EAC: How Tanzania is shooting herself in the foot

Dhuks said:
And there is nothing wrong with Tanzania, just a terrible FEAR FACTOR
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Fearing the unknown.........France suffered a lot under Germany before and during WWII na today they are pulling the strings of the EU......neighbors that is!!!
 
Gooogle said:
Kama ingewezekana tungeifanya iwe poll kabisa.

Basing on -Tribal conflicts
-Income inequalilty
-Inflow of Foreign based/owned companies
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Mkuu nasikitika kukutangazia kwamba Tanzania ndio ipo hatarini ya kupigwa nje ya EAC sio Kenya.Wengine wanasema kwamba Tanzania wanazuia kasi ya EA integration. Hii nimebaini katika ziara zangu nchi husika na kuzungumza na watu kuusu integration. Ningependa mods wa JF waweke poll watu wa kawaida wa nchi zote za EAC watoe maoni yao. Taarifa nyingi tunazo zisikia ni za serekali na sio raia kuusu integration. Inawezekana majority ya raia wa EAC au nchi baadhi hawautaki huu muungano.
 
A poll will not give the right realisties on the ground; and even if miraculously Tanzanians deny or accept intergration, still the issue of political good-will will be the thing that determine success of intergration.
 
I have always been asking myself, why is it that in Kenya, a big discussion is on TZ. Okay, you have killed ATC with our own KQ (former East African Airways) that you decided to hold planes and killed the then EA. Why dont you sit down plan your own ways without TZ? You have a neghbour that you dont need to do any help and you always try pushing! This is stupidity for sure. We dont even think of you guys, for many reasons, one being NOT TRUSTED at all! If a Kikuyu can not trust a Luo, how will it work with 132 tribes in TZ? leave us alone plz. It is just a matter of time we will have a good political leadership with enough experties to transform our economy. We do not want you KENYANS to be specific. We can easily intergrate with Uganda, Rwanda and Burundi, but not you thieves!
moyo said:
Why do you choose to be stupid!?..any company incorporated in Kenya must have Kenyan partners and shareholders,according to the law..that was then,now Kenyans have taken control of most public companies thru IPO's and many have started their own.Its myopic people like you that make Tanzanians remain stupid,always living in denial.Shame..i guess as a person,you are a failure..i dont c a person with your mentality can be of any help even to himself..leave alone the society!.Shame! Shame! Shame! Shame!..Jinga wewe!
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Hi all. I am shocked but not surprised. Kenya Commercial bank is a kenya owned Bank, so is Kenya Airways, Equity Bank, Uchumi Super markets, Nakumatt Supermarkets, Other Banks such as Barclays, standard Chartered are 59% Kenyan owned.

The gist of the story is simply, Tanzania is afraid of its shadow. Can those spewing insults tell us the largest Kenyan land owner owns how many acres in Tanzania? The land issues is simply a smokescreen for the real issue- sabotage. Tanzania Caused the death of EAC in 1977 because it wanted to slow Kenya down until they catch up-a pip dream which they still pursue - and a dismal failure.

The truth Kenya is the leading market in Africa for Tanzania manufactured and agricultural produce. So does Tanzania need Kenya? Try closing border.

What I am saying Tanzania will one day regret the opportunities it let go in pursuit of the wind. And Kenya, the largest economy in East Africa . I can cite specific cases where Tanzania officials acted out rightly stupid.
 
Nairoberry,

It is illegal to copy and post my work without my authority. I demand you withdraw the entire copy. I doubt whether this forum allows anyone to plagiarise any body's intellectual property
 
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After reading through the material Iam shocked at the callumy my piece has generated. There a few sensible arguments and these are the people I would responding to. Much of the outburst is not worth my response.

My story for the sensible ones, was meant to demonstrate that Tanzania is losing out on opportunities that are rightly hers. For instance Tanzanian Politicians opposed the sale of ATC to KQ in the pretext that they are protecting their tourism industry. To date the tourism industry is still intact, what is not intact is ATC. If KQ had bought ATC, Tanzania would have both a thriving ATC and a thriving tourism industry.
Lets pick up a few facts that my story sought to drive home.

According to official reports by Tanzania's ministry of agriculture, some 0.6 million head of cattle are exported to Kenya every year. This is because although Tanzania boasts of the second largest heard of livestock in Africa, per capita meat consumption is 28 Kg a year compared to kenyans who wallop 100 kgs per head a year. To add insult to injury, the meat processing plant in Tanzania, that used to exist in the neighbourhood of Kawe in Dar died years ago.
Tragically the Ministry did not write this report in order to support the rehabilitation of the plant. It was looking at the taxes lost through what it termed as smuggling.

In 2008, there was a minister in charge of East African community going by the name Kamala, I wonder what happened to him. This fellow was spewing hatred for Kenya. His pet subject was the Milk processing plant in Arusha that was bought by the Kenyatta Family. The plant has a capacity to process some 60,000 litres a day. Yet the entire region, incorporating Arusha, Kilimanjaro, and Tanga provinces, can produce only 12,000 litres, that is one-fifth of the capacity of the plant at Arusha. According to studies by the Ministry of Finance in Tanzania, the region city to produce 300,000 litres of milk a day. In Kenya one division called Githunguri produces 200,000 litres of milk.

Brookside, the Kenyan owner of the Tanzania plant, found it uneconomical to process that quantity in Tanzania. Instead, they ship the milk and process it in Kenya, then sell it in Tanzania as a Tanzanian product-which it is. This is called contract processing and it is a reasonable business activity. Even Kenyan companies contract the Tanzania Coffee processor to process their instant coffee.

What Kamala forgot was; the company he wanted closed was actually doing the farmers in that region a favour. If Brookside does not buy the milk and process it, it would be poured since the marketing infrastructure for raw milk in Tanzania is non-existent.He was condemning the pastoralists to poverty.

Rather condemning them, he should have organised to have local farmers trained in animal husbandry in Kenya so that they increase their milk output. More milk output would drag Tanzania farmers out of poverty. It has done that in Kenya.

So now land is the excuse. One Samuel Sitta, who was the chairman of Tanzania Investment promotion Corporation, now the Minister for commerce and industry knows very well that Kenyans would only buy land in Tanzania if they need it for productive purposes, otherwise land as of itself has no intrinsic value to anyone, leave alone Kenyans.
So Kenyans must be seeking to invest in Tanzania in order to need land. In fact, apart from Tanzania no one else in EACM worries about "neighbours eyeing their land greedily."

And Kenyans have access to more land in Kenya than Tanzanians believe. And since they need for investment purposes, they have a greater access to it in the region than Tanzania wants us to believe.

It is a tragedy that when we raise issues that we understand very well, when we seek to enlighten Tanzanians- their Media is one of the most incompetent in Africa- they only see arrogance on our part. Tanzania, as one sensible person put it has the potential to grow big. But with such intellectual dwarfs are are found in this forum, it is doomed.
 
mwathai said:
After reading through the material Iam shocked at the callumy my piece has generated. There a few sensible arguments and these are the people I would responding to. Much of the outburst is not worth my response.

My story for the sensible ones, was meant to demonstrate that Tanzania is losing out on opportunities that are rightly hers. For instance Tanzanian Politicians opposed the sale of ATC to KQ in the pretext that they are protecting their tourism industry. To date the tourism industry is still intact, what is not intact is ATC. If KQ had bought ATC, Tanzania would have both a thriving ATC and a thriving tourism industry.
Lets pick up a few facts that my story sought to drive home.

According to official reports by Tanzania's ministry of agriculture, some 0.6 million head of cattle are exported to Kenya every year. This is because although Tanzania boasts of the second largest heard of livestock in Africa, per capita meat consumption is 28 Kg a year compared to kenyans who wallop 100 kgs per head a year. To add insult to injury, the meat processing plant in Tanzania, that used to exist in the neighbourhood of Kawe in Dar died years ago.
Tragically the Ministry did not write this report in order to support the rehabilitation of the plant. It was looking at the taxes lost through what it termed as smuggling.

In 2008, there was a minister in charge of East African community going by the name Kamala, I wonder what happened to him. This fellow was spewing hatred for Kenya. His pet subject was the Milk processing plant in Arusha that was bought by the Kenyatta Family. The plant has a capacity to process some 60,000 litres a day. Yet the entire region, incorporating Arusha, Kilimanjaro, and Tanga provinces, can produce only 12,000 litres, that is one-fifth of the capacity of the plant at Arusha. According to studies by the Ministry of Finance in Tanzania, the region city to produce 300,000 litres of milk a day. In Kenya one division called Githunguri produces 200,000 litres of milk.

Brookside, the Kenyan owner of the Tanzania plant, found it uneconomical to process that quantity in Tanzania. Instead, they ship the milk and process it in Kenya, then sell it in Tanzania as a Tanzanian product-which it is. This is called contract processing and it is a reasonable business activity. Even Kenyan companies contract the Tanzania Coffee processor to process their instant coffee.

What Kamala forgot was; the company he wanted closed was actually doing the farmers in that region a favour. If Brookside does not buy the milk and process it, it would be poured since the marketing infrastructure for raw milk in Tanzania is non-existent.He was condemning the pastoralists to poverty.

Rather condemning them, he should have organised to have local farmers trained in animal husbandry in Kenya so that they increase their milk output. More milk output would drag Tanzania farmers out of poverty. It has done that in Kenya.

So now land is the excuse. One Samuel Sitta, who was the chairman of Tanzania Investment promotion Corporation, now the Minister for commerce and industry knows very well that Kenyans would only buy land in Tanzania if they need it for productive purposes, otherwise land as of itself has no intrinsic value to anyone, leave alone Kenyans.
So Kenyans must be seeking to invest in Tanzania in order to need land. In fact, apart from Tanzania no one else in EACM worries about "neighbours eyeing their land greedily."

And Kenyans have access to more land in Kenya than Tanzanians believe. And since they need for investment purposes, they have a greater access to it in the region than Tanzania wants us to believe.

It is a tragedy that when we raise issues that we understand very well, when we seek to enlighten Tanzanians- their Media is one of the most incompetent in Africa- they only see arrogance on our part. Tanzania, as one sensible person put it has the potential to grow big. But with such intellectual dwarfs are are found in this forum, it is doomed.
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your post is a breath of fresh air from all the name calling and baseless arguments I find in this forum. if only people see the sense in what we Kenyans try to do in their country. Tanzania has everything set for success. their only hindrance is political fanaticism which that is made worse by an incompetent media and its array of nationalistic experts..otherwise I don't think Kenya has any negative intentions towards Tanzania.
 
mwathai said:
Hi all. I am shocked but not surprised. Kenya Commercial bank is a kenya owned Bank, so is Kenya Airways, Equity Bank, Uchumi Super markets, Nakumatt Supermarkets, Other Banks such as Barclays, standard Chartered are 59% Kenyan owned.

The gist of the story is simply, Tanzania is afraid of its shadow. Can those spewing insults tell us the largest Kenyan land owner owns how many acres in Tanzania? The land issues is simply a smokescreen for the real issue- sabotage. Tanzania Caused the death of EAC in 1977 because it wanted to slow Kenya down until they catch up-a pip dream which they still pursue - and a dismal failure.

The truth Kenya is the leading market in Africa for Tanzania manufactured and agricultural produce. So does Tanzania need Kenya? Try closing border.
What I am saying Tanzania will one day regret he opportunities it let go in pursuit of the wind. And Kenya, the largest economy in East Africa . I can cite specific cases where Tanzania officials acted out rightly stupid.
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Where do you get your food? If we Tanzania closing border, you guys will go hunger. Your Economy depend on Tanzania. Ndio maana mnaogopa kuwa iwapo Tanzania ikijitoa EAC Kenya kwisha habari yake
 
Lol wakenya bana.

Tunajua yote hayo neighbours, now please please please do us a favour a little favour. **** OFF LADS, toeni maboriti yalo machoni kwenu kwanza deal wit yo things jamani, mtutue mzigo sasa heee hawa jamaa vipi ase emb acheni ufara, sahihisheni yo corrupt leaders, ukabila, hunger, refugees wa vita yenu ile mlouana wapo huko huko wanakufa na njaa hawana makazi muwatafute muwasaidie, al shabaab, afu mombasa wanataka jitenga bear that in mind , bandari ile itakula kwenu, na mengne kibao yapo mrama huko siyajui sijawai fika kenya na wala sitaki fika coz nawachukia.

Acheni shoboka na Tz tuna shida zetu zinatuhusu sisi sio nyie, mnazo kibao za kusolve wenyewe, MTUACHE SASA JAMANI, tunahangaika sahihisha madubwasha yalofanywa na viongozi wachache wajinga enzi hizo na nyie mnakuja huko from nowhere within kenya mnaandika andika stupid articles ambazo we are all aware of them,mwatuumiza vichwa wtf meen leave us alone dumb ass neighbours shiet, we are tired, kila ukiingia forum vimejazana kujisifia sifia tu na kutupondea hawa watu vipi, ee bwana eeh emb kuweni acheni utoto ase. hii EAC hatuitaki mwaweza endelea nayo na hao wengine, let us deal with our shits first a lot of em, if you want to go ahead, PROCEEEED.damn
 
I must first of all express my dismay at two Tanzania brothers who think Kenyans would starve if they stopped exporting food to Kenya. Last time i checked Kenya trades with Tanzania and amongst the items traded is food, now if Tanzania were to divert its food to other markets Kenya would look for another food source; so how does that equate to being fed by Tanzania? Is it too hard to understand that it is trade that happens between our borders and not philanthropy?It is that kind of reasoning that is a barrier to development.
 
Hoshea

you shall find yourself living in dark days if you spend more energy creating hate then seeking peace within yourself, I only hope you find faith before its too late. Never bring a knife to a gunfight, if this Hoshea guy is the best comeback for the intellectual discourse Mwathai had posted up there, then I fear for your country. This is more proof that your political system (villagization/ African socialism) has done more harm than good for your country.
 
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Smatta said:
you shall find yourself living in dark days if you spend more energy creating hate then seeking peace within yourself, I only hope you find faith before its too late. Never bring a knife to a gunfight, if this Hoshea guy is the best comeback for the intellectual discourse Mwathai had posted up there, then I fear for your country. This is more proof that your political system (villagization/ African socialism) has done more harm than good for your country.
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I was wrong kusema nawachukia my bad and am the worst comeback for that discourse not inellectual i disagree, hasira hiyo, aknife can kill in a gunfight usisahau hilo, bwana Smatta, what are yo fellowcountry men creating? brother usije ukawa unaongelea hili moja yapo kibao wenzakowanaongelea kuhusu Tz kuna ya kweli mengine false facts, hili lile yule,slowing intergration lagging it, IT IS OUR COUNTRY we're trying to do our bestfor it, dont push us, let us alone deal with our problems kama hatutaki EAC endeleeni lkn hii kusema sema mambo ya kwetu inakera bana.

You imagine u haveyo house afu unasikia majirani wanawaongelea ongelea how would you feel? Itsucks a lot mlichukua madege yale afu mwasema shirika letu linakufa soon,mnacreate nini sasa hapo, yapo mambo lukuki kwenu yapo hovyo yahangaikienikwanza huko tuacheni na mambo yetu, you dont have any proof what our politicalsystem has done to us, what has yours done to you?

