Untapped: The Scramble for Africas Oil

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Yes it answers my question.

Now, if you think it was bad all the way around, why don't ditch everything that's colonial?

Ditch in what sense? If you mean stop using the railroads or whatever they built that doesn't make any sense because I will say again they used the money they made from our resources to built those things. Or what exactly do you want us to ditch?

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Ditch in what sense? If you mean stop using the railroads or whatever they built that doesn't make any sense because I will say again they used the money they made from our resources to built those things. Or what exactly do you want us to ditch?

Lol...That's not what I meant though it is laughably contradictory in itself!!

You can start by ditching English....

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Lol...That's not what I meant though it is laughably contradictory in itself!!

You can start by ditching English....

How is it contradictory?Anyway so you mean to say English is one of the benefits the whites gave to Africa? Because the whole argument is about what benefits the whites brought about so unless you mean to say English is a benefit we got from the whites you would be going off topic.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

How is it contradictory?Anyway so you mean to say English is one of the benefits the whites gave to Africa? Because the whole argument is about what benefits the whites brought about so unless you mean to say English is a benefit we got from the whites you would be going off topic.

You have already admitted that colonialism was bad all the way around. Now, because we have already established that to be your point of view, don't you think that embracing the English language (regardless of it being a benefit or not), which is clearly one of the lasting vestiges of British colonial rule, is hypocritical?

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

You have already admitted that colonialism was bad all the way around. Now, because we have already established that to be your point of view, don't you think that embracing the English language, which is clearly one of the lasting vestiges of British colonial rule, is hypocritical?

You still going off topic. The topic was about benefits. Sasa until you tell me English is a benefit then I can oppose or agree. And also English is not a result of us being colonized by Britain or else we would have adopted it as our first language like other countries have done with the language of their colonizers. We would have to speak English because it is an international language not because they colonized us. Kwani tunge tawaliwa na mfano Wareno unasema tusinge ongea kingereza? Hapa kinaongelewa how colonialism has benefited us.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

You still going off topic. The topic was about benefits. Sasa until you tell me English is a benefit then I can oppose or agree. And also English is not a result of us being colonized by Britain or else we would have adopted it as our first language like other countries have done with the language of their colonizers. We would have to speak English because it is an international language not because they colonized us. Kwani tunge tawaliwa na mfano Wareno unasema tusinge ongea kingereza? Hapa kinaongelewa how colonialism has benefited us.

Is English one of our offical language? Yes or no?

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Is English one of our offical language? Yes or no?

Is English one of the benefits from the colonialists? Yes or no? Again tunaongelea benefits so kwanza sema if it is a benefit or else their is no point arguing over it.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Is English one of the benefits from the colonialists? Yes or no? Again tunaongelea benefits so kwanza sema if it is a benefit or else their is no point arguing over it.

Yes it is.

Now, is English one of our official languages?

And you are wrong to say us (Tanzania) being an Anglophone country is not a result of being colonized by the British. I just wanted set that straight.

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Yes it is.

Now, is English one of our official languages?

And you are wrong to say us (Tanzania) being an Anglophone country is not a result being colonized by the British. I just wanted set that straight.

Ok so it's a benefit of them colonizing us? Umeshasema being Anglophone is not a result of being colonized by Britain yet still you say it is a benefit brought by the British colonization? Thats contradictory. If speaking English is not a result of being colonized by Britain then how can you say it is a benefit brought about by being colonized by Britain?

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

You still going off topic. The topic was about benefits. Sasa until you tell me English is a benefit then I can oppose or agree. And also English is not a result of us being colonized by Britain or else we would have adopted it as our first language like other countries have done with the language of their colonizers. We would have to speak English because it is an international language not because they colonized us. Kwani tunge tawaliwa na mfano Wareno unasema tusinge ongea kingereza? Hapa kinaongelewa how colonialism has benefited us.

Ok so it's a benefit of them colonizing us? Umeshasema being Anglophone is not a result of being colonized by Britain yet still you say it is a benefit brought by the British colonization? Thats contradictory. If speaking English is not a result of being colonized by Britain then how can you say it is a benefit brought about by being colonized by Britain?

Sasa vipi bana? Vitu unasema mwenyewe halafu unasema mimi ndio nimesema. What the hell bruh?

Sasa hebu soma tena hapo kwenye wekundu halafu uniambie nani kasema Kiingereza kuwa moja ya lugha zetu rasmi sio matokeo ya sisi kutawaliwa na Waingereza...

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Sasa vipi bana? Vitu unasema mwenyewe halafu unasema mimi ndio nimesema. What the hell bruh?

Sasa hebu soma tena hapo kwenye wekundu halafu uniambie nani kasema Kiingereza kuwa moja ya lugha zetu rasmi sio matokeo ya sisi kutawaliwa na Waingereza...

