Chadema should not apologize!

[kipipili]

Mgsalon, you are one great tinker, yes, tinker and not thinker.

vipi na wewe ni great thinker kwa ku-quote bandiko zima na kuuliza swali hilo?

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Mh, Dr. Slaa,

With all due respect to you,
Lately Chadema mnana jikanyaga sana. Nadhani you are having a problem of finding a way to move forward. Dr. Slaa umesema mme tumia lugha ya Kiingereza maksudi kuonyesha tofauti. Kwa nini mtumie Kiingereza wakati majority ya Watanzania hawaongei Kiingereza? Pamoja na wasomi wote ndani ya chama meme shindwa kuexpress msimamo wao kwa Kiswahili?

Ndiyo maana nasema kwamba mmekosea lakini hamtaki kukiri kosa. Haileti maana kusema kitu ni "Lawful but Illegitimate". Kitu kikisha itwa lawful ina maana ni legitimate. Sasa kitu uta semaje ni lawful but at the same time ni illegitimate? Au ndiyo kutake advantage ya Watanzania kuto kujua lugha?

So my point is kwanza mlitakiwa mtafute maneno ya Kiswahili kuexpress msimamo wenu. Chama ambacho kina wasomi haileti maana kusema mlishindwa kutafuta maneno ya Kiswahili kumaanisha mlicho taka kumaanisha mpaka mtumie lugha ambayo majority ya Watanzania hawa tumii!
Pili hakuna sehemu duniana ambao kitu ni lawful lakini ni illegitimate. Tafuta hata maana ya maneno haya kwenye dictionary na mtu utagundua kuwa that statement contradicts itself.

 

[Waberoya]

Dr. Slaa,

Nimesoma sana Katiba yetu hiyo ibara ya 41 kifungu cha 7 kinasema hivi: "Iwapo mgombea ametangazwa na Tume ya Uchaguzi kwamba amechaguliwa kuwa Rais kwa mujibu wa ibara hii, basi hakuna Mahakama yoyote itakayokuwa na mamlaka ya kuchunguza kuchaguliwa kwake." Inaonekana kuwa uongozi wa CHADEMA unaangalia rangi ya bluu tu katika kifungu hicho na kushindwa kuangalia rangi nyekundu. Hakuna mwanasheria anayeweza kuonyesha kuwa kifungu hicho kinataka rais awe amachaguliwa kwa mujibu wa ibara ya 41 yote, ambapo pamoja na mambo mengine ni lazima kifungu chya 6 kiwe kimetimizwa, ambacho kinasema kuwa "Mgombea yeyote wa kiti cha Rais atatangazwa kuwa amechaguliwa kuwa Rais iwapo tu amepata kura nyingi zaidi kuliko mgombea mwingine yeyote. "

(1) Kama kweli kuna ushahidi kuwa matokeo ya Kikwete yalichakachuliwa na hakuwa amepata kura nyingi kuwazidi wagombea wengine na hivyo Tume ilifanya makosa kwa kumtangaza Kikwete kama mshindi bila kutekeleza matakwa yote ya aya 41 ya Katiba, je hamuoni kuwa kifungu cha 7 kitakuwa hakifanyi kazi tena kwa vile rangi nyekundu haikutimia na hivyo matokeoa hayo yanaweza kupingwa?

(2) Iwapo itakuwa ni vigumu kuhoji matokeo hayo, je hamuoni kuwa kuna haja ya kuishitaki tume kwa kosa la kuvunja katiba ya nchi ibara 41(6) kwa kumtangaza mtu ambaye hakupata kura nyingi? katiba haitoi kinga yoyote kwa tume dhidi ya kushitakiwa kwa sababu yoyote ile.

Ningependa jambo hili lichukuliwa kwa umuhimu wa juu sana kabla hatujafikia hatua ya Ivory Coast na Kenya siku za mbeleni.

