Udini CCM? - viongozi waislam ni 75

[jmushi1]

So far, you are talking about the same thing, you cant accuse Chadema of tribalism and not do the same to CCM. The same standards you are using have been used by somebody else to show that 30 of 38 CCM CC members are muslims.

You have to equally blame both parties (if this really matters) if you want to make a point. Otherwise, you are just presenting yourself as a party zealot who will bend rules and issues to score a point. Shame on you and all who try to instill religious and tribalistic feelings into our minds.

CCM and CUF shouldnt be considered as islamic parties the same way as TLP and CHADEMA shouldnt be considered as tribalistic parties.

POINTI HAPA NI KWAMBA HAIJALISHI KAMA NI ccm ama chadema....!
Hapa ni KAMA NI MFISADI AMA NI MZALENDO!
TUTAYAANDAA MAJINA YOTE YA MAFISADI VS WALE WALIO FREE OF MTANDAO VIRUSES,PAMOJA NA WAPINZANI WA KWELI WENYE KUZINGATIA MASLAHI YA TAIFA KWANZA!

 

[Mwafrika]

POINTI HAPA NI KWAMBA HAIJALISHI KAMA NI ccm ama chadema....!
Hapa ni KAMA NI MFISADI AMA NI MZALENDO!
TUTAYAADAA MAJINA YOTE YA MAFISADI VS WALE WALIO FREE OF MTANDAO VIRUSES,PAMOJA NA WAPINZANI WA KWELI WENYE KUZINGATIA MASLAHI YA TAIFA KWANZA!

Asante jmushi1,

Watu tukianza kuongelea haya mambo ya ukabila na udini, tutaacha kabisa kufanya kazi pamoja. Inasikitisha kwamba kuna watu wakiona viongozi wa ccm wanaona waislam 30 kati ya viongozi 38. Inasikitisha pia kuwa wengine wakiona wabunge wa chadema, wanaona wabunge 5 wachaga kati ya wabunge 6 wa kuteuliwa.

Kama ulivyosema, sitashangaa kujua kuwa hizi hoja zinatumika kutoa watu kwenye mjadala muhimu. Nakumbuka Lowassa alisema kuwa anaonewa kwa vile yeye ni mtu wa Arusha kabla Mollel hajamuunga mkono. Haya ni makosa na kuna sababu kubwa kukataa hii migawanyo.

 

[Kubwajinga]

So far, you are talking about the same thing, you cant accuse Chadema of tribalism and not do the same to CCM. The same standards you are using have been used by somebody else to show that 30 of 38 CCM CC members are muslims.

You have to equally blame both parties (if this really matters) if you want to make a point. Otherwise, you are just presenting yourself as a party zealot who will bend rules and issues to score a point. Shame on you and all who try to instill religious and tribalistic feelings into our minds.

CCM and CUF shouldnt be considered as islamic parties the same way as TLP and CHADEMA shouldnt be considered as tribalistic parties.

1. First of all you are wrong with your numbers, only 24 are Muslims.
2. CCM ZNZ contribute about 1/3 of the members who are Muslims
3. therefore if you take the ZNZ members, the mainland distribution is almost 50% -50%. Can this be said about CHADEMA?

I am not advocating for CCM but it is very obvious that something fishy is going on in CHADEMA and if not corrected, we will see again what traspired in NCCR.

 

[Kubwajinga]

Does it mean that only Muslims are the good and competent leaders in CCM?

Of course NOT.

It just happened that 30 out 38 CCM leaders are Muslim but this doesnt mean that only Muslims are capable of being good leaders in CCM. The same should be said of CUF, Chadema, etc.

Let us both look beyond tribes and religions when talking about our issues.

Your numbers are wrong for CCM and so is your conclussion. But the CHADEMA case seems to be to be factually right.

 

[Mwafrika]

1. First of all you are wrong with your numbers, only 24 are Muslims.
2. CCM ZNZ contribute about 1/3 of the members who are Muslims
3. therefore if you take the ZNZ members, the mainland distribution is almost 50% -50%. Can this be said about CHADEMA?

I am not advocating for CCM but it is very obvious that something fishy is going on in CHADEMA and if not corrected, we will see again what traspired in NCCR.

It doesnt matter to me how the numbers are made up. I could care less if all leaders were from Zanzibar or Tanga. Somebody counted 30 muslims out of 38 ccm leaders as you counted 5 chaggas out of 6 chadema MP's.

