'Who created God' is an Illogical Question!

gasgas · Oct 13, 2016

Maji67 said:
Does God has desire?
If God has a desire and He is ruler of everything then He is to blame for everything happens to us. If He has a desire, be will definitely makes mistakes all the time so He can't be Omniscient at all. Smh I agree with those who say that Abrahamic religions have root in pagans' religions coz as Homer put it "The Gods' war" so can be true because of their Desire.

Better say you are not sure of this coz if he/He has desire then everything about him/Him will perfect makes sense that He isnot Perfect at all;He hides himself and want us to believe in Him blindly, He has created Devil and praised him as a mostly devoted angel at first kisha badae akamlaani (Hakuliona hilo kabla ya kumuumba? );He has created Adam bila kujua atakuwa mpweke mwenyewe bila kujua watadanganywa na shetani huyo huyo aliyemsamehe mwanzoni etc And as how some philosopher said early "God is our enemy."
Note:This doesn't mean He is real existing

Why is he to blame.
He gave man a free will to choose what is right and what is wrong and he revealed the consequences of man choosing either right or wrong
If man baada ya kupewa all the choices and information needed to make a decision yeye akachagua the wrong one, nani mwenye makosa hapo eh?

He doesnt want us to believe him blindly, he wants us to believe him by faith first before we are able to understand him in the mind.
That's how he operates

Wewe hapo unataka Mungu angeoperate kama binadamu kwaza because binadamu anataka aelewe kwanza ndiyo anaamini

Basically unamlaumu Mungu kwa sababu Mungu haoperate the same way binadamu anaoperate wakati He is God and we are humans

Alimuumba shetani kama malaika wa nuru, na kupitia disobedience yake God's character has been revealed to us.
Through disobedience ya shetani, God's character itakuwa revealed kwa viumbe wake. Nikipata nafasi ntakuelezea hii kwa undani zaidi

There's purpose behind everything

gasgas · Oct 13, 2016

Kiranga said:
If you have everything, what will you desire?

Naona hujanielewa what i mean by "desire"

Let me put it this way

Umepata hela na ukaamua kuunda a company, as the CEO there's a certain way you prefer/desire things to be run. A way that suits your purpose

that's what i meant

Kiranga · Oct 13, 2016

gasgas said:
Naona hujanielewa what i mean by "desire"

Let me put it this way

Umepata hela na ukaamua kuunda a company, as the CEO there's a certain way you prefer/desire things to be run. A way that suits your purpose

that's what i meant

Swali langu ni dogo tu, ambalo hujalijibu.

If you have everything, what will you desire?

CEO ana desire kwa sababu hana kila kitu.

Mungu mwenye kila kitu, ata desire nini ambacho hana tayari?

Na akiweza ku desire, ina maana hicho anacho desire hana (hawezi ku desire ambacho anacho tayari), huyo ambaye hana kila kitu (na ana desire kitu fulani) atakuwaje Mungu mwenye kila kitu hapo hapo?

If you have everything, what will you desire?

If you do desire something, do you really have everything?

de·sire
dəˈzī(ə)r/
noun

1.
a strong feeling of wanting to have something or wishing for something to happen.
"a desire to work in the dirt with your bare hands"
synonyms: wish, want, aspiration, fancy, inclination, impulse; More

verb

1.
strongly wish for or want (something).
"he never achieved the status he so desired"
synonyms: want, wish for, long for, yearn for, crave, hanker after, be desperate for, be bent on,covet, aspire to; More

ShyaRuwa · Oct 13, 2016

Maji67 said:
Let's cut the chase, kwanini tusitumie njia bora iliyotumiwa na mitume huko nyuma. Nakumbuka Mungu alijitokeza (in physical form) mbele ya Musa ili tu kumwaminisha yeye , nakumbuka pia Mungu alimsaidia Musa kutenda miujiza mikubwa (kama isemwavyo) ili kumwaminisha farao. Nakumbuka nmesikia hata kwenye Quran, Mtume alitenda miujiza ikiwemo kushusha Jua usoni kwake (kama isemwavyo)·Sasa mbna nyie mnaosema mungu yupo hamjitahid vya kutosha kuthibitisha yuko? Kwanini msiongea naye ajitokeze au afanye kwetu kama alivyofanya kwa musa? Sidhani kama mungu anataka Dogmatists, wale wanaoshindwa hata kuonyesha yuko/hajafa/ni omniscient/omnipresent etc.
Bila hivo, hamtakuwa na tofauti yoyote na wengine, wote tutakuwa tuliopotoea (relativism), na swali la "mungu yupo au hayupo" litakuwa illogical kwa wote.
Kaa chini, ongea na mungu wako kama alivyofabmnya Yona wakati ule. Mweleze jinsi tusivyomwamini kama Yupo au Yuhai pamoja na sisi, then mwombe ajitokeze kama alivyofanya kwa musa.