Thanks, lakini CDM ina wanasheria akina Tundu Lisu, sijui wanasema nini, umeelezea kilichitakiwa kifanyike na sio usanii usanii, watu wameingia kwenye uchaguzi hali wakijua kabisa rules of the game.

Ikiwa kikwete ameshinda (kwa kura halisi za chadema) basi JK ni rais, kama ameshindwa basi ushauri wa Kichuguu ni wa muhimu zaidi.

Yaani issue nzima ilitakiwa iwe discussed word by word! kama kichuguu anavyoeleza hapa

Big up kichuguu

Dar-Es-Salaam,
Nashukuru sana. Kesi ya kumpoka mtu mke? Nadhani ni vema wakaulizwa walioianzisha. Mimi sawa na wewe sijui ilikoenda. Ukifanikiwa kujua nijulishe ili nami nijue ilikoenda au ilikoishia baada ya uchaguzi.

Sidhani kama unalazimika kujibu kila swali, wala hakuna anayekudai labda kama unajisikia kuhukumiwa ndio utalipuka kujibu swali lolote. kama uko clean , then kaa kimya. kama unataka kujibu basi JIBU KWA KUELEWEKA SIO KUWEKA MANENO KAMA HAYA AMBAYO yana maswali mengi sana, usijibu kimtaani wala usijifiche kwenye kivuli cha UCHAGUZI, wote tunaiba wake za watu ila wengine hatujakamatwa tu, hauko peke yako, labda nikutoe hofu!!

 

[Mtazamaji]

• Ni safi sana kama watanzania tungekuwa hatuaminiani hivi.
• Ingekuwa vizuri sana mawazo ya viongozi wetu yote yangekwua yanapata challenge endelevu kama hivi

But kumshambulia mtu badala ya hoa ni kosa pia.

Ile Nakala ya Mwanakijiji hata mimi sikubalini na Hoja zake. Unless aliiweka kifasihi zaidi kama baadhi ya wachambuzi walivyosema. Lakini yeye mwenyewe hajasema hivyo

Tatizo la watu wengi wana support au kuponda hoja fulani kwa kuangalia majina badala ya content

Ile hoja ya MM angeandika kwa alias yake " x" au "y" au "z" isiyojulikana 90% ya wachangiaji wangemshambulia.

 

[Mlachake]

Dokta Slaa, kwa kuwa unapenda kufafanuwa mambo wewe mwenyewe humu jamvini, hicho ni kitu kizuri sana.

Naomba tufafanulie ile kesi yako iliishaje, nadhani ingawa una majukumu mengi lakini utaikumbuka, kama huikumbuki, labda nikudokezee kidogo. Ile ya yule jamaa anaekushutumu kuwa umechukuwa mkewe. Hebu tujuze imefikia wapi?

Watu kama hawa wanastahili burn!! How can you just waste your energy on this crap? anyway, mods please be carefull with guys like these. They are supposed to be burned without notice!

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Thanks, lakini CDM ina wanasheria akina Tundu Lisu, sijui wanasema nini, umeelezea kilichitakiwa kifanyike na sio usanii usanii, watu wameingia kwenye uchaguzi hali wakijua kabisa rules of the game.

Na kweli ina bidi tuwauliza wanasheria wa Chadema kuhusu hii kauli ya Dr. Slaa kwamba "Kikwete's Presidency ni Lawful it is Illegitimate." Watuambia ni wapi inapo wezekana sheria ikawa lawful but illegitimate at the same time. Maana nyingine ya illegitimate ni unlawful sasa ina maana Dr. Anasema Kikwete's presidency is lawful but unlawful???

Pili, kama ulivyo sema wameingia kwenye uchaguzi na sheria hizi hizi. Je wangeshinda wange taka kuzi badilisha? Au hizi kasoro zimeanza kuonekana lini haswa?

