RWANDA'S HUNTED: Inside the plots to kill Rwanda’s dissidents

[Commanche]

1. So kama inner circle (akazu) iliongozwa na mke wa habyarimana, na ndio hao unadai walitungua ndege, are you saying mke wa habyarimana alichukia watutsi kiasi cha kumtungua mumewe? Hivi hii inaingia akilini kweli?

The real story behind tulishaijadili hapa:https://www.jamiiforums.com/interna...and-will-continue-to-kill-if-not-stopped.html

2. Speech ya ingabire unayodai ina uchochezi ni hii hapa chini kila mtanzania anaweza kujionea mwenyewe: Which part of Victoire Ingabire's speech is evidence of divisionism? « Analysis « The Proxy Lake

3. Kuhusu genocide numbers, kila siku mnashindwa kuthibitisha kivipi watutsi 800-1mil waliuawa. Unasema eti census iliyofanya na UN kwa ufadhili wa US na Canada ilikuwa flawed, okay, mbona haikuwahi kuwa disputed then mpaka pale mnapotaka kufanya genocide iwe ya watutsi? for 3 years mbona RPA hawakusema chochote (they were also a political party no?). These are the facts:

1. census of 1991 gives total number of Tutsis at 596,387 which is 8.4% of the entire population of Rwanda
2. survivor group "Ibuka" counts 300,000 survivors. This number is agreed by the kagame's gov.
3. Lakini la muhimu kabisa ni watutsi wenyewe waliofiwa. Ibuka hao hao walitafuta nyumba hadi nyumba watutsi wangapi wamepotea wakapata less than 500,000 verified genocide victims, hao marehemu wengine 600,000 to 1mil unadhani ni nani? Halafu hapo hapo wahutu wamekatazwa kusema kuwa na wao walichinjwa hivyo ingabire kuhoji "when will our dead be mourned" anawekwa jela miaka 8! wakati simple logic inaonyesha kuwa majority ya victims wa 94 ni wahutu! Hilo hata ufanyeje halibadilishiki, it doesn't matter how many times you prepare those festivities year after year, the number of Hutu "remembering" will always be greater than the number of tutsis.
4. Lakini ili tumalize mgogoro, kwa nini wewe hauna methodology yoyote ile inayothibitisha kuwa watutsi ndio waliokufa, hata alternative census figures pia huna, why?

Cc: JustDoItNow rushasha KIM KARDASH irankunda

jMali tatizo lako you are very selective when it comes to giving your sources to support your arguments. Wengine tunaandika nondoz hapa wewe unachukua na ku-google na wikipedia halafu unatutuhumu eti tumetoa huko, unateleza kijana. Koba katoa nondoz za sensa hapa lakini unajifanya kama hujaona. Nilikwambia muda mrefu sana kuwa sensa kabla ya 1994 zilikuwa za kupikwa kwa kuwa watawala wa ki-hutu wa mrengo mkali hawakutaka namba sahihi ya tutsi ijulikane kwa sababu zao za kizandiki na kibaguzi. Soma alicho-post Koba uone na kuelewa. Sensa kufadhiliwa na kusimamiwa na UN, US, Canada haileti tofauti yeyote. Mbona UN under a Canadian three-star general walikuwepo wakati watu milioni moja wanauawa kikatili all over Rwanda and they did nothing. so who fcuking cares about the UN, US, or Canadians? Usibabaikie wazungu kiasi hicho kijana. Wao ni watu kama wewe wenye mapungufu kama mwanadamu yeyote.

Victoire Ingabire is a terrorist and divisionist. Hakujua kuwa serikali ya Rwanda imejipanga vizuri na ina habari zake zote. She came with her typical European patronizing towards Africans and thought she could railroad people into submission. Watu wakamkataa na siasa zake dhalimu za kibaguzi na kimauaji.

 

[irankunda]

jMali tatizo lako you are very selective when it comes to giving your sources to support your arguments. Wengine tunaandika nondoz hapa wewe unachukua na ku-google na wikipedia halafu unatutuhumu eti tumetoa huko, unateleza kijana. Koba katoa nondoz za sensa hapa lakini unajifanya kama hujaona. Nilikwambia muda mrefu sana kuwa sensa kabla ya 1994 zilikuwa za kupikwa kwa kuwa watawala wa ki-hutu wa mrengo mkali hawakutaka namba sahihi ya tutsi ijulikane kwa sababu zao za kizandiki na kibaguzi. Soma alicho-post Koba uone na kuelewa. Sensa kufadhiliwa na kusimamiwa na UN, US, Canada haileti tofauti yeyote. Mbona UN under a Canadian three-star general walikuwepo wakati watu milioni moja wanauawa kikatili all over Rwanda and they did nothing. so who fcuking cares about the UN, US, or Canadians? Usibabaikie wazungu kiasi hicho kijana. Wao ni watu kama wewe wenye mapungufu kama mwanadamu yeyote.

Victoire Ingabire is a terrorist and divisionist. Hakujua kuwa serikali ya Rwanda imejipanga vizuri na ina habari zake zote. She came with her typical European patronizing towards Africans and thought she could railroad people into submission. Watu wakamkataa na siasa zake dhalimu za kibaguzi na kimauaji.