Mkuu niliwahi kuanzisha mada hapa nikieleza [HASHTAG]#Makosa10[/HASHTAG] aliyotenda Mungu.....kuishi mafichoni ni kosa kubwa sana, ndio maana huu ubishi hauhishi.....Sasa kama alishadanja, sisi tutajuaje?

gasgas · Oct 13, 2016

Ubavu said:
Mkuu mi hata nikikukuta kwenye chumba cha upasuaji na ikawa we ndo oparetor mwenyewe sitakubali unihudumie especially kwa ujinga uliouonyesha hapa... ! Hivi hata historia ya medicine unaifahamu kweli ?! Unajua tumetoka wapi kweli ?! Unafahamu for just 500 years kuna maendeleo mengi sana yamefanyika katika field nzima ya medicine kuliko dini ?! Na kama wanasayansi wangetegemea kila kitu kutoka kwa mungu unadhani tungekuwa hapa leo? Its a shame.. !

Sio mbaya i'll let you die in your rebellion

Wewe unaifahamu historia ya Medicne?
Tuassume mimi mjinga sijui lolote. Nipe hiyo historia ya medicine unayoijua

Sasa maendeleo ni nini hasa? Binadamu amepewa wisdom na always anatafuta kufahamu zaidi jinsi ya kuboresha mustakabali wake.

Does that mean he is always right?
Does that mean hakosei au kuna muda anafikia conclusion fulani halafu miaka ijayo anakuja kugundua alikosea?

Kama wanasayansi wangemtegemea Mungu tusingefika hapa? Hiyo ni a matter of "what ifs" na wala hamna evidence kwamba science and faith can't coexist

As a matter of fact many scientists tu hivi recently wanaturn towards faith, because it provides answers

It's a shame kwako wewe actually

gasgas · Oct 13, 2016

CHARMILTON said:
Mkuu niliwahi kuanzisha mada hapa nikieleza Makosa 10 aliyotenda Mungu.....kuishi mafichoni ni kosa kubwa sana, ndio maana huu ubishi hauhishi.....Sasa kama alishadanja, sisi tutajuaje?

unasema makosa based on what?
Based on uelewa utafakari wako?

Based on kitabu kilichoandikwa mtu mwingine ambaye unakubali mtazamo wako?

Based on what actually?

Ubavu · Oct 13, 2016

gasgas said:
If i may ask,
is evolution a continuous process?
Mbona haiendelei, what happened?
Why don't we see other species continually changing and adapting to different life forms?

Yes it is a continous process.. Actually hata wewe hapo ulipo ni tokeo la evolution (microevolution) jiulize hivi ni kwann wewe unafanana na watu wa familia yako na sio watu wa familia yangu ? Na kwanini Mimi na wewe hatufanani na wazungu wala watu wa race nyingine ?! Kama unaweza kuishi miaka zaidi ya milioni Mona then at least tena ni at least ndo ungeweza kupata kuona mabadiliko.. !

Na naomba kitu kimoja... Watanzania wengi tuna misconceptions nyingi sana kuhusu evolution ! No actually hizi misconceptions zipo kwa watu wengi tu dunia nzima... ! Naomba msome na sio mnaropoka mambo ambayo hamyafahamu ! Hii sio dini ambayo ili kuelewa lazima uvae miwani ya faith..! Science haiitaji faith kwa wewe kuijua you just need to reach out and study it !

Kiranga · Oct 13, 2016

CHARMILTON said:
Mkuu niliwahi kuanzisha mada hapa nikieleza [HASHTAG]#Makosa10[/HASHTAG] aliyotenda Mungu.....kuishi mafichoni ni kosa kubwa sana, ndio maana huu ubishi hauhishi.....Sasa kama alishadanja, sisi tutajuaje?