 

[kipipili]

Dokta Slaa asnte kwa jibu lako lakini naona unajibu sivyo nilicyoulizan au unachakachuwa? Unasema hujui ilipooenda wakati mimi nimeuliza iliishaje? Sasa Dokta sidhani kama hilo jibu linafanana na swali nililokuuliza. Naomba jibu iliishaje?

soma sentensi ya mwisho kwenye jibu lake 'Ukifanikiwa kujua nijulishe ili nami nijue ilikoenda au ilikoishia baada ya uchaguzi'. usisome kwa kuruka ruka, soma habari nzima ndiyo utapata majibu kamili siyo nusu nusu. Asante

 

[Mlachake]

Nashukuru Mungu amenipa kipaji cha uelewa. Nafikiri nilivyo muelewa mwanakijiji ni tofauti na maoni ya wengi niliyoyasoma hapa

 

[Fundi Mchundo]

Mh, Dr. Slaa,

With all due respect to you,
Lately Chadema mnana jikanyaga sana. Nadhani you are having a problem of finding a way to move forward. Dr. Slaa umesema mme tumia lugha ya Kiingereza maksudi kuonyesha tofauti. Kwa nini mtumie Kiingereza wakati majority ya Watanzania hawaongei Kiingereza? Pamoja na wasomi wote ndani ya chama meme shindwa kuexpress msimamo wao kwa Kiswahili?

Ndiyo maana nasema kwamba mmekosea lakini hamtaki kukiri kosa. Haileti maana kusema kitu ni "Lawful but Illegitimate". Kitu kikisha itwa lawful ina maana ni legitimate. Sasa kitu uta semaje ni lawful but at the same time ni illegitimate? Au ndiyo kutake advantage ya Watanzania kuto kujua lugha?

So my point is kwanza mlitakiwa mtafute maneno ya Kiswahili kuexpress msimamo wenu. Chama ambacho kina wasomi haileti maana kusema mlishindwa kutafuta maneno ya Kiswahili kumaanisha mlicho taka kumaanisha mpaka mtumie lugha ambayo majority ya Watanzania hawa tumii!
Pili hakuna sehemu duniana ambao kitu ni lawful lakini ni illegitimate. Tafuta hata maana ya maneno haya kwenye dictionary na mtu utagundua kuwa that statement contradicts itself.

Mfano rahisi kwa kukujibu. Mtoto anaweza akawa illegitimate lakini mbele ya sheria ni lawful. Hawa jamaa wanachotaka kusema kuwa ni kuwa ingawa Mheshimiwa Rais ni lawful ( kwa maana kuwa sheria na katiba inamtambua) lakini kwa maono yao morally (kwa values na sio law) wao wanaona hastahili.

Amandla.....

 

[VoiceOfReason]

How will that help Tanzanians? Tunaongelea President to be, he has to be responsible. Even kwa mke wa mtu, if he can not be responsible, kama kuna ukweli katika shutuma zilizompeleka kushitakiwa, of ones wife how can he be responsible for the wives and daughters of all Tanzanians? Be a thinker not a tinker.

So you are depending on the president to be responsible for your wife and daughter....... aint you asking a lot..... if you want someone to be responsible for your family then whats your job.... Guys instead of discussing things which will affect all of use you want to discuss people's personal issues which is non of your business unless you are the gentleman who is accusing him, and if so you should take it to courts or start your own post

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Mfano rahisi kwa kukujibu. Mtoto anaweza akawa illegitimate lakini mbele ya sheria ni lawful. Hawa jamaa wanachotaka kusema kuwa ni kuwa ingawa Mheshimiwa Rais ni lawful ( kwa maana kuwa sheria na katiba inamtambua) lakini kwa maono yao morally (kwa values na sio law) wao wanaona hastahili.

Amandla.....

I think I replied to this example of yours in another thread mkuu so for this one I will make it short. Morals/values are matter of opinion which can vary from person to person but the law is a matter of fact which does not consider a person's personal opinion to that law. If their only justification is that JK shouldn't have been swon is as president is morals then they have no case. If you haven't noticed by now there are no morals in politics.

 

[Ng'wanangwa]

So you are depending on the president to be responsible for your wife and daughter.......?

Forgive.