Unatia huruma Commanche; kwa hiyo na wewe unalazimisha wote tukubali mnachotaka nyie? Ila am not surprised coz this is a typical tutsi behavior!....Simjui sana huyo Victoire Ingabire, ila badala ya kusema alikataliwa na watu, ungesema alikataliwa na watutsi kwa sababu yeye ni muhutu. Kama sensa za before 1994 zilikuwa sio za kweli kwa sababu za wahutu kutoa wrong statistics, kwa nini unataka tukubali kuwa za baada ya 1994 ndio za kweli? kwanini tusiseme kuwa na watutsi wanatoa wrong statistics kupotosha namba halisi ya wahutu wakati it is well known that, wahutu are second class citizens huko rwanda?....sometimes responding to your comments seems to me foolish, but I keep on coming here ili usiwadanganye WaTanzania ambao hawajui the real history ya hutu - tutsi relations. Sisi wa kutoka huku Ngara we know it well, si kwa kusoma kwenye google kama unavyofanya wewe, lakini we have a first hand experience coz we live together, we speak the same language; we go in the same Church etc, etc....for that matter sitokubali kuona unawadanganya WaTanzania wengine. By the way, a BOOK is on preparation,,,,,,,,hata watoto wa Primary School will come to know about the hutus and the tutsis and how the later has been oppressing the former and the reaction of the former...

 

[Commanche]

Unatia huruma Commanche; kwa hiyo na wewe unalazimisha wote tukubali mnachotaka nyie? Ila am not surprised coz this is a typical tutsi behavior!....Simjui sana huyo Victoire Ingabire, ila badala ya kusema alikataliwa na watu, ungesema alikataliwa na watutsi kwa sababu yeye ni muhutu. Kama sensa za before 1994 zilikuwa sio za kweli kwa sababu za wahutu kutoa wrong statistics, kwa nini unataka tukubali kuwa za baada ya 1994 ndio za kweli? kwanini tusiseme kuwa na watutsi wanatoa wrong statistics kupotosha namba halisi ya wahutu wakati it is well known that, wahutu are second class citizens huko rwanda?....sometimes responding to your comments seems to me foolish, but I keep on coming here ili usiwadanganye WaTanzania ambao hawajui the real history ya hutu - tutsi relations. Sisi wa kutoka huku Ngara we know it well, si kwa kusoma kwenye google kama unavyofanya wewe, lakini we have a first hand experience coz we live together, we speak the same language; we go in the same Church etc, etc....for that matter sitokubali kuona unawadanganya WaTanzania wengine. By the way, a BOOK is on preparation,,,,,,,,hata watoto wa Primary School will come to know about the hutus and the tutsis and how the later has been oppressing the former and the reaction of the former...

Mara unituhumu kuwa m-Tutsi mara useme na-google. Make up your mind dude. Jew me all you want but I will not change my mind. Nyie watu mnatetea wauaji walioua mamia ya maelfu ya watu wasio na hatia. Na bado wana mipango hiyo hiyo. Wewe kutoka Ngara sijui wapi it does not matter. Weka ubishi kwenye facts sio mtu. Wako watu ndani ya Rwanda wenye mawazo kama ya kwako, sishangai. Lakini ukweli utabaki pale pale.

 

[JustDoItNow]

jMali tatizo lako you are very selective when it comes to giving your sources to support your arguments. Wengine tunaandika nondoz hapa wewe unachukua na ku-google na wikipedia halafu unatutuhumu eti tumetoa huko, unateleza kijana. Koba katoa nondoz za sensa hapa lakini unajifanya kama hujaona. Nilikwambia muda mrefu sana kuwa sensa kabla ya 1994 zilikuwa za kupikwa kwa kuwa watawala wa ki-hutu wa mrengo mkali hawakutaka namba sahihi ya tutsi ijulikane kwa sababu zao za kizandiki na kibaguzi. Soma alicho-post Koba uone na kuelewa. Sensa kufadhiliwa na kusimamiwa na UN, US, Canada haileti tofauti yeyote. Mbona UN under a Canadian three-star general walikuwepo wakati watu milioni moja wanauawa kikatili all over Rwanda and they did nothing. so who fcuking cares about the UN, US, or Canadians? Usibabaikie wazungu kiasi hicho kijana. Wao ni watu kama wewe wenye mapungufu kama mwanadamu yeyote.

Victoire Ingabire is a terrorist and divisionist. Hakujua kuwa serikali ya Rwanda imejipanga vizuri na ina habari zake zote. She came with her typical European patronizing towards Africans and thought she could railroad people into submission. Watu wakamkataa na siasa zake dhalimu za kibaguzi na kimauaji.

We mnyamulenge, rudi kwenu Congo msituni. Hata ukimfagilia kagame kiasi gani. yeye ushaambiwa anataka watusi fulani wa uganda. siyo ninyi. Irankunda kashatoa data zenu, huwezi kutuchota akili tena. Kuyajua makabila ya TZ bado hakujakuhararisha wewe kuwa mbongo.

