Papa Francis: There are limits to free expression

[Aqua]

dogo wacha maneno ya uwongo moderator hapa wanwasaida wakristo, wakisha ona mmezidiwa wanafunga thread. Usijaribu kukwepesha ukweli. Hebu nipe point wapi mlituzidia nacho ona nyie mnakimbia kila kukicha dalili mmebaki kuquote hadith zile fake. Nimeisha waelezeni kule waislam wao wanamini Qur'an tu. Hadith sijui nini hamna anaye ziamini.Hakuna hadithi haina uwongo.

Ok,brother that is not a big deal.Jesus loves you?Were you born in a Muslim family or you were converted to Islam?
As I said before we can not save you but only God can if and only if he has plan for you.Dedicate your time learn these religion but when learning put your difference aside.

 

[Nkwesa Makambo]

dogo wacha maneno ya uwongo moderator hapa wanwasaida wakristo, wakisha ona mmezidiwa wanafunga thread. Usijaribu kukwepesha ukweli. Hebu nipe point wapi mlituzidia nacho ona nyie mnakimbia kila kukicha dalili mmebaki kuquote hadith zile fake. Nimeisha waelezeni kule waislam wao wanamini Qur'an tu. Hadith sijui nini hamna anaye ziamini.Hakuna hadithi haina uwongo.

Mmmh hii ni version mpya ya uislam wanaoamini Quran pekee.
Maana wengine hadith ni sehemu ya uislam.
Hivi hizi swala tano ni ayat qani ya qaraa ?
Umedoda mkuu. Wenzio wengi kisingizio Chao wanasema "hiyo hadith fake " au ilipokelewa na asiye na uzito; wewe umehitimisha hadith sio chochote kwa mwislam wewe

 

[Adiosamigo]

Ok,brother that is not a big deal.Jesus loves you?Were you born in a Muslim family or you were converted to Islam?
As I said before we can not save you but only God can if and only if he has plan for you.Dedicate your time learn these religion but when learning put your difference aside.

Yeah I love Jesus too, but if you make a claim on someone, then you would expect that someone to back your claim up. If I claim somebody is a king, you would expect that king to say he is a king, at least once. The Bible (OT) God says he is God several times, why not once with Jesus in the NT? Did God change his ways? I think not, since the OT says God does not change. Here are the passages from the OT where God says he is God Isa 45:5; am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:

 

[Adiosamigo]

Mmmh hii ni version mpya ya uislam wanaoamini Quran pekee.
Maana wengine hadith ni sehemu ya uislam.
Hivi hizi swala tano ni ayat qani ya qaraa ?
Umedoda mkuu. Wenzio wengi kisingizio Chao wanasema "hiyo hadith fake " au ilipokelewa na asiye na uzito; wewe umehitimisha hadith sio chochote kwa mwislam wewe

Hebu nipe nani muislam anaye amini hadith zaidi ya Qur'an? Muislam anaye fata hadithni ujuwe huyo sio muislam, sababu Qur'an inakataza kabisa kufata hadith. Salaa zote zimetajwa kwenye Qur'an.

 

[Nkwesa Makambo]

Hebu nipe nani muislam anaye amini hadith zaidi ya Qur'an?

Kuamini hadithi zaidi ya Quran nani kasema ? Kurejea hadith ni sehemu ya Uislam wewe umesema waamini Quran Tu.
Wewe ni mjanja kuliko wenzio wengi. Wenzako wanachagua baadhi ya hadith na kuziamini zingine wanazikataa japo zote ziwe kutabu kimoja...
Vipi kuhusu hiyo hadith iliyonukuliwa hapo juu

 

[Adiosamigo]

Kuamini hadithi zaidi ya Quran nani kasema ? Kurejea hadith ni sehemu ya Uislam wewe umesema waamini Quran Tu.
Wewe ni mjanja kuliko wenzio wengi. Wenzako wanachagua baadhi ya hadith na kuziamini zingine wanazikataa japo zote ziwe kutabu kimoja...
Vipi kuhusu hiyo hadith iliyonukuliwa hapo juu

Yani we kila anaye itwa jina la kislam ni muislam, anaye sema muislam na anafata hadithi we weka akilini huyo si Muislam wa kweli. Tazama Qur'an inasema nini Qur'an 6:38; We did not leave anything out of this book.

Qur'an 18:27; You shall recite what is revealed to you of YOUR LORD's SCRIPTURE. NOTHING SHALL ABROGATE HIS WORDS, and you SHALL NOT FIND ANY OTHER SOURCE BESIDE IT.

 

[Nonda]

Even Quran agrees with me.

Na huyu anakubaliana na Quran lakini hakubaliani na wewe wala uzushi wako.

 

[Ishmael]

Na huyu anakubaliana na Quran lakini hakubaliani na wewe wala uzushi wako.

Huyu baada ya kuisoma Quran, Quran ikamgeuza na kuwa Mkristo. Hakika wewe ni kipofu.

 

[Nonda]

Huyu baada ya kuisoma Quran, Quran ikamgeuza na kuwa Mkristo. Hakika wewe ni kipofu.

Huyu alikuwa Minister wa kuchunga kondoo kama Ishmael.

 

[Ishmael]

Huyu alikuwa Minister wa kuchunga kondoo kama Ishmael.

Pole sana kijana. Huyo uliye muweka sio mali kitu.

 

[SiimaK]

Mimi ndio maana nimeamua kubaki katika imani yangu ya kikatoliki, na mara nyingi sipendi kubeza imani za dini au mathehebu mengine, kwani ni Mungu tu ndiye anayejua nani mkamilifu na Mungu ndiye anayehukumu.

Nimependa Pope alivyosema tungefuata ushauri wake hii ingesaidia kuleta amani duniani.

 

[Adiosamigo]

Huyu baada ya kuisoma Quran, Quran ikamgeuza na kuwa Mkristo. Hakika wewe ni kipofu.

Nimemnasa huyo sio Muislam alikuwa anataka kupoteza watu tu, hana asili yoyote yakislam huyo. Kwanza Imam gani atasema uwongo kama wake wakusema Jesus katajwa kuliko Mtume Muhammad kwenye Qur'an. Mwenye kufahamu Qur'an anafahamu wazi Mtume Muhammad katajwa na Mungu kwa jina mara nne tu, lakini kuna sehemu nyingi sana Mungu ana muita Mtume Muhammad kwa kumuita Yaa Aiyu Hua Nabii na Yaa Rasool Lah. Sa vipi mtu kama huyu aseme yeye alikuwa Imam si muongo huyu.

 

[Ishmael]

Nimemnasa huyo sio Muislam alikuwa anataka kupoteza watu tu, hana asili yoyote yakislam huyo. Kwanza Imam gani atasema uwongo kama wake wakusema Jesus katajwa kuliko Mtume Muhammad kwenye Qur'an. Mwenye kufahamu Qur'an anafahamu wazi Mtume Muhammad katajwa na Mungu kwa jina mara nne tu, lakini kuna sehemu nyingi sana Mungu ana muita Mtume Muhammad kwa kumuita Yaa Aiyu Hua Nabii na Yaa Rasool Lah. Sa vipi mtu kama huyu aseme yeye alikuwa Imam si muongo huyu.

You have no excuse.
You cannot seriously engage my evidence, much less refute it.

You avoid everything - just like the rest.

 

[Nonda]

Pole sana kijana. Huyo uliye muweka sio mali kitu.

Isaiah 53 New International Version (NIV)

53 Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.
Like one from whom people hide their faces
he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.

4 Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.

7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression[a] and judgment he was taken away.
Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was punished.[b]
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.

10 Yet it was the Lord's will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes[c] his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life[d] and be satisfied[e];
by his knowledge[f] my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,[g]
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,[h]
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.



About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

Does this sound like God's word to you? If, yes, Which one?

The Eli, Eli one or the one you claim to be god?

 

[Ntuzu]

Shukran sana

imekaa vema

Mkuu unasema imekaa poa hii? unayafahamu madhara ya hiyo kauli yake?

 

[Ntuzu]

wazawa

Unafiki utaendeleza maafa duniani ! Hivi Uhuru WA kuabudu maana yake ni tofauti na Uhuru WA kutoa mawazo ? Inawezekana ibada yangu ikakamilishwa na kutenda kile ambacho kwa mwingine ni kashfa ! Papa alitakiwe ahimize watu kujiamini katika imani zao na kujibu hoja kinzani kwa wanaopinga au kulashfu pasipo kurusha mawe,mabomu au risasi.
Uhuru WA maoni upiganiwe na kila.binadamu mwenye busara.
Maoni ya Muhammad kuwa Yesu so Mungu wala hakusurubiwa msalabani yajibiwe kwa hoja sio kwa mabomu vivyo hivyo maoni kuhusu Muhammad yajibiwe kwa hoja sio risasi.
Ukisha weka Uhuru WA kuabudu lazima ufungashe kwenye Uhuru WA kutoa maoni pasipo mipaka la sivyo hata Uhuru WA kuabudu uwekewe mipaka...