That's how far CCM/Ufisadi supporters can think

 

[VoiceOfReason]

Mh, Dr. Slaa,

Kiingereza wakati majority ya Watanzania hawaongei Kiingereza? Pamoja na wasomi wote ndani ya chama meme shindwa kuexpress msimamo wao kwa Kiswahili?"Lawful but Illegitimate". Kitu kikisha itwa lawful ina maana ni legitimate.

With all due respects my brother, you have just shown your capacity and knowledge about law...... first of all wametumia english sababu vipengele vya sheria iliyotumika vimeandikwa in english kwahiyo translating there might be a loss in translation kikaloose meaning. Second Something might be Okay (By the rule of Law) as kama sheria ya Tanzania Tume ikishatangaza Raisi huwezi kupinga........ lakini its illegitimate that is not legally (morally correct) due to kwamba both mimi na wewe tunajua kwamba wamechakachua..... Therefore since katiba inatake precedents. hata kama una evidence you can not go to court

 

[Fundi Mchundo]

I think I replied to this example of yours in another thread mkuu so for this one I will make it short. Morals/values are matter of opinion which can vary from person to person but the law is a matter of fact which does not consider a person's personal opinion to that law. If their only justification is that JK shouldn't have been swon is as president is morals then they have no case. If you haven't noticed by now there are no morals in politics.

Of course they have no case. That's why they are demanding that the constitution should be changed so that in the future one could challenge such results on both moral and legal grounds.

Amandla......

 

[VoiceOfReason]

Morals/values are matter of opinion which can vary from person to person but the law is a matter of fact which does not consider a person's personal opinion to that law. If their only justification is that JK shouldn't have been swon is as president is morals then they have no case. If you haven't noticed by now there are no morals in politics.

Who said they had a Case in Court of Law...... Katiba hairuhusu... so they dont have case in the eyes of the law lakini morally because a good number of people waliona wamechakacha so they have a case......... Kuhusu illegitimate these are definitions........

1. Against the law; illegal.
2. Born out of wedlock.
3. Grammar Not in correct usage.
4. Incorrectly deduced; illogical.
5. Biology Unacceptable as a scientific name because of contradiction to the international rules of nomenclature.

So from Slaa usage it means number (4) which means the president was sworn kwenye kura which was incorrectly deduced... you know in law you can not pick and choose sentences you need to read the all content a word might mean one thing by itself and another in a sentence

 

[Maishamapya]

MGSalon,
walichokifanya Chadema ni kuwaita CCM wezi wa kura. Sasa ni sawa na wewe mtu akuite mwizi, halafu baadaye anasema kwa marafiki zake kuwa wewe siyo mwizi bila kukuomba radhi; huu hautakuwa uungwana. Kwa hiyo Chadema inawajibika kuomba radhi au kuendelea na msimamo wa awali.

SINA HAKIKA KAMA CHADEMA WAMESEMA CCM SIO WEZI WA KULA. Kwa jinsi nilivyofuatilia hoja za CDM sioni kama wana haja ya kuwaomba watanzania msamaha wowote kwa vile wamekuwa wazi na 'consistent'. Hoja za Mwanakijiji zina kasoro nyingi. Anahitaji asome tena taarifa ya chadema na kuifahamu. Majibu ya hoja zake atayapata.

 

[Mtazamaji]

I think I replied to this example of yours in another thread mkuu so for this one I will make it short. Morals/values are matter of opinion which can vary from person to person but the law is a matter of fact which does not consider a person's personal opinion to that law. If their only justification is that JK shouldn't have been swon is as president is morals then they have no case. If you haven't noticed by now there are no morals in politics.

Law sio fact sababu kuna utashi pia wa binadamu unaweza kuchangia. Sababu anayemtangaza rais ni binadamu. Ingawa anaongzwa na sheria wht if kama lawfully kiwkete alikuwa ameshinda na Mwenyekiti akaamua kwa utashi au sababu anazozijua akamtangaza mtu mwingine

Kwenye masuala ya mahakama kidogo kuna unafuu sababu ingawa kuna miongozo unaona jaji fulani anawez kuhukumu kesi iwe hivi then mtu akikata rufaa jaji mwingine anaamua vinginevyo.

Sasa kwenye masuala ya Uchaguzi wa rais hakuna room ya kuhoji. Yaani ni kama tuna assume Mwenyekiti wa NEC na Tumeya uchaguzi ni malaika or error free anpotangaza matokeo ya urais.

Amepata kura nyingi+ Ametangazwa na tume+ Akishatanganzwa hakuna anayeweza kuhoji!!!!!????

 

[Mungi]

Mwanakijiji ana haki ya kuuliza na kukosoa lolote Chadema kama mtu yeyote yule. Huna haja ya kumuita majina yote hayo. Mimi ninamuelewa vizuri kwa nini kafikia uamuzi huo.
Hata mimi sijaelewa vizuri suala la Chadema kuitambua serikali ya Kikwete hadi waje na sababu za kuniridhisha. La sivyo ni kweli itabidi waombe msamaa kwa kauli zao za kwanza kuwa hawakumtambua rais.
Mimi ni mwana Chadema lakini nasema sintamtambua Kikwete kama rais wangu. Bado ninaamini ni rais wa NEC. sasa sijui na mimi utanitukana? Soma saini yangu na sintaibadilisha.

CHADEMA mpaka sasa hawautambui ushindi wa JK. yale yalikuwa maoni ya wazee wa CDM.

 

[Kichuguu]

Na kweli ina bidi tuwauliza wanasheria wa Chadema kuhusu hii kauli ya Dr. Slaa kwamba "Kikwete's Presidency ni Lawful it is Illegitimate." Watuambia ni wapi inapo wezekana sheria ikawa lawful but illegitimate at the same time. Maana nyingine ya illegitimate ni unlawful sasa ina maana Dr. Anasema Kikwete's presidency is lawful but unlawful???

Pili, kama ulivyo sema wameingia kwenye uchaguzi na sheria hizi hizi. Je wangeshinda wange taka kuzi badilisha? Au hizi kasoro zimeanza kuonekana lini haswa?

Lawful but illegtimate: Kwenye sheria jambo hili lipo sana; kimsingi jambo lolote linalofanywa kwa mujibu wa sheria ni lawful lakini linaweza kuwa illegitimate iwapo halitoshelezi malengo ya sheria ile.

Mifano michache:

Sheria ya ukaguzi wa vitabu vya mahesabu inataka kazi hiyo ifanywe na mtaalamu wa mahesabu. Iwapo mtaalamu huyo atatoa ripoti kuwa mahesabu yako sahihi wakati kuna wizi umefanyika, bado ripoti ile itakuwa ni lawful kwa sababu imefanywa kwa mujibu wa sheria lakini itakuwa ni illegitimate kwa sababu haitoshelezi malengo ya sheria hiyo.

Sheria ya usalama wa raia inawapa madaraka polisi kuwadhibiti watu wanaotaka kuvuruga amani. Iwapo polisi watatutumia nguvu sana kuwapiga raia wanaoandamana, basi bado itakuwa ni lawful action kwa mujibu wa seria hiyo, lakini ni illegitimate kwa vile kufanya hivyo hakuleti amani kwa wananchi hao.

Je wangeshinda wange taka kuzi badilisha?

Hizo kasoro za katiba zilikuwa zinajulikana ila kitu ambacho hakikuwa kinajulikana mapema ni iwapo kweli Tume ingeweza kufanya maovu ya aina hiyo. Hata hivyo mojawapo ya ahadi za Slaa ilikuwa ni kuanza mchakato wa kubadili katiba katika muda wa siku mia moja

 

[zomba]

vipi na wewe ni great thinker kwa ku-quote bandiko zima na kuuliza swali hilo?

Hilo si swali ni statement, na nime-quote bandiko zima kuonyesha how much a tinker he is.