 

[Commanche]

We mnyamulenge, rudi kwenu Congo msituni. Hata ukimfagilia kagame kiasi gani. yeye ushaambiwa anataka watusi fulani wa uganda. siyo ninyi. Irankunda kashatoa data zenu, huwezi kutuchota akili tena. Kuyajua makabila ya TZ bado hakujakuhararisha wewe kuwa mbongo.

Profesa Lwakabamba naye ni mtutsi wa Uganda? te he he. Rwanda ni moja,hakuna nafasi ya makundi.

 

[irankunda]

Profesa Lwakabamba naye ni mtutsi wa Uganda? te he he. Rwanda ni moja,hakuna nafasi ya makundi.

Prof Lwakabamba alikulia hapa TZ; anachotaka PaKa ni Anglophones wa kitutsi, hata watutsi wenzao ambao ni francophone hawatakiwi hii ikiwa ni mpango wa kuwa eliminate wahutu ambao majority ni francophone.. so hiyo ndio point ya JustDoItNow..

 

[irankunda]

Mara unituhumu kuwa m-Tutsi mara useme na-google. Make up your mind dude. Jew me all you want but I will not change my mind. Nyie watu mnatetea wauaji walioua mamia ya maelfu ya watu wasio na hatia. Na bado wana mipango hiyo hiyo. Wewe kutoka Ngara sijui wapi it does not matter. Weka ubishi kwenye facts sio mtu. Wako watu ndani ya Rwanda wenye mawazo kama ya kwako, sishangai. Lakini ukweli utabaki pale pale.

..Yes both, you are an EXTREMIST TUTSI, and you don't have any facts in your hands, you just rely on google to spit your lies here....HAKUNA anayewatetea wauji hapa; ila ukweli ndio usemwe; msituletee hadithi za eti watutsi ndio waliokufa wengi..hata kama ni hivyo, but it is RPA under the leadership of PaKa and Mu7 who ignited the massacre of Rwandans...so hao ndio wakuwalaumu!

 

[Koba]

I think most Tanzanians are big time supporter of Rwanda as well. But they just don't like Kagame regime as it perpetuate Hutu vs Tutsi hate vicious circle. Kagame his cronies should try to live like Nyerere instead of praising nyerere and raiding and looting your fellow african in Congo.

Kagame hana upuuzi unaoandika that's why Rwanda is doing fine na inasonga mbele,mengine ni propaganda tuu na wananchi wanaelewa ila nina uhakika hata JK angekuwa anawashughulikia mafisadi na wachafuzi etc leo hii angeitwa dictator,acha genociders na mafisadi,wala rushwa etc washughulikiwe na wanywarwanda watakuja kumshukuru Kagame...hakuna haja ya kuachia upuuzi ili kufurahisha wachache then you end up with another genocide,endless civil wars and failed state like Somalia or any other African states,na Kagame hana cronies and is the one working hard to end hiyo hate vicious circle...Kagame is my hero.

 

[Koba]

..Yes both, you are an EXTREMIST TUTSI, and you don't have any facts in your hands, you just rely on google to spit your lies here....HAKUNA anayewatetea wauji hapa; ila ukweli ndio usemwe; msituletee hadithi za eti watutsi ndio waliokufa wengi..hata kama ni hivyo, but it is RPA under the leadership of PaKa and Mu7 who ignited the massacre of Rwandans...so hao ndio wakuwalaumu!

Muhutu wa Ngara unayechukia mbunge wako just because ana asili ya utusi,achana na akili za interahamwe mpuuzi wa mwisho wewe la sivyo utaishia pabaya.

 

[murutongore]

Earth calling jMali....kwa ninavyomjua huyu jamaa, ile nondo niliyompa ya statistics imemfukuza kabisa hapa. I bet you this guy will never return here. Amefyata mkia. Shiee...jamaa anadhani eti by being silent we don't have data.

cc Koba Commanche MUKAMASIMBA,

 

[murutongore]

Unatia huruma Commanche; kwa hiyo na wewe unalazimisha wote tukubali mnachotaka nyie? Ila am not surprised coz this is a typical tutsi behavior!....Simjui sana huyo Victoire Ingabire, ila badala ya kusema alikataliwa na watu, ungesema alikataliwa na watutsi kwa sababu yeye ni muhutu. Kama sensa za before 1994 zilikuwa sio za kweli kwa sababu za wahutu kutoa wrong statistics, kwa nini unataka tukubali kuwa za baada ya 1994 ndio za kweli? kwanini tusiseme kuwa na watutsi wanatoa wrong statistics kupotosha namba halisi ya wahutu wakati it is well known that, wahutu are second class citizens huko rwanda?....sometimes responding to your comments seems to me foolish, but I keep on coming here ili usiwadanganye WaTanzania ambao hawajui the real history ya hutu - tutsi relations. Sisi wa kutoka huku Ngara we know it well, si kwa kusoma kwenye google kama unavyofanya wewe, lakini we have a first hand experience coz we live together, we speak the same language; we go in the same Church etc, etc....for that matter sitokubali kuona unawadanganya WaTanzania wengine. By the way, a BOOK is on preparation,,,,,,,,hata watoto wa Primary School will come to know about the hutus and the tutsis and how the later has been oppressing the former and the reaction of the former...