You are as misguided and cynical as the other guy.

It is wrong, it is shamefully below our standards.

 

[jmushi1]

1. First of all you are wrong with your numbers, only 24 are Muslims.
2. CCM ZNZ contribute about 1/3 of the members who are Muslims
3. therefore if you take the ZNZ members, the mainland distribution is almost 50% -50%. Can this be said about CHADEMA?

I am not advocating for CCM but it is very obvious that something fishy is going on in CHADEMA and if not corrected, we will see again what traspired in NCCR.

Usimtukane mamba kabla hujavuka mto na wala usimtukane mkunga uzazi ungalipo...mwenzako akinyolewa we tia maji!

ccm days are gone! Kama wewe unafikiri chadema itagawanyika na ccm kubaki..Then huna point hapo kwasababu unaonyesha kuwa kuna possibility ya ccm MTANDAO kuwawezesha kushinda!

UMEKOSEA!ccm nayo ilikufa siku mwalimu alipokufa!
Tangazo la kifo lilikuwa siku walipoipitisha bajeti ya kifisadi kwa kauli moja!

 

[Mwafrika]

Your numbers are wrong for CCM and so is your conclussion. But the CHADEMA case seems to be to be factually right.

you still dont get it, do you? When are u gonna get over dividing lines? It doesnt matter if CCM leaders are all muslims to me. I would only ask to know if they are qualified for the job or not. It speaks large about you on how you pretend to be concerned of one evil over the other.

 

[Mwiba]

Udini udini udini naona mnasahau mafusho ,haya udini katika sehemu inalingana na wananchi wenyewe wa eneo ,mfano Mikoa ya ukanda wa bahari utakuta wengi ni Waisilamu na ukipanda kuelekea mikoani wengi wa huko ni wadini nyengine ,sasa viongozi wa kichama wataonekana wengi ni wa upande wa dini moja ,hivyo suala la kidini huwezi kulichanganya katika siasa ila mpaka pale itakapoonekana maamuzi ya Kitaifa kimaendeleo yanachagua kufanyiwa sehemu ambazo ni za dini ya aina moja ,kwa mfano lilipokuja suala la wanaopasi kuendelea na masomo ya juu wakati huo yakitumika majina ilionekana wazi wengi ya wanaopasi ni wakiristo japo mitihani inapoibiwa wanafunzi wote hawatengani katika kupeana hardcopy ,na baada ya majina kuondolewa na kuwekwa nambari ikawawia vigumu wasamaria kutenganisha , matokeo yake pasentaji ya waliopasi haikupigiwa makelele.
Na ndio hivyo hivyo sioni sababu ya dini kuwa na uzito ndani ya Chama fulani.

 

[Kubwajinga]

Asante jmushi1,

Watu tukianza kuongelea haya mambo ya ukabila na udini, tutaacha kabisa kufanya kazi pamoja. Inasikitisha kwamba kuna watu wakiona viongozi wa ccm wanaona waislam 30 kati ya viongozi 38. Inasikitisha pia kuwa wengine wakiona wabunge wa chadema, wanaona wabunge 5 wachaga kati ya wabunge 6 wa kuteuliwa.

Kama ulivyosema, sitashangaa kujua kuwa hizi hoja zinatumika kutoa watu kwenye mjadala muhimu. Nakumbuka Lowassa alisema kuwa anaonewa kwa vile yeye ni mtu wa Arusha kabla Mollel hajamuunga mkono. Haya ni makosa na kuna sababu kubwa kukataa hii migawanyo.

I agree with Mushi, but to me ukabila is even worse than Chenge's ufisadi, especially when let to bloom. I urge MJJ not use some wrong presentation on the alleged udini ndani ya CCM, to deflate the ukabila that has been reveiled in CHADEMA. Fight it and do not defend it, 'cos it is contageous.

 

[Mwafrika]

Udini udini udini naona mnasahau mafusho ,haya udini katika sehemu inalingana na wananchi wenyewe wa eneo ,mfano Mikoa ya ukanda wa bahari utakuta wengi ni Waisilamu na ukipanda kuelekea mikoani wengi wa huko ni wadini nyengine ,sasa viongozi wa kichama wataonekana wengi ni wa upande wa dini moja ,hivyo suala la kidini huwezi kulichanganya katika siasa ila mpaka pale itakapoonekana maamuzi ya Kitaifa kimaendeleo yanachagua kufanyiwa sehemu ambazo ni za dini ya aina moja ,kwa mfano lilipokuja suala la wanaopasi kuendelea na masomo ya juu wakati huo yakitumika majina ilionekana wazi wengi ya wanaopasi ni wakiristo japo mitihani inapoibiwa wanafunzi wote hawatengani katika kupeana hardcopy ,na baada ya majina kuondolewa na kuwekwa nambari ikawawia vigumu wasamaria kutenganisha , matokeo yake pasentaji ya waliopasi haikupigiwa makelele.
Na ndio hivyo hivyo sioni sababu ya dini kuwa na uzito ndani ya Chama fulani.

Mwiba,

Vigezo vyote, iwe udini, ukabila, upemba na uunguja, au ukigoma na umusoma lazima viachwe kwenye maamuzi ya kila siku ya maendeleo. Huwezi kusema watu waache udini lakini wakaendelea na ukabila. Na huwezi kusema watu waache ukabila lakini wakaendelea na udini.

Tuache hizi dividing lines maana wakoloni wanataka kuzitumia ili watutawale tena.

 

[Kubwajinga]

you still dont get it, do you? When are u gonna get over dividing lines? It doesnt matter if CCM leaders are all muslims to me. I would only ask to know if they are qualified for the job or not. It speaks large about you on how you pretend to be concerned of one evil over the other.

Yes, it doesnt matter if those leaders were elected/apointed fairly. But if you are picked just because your father is the chief financier of the party or because your somebody's girlfriend, then we have a problem. This is exacatly what Wangwe is fighting for.

 

[Mwafrika]

I agree with Mushi, but to me ukabila is even worse than Chenge's ufisadi, especially when let to bloom. I urge MJJ not use some wrong presentation on the alleged udini ndani ya CCM, to deflate the ukabila that has been reveiled in CHADEMA. Fight it and do not defend it, 'cos it is contageous.

That statement in red sums it all about you. Whatever you see in ukabila is worse than what Chenge did? The same Chenge who brought us Buzwagi, IPTL, and all dubious contracts?

You are beyond comprehension my friend, this potrays you negatively.

 

[jmushi1]

Ila MWAFRIKA BADO NASISITIZIA KUHUSU HIYO KAULI YAKO HAPO YA PROUD TO BE DARK SKINNED AFRICAN...Huko Darfur Sudan..Wale wakristo wenye NGOZI NYEUSI HASWA NDIO WANAOTENGWA NA KUHAMISHWA NA WALE WEUSI AMBAO WANAJIITA WAARABU!
TENA HATA BIN LADEN ALIKUWA ANAISHI HUKO!
Kwa hiyo...Bado nasimamia pointi yangu kuwa descriptions za color tones falls under the same scrutiny!

 

[Kubwajinga]

Mwiba,

Vigezo vyote, iwe udini, ukabila, upemba na uunguja, au ukigoma na umusoma lazima viachwe kwenye maamuzi ya kila siku ya maendeleo. Huwezi kusema watu waache udini lakini wakaendelea na ukabila. Na huwezi kusema watu waache ukabila lakini wakaendelea na udini.

Tuache hizi dividing lines maana wakoloni wanataka kuzitumia ili watutawale tena.

Sijasema waache kimoja na wachukue kingine. Unachotaka wewe ni kuwa hata kama vipo basi watu wakae kimya. You are very wrong on that. Kuna ukabila ndani ya CHADEMA lazima tuumulike. That is the point.

 

[Mwafrika]

Yes, it doesnt matter if those leaders were elected/apointed fairly. But if you are picked just because your father is the chief financier of the party or because your somebody's girlfriend, then we have a problem. This is exacatly what Wangwe is fighting for.

It is the same thing. If (using your standards) it is wrong to have 5 out 6 chagga MPs, is is still then wrong to have 30 muslims out 38 ccm leaders.

To me, it doesnt matter either way, it is wrong and shamefully below our standards.

 

[jmushi1]

I agree with Mushi, but to me ukabila is even worse than Chenge's ufisadi, especially when let to bloom. I urge MJJ not use some wrong presentation on the alleged udini ndani ya CCM, to deflate the ukabila that has been reveiled in CHADEMA. Fight it and do not defend it, 'cos it is contageous.

Ni kweli hapa ndiyo mbaya zaidi kwani kama ukishakubali kuwa ccm ni MAFISADI...HALAFU TENA NI wadini haswa haswa waislam...Then ni sawa na kusema waislam ama wasukuma ama wamasai ni mafisadi!
Which it doesnt make any sense at all!
Hivyo dhambi ya UFISADI HAISAFISHIKI KWA DINI WALA KABILA...NI KWA SHERIA PEKE YAKE!

 

[Mwafrika]

Sijasema waache kimoja na wachukue kingine. Unachotaka wewe ni kuwa hata kama vipo basi watu wakae kimya. You are very wrong on that. Kuna ukabila ndani ya CHADEMA lazima tuumulike. That is the point.

Hakuna ukabila ila wewe ndio unataka kuuleta kwa vile unaangalia makabila ya watu badala ya qualification zao. Ukiangalia ukabila lazima pia uangalie udini uliokithiri ndani ya ccm. Baada ya hapo itabidi uangalie sexism na uzanzibar na mengine mengi tu ndani ya ccm.

Ukianza hayo hutaishia hapo, maana utaanza kuangalia kuwa kuna warombo na wameru wangapi kati ya hao wachaga na utaanza kuangalia kuwa kuna washia au wasuni wangapi kati ya hao waislam waliojazana ccm.

Haya yote ni makosa.

 

[Mwafrika]

Ni kweli hapa ndiyo mbaya zaidi kwani kama ukishakubali kuwa ccm ni MAFISADI...HALAFU TENA NI wadini haswa haswa waislam...Then ni sawa na kusema waislam ama wasukuma ama wamasai ni mafisadi!
Which it doesnt make any sense at all!
Hivyo dhambi ya UFISADI HAISAFISHIKI KWA DINI WALA KABILA...NI KWA SHERIA PEKE YAKE!

jmushi,

hawa wanaoleta mambo ya ukabila na udini, wanataka mambo ya ufisadi ambayo yanaongelewa Tanzania nzima sasa hivi yasijadiliwe. Ndio maana mie sitaki kusema kuwa ccm ni chama cha kiislam au kusema kuwa kuna uislam CUF na CCM kama vile ninavyokataa kusema kuwa kuna ukabila UDP na Chadema.

 

[Mwafrika]

Ila MWAFRIKA BADO NASISITIZIA KUHUSU HIYO KAULI YAKO HAPO YA PROUD TO BE DARK SKINNED AFRICAN...Huko Darfur Sudan..Wale wakristo wenye NGOZI NYEUSI HASWA NDIO WANAOTENGWA NA KUHAMISHWA NA WALE WEUSI AMBAO WANAJIITA WAARABU!
TENA HATA BIN LADEN ALIKUWA ANAISHI HUKO!
Kwa hiyo...Bado nasimamia pointi yangu kuwa descriptions za color tones falls under the same scrutiny!

Point yako ni nzuri na nimeielewa. Lakini pia sidhani kama wewe unaweza kusoma moyo wangu kujua kuwa ninasema kile wanachosema walioko Darfur. Mimi nimesema tu vile nilivyo bila kudhalilisha yoyote yule ambaye yuko tofauti na mimi. Ninatambua diversity bila kumtenga yoyote yule. Ni kama vile wewe ulivyosema kuwa ni mchaga lakini sidhani kama una maana kuwa wengine watakojiita wasukuma watakuwa wanatafuta ugomvi nawewe.

Hakuna makosa kwa wewe kusema kuwa ni mchaga kwa sababu umesema ukweli kuhusu wewe. Ukianza kuwatenga ambao sio wachaga kwa vile tu wao si wachaga basi hapo ndipo kuna tatizo.

Itakuwa pia tatizo kama wengine pia wataanza kukutenga na kukuchukia kwa vile tu wewe ni mchaga.

 

[jmushi1]

Nakubaliana na MWAFRIKA kwenye hili kwani sitaki watu waanze kuwakwida wamasai na wamachinga wa watu eti kwasababu tu MKAPA NA LOWASSA NI MAFISADI?
NO TUSIENDE UKO!
IMPUNITY WILL BE DECIDED IN THE COURT OF LAW!