UK group plans Pope's arrest

[Ng'wanza Madaso]

Pope 'has no UK arrest immunity'

1 hour 28 mins ago

Plans to have the Pope arrested when he visits the UK will succeed because he is not a head of state, a solicitor has said.


Pope 'has no UK arrest immunity' Enlarge photo

Atheist authors Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens proposed the action against the Pontiff for his handling of child abuse scandals in the Catholic church.

The writers' solicitor Mark Stephens said applications will be made to courts in the UK and the International Criminal Court for a warrant for Pope Benedict XVI's arrest.

His likely defence would be be that he is immune from prosecution during his visit to Britain in September, according to the lawyer.

Mr Stephens said: "The courts will examine the claim of immunity. I believe that an English court would reject it. If the Pope was here on a state visit, ordinarily a head of state would have sovereign immunity. What I believe is that because he's not a sovereign, not a head of state, he's not entitled to the defence."

He said that the Vatican was declared to be a state by Benito Mussolini, but this had no standing in international law.

The Pope faced criticism after it emerged that he signed a letter which delayed the punishment of a paedophile priest in the US for the "good of the universal church".

Writing in 1985, the future Pontiff said that he needed more time to consider the case.

Mr Stephens, who has represented abuse victims in the past said: "This will require the Pope to deal with the way in which he appears to have prioritised the reputation of the Catholic church over the welfare of children."

Potential charges against the Pope would be crimes against humanity.

 

[Nkamangi]

This could be interesting...

 

[paradox]

This should be very interesting, I hope they do arrest the man, nobody should be immune from justice even the head of the Catholic church

His Holiness isn't so 'Holy' afterall

 

[Mzee Mwanakijiji]

Not even close... hakuna mahakama inayoweza kufanya hivyo...

 

[Nemesis]

hii itakuwa kali, lakini haitatokea.

 

[Prof Griff]

Huu ni mkwara tu na hao Hitchens na Dawkins wanatafuta misifa tu. isitoshe hajafa mtu hapo zaidi ya padiri wawili-watatu kupakatapakata watoto kwa staili za "ulavidavi".

Kama kweli hawa dudes wako serious basi wangemuunganisha Mkapa Mwizi kwa kukwiba pesa na kusababisha vifo na mateso makubwa kwa Waafrika wa Tanzania.

 

[roselyne1]

..dirty campaign to spread ideology,being atheist is better than being catholic?
...nimeona mahali kuwa huyo mmoja ndio author ana vitabu viwili,mwingine ni journalist wa kawaida....could this be his means...for his books to get 'publicity'??bussiness campaign?

 

[Rufiji]

..
Ukisema Mahakama ya Tanzania haiwezi kufanya hivyo nitakuelewa...lakini mahakama zinazoheshimu utu wa watu na ambazo zinatetea haki za watoto anything is possible. Jamani kanisa katoliki needs to come clean on this ​

otherwise.....

 

[Magobe T]

..
Ukisema Mahakama ya Tanzania haiwezi kufanya hivyo nitakuelewa...lakini mahakama zinazoheshimu utu wa watu na ambazo zinatetea haki za watoto anything is possible. Jamani kanisa katoliki needs to come clean on this ​

otherwise.....

Kama haki inaonekana hivyo huko UK, basi Uingereza isingeingia kichwakichwa kwenye vita na Iraq. Mbona hao wanasheria hawajawahi kuona kuwa Uingereza kujiingiza kwenye vita Iraq na kuua maelfu ya watu wasio na hatia ilikuwa kuvunja haki za watu? Hili la papa lina 'mixed motives'. Kitu chochote kinachofanyika kwa hila huwa mwisho wake unajulikana kuwa hila. Naomba hiyo September ifike. Na je, watamkamata papa peke yake au hata masskofu wa Ireland na mapadre wao?

 

[Mzee Kibiongo]

Lakini mapadre walio wadhalilisha watoto si wanajulikana?? Kwa nini wasishughulikiwe wao kwanza. Hili la papa kuchelewa kutoa maamuzi ni kwamba alikuwa analinda umoja na heshima ya kanisa lake, lakini ndiyo hivyo sasa limejulikana, anatakiwa ajibu. Ama kweli.............................. kipofu kumwongoza kipofu mwenziwe ni kutumbukia katika korongo.....Jesus Christ.

 

[Magobe T]

Lakini mapadre walio wadhalilisha watoto si wanajulikana?? Kwa nini wasishughulikiwe wao kwanza. Hili la papa kuchelewa kutoa maamuzi ni kwamba alikuwa analinda umoja na heshima ya kanisa lake, lakini ndiyo hivyo sasa limejulikana, anatakiwa ajibu. Ama kweli.............................. kipofu kumwongoza kipofu mwenziwe ni kutumbukia katika korongo.....Jesus Christ.

Siyo kweli unachosema. Hayo ni maoni ya watu na siyo ukweli kuhusu kitu gani kilifanyika. Kitu alichofanya papa ni kutaka muda zaidi wa kufanya uchunguzi kwa vile ushahidi wake ulikuwa siyo wazi sana kwa wakati huo. 'Kulinda heshima ya Kanisa' ni katika maana ya kulinda heshima ya mtuhumiwa hata kama amekosa na kutotumia tuhuma hizo kwa nia ya kuua imani ya waumini hasa wale wenye imani ndogo. Huku hakuna maana ya kuficha uovu.

Of course, mtazamo wa Kanisa ni tofauti na mitazamo ya 'state authorities' katika mambo mengi sana. Mfano, Kanisa haliwezi kushinikizwa kumwadhibu au kutomwadhibu padre au askofu kama limejilidhisha kuwa padre au askofu fulani ametenda hayo makosa anayotuhumiwa nayo au hajatenda. Kanisa linafuata kinachoitwa 'moral certainty' wakati 'state authorities' zinafuata 'legal certainty' au 'arbitrary power'. Lakini ninacholaumu mimi ni kwamba mara nyingi tunatoa maoni bila kuwa na 'facts' mbele yetu bali kwa kufuata maoni ya watu wengine. Mapadre wanafundishwa kuwa wasiri kuhusu wanayoambiwa na waumini wao kwenye kitubio au katika ushauri. Hii kutaka kujenga imani ya waumini hata kama ni wakosefu. Hivyo, hapa ni tofauti katika methodolojia: Kanisa linafanya 'pastoral care' tofauti na 'state authorities'.