1. Hakuna anaekulazimisha ukubali facts. Whether you like it or not. FACT ARE FACTS.

2. There you go again with your stereotypical comments. What is tutsi behavior?

 

[KIM KARDASH]

1. Hakuna anaekulazimisha ukubali facts. Whether you like it or not. FACT ARE FACTS.

2. There you go again with your stereotypical comments. What is tutsi behavior?

Baada ya kusoma mtiririko mzima wa comments kwenye hii post sasa nimeanza kuelewa kwa nini kagame anatumia nguvu nyingi sana au niseme mkono wa chuma kuitawala rwanda,you guys wote wawili i mean hayo makundi yenu mna matatizo makubwa sana,mnachukiiana kupita kiasi,hii inadhihirika popote mnapokutana sio rwanda ama burundi tu,hata ngara na kwingineko mlipo pamoja mnakaa kimakundi,uchaguzi wa mbunge wa ngara mfano mzuri,huwa mnachaguana kwa misingi hiyo ya ukabila.So style anayoitumia kagame kutawala inatokana na historia yenu,nawafananisha na wazanzibar kwa maana ya uunguja na upemba(uarabu),ndio maana kuongoza zanzibar ni lazima uwe mbabe kama karume au comandoo salmin!the same to rwanda,ndio mana kagame hamuamini mtu yeyote nadhani hata mkewe hamuamini pia,ana wasiwasi wa kupinduliwa,hana raha wala amani na urais wake.

 

[murutongore]

Baada ya kusoma mtiririko mzima wa comments kwenye hii post sasa nimeanza kuelewa kwa nini kagame anatumia nguvu nyingi sana au niseme mkono wa chuma kuitawala rwanda,you guys wote wawili i mean hayo makundi yenu mna matatizo makubwa sana,mnachukiiana kupita kiasi,hii inadhihirika popote mnapokutana sio rwanda ama burundi tu,hata ngara na kwingineko mlipo pamoja mnakaa kimakundi,uchaguzi wa mbunge wa ngara mfano mzuri,huwa mnachaguana kwa misingi hiyo ya ukabila.So style anayoitumia kagame kutawala inatokana na historia yenu,nawafananisha na wazanzibar kwa maana ya uunguja na upemba(uarabu),ndio maana kuongoza zanzibar ni lazima uwe mbabe kama karume au comandoo salmin!the same to rwanda,ndio mana kagame hamuamini mtu yeyote nadhani hata mkewe hamuamini pia,ana wasiwasi wa kupinduliwa,hana raha wala amani na urais wake.

Nikuulize tena.

1. What is tutsi behavior?

 

[jMali]

cc: irankunda KIM KARDASH na watanzania wote.

Dear murutongore, Commanche MUKAMASIMBA Koba

Utangulizi:
Mimi silipwi kushindwa humu JF i actually have a job! sio kama baadhi yenu ambao mmepewa kibarua cha kushinda humu JF kumsafisha kagame. Nilishawaambieni mkitaka kuniona humu full time basi mnilipe! Unless mliona niko online halafu sijawajibu ambapo mngetakiwa kutuma live message basi, sio mnaona kabisa niko offline halafu mnajitamba eti "nimefyata mkia", aliyefyata mkia ni yule aliyeumbuka twitter kwa kutumia akaunti richardgoldstone. Jiafrika zima hata kujificha linatumia jina la kizungu! Limbukeni wa kutupwa!
Msidhani kuna hoja yoyote nashindwa kuwajibu nyinyi tutsi-extremists. Nyie wepesi sana, for the record mijadala yote kuhusu Rwanda huwa nashinda mimi kwa hoja ambazo mnashindwa kujibu. Hamshangai tu watu zaidi ya wanne mnapambana na mtu mmoja? kila b.w.e.ge ooh jMali hivi, ooh jMali vile, jMali anawanyima usingizi ee? ..

haya twende kazi, ninajibu kwa mtiririko wa gazeti lenu, nikikosea mtiririko mnisamehe hii ni freestyle....

From your own so called "nondo" I gathered the following points, remember all these are quotations FROM YOUR OWN "NONDO" not my words!:

1. "Unrest started in Rwanda at the end of 1990, when the RPF (Rwandan Patriotic Front) started launching attacks from Uganda." Umeona ee? Hata "nondo" yako knows that it was RPF that started matatizo and not Habyarimana.

2. "Simultaneously, the war between the Rwandan army and the RPF resumed." Hapa hata "nondo" yako inakubali kitu ambacho wewe na wenzio hamtaki watu wakumbuke, kuwa the so called genocide was not a stand-alone event, THERE WAS A WAR IN WHICH KAGAME/RPA WERE THE AGGRESSORS (REBELS)!

3. "In May 1994, Radio Muhabura, the RPF radio, talked about 500,000 persons killed, and adjusted the figure downwards to 300,000 several days later. These figures were guesses rather than estimates, since they were not based on any systematic counting (Prunier, 1998, p. 262). After the genocide, the accuracy of the estimates did not improve. The UN report of November 1994 (UN 1994) took a safe range between 500,000 and one million victims. These figures include both Tutsi and Hutu.." kila siku mnaongelea radio ya wahutu iliyoeneza chuki n.k, hii radio muhabura iliyoanzishwa kabla hata ya hiyo radio ya wahutu ilikuwa inapiga ndombolo au? What did the rebels RPF use this radio for? Anyway your own nondo discredits taarifa za Radio muhabura upo hapo?

