?
unaamini sayansi kuwa binadamu alievolve? that was scientific failure of all times. sasa imekuwaje siku hizi hatuevolve tena na kuwa kitu kingine au hapa evolution imefikia mwisho? evolution ina mapungufu mengi sana.
mfumo wa jua na chanzo chake,chanzo cha mwanadamu katika dunia hii,perhaps na sababu ya kuwapo katika dunia,and everything that exist had a start na this scientist are trying and trying to explain but they have not come to consensus. hii tu inathibitisha kuwa majibu yao si sahihi ndio maana kila anayeona anaweza kueleza hili anaeleza na mwingine anampinga.
science haijajitosheleza kueleza vyanzo hizi ikaeleweka.

Kufikiri kwamba "sasa hivi hatu evolve" ni sawasawa na kubisha dunia si mviringo kwa sababu huuoni mviringo huu ukitoka barazani kwako.

What you lack is scale.

To see the curvature of the earth you need to look at the world from afar, preferrably from a very tall building or even better a plane.

To see evolution you need to observe living beings for a very long timesscales.Evolution is a process that moves at a snail's pace, and takes billions of years to produce discernible changes.

The continents do shift a few centimeters a few years (Continental Drift), but you can't possibly see this with your eyes.

Bacteria move around your body, but you can't see them with your eyes.

It's all about scale.You can't expect to see bacteria, evolution, continental drift, with your eyes.

The best example of evolution is the bacterial resistance of antibiotics.This can be observed in human timespans because of scale - bacteria do not require much time to reproduce, hence mutations are magnified fastly-

Read some more on the curvature of the earth, evolutionary timescales, continental drift and bacterial resistance of antibiotics.Then relate and reconsider.

 

[Kiranga]

unajua nimekuwa nikifwatilia haya matheory ya sayansi yanayoeleza chanzo cha kila kitu,

Kwanza kabisa sayansi ya kweli haiwezi kueleza chanzo cha kila kitu, hiyo ni domain ya dini.

eti wanasayansi wanabishana wenyewe kwa facts za kisayansi halafu wakishindwa wanasema well maybe there is super natural power

Wana sayansi gani hao? Wa "Flat Earth Society"?

but that power is not god.

Over the years, history has proved that most things that were relegated to the supernatural- lightning and thunder etc- turned out to be yet to be understood natural phenomena.

bcoz when we say it is god it will need us to prove scientific that there is god of which we cant but there is supernatural being.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof, so said that sage of old Sagan.

When you say god made everything, that is an extraordinary claim, back it up by an equally extraordinary proof.

Not some inconsistent fiction.