Mungu hayupo, angekuwepo asingejificha hivi.

Ajifiche kwani yeye mwali?

Ubavu · Oct 13, 2016

gasgas said:
Friend
Evolution is a theory not a FACT,
It's a possible explanation
For you to prove that evolution you would need to be there to observe a given species from a time it started as a certain life form to how it changed to another

All there is to it is possible explanations by certain men and some connections that can support the explanation

Association doesnt necessarily mean Causation

And as a matter of fact many scientists are adopting Creation as a more plausible explanation as compared to evolution and what not

Totally wrong !

gasgas · Oct 13, 2016

Y

Kiranga said:
Swali langu ni dogo tu, ambalo hujalijibu.

If you have everything, what will you desire?

CEO ana desire kwa sababu hana kila kitu.

Mungu mwenye kila kitu, ata desire nini ambacho hana tayari?

Na akiweza ku desire, ina maana hicho anacho desire hana (hawezi ku desire ambacho anacho tayari), huyo ambaye hana kila kitu (na ana desire kitu fulani) atakuwaje Mungu mwenye kila kitu hapo hapo?

If you have everything, what will you desire?

If you do desire something, do you really have everything?

de·sire
dəˈzī(ə)r/
noun

1.
a strong feeling of wanting to have something or wishing for something to happen.
"a desire to work in the dirt with your bare hands"
synonyms: wish, want, aspiration, fancy, inclination, impulse; More

verb

1.
strongly wish for or want (something).
"he never achieved the status he so desired"
synonyms: want, wish for, long for, yearn for, crave, hanker after, be desperate for, be bent on,covet, aspire to; More

Yes if you have everything you can still desire.

You can desire the way things you have ziweze kuoperate in a certain way.
It's more like a preference. God desires for man to relate to him in a certain way. If man does or doesn't, it doesn't change anything of what God has

gasgas · Oct 13, 2016

Ubavu said:
Totally wrong !

No
What you should have said is
"I disagree with you"

Wrong or Right depends on point of reference
What you base your statements on

Ubavu · Oct 13, 2016

gasgas said:
Friend
Vitu vingi ni vigumu kujulikana

Especially hiyo Science ambayo most probably ni your standing point

Nitoe mfano

Kweynye mwili wa binadamu tunafahamu kuna mfumo wa fahamu, kuna Neurons ambazo zinabeba taarifa kutoka sehemu mbali mbali za mwili

Tunafahamu kuwa binadamu kuwa ana ubongo ambao hupokea taarifa kwa kupitia hizi neurons ambazo zinabeba taarifa in form of electric signals

lakini muulize neurosurgeon yeyote
How does an electric signal transform to kumbukumbu fulani kwenye brain hana jibu.

Jinsi gani electric signals zinageuka kuwa kumbukumbu ambayo ni vivid kabisa, Mechanism ipoje
Hawezi kukwambia
Je wanweza kugeuza signal za umeme zozote tu na kuzi-induce kwa binadamu ikawa kumbukumbu fulani?

Lakini just because hatuelewi doesnt mean mechanism haipo.

just because we cant prove, doesnt mean haipo

It means we are limited

Kutokua na jibu leo haimaanishi kuwa hakuna jibu ! Unajua kuna vitu vingapi ambavyo mwaka 1500 watu walikuwa hawavijui na leo vinajulikana.. ?! Lakini jiulize ni vitu vingapi ambavyo vimejikanganya kwenye vitabu vya dini na mpaka leo hakuna hata anayeattempt kuvijua...?! Mmelizika kabisa...!

ShyaRuwa · Oct 13, 2016

gasgas said:
unasema makosa based on what?
Based on uelewa utafakari wako?

Based on kitabu kilichoandikwa mtu mwingine ambaye unakubali mtazamo wako?

Based on what actually?

Based on the logical positivism!

gasgas · Oct 13, 2016

Ubavu said:
mkuu rudi ukasome biology ya form four.. !

Theory ya evolution ina Weaknesses za kutosha
I am surprised at how uniconsider kama Fact wakati it's only a theory

Hata kweny medicne tuna theories nyingi tu on mechanisms by which certain diseases come about.
We dont take them as fact, we take as they are, theories until proven beyond reasonable doubt

Kiranga · Oct 13, 2016

gasgas said:
Y

Yes if you have everything you can still desire.
You can desire the way things you have ziweze kuoperate in a certain way.
It's more like a preference
God desires for man to relate to him in a certain way
If man does or doesn't, it doesn't change anything of what God has

If you desire things to operate by plan B, while they are operating by plan A, you do not have everything.

You do not have the satisfaction of seeing things going the way you want.

That is why you will desire to see things going by plan B.

Desire shows a shortcoming. A goal not reached. Something not attained. A wish.

If you say God has a desire you are saying God is not perfect. A perfect being cannot have a desire. Desire shows a shortcoming. A wish. A goal not attained, a preference - to use your own word- not realized.

A perfect being cannot have desire. In fact, in Buddhist teachings, in order to become a Buddha, one thing a person has to overcome and eliminate is desire.

So desire shows imperfection. Desire shows room for improvement.

You cannot have room for improvement in a perfect being.

That is why I am telling you that your godhead who has desires is a man made idea.

By the way, you have not resolved the contradictions in the bible.

ShyaRuwa · Oct 13, 2016

Kiranga said:
Mungu hayupo, angekuwepo asingejificha hivi.

Ajifiche kwani yeye mwali?

Watu wanahangaika sana kutaka kumjua Mungu wasijue Mungu ni outdated Idea.Mungu ni fantasy na hallucination za watu wa kale kama kina Abraham walizojianzishia ili kujipa sababu ya mambo yaliyokuwa yakiwatokea ambayo hawakuyaelewa.

Lakini hivi sasa sayansi inajitahidi sana kuelezea mambo ambayo hayakueleweka kwa mababu zetu.

gasgas · Oct 13, 2016

Ubavu said:
Kutokua na jibu leo haimaanishi kuwa hakuna jibu ! Unajua kuna vitu vingapi ambavyo mwaka 1500 watu walikuwa hawavijui na leo vinajulikana.. ?! Lakini jiulize ni vitu vingapi ambavyo vimejikanganya kwenye vitabu vya dini na mpaka leo hakuna hata anayeattempt kuvijua...?! Mmelizika kabisa...!

So unakubali kuwa the world of science inachange, it's dynamic
So kwa nini wewe unaichukulia Evolution THEORY as a fact.
Wakati ni theory na inaweza kuwa disproved vile vile.

Vitabu vya dini vimejikanyaga?
Just because umekutana na mtu ambaye hayupo well grounded kwenye Scriptures akashindwa kuelezea doesnt mean kwamba the scripture is wrong,
it means the person is lacking in revelation of the scripture and he ought to go and read more

Ubavu · Oct 13, 2016

gasgas said:
No wewe ndiyo ukasome Biology

It's a theory of evolution
Ni nadharia
Yaani attempt ya mtu kuelezea jambo fulani

Nadharia siyo fact
Theory is not fact

Hivi hata maana ya theory unaifahamu kweli ?

Ubavu · Oct 13, 2016

MSEZA MKULU said:
Evolution ni Theory with Millions of weakness,

Fahamu pia kwenye science hakuna 100% certainty..!

Kiranga · Oct 13, 2016

CHARMILTON said:
Watu wanahangaika sana kutaka kumjua Mungu wasijue Mungu ni outdated Idea.Mungu ni fantasy na hallucination za watu wa kale kama kina Abraham walizojianzishia ili kujipa sababu ya mambo yaliyokuwa yakiwatokea ambayo hawakuyaelewa.....Lakini hivi sasa sayansi inajitahidi sana kuelezea mambo ambayo hayakueleweka kwa mababu zetu.

Ujue zamani kulikua na vita sana kati ya makabila.

Sasa ili kuwaunganisha watu wa kabila moja ili wapigane kama kitu kimoja, ilibidi wazee watunge story iliyo kubwa kuliko kabila lao.

Ni kama Kinjekitile Ngwale alivyowaambia watu wapigane na Mjerumani, na wakipigana risasi zitageuka Maji.

Kama tungeshinda vita na tungekuwa watu wa kuandika, baada ya miaka elfu kadhaa ya kutia chumvi tungekuwa na dini yetu na Kinjekitile angekuwa mtume.

Hizi habari za vita vya kikabila zimechangia sana kuendeleza propaganda kwa jina la Mungu.

Ajabu ni kwamba leo tumeelimika lakini bado tunashikilia uongo huu wawazi kabisa.

'Who created God' is an Illogical Question!

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