4. "Another problem is the reliability of the 1991 census. Two criticisms have been put forward. First, to avoid discrimination, an undetermined number of Tutsi registered as Hutu. Second, the Habyarimana regime is said to have deliberately under-reported the number of Tutsi in order to keep their school enrolment and public employment quotas low. Until now, this allegation has not been documented. However, this strong suspicion alone led G. Prunier (1998) to estimate the actual Tutsi population in 1994 at 12% of the total population instead of 8%, the estimate put forward by the Habyarimana regime." Kwa hiyo kumbe your numbers are based on what your "nondo" calls suspicion, tena it categorically says it has never been documented! So why even use this? There are many people allegeging all sorts of things against kagame and RPF hivi tukianza kuvichukulia kama facts wewe utakubali? Uliposema "nondo" mi nikajua nondo kweli, kumbe ni ka-some academic paper! Hebu niendelee kusoma…

5. "Also, an unknown number of Hutu were killed by the RPF, both in the course of combat and in acts of revenge after the genocide." Hii inajiongelea yenyewe, wengi wenu ma-extremist mnadai kuwa RPF walistopisha genocide, "nondo" yako inasema wazi kuwa RPF waliua in revenge. Your "nondo" knows that on one side the hutus (interahamwe etc) killed Tutsis because they were Tutsis and watutsi (RPF/Kagame) wakiua wahutu because they were simply hutus. Ndio maana dunia inatambua Rwandan genocide and not the one sided "genocide against Tutsis" as coined by kagame TEN YEARS AFTER. Hii ina maana whoever wrote this "nondo" of yours agrees with that song by Kizito mihigo!

6. Hii uliiwekea red, I guess ndio basis ya mjadala wako. "A first objective is to provide evidence for the under-reporting of Tutsi in the 1991 census.": Hapa nakubali. " A second objective is to analyse the geographical pattern of killings during the genocide and estimate the survival chance of Tutsi in Gikongoro, a prefecture located in southern Rwanda (Map 1, Appendix I)" : hapa I have a problem, why Gikongoro? What's so special about Gikongoro? Sensa ilifanyika nchi nzima, kwa nini utumie Gikongoro alone? Kwa nini usitafute njia ambayo itachukua nchi nzima? Hii ni kwa sababu si lazima udanganyifu ukifanyika sehemu moja basi utakuwa sawa na sehemu nyingine, si lazima kura zikiibiwa kituo kimoja basi zitaibiwa sawa sawa kituo kingine, hivyo sikubaliani na uamuzi wa kuchukua Gikongoro kama sample alone. Anyway tuendelee..

7."The 1990 local population data provide information on the proportion of Tutsi in 117 administrative sectors of Gikongoro Prefecture. These data are compared with local population data of 2002 for the same 117 administrative sectors. Since the local administration stopped recording ethnic identity after 1994, the death toll among Tutsi living in these sectors cannot be derived from a mere comparison between the number of Tutsi in 1990 and 2002. However, much can be revealed from a study of the sector's population growth between 1990 and 2002, and its sex ratio in 2002.": with all due respect to the author, this is nonsense a.k.a bullshit! Unachukuaje data za 2002 zisizo na mgawanyo wa makabila ukalinganisha na SENSA ya mwaka 1991 inayoweka wazi wahutu wako wangapi na watutsi wako wangapi ili kujua wangapi wamekufa 1994? Why not simply ask Hutu survivors of 1994 how many people they have lost, kama ambavyo Tutsis wameruhusiwa? Tutsis themselves wamefiwa na watu less than 500,000 (ibuka figures)! Kuna ugumu gani kufanya the same to the Hutus?

8.Hii nayo uliwekea red, lakini kwa bahati nzuri inanisapoti mimi kuliko wewe: "However, many scholars have raised and repeated the allegation that this percentage is unreliable (Prunier, 1998, p. 265; HRW, 1999, p. 15). In the early seventies, the Hutu regime introduced an ethnic quota system for the appointment of civil servants and for school enrolments. This policy required that places be distributed between Hutu and Tutsi according to their proportion in the total population (Reyntjens, 1985, pp. 501-503). As the government wanted to restrict the power held by the Tutsi, they had a motive for keeping quotas for Tutsi in education and administration low, and to this end, may have under-reported the proportion of Tutsi. This accusation has often been levelled, but never proved. Umeona hapa? "It was never proved"! Hii ni kwa sababu, mfumo wa vitambulisho ulianza wakati wa ufalme wenu wa kitutsi ili kunyanyasa wahutu, hivyo introduction ya huu mfumo wa serikali ya Habyarimana wa quotas haukuleta vitambulisho vipya labda kwa wale tu ambao walikuwa hawanavyo! kama kitambulisho chako kilikuwa mhutu/mtutsi that did not change! Kilichobadilika ni kiwango cha huduma sio kitambulisho. "after th In addition, there are many stories of Tutsi reporting as Hutu in the population census in order to avoid discrimination. Therefore, even the census report itself urged caution with respect to the figures on ethnicity (SNR, April 1994, p. 114):" Unaona sasa!? huyo Habyarimana ambaye unamuona shetani kumbe aliweka caution kwenye sensa yake mwenyewe, kuwa just like some Hutus reported themselves Tutsis back in the kingdom era, the vice versa was to be expected kwenye sensa yake, uko hapo? Kumbe serikali ya Habyarimana haikuwa na nia yoyote mbaya na iliweka hii fact wazi wazi! But here you are….
Lingine linaloshangaza ni kuwa baadhi yenu mnasema kuwa eti vitambulisho ndio vili-determine kuwa wale waliokufa walikuwa watutsi, sasa kama hoja yako ni kuwa watutsi nao walijifanya wahutu na kuchukua ID za kihutu ndio maana sensa inasema watutsi walikuwa wachache in 1991, je hiyo 1994 kagame alijuaje sasa kama marehemu wengi walikuwa watutsi? Ina maana serikali ya kagame waliangalia ID ya marehemu halafu hata kama ilisema mtu alikuwa mhutu wao wakasema no huyu marehemu ni mtutsi aliyejifanya mhutu kwa sababu ya pua yake, macho au mzigo (kwa sauti ya sheikh kipozeo) au?