The way you guys sound yanihamjioni nyie madudu yenu who in the world doesnt know what kenyan politicalsystem has done to her people? Tuparamie muungano wakati makabila yenu tu nyiejirani hayajaungana makabila tu, na loopholes kibao. Only a fool ndo angeingiakichwa kichwa kwa hiyo muungano, Neighbour narudia tena "toa boriti lililokwa jicho lako ndo utoe la kwa jirani yako" Yesu huyo alisema, usimnyosheemwenzako kidole, vitatu vina vinakuelekea wewe hapo. Now I hope u got ma pointsintellectual Kenyans

DAIMA MIMI MTANZANIA, MWANANCHI MZALENDO
 
mwathai said:
Hi all. I am shocked but not surprised. Kenya Commercial bank is a kenya owned Bank, so is Kenya Airways, Equity Bank, Uchumi Super markets, Nakumatt Supermarkets, Other Banks such as Barclays, standard Chartered are 59% Kenyan owned.

The gist of the story is simply, Tanzania is afraid of its shadow. Can those spewing insults tell us the largest Kenyan land owner owns how many acres in Tanzania? The land issues is simply a smokescreen for the real issue- sabotage. Tanzania Caused the death of EAC in 1977 because it wanted to slow Kenya down until they catch up-a pip dream which they still pursue - and a dismal failure.

The truth Kenya is the leading market in Africa for Tanzania manufactured and agricultural produce. So does Tanzania need Kenya? Try closing border.
What I am saying Tanzania will one day regret he opportunities it let go in pursuit of the wind. And Kenya, the largest economy in East Africa . I can cite specific cases where Tanzania officials acted out rightly stupid.
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Mkuu, if my memories serves me right can't remember any Tanzanian ever been concern by Kenyan Cabinet leadership quality! Consequently your opinion regarding Tanzania Leaders I humbly suggest you keep it to yourself - see, if you don't have anything good to talk about an individual/country the best thing is to keep tight-lipped, Tanzania as a Country she's none of your LOOKOUT - is that clear, jirani.

Going through your sensational post above, one gets the impression that actually it is Kenya not TANZANIA that is afraid of its SHADOW, something is seriously amiss about some of you guys-honestly, if you realy need no know, please read one post filed by JF Member from Botswana on how Botswanas perceives your persona (Kenyans) and why they have been targeting Kenyans in particular!! Mark you Botswana is light years away, why a distant Country should have -ve attitude towards YOU? got it - your behaviour leaves much to be desired, neo-colonialism trait of having a burning desire to dictate terms to any country in Africa specifically East Africa and get away with IT will lead you to a deadend, if you are not going to amend your behavior towards your jiranis EAF will remain but a pipe DREAM.

Please revisit your post attacking TANZANIA and its leaders-would you believe it?? -hawajuhi jinsi ya kuheshimu binadamu wanzao - ni ajabu na KWELI!! Take a look at what this Guy has written above! I can assure JF members that 99.999% of his story is purely fictitious, an handout from Hollywood Script writers tailor made to suit your purpose, oh YES to get even with a perceived stubborn TANZANIA.

One more thing, can you tell JF members who owns Kenya Airways? - come on, your sensational story has it that the Airline is owned wolly by Kenyans, right? Wrong, the truth of the matter is: 26% is own by Air France-KLM, 23% by Kenyan Govt and the remaining 30.94% by individual shareholders, wenzetu mambo wanayo yasema kuhusu nchi yao mengine ni ya kweli lakini mengine mengi wanaweka chumvi mno! The paper seems to reduce me here, but I promise will be back to spill the beans.
 
This issue has strong political opinion and politicians/leaders are very sensitive on this and I can tell you land, job opportunities this is what Tanzania is afraid off. In my opinion, EAC member states should accept Tanzania stand on land (they should have land laws which are somehow accommodating foreign investors) and job opportunities in same way. It is better now we have these issues and solutions should be thought careful otherwise getting into common bloc and later on it get collapse like 1977 is not good idea.
 
Geza Ulole said:
Ati Kenya companies! ********* nathani! Angalia share holding ujue kuwa those r Kenyan incorporated companies and not Kenyan owned! The owner of those companies like many other decide where to invest is not upon u to cry a river! Who wants ur investments anyway? BTW hiyo KCB ina market share ngapi Tanzania i bet hata 5% haifiki nobody uses KCB except for loans u must be fooling urself!
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Don't abuse your friends and expect them to consider it criticism
 
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