Kamanda wangu leo umenikosha.

cc: Lawkeys

 

[Ntuzu]

Hayo yatabakia kua mawazo au maoni ya pope mwenyewe,has nothing to do with freedom of kuongea.

Pope mwenyewe kashasema atakufa mwaka keshokutwa,hayo ni mawazo ya mtu anaetaka kufa.

Hapana mkuu haya yataingia kwenye vitendo kabisa mkuu.............hii michakato ya katiba na haya matukio ya kigaidi yanafanya mataifa mengi kupitisha sheria ambazo ni mbaya ktk uhuru wa kuabudu hasa ktk uhuru wa maoni....

 

[Ntuzu]

Hayo ni maoni ya pope mwenyewe,hayana cha kufanya kuhusu uhuru wa kuongea.

Watu lazima waongee,upende au usipende hiyo ni juu yako.

Ukilazimisha kuongea utafungwa au utakimbia maporini kujificha au kuuwawa yani uwe tayari ktk hayo.

 

[Ishmael]

Isaiah 53 New International Version (NIV)

53 Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.
Like one from whom people hide their faces
he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.

THE POISONING OF MUHAMMAD
Narrated 'Aisha: The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O 'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."

MUHAMMAD AND GABRIEL PRAY FOR HEALING
From Ibn Sa'd page 265

The apostle of Allah fell ill and he i.e. Gabriel, chanted on him, saying, "In the name of Allah I chant on to ward off from you every thing that harms you and (to ward off you) against every envier and from every evil eye and Allah will heal you."

MUHAMMAD'S DEATH
[again quoting from Bukhari's Hadith 5.713:]

Narrated 'Aisha:

The Prophet in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O 'Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison."

QUESTIONS

1) If Muhammad were a real prophet of God, why didn't he catch the poison before he ate it?

2) If you believe that it was God's will for Muhammad to have eaten the poison, along with Bishr, why then did Muhammad try to get well? Even Gabriel prayed for Muhammad to get better, but Allah didn't answer that prayer either.

3) Why did Gabriel not know the will of Allah? Why would Gabriel pray if Allah had decided death?

4) Why did Muhammad force the other Muslims to drink the medicine he was given? One of them was one of his wives, and she was fasting. He forced her to break her fast and drink the medicine as well. Doesn't this sound vindictive and petty?

5) Why, when just before his death, did Muhammad have to utter a curse upon the Christians and the Jews? Wouldn't it have been better for Muhammad to pray for guidance for them? This also sounds like a jealous, bitter prayer to Allah. Muhammad prayed for and uttered curses instead of asking Allah to guide people.

6) Why would pleurisy, which is a normal infection of the lung membrane, be considered to be from Satan, but being poisoned would not be from Satan?

 

[Adiosamigo]

You have no excuse.
You cannot seriously engage my evidence, much less refute it.

You avoid everything - just like the rest.

Ishmael; This man pretended to be an imam, or Islamic preacher, and he does not know anything about Qur'an. He said; The name Prophet Muhammad is mentioned four times only.

Most of the hypocrities will be reciters (of Qur'aan) with understanding. Firstly; It was not permissible to address the Prophet by saying "Ya Muhammad" during his lifetime, because Allah says in the Qur'an 24:63; "Make not the calling of the Messenger among you as your calling one of another"
The name 'Muhammad' comes 4 times. 'The name 'Ahmed' comes 1 time. Total 5 times the name of our Prophet is never addressed by name in the Holy Qur'an. Like we can see verses 'Ya Mussa', Ya Issa, Ya Ibrahim, But never 'Ya Muhammad'. Instead, He is called numerous times by his esteem titles. As ' Ya Ayyuha Rasool', Ya Mudathir, Ya Muzzammil', Ya Ayyuha Nabi and so on.

So the Prophet should not be addressed by name only, rather it should be said: Ya Rasool Allaah, Ya Nabi Allaah.

Ishmael, BTW; How can you trust your life after death to a person who is still dead?​