Ok mkuu to make this simple so we can end the never ending argument. Wewe unaona Kiingereza ni matokeo ya utawala wa Wakoloni au ni lugha ambayo tungeweza kuwa nayo bila wao kutu tawala? Mimi I'm still saying English is NOT a benefit we got from being colonized by Britain. My argument was that we got no benefits from being colonized by Britain. Since we could have had English as our official language even without being colonized by them then it's not a benefit which still goes back to what I've been trying to tell you in the first place. So untill you show me how English is a benefit from being colonized my argument still stands correct.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Ok mkuu to make this simple so we can end the never ending argument. Wewe unaona Kiingereza ni matokeo ya utawala wa Wakoloni au ni lugha ambayo tungeweza kuwa nayo bila wao kuwa tawala? Mimi I'm still saying English is NOT a benefit we got from being colonized by Britain. My argument was that we got no benefits from being colonized by Britain. Since we could have had English as our official language even without being colonized by them then it's not a benefit which still goes back to what I've been trying to tell you in the first place. So untill you show me how English is a benefit from being colonized my argument still stands correct.

So unakubali kuwa umechemsha kwa kusema kuwa mimi ndio nimesema kile ulichosema nimesema?

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

So unakubali kuwa umechemsha kwa kusema kuwa mimi ndio nimesema kile ulichosema nimesema?

Ok fine I made a mistake kwenye hilo so na wewe jibu swala kwamba bado unadhani English is a benefit of being colonized? Because the argument is about benefits so to end it you just tell me how is it a benefit of colonization au sivyo ukweli una baki pale pale kuwa what i said about there being no benefits from colonization is true.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Ok fine I made a mistake kwenye hilo so na wewe jibu swala kwamba bado unadhani English is a benefit of being colonized? Because the argument is about benefits so to end it you just tell me how is it a benefit of colonization au sivyo ukweli una baki pale pale kuwa what i said about there being no benefits from colonization is true.

Colonisation had many benefits with English being among the many.

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Colonisation had many benefits with English being among the many.

You still haven't shown how English is a benefit of colonization. Kwani nchi ambazo haziku tawaliwa na Britain hawana watu wanao ongea Kingereza? My point still remains how is it a benefit from colonization if we didn't have to be colonized to speak it? Kwani wote wanaongelea kingereza wame tawaliwa na wakoloni? Na imetu benefit vipi wakati even the majority of Tanzanians don't even speak it? Na hizo other benefits zitaje basi si zipo nyingi kama unavyo sema?

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

You still haven't shown how English is a benefit of colonization. Kwani nchi ambazo haziku tawaliwa na Britain hawana watu wanao ongea Kingereza? My point still remains how is it a benefit from colonization if we didn't have to be colonized to speak it? Kwani wote wanaongelea kingereza wame tawaliwa na wakoloni? Na imetu benefit vipi wakati even the majority of Tanzanians don't even speak it? Na hizo other benefits zitaje basi si zipo nyingi kama unavyo sema?

Okay, haya twende taratibu.

Wakoloni walijenga miundombinu ambayo hadi hivi leo bado tunaitumia. Tuanzie na reli ya kati. Ndio, labda dhumuni la wao kujenga hiyo reli ilikuwa ni kurahisisha usafirishaji wa mazao n.k. Lakini baada ya wao kuondoka hawakuzing'oa hizo reli. Walituachia na sisi tukazipokea na kuendelea kuzitumia.

Nimepanda sana treni mimi ya kwenda Mwanza na kushukia Shinyanga. Enzi hizo usafiri wa basi ulikuwa mgumu kweli. Kulikuwa hakuna njia ya kuaminika kwenda hiyo mikoa ya kanda ya ziwa. Usafiri wa ndege sio kila mtu alikuwa anaweza kumudu. Sasa uje wewe unambie eti mimi sijafaidika na kuwepo kwa reli ya kati kwa kweli nitakushangaa.

Kuna wafanya biashara wengi sana wa kutoka mikoa ya kanda ya ziwa waliokuwa na bado ambao wanatumia hiyo reli kusafirisha bidhaa zao kuleta Dar-es-Salaam na mikoa mingine. Unataka kunambia hawafaidiki kuwepo na hiyo reli? Mwambie babu yangu na wajomba zangu waliokuwa wanasafirisha ng'ombe wao kutoka Mwanza na Shinyanga kwenda Kibaha kuwa hiyo reli haina faida yoyote uone kama watakuelewa.

Kuna shule ngapi ambazo wakoloni walizijenga na walipoondoka hawakuzivunja? Ni viongozi wetu wangapi ambao wamepitia ktk hizo shule? Ni wasomi wangapi ambao tunao leo tunaojivunia ambao wamepitia shule zilizojengwa na mkoloni?

Bandari yetu ya salama tuliyonayo leo hii tumeijenga wenyewe? Ni nchi ngapi zinazotumia bandari yetu? Kama kila kitu cha wakoloni kilikuwa kibaya basi tungeibomolea mbali na kujenga upya.

Nenda Oysterbay, Upanga na kwingineko uhesabu ni nyumba ngapi zilizojengwa na kuachwa wakoloni ambazo wanaishi Watanzania sasa hivi. Kwa nini baada ya uhuru hatukuzivunja na kujenga za kwetu wenyewe?

Ni Watanzania wangapi wanaoenda kutibiwa pale hospitali ya Ocean Road? Umewahi kufika kwenye hiyo hospitali wewe? Hiyo hospitali imejengwa na mkoloni na leo hii ndio taasisi kubwa Tanzania inayotibu magonjwa ya saratani. Nenda kawaambie wagonjwa wote wanaotibiwa hapo kuwa hiyo hospitali haina faida yoyote kwao kwa sababu ilijengwa na wakoloni.

Mimi sikatai kuwa ukoloni ulitunyima haki yetu kubwa ya msingi ambayo ni uhuru na uwezo wa kujitawala na kujiamulia mambo yetu wenyewe. Lakini vilevile nitakuwa si mkweli nikikataa katakata kuwa ukoloni haukuleta faida zozote zile. Malengo na madhumuni ya wakoloni kujenga makoloni yao pengine yalikuwa ni ya kuwanufaisha wao zaidi lakini vilevile na sisi waliotuachia tumenufaika na tunaendelea kunufaika pia. Tungeona kuwa vyote walivyotuachia havina faida yoyote basi baada ya wao kuondoka tungeondokana navyo vyote.

Kuna raisi mmoja huko Afrika Magharibi, Sekou Toure wa Guinea kama sijakosea ambaye aling'oa hadi milingoti ya taa za umeme za barabarani baada ya Wafaransa kuondoka na baadaye kujikuta anaomba msaada wa vile vile alivyovibomoa kutoka kwa rafiki yake Kwame Nkrumah. Now how smart was that?

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Okay, haya twende taratibu.

Wakoloni walijenga miundombinu ambayo hadi hivi leo bado tunaitumia. Tuanzie na reli ya kati. Ndio, labda dhumuni la wao kujenga hiyo reli ilikuwa ni kurahisisha usafirishaji wa mazao n.k. Lakini baada ya wao kuondoka hawakuzing'oa hizo reli. Walituachia na sisi tukazipokea na kuendelea kuzitumia.

Nimepanda sana treni mimi ya kwenda Mwanza na kushukia Shinyanga. Enzi hizo usafiri wa basi ulikuwa mgumu kweli. Kulikuwa hakuna njia ya kuaminika kwenda hiyo mikoa ya kanda ya ziwa. Usafiri wa ndege sio kila mtu alikuwa anaweza kumudu. Sasa uje wewe unambie eti mimi sijafaidika na kuwepo kwa reli ya kati kwa kweli nitakushangaa.

Kuna wafanya biashara wengi sana wa kutoka mikoa ya kanda ya ziwa waliokuwa na bado ambao wanatumia hiyo reli kusafirisha bidhaa zao kuleta Dar-es-Salaam na mikoa mingine. Unataka kunambia hawafaidiki kuwepo na hiyo reli? Mwambie babu yangu na wajomba zangu waliokuwa wanasafirisha ng'ombe wao kutoka Mwanza na Shinyanga kwenda Kibaha kuwa hiyo reli haina faida yoyote uone kama watakuelewa.

Kuna shule ngapi ambazo wakoloni walizijenga na walipoondoka hawakuzivunja? Ni viongozi wetu wangapi ambao wamepitia ktk hizo shule? Ni wasomi wangapi ambao tunao leo tunaojivunia ambao wamepitia shule zilizojengwa na mkoloni?

Bandari yetu ya salama tuliyonayo leo hii tumeijenga wenyewe? Ni nchi ngapi zinazotumia bandari yetu? Kama kila kitu cha wakoloni kilikuwa kibaya basi tungeibomolea mbali na kujenga upya.

Nenda Oysterbay, Upanga na kwingineko uhesabu ni nyumba ngapi zilizojengwa na kuachwa wakoloni ambazo wanaishi Watanzania sasa hivi. Kwa nini baada ya uhuru hatukuzivunja na kujenga za kwetu wenyewe?

Ni Watanzania wangapi wanaoenda kutibiwa pale hospitali ya Ocean Road? Umewahi kufika kwenye hiyo hospitali wewe? Hiyo hospitali imejengwa na mkoloni na leo hii ndio taasisi kubwa Tanzania inayotibu magonjwa ya saratani. Nenda kawaambie wagonjwa wote wanaotibiwa hapo kuwa hiyo hospitali haina faida yoyote kwao kwa sababu ilijengwa na wakoloni.

Mimi sikatai kuwa ukoloni ulitunyima haki yetu kubwa ya msingi ambayo ni uhuru na uwezo wa kujitawala na kujiamulia mambo yetu wenyewe. Lakini vilevile nitakuwa si mkweli nikikataa katakata kuwa ukoloni haukuleta faida zozote zile. Malengo na madhumuni ya wakoