Referendum for Zanzibar Independence

[zanzibar huru]

kwa nini wanasiasa wanaogopa hiii referendum?

kwa nini wananchi wasiulizwe kwenye kura za maoni kama wanataka kuwa huru au la?

 

[S.Liondo]

Na sisi watu wa mikoa ya kusini yaani mtwara na lindi na pwani bila kusahau visiwa vya Mafia tumechoka kutawaliwa na watu wa kaskazini na lake zote.

Tunaomba referendum hiyo watuulize kama tunataka tujiunge na Wakaskazi au tujiunge na msumbiji.

Tanzania bara itabaki kuwa moja siku zote. Wazo lako halikubaliki.

 

[zanzibar huru]

ngoja niutafute ule mkataba

 

[zanzibar huru]

Nilisema kitambo hapa kwamba suluhisho la swala la muungani ni kura ya maoni.

Mwanakijiji hili halitaki

 

[Kiranga]

Can you tell me of one single union in history where citizens were consulted before consumating the union? In history?

Australia.

http://historysouthaustralia.net/FedDates.htm

[url]http://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/prod/web/common.nsf/key/HistoryTowardsFederation
[/URL]

 

[EMT]

The relationship between Zanzibar government and Tanzanian Mainland hasn't been so good in recent years since Tanzania Prime Minister Mizengo Pinda's remark about the Isles' strong sovereignty that Zanzibar is not an independent country outside the Union Government, within which it can only exercise its sovereignty.

Members from both the ruling party, Chama Cha Mapinduzi (CCM), and the opposition Civic United Front (CUF) disagreed with Mr Pinda's interpretation and stand firmly in recognizing Zanzibar as a fully autonomous and full state, the move which is widely unrecognized by the formation of the Government of the United Republic of Tanzania which raises a backlash between Members of Parliament from the Tanzania mainland and Zanzibar.

In 2008, Tanzanian president Jakaya Kikwete tried to silence the matter when he addressed the nation in a live conference by saying that Zanzibar is a state internal but semi-state international. But this this has not no calmed down the situation.

It seems that a plebiscite is the only way forward.

 

[zanzibar huru]

Australia.

Federation of Australia Timelinehttp://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/prod/web/common.nsf/key/HistoryTowardsFederation

wachache sana JF wana kichwa kama chako

safi sana umemkata zote na hawezi kurudi huyo

hii ndio definition of a great thinker

 

[Kiranga]

wachache sana JF wana kichwa kama chako

safi sana umemkata zote na hawezi kurudi huyo

hii ndio definition of a great thinker

Kuna ubaya gani kuwapa wananchi maamuzi, waamue nchi yao iende vipi? Si ndiyo maana ya demokrasia hiyo?

 

[zanzibar huru]

Kuna ubaya gani kuwapa wananchi maamuzi, waamue nchi yao iende vipi? Si ndiyo maana ya demokrasia hiyo?

Mwanakijiji anasema hiyo ni bad precedence

btw Mwanakijiji ni Great thinker wa JF

Inatisha sana hii

 

[Pharaoh]

Not a State and not even a semi state is just semi autonomous Island of Tanzania

 

[EMT]

Mwanakijiji anasema hiyo ni bad precedence

btw Mwanakijiji ni Great thinker wa JF

Inatisha sana hii

Kwa vile Mwanakijiji anaamini sana kwenye popular sovereignty niliwuliza kwa nini ni bad precedence hakujibu.

 

[Kiranga]

Mwanakijiji anasema hiyo ni bad precedence

btw Mwanakijiji ni Great thinker wa JF

Inatisha sana hii

Kuwapa wananchi uamuzi wa kuamua nchi yao inaendaje haiwezi kuwa bad precedent. Tunafanya hili kila miaka mitano katika uchaguzi mkuu tunapochagua rais, kwa hiyo sababu pekee ya kusema "bad precedent" ni kama mtu anajua muungano haupendwi na unaweza kukataliwa na wananchi.

Wanaokataa kura ya maoni wanajuaje kwamba wananchi hawataweza kuukubali muungano kwa kishindo?

Mimi ninachotaka ni muungano upate kupitishwa au kukataliwa na wananchi, ukikubaliwa na wananchi serikali itapata uhalali wa kuwapiga mabomu ya machozi waandamanaji wanaopinga muungano. Kwa sababu watakuwa wanaleta uchochezi kwa kitu kilichokubaliwa na wengi.

Muungano ukikataliwa, serikali itabidi ikubali matakwa ya wananchi.

Sasa hivi hatujui kama muungano unakubalika kwa wananchi, au haukubaliki. Inawezekana unakubalika, lakini kwa sababu hakuna matokeo ya referendum rasmi, serikali ikiwapiga mabomu ya machozi wanaopinga muungano kwa minajili ya kutetea muungano wa watu wa Tanzania, siwezi kusema kwamba haitakuwa imewawaonea, maana kauli ya serikali kujidai inatetea muungano wa watu inakuwa inaelea hewani tu, haina kura za kuipa nguvu.

Lakini kama kesho muungano ukipitishwa kwa 80% kote, bara na visiwani, serikali itakuwa imewanyamazisha kabisa wanaopinga muungano.

Kwa hiyo kwa kutoitisha kura ya maoni, serikali haiwatendei haki wanaopenda muungano, na wasiopenda muungano.Kwa sababu wote hawajui ukweli uko wapi, muungano una support kiasi gani.

The truth shall make you free.

 

[Taso]

Mwanakijiji hili halitaki

Sitauliza Mwanakijiji ndio nani, maana najua ana nafasi yake ya pekee, anafikiri kwa niaba ya wengi hapa, ila nitauliza Mwanakijiji anapiga kura ngapi katika maamuzi ya referendum za Watanzania? Last time I checked hana hata kura moja kwa sababu bado hatujapitisha absentee ballot.

 

[zanzibar huru]

wazee mnakata ishu za kufa mtu naona hakuna wa kuja kubishana nanyi

safi sana hiyo

 

[zanzibar huru]

jamaa wote wamekimbia

 

[Mag3]

Kwa vile Mwanakijiji anaamini sana kwenye popular sovereignty niliwuliza kwa nini ni bad precedence hakujibu.

EMT, je unadhani kuna siku moja ama referendum au plebiscite itaweza kufanyika Marekani kuhusu kujitenga kwa Texas?
Jibu ni hapana, haitawezekana kwa sababu ita"set bad precedence" ila wanaweza kutumia nguvu kujitenga kama wanayo! Na Zanzibar pia hivyo hivyo, wanaweza kuchukua maamuzi ya kujitenga kama wana ubavu lakini si kwa makubaliano kama inavyodaiwa kwani inatoa mwanya kwa nchi kusambaratika. Kwanza kura ya maoni haitabiriki na pili ikiruhusiwa kwa nini kesho na kesho kutwa sehemu nyingine ya Tanzania isifanye hivyo. Ngoja nitoe mfano;

Texas entered the union in 1845 but with the understanding it could pull out (sio kama Zanzibar). Texas however did decide to secede in 1861, but the North's victory in the Civil War put an end to that through force and might. Early last year Rick Perry, the governor of Texas, stroked political fires when he mentioned Texas secession at a public anti-tax rally on April 15th, 2011. Many famous sayings are known to be of Texas origin such as "Remember the Alamo," and "Don't Mess with Texas." These sayings highlight the feelings of most native born, and transplanted Texans of patriotism to Texas first, then second to the United States...yale yale ya Uzanzibari!

Rick Perry suggested that seceding from the union could be benefit Texas but was Rick Perry's secession talk only an isolated politician spouting hype? No, there are at least 6 organizations that actively campaign for a Texas secession including the Texas Nationalist. Most Texas succession activists claim the US government saps the wealth of Texas and forces socialistic ideals upon a state with strong independent abilities. These secession activists would like to see Texas regain pride and strength through seceding from the United States union...Madai kama ya Uamusho?

In reality, can Texas secede? Maybe, but only if they have the power and might...je Zanzibar wanazo? Kama wanazo, hawana haja ya kubembeleza. Kuungana na kuwa nchi moja kunaweza kukahitaji mjadala na kukubaliana lakini kujitenga ni "enemy action" hakuwezi kujadiliwa kwa amani kwa sababu kunatokana na pande mbili kutokubaliana. Ni sawa na harusi, inafungwa kwa shangwe lakini inapovunjika ni mambo mengine kabisa na wakati mwingine kunazaa uadui baina ya pande mbili hasa pale dai la msingi linapohusu kukosekana kwa haki, upendo na kuaminiana.

 

[zanzibar huru]

Mwanakijiji na Pasco mnaombwa mrudi ili mjibu hoja

 

[Moses msisia]

its all about OIL and GAS

Watapoteza hao sio oil wala gas itachimbwa hapo

 

[BORGIAS]

Huyu ni Pasco huyo huyo wa siku zote au mwingine?

kazi kweli kweli

 

[EMT]

EMT, je unadhani kuna siku moja ama referendum au plebiscite itaweza kufanyika Marekani kuhusu kujitenga kwa Texas?
Jibu ni hapana, haitawezekana kwa sababu ita"set bad precedence" ila wanaweza kutumia nguvu kujitenga kama wanayo! Na Zanzibar pia hivyo hivyo, wanaweza kuchukua maamuzi ya kujitenga kama wana ubavu lakini si kwa makubaliano kama inavyodaiwa kwani inatoa mwanya kwa nchi kusambaratika. Kwanza kura ya maoni haitabiriki na pili ikiruhusiwa kwa nini kesho na kesho kutwa sehemu nyingine ya Tanzania isifanye hivyo. Ngoja nitoe mfano;

Texas entered the union in 1845 but with the understanding it could pull out (sio kama Zanzibar). Texas however did decide to secede in 1861, but the North's victory in the Civil War put an end to that through force and might. Early last year Rick Perry, the governor of Texas, stroked political fires when he mentioned Texas secession at a public anti-tax rally on April 15th, 2011. Many famous sayings are known to be of Texas origin such as "Remember the Alamo," and "Don't Mess with Texas." These sayings highlight the feelings of most native born, and transplanted Texans of patriotism to Texas first, then second to the United States...yale yale ya Uzanzibari!

Rick Perry suggested that seceding from the union could be benefit Texas but was Rick Perry's secession talk only an isolated politician spouting hype? No, there are at least 6 organizations that actively campaign for a Texas secession including the Texas Nationalist. Most Texas succession activists claim the US government saps the wealth of Texas and forces socialistic ideals upon a state with strong independent abilities. These secession activists would like to see Texas regain pride and strength through seceding from the United States union...Madai kama ya Uamusho?

In reality, can Texas secede? Maybe, but only if they have the power and might...je Zanzibar wanazo? Kama wanazo, hawana haja ya kubembeleza. Kuungana na kuwa nchi moja kunaweza kukahitaji mjadala na kukubaliana lakini kujitenga ni "enemy action" hakuwezi kujadiliwa kwa amani kwa sababu kunatokana na pande mbili kutokubaliana. Ni sawa na harusi, inafungwa kwa shangwe lakini inapovunjika ni mambo mengine kabisa na wakati mwingine kunazaa uadui baina ya pande mbili hasa pale dai la msingi linapohusu kukosekana kwa haki, upendo na kuaminiana.

Kwa hiyo tuwachie wanasiasa watuamulie aina ya muungano unaotakiwa kwa kuogopa kuwa na bad precedent?

So far tayari tunaona precedents wanazojaribu ku-set huko kwenye "Bunge la Katiba".

Kama ni kweli wananchi walipendekeza kuwa na serikali tatu, then ni sawa kuepuka ku-set bad precedent kwa kuwaachia wanasiasa kuja na mapendekezo yao kuwa na serikali mbili na mabunge matatu (kama kweli hizo fununu ni za kweli)?