The percentages reported in 1978 and 1991 even seem very plausible if we take into account the number of Tutsi who left the country between 1959 and 1990, or who were killed during this period" Hapa nakubali kabisa bila wasiwasi. Sensa zilizopita kabla ya revolution zilikuwa na idadi kubwa ya watutsi kwa sababu baadhi ya wahutu walijifanya watutsi ili kufaidi ufalme wa kitutsi, na vile vile baada ya revolution ya 1959 watutsi wengi waliondoka, kumbuka Ugandan tutsi alone ambao kagame/RPA walikuwa wanasema wanarepresent walikuwa ni zaidi ya 500,000! Hii sio idadi ndogo. Hapo bado hujajumlisha na wale waliokuwa DRC, Burundi, TZ n.k..

9."In contrast to the doubts concerning the reliability of the population censuses, there is no reason to suspect any systematic under-reporting of Tutsi in the local population data. Since everybody knows each other at the local level, it would have been almost impossible for Tutsi to deceive the local administration about their true ethnic identity. Whereas census interviewers sent by the central government were not allowed to ask for the respondent's identity card (on which ethnic identity was mentioned), no such restriction was imposed on the local administration (SNR, 1994, p. 109). In addition, the local administration had no incentive to misreport the size of the local Tutsi population. The quota policy was centralized and implemented at the national level. Even if the local administration had been inclined to influence this policy, it could not have done so by modifying its reports. Each of the reports made by the communes was filed to the Interior Ministry in Kigali, but none of these reports were ever made public, and the quota policy remained solely based on census reports as published" Mbona unajishushua mwenyewe? Hapa inaonyesha wazi usahihi wa sensa ya 1991!


10."According to the population census of 1991, the proportion of Tutsi in Gikongoro was 12.8% (Table 1). The local population data of 1990 revealed a much higher proportion of at least 17.5%. This suggests that the under-reporting of Tutsi in the 1991 census was quite high. However, to provide solid support for this argument, we must ensure that the local population data is reliable. To this end, we compared other aspects, besides ethnicity, such as the number of men and women and the total population, with census data. If the local population data are of good quality, we should find a close resemblance with census data." Kwenye point yako mwenyewe, hapo number 9, imesema wazi kuwa local population data hazikuwa zinawekwa wazi, zilizokuwa zinawekwa wazi ni matokeo ya taifa, je hii ya Gikongoro imetoka wapi? Na kwanini huko ilikotoka kusitoke local data zingine zooote za Rwanda nzima ili tulinganishe vizuri discrepancy na sensa ya jumla? "Authorized by the Rwandan government to do research on economic issues, we were able to get local population data for 1990 as well as for 2002 from the Statistical Unit of Gikongoro Prefecture." Kimsingi mjadala unaishia hapa. Local population data hazikutolewa na Habyarimana mwenyewe aliyofanya sensa, zimekuja kutolewa na kagame ambaye anatuhumiwa kwa genocide!? Unategemea atatoa data sahihi athibitishe uhalifu wake? Kweli hii ndio unaita "nondo"? wewe kweli mtutsi-extremist! Hata walioandika wenyewe wanasema: "It would greatly help if we could obtain local population data for other prefectures". Lakini swali langu linabaki pale pale in 1991 RPF was also a quasi-political party, na kulikuwa na vyama vingine kama vile vya Lando Ndasigwa (kaka yake mushikiwabo), kwa nini hawa wote hawaku-raise concern yoyote kuwa matokeo ya sensa yamepikwa? Kwa nini mpaka baada ya "genocide" in 1994 ndio sensa ianzwe kutiliwa shaka, tena kwa kulinganisha na data za 2002, miaka 8 baadaye?


Conclusion: nadhani labda kingereza kinakupa shida ndio maaana ukadhani kuwa document hii inakusapoti, hii document inajaribu tu kufanya estimation na guess work ENDAPO assumptions kuhusu under-reporting are true, lakini sio conclusive kuwa sensa ya Habyarimana imechezewa based on discrepancies brought by local population data of Gikongoro prefecture alone, tena which is obtained under authorization from kagames murderous government. Swala hilihalihitaji sayansi wala matakwimu ya uongo uongo. Ibuka (tutsi genocide survivor organization) ipo na inasema survivors of the genocide wako 300,000+ , this figure has been endorsed by kagame's government na ndio iliyopelekwa na inayojulikana na UN kwa ajili ya misaada ya hawa survivors. These 300,000 plus survivors are real people hata ukienda leo utawaona they are not estimates, lakini wewe unaleta hii .. "..By subtracting the estimated 150,000 Tutsi survivors.." Unaona jinsi ulivyo extremist? Serikali yako mwenyewe inasema waliosurvive ni 300,000 plus, wewe unaleta estimation pungufu kwa nusu, makusudi tu ili ushindane na jMali! Hahaha. Do I need more to discredit this "nondo" of yours? Kama paper yako imehalve the survivors why not assume kuwa ume-double the tutsi victims?

Ibuka hao hao pia walifanya zoezi la kuuliza nyumba hadi nyumba watutsi wangapi wamepoteza maisha kwenye genocide, wakapata less than 500,000! Kagame na serikali yake wakakalia hayo matokeo, mpaka leo hawataki kuyatoa why? Hapo hapo ni kosa la jinai kuhesabu wahutu wangapi wamekufa kwenye genocide, eti sasa genocide was against tutsis tu. Hii "nondo" yako mwenyewe inathibitisha kuwa RPF walifanya mauaji vile vile under revenge, okay, why not count hao wahutu pia tuone wako wangapi? Hilo ndilo swali lililomfunga Ingabire na ndio swali linalomtia matatizoni msanii kizito mihigo, kwa sababu jawabu lake ni kuwa wahutu ndio majority ya hii figure ya UN ya 800,000 to 1 mil! Hivyo kagame na jeshi lake RPF ni wauaji wa kimbari.

Common sense haiwezi kukubali kuwa eti wahutu wa kawaida waue wenzao watutsi milioni moja ndani ya siku chini ya 100 kwa kutumia visu na mapanga tu! Halafu wahutu hao hao wawe ndio wakimbizi leo hii, badala ya hao watutsi waliokuwa waliochinjwa. Kwa hiyo ina maana wahutu walikuwa wanachinja watutsi huku wao wenyewe wanakimbia na watoto migongoni na mbuzi wao, magodoro n.k kama tulivyokuwa tunawaona kwenye TV?

Ukweli ni kwamba immediately baada ya kutunguliwa ndege, RPF walivamia Rwanda, in fact walishateka maeneo mengi tu pembezoni mwa Rwanda, including kule karibu na TZ walikokuwa wanatupa maiti za wahutu mtoni zinakuja kwetu. Hivyo si kweli kuwa RPF walizuia genocide kwa siku mia moja, No, wao waliteka nchi kwa siku mia moja.

Na siku zingine usilete magazeti makubwa makubwa ukadhani unanikomoa, great thinkers wa JF wanachambua wao wenyewe halafu wanaweka link kwenda kwenye habari nzima, Nondo maana yake ni hoja sio maelezo marefu. wewe extremist unacopy-paste dude looote unajaza server tu bure! Anyway, ubarikiwe sana!

 

[jMali]

jMali tatizo lako you are very selective when it comes to giving your sources to support your arguments. Wengine tunaandika nondoz hapa wewe unachukua na ku-google na wikipedia halafu unatutuhumu eti tumetoa huko, unateleza kijana. Koba katoa nondoz za sensa hapa lakini unajifanya kama hujaona. Nilikwambia muda mrefu sana kuwa sensa kabla ya 1994 zilikuwa za kupikwa kwa kuwa watawala wa ki-hutu wa mrengo mkali hawakutaka namba sahihi ya tutsi ijulikane kwa sababu zao za kizandiki na kibaguzi. Soma alicho-post Koba uone na kuelewa. Sensa kufadhiliwa na kusimamiwa na UN, US, Canada haileti tofauti yeyote. Mbona UN under a Canadian three-star general walikuwepo wakati watu milioni moja wanauawa kikatili all over Rwanda and they did nothing. so who fcuking cares about the UN, US, or Canadians? Usibabaikie wazungu kiasi hicho kijana. Wao ni watu kama wewe wenye mapungufu kama mwanadamu yeyote.

Victoire Ingabire is a terrorist and divisionist. Hakujua kuwa serikali ya Rwanda imejipanga vizuri na ina habari zake zote. She came with her typical European patronizing towards Africans and thought she could railroad people into submission. Watu wakamkataa na siasa zake dhalimu za kibaguzi na kimauaji.

ya koba muachie koba, wewe jibu ya kwako. je are you saying mama habyarimana ndie aliyepanga kumuua mumewe?

 

[Jamaa_Mbishi]

Te he he, now you are branding me "stupid" just because I refuse to buy into your warped tutsi-hating gibberish? young nigga! you can get a smack for that! ha ha ha. Anyway, call me whatever you want, it wont change a thing, I aint fazed at all. I stand unshaken in the pursuit for the truth. The record must be set straight. I will stand for Pres Kagame for as long as it takes and a day. Sasa sijui umekuwa Mungu kumtabiria baba wa watu kifo? Vibaya namna hiyo kijana. Kagame yupo sana na ataendelea kuwapo hata mseme nini.

That man is a fool and no man with the right mind will support him. You cannot kill for fun or to hide the truth because at the end the truth will always prevail. I didn't call you stupid I just said stop being stupid because unatetea ujinga.

 

[KIM KARDASH]

Nikuulize tena.

1. What is tutsi behavior?

Uniulize tena?!!!!kwani uliniuliza saa ngapi au umechanganya taarifa na kunifananisha na huyo uliemuuliza mwanzo?kiufupi i know nothing about hayo makabila yenu,nasikia tu kuna minority na majority that's it,ila hapa mjadala unavoendelea ndio naona jinsi gani mlivyokua na matatizo makubwa ya kuchukiana!

Mtafute huyo uliemuuliza mwanzo labda anawajua vizuri hao watu wako,mi mbongo wa kariakoo u tutsi na u hutu kwangu wa na wapi,but nawajua waswahili wenzangu wa nyamirambo na buyenzi tu kwenye hizo nchi zenu!

 

[KIM KARDASH]

Kitu kingine,kwa maoni yangu naona kagame ni kama aliover react kwenye ule ushauri wa kikwete.Folks njia pekee ya kuifanya Rwanda ipate usalama wa kudumu ni kukaa na wale mabwana na kutizama namna bora ya kusahau yaliyopita then kuleta umoja wa wanyarwanda wote,katika hali ilivyo rwanda na ninachokisoma hapa kutoka kwenu hakuna rwanda ya utawala wa mtutsi peke yake wala ya mhutu peke yake,ni lazima mtawale kwa pamoja ndio mtabaki na usalama wa kudumu acha huu usalama wenu alioushikilia kagame as kagame akiondoka nao umeondoka.Kukaa meza moja na waasi si dhambi wala si kitu kigeni,angola na unita walifanya,Sudan na Garang walifanya south africa na mandela halikadhalika na matokeo tuliyaona.FDLR mmeanza kupambana nayo toka lini na matokeo ni nini labda zaidi ya kila siku kutuonyesha bado wapo na bado ni tishio kwa kagame regime.As i said kukaa nao meza moja si dhambi,hao sio wa kwanza kuua.

 

[platozoom]

jMali Nenda taratibu, hiyo 'counter attack' hapo juu inatisha.
Ila angalau umefungua wengi macho juu ya idadi ya waliokufa katika mauaji ya kimbari Rwanda. Na taarifa kama hizi si wengi waliokuwa wanazifahamu. Wengi waliaminishwa kwamba ni Watusi wengi sana ndiyo waliouwawa na kwamba kuna idadi ndogo sana ya Wahutu waliokufa wakati wa vita.

Hapa naona umuhimu wa kauli ya Victorie Ingambire: 'Ni lini na siye wahanga wetu wataadhimishwa?'
Hivi inapofika kumbukumbu ya mauaji ya Kimbari na Watusi ndiyo 'wanaoadhimishwa' wale wahanga wa Kihutu huwa wanajisikiaje! very bad.

 

[jMali]

jMali Nenda taratibu, hiyo 'counter attack' hapo juu inatisha.
Ila angalau umefungua wengi macho juu ya idadi ya waliokufa katika mauaji ya kimbari Rwanda. Na taarifa kama hizi si wengi waliokuwa wanazifahamu. Wengi waliaminishwa kwamba ni Watusi wengi sana ndiyo waliouwawa na kwamba kuna idadi ndogo sana ya Wahutu waliokufa wakati wa vita.

Hapa naona umuhimu wa kauli ya Victorie Ingambire: 'Ni lini na siye wahanga wetu wataadhimishwa?'
Hivi inapofika kumbukumbu ya mauaji ya Kimbari na Watusi ndiyo 'wanaoadhimishwa' wale wahanga wa Kihutu huwa wanajisikiaje! very bad.

kweli kabisa, na actually wanaosherekea hii "genocide" kila mwaka ni hawa watutsi ambao wala hawakupoteza ndugu yoyote, watutsi waliorudi baada ya kagame kupindua nchi. Hawa wanafiki ikifika hii wiki wao ndio wanajifanya wana majonzi kuliko hata wafiwa.
Watutsi ambao walikuwapo Rwanda na kweli walipoteza ndugu zao, wanaelewa kuwa genocide yalianza kwa RPF kusambaratisha vijiji vya wahutu toka 1990, na hivyo pamoja na kuwa wamelipiziwa kisasi na interahamwe, they understand. For e.g ni kama yule msanii kizito mihigo ambaye sasa hivi ananyanyaswa kwa kuimba wimbo unaoomboleza vifo vya wote.
kwa sababu huko vijijini kila mtu anamjua kila mtu, hakuna mtutsi mstaarabu ambaye ikifika hii wiki atajifanya yeye ndio mfiwa wakati labda kapoteza ndugu wawili waliochinjwa na mapanga ya interahamwe halafu anajua jirani yake mhutu kapoteza 20 waliojegejwa na machine gun za RPF! "genocide against tutsis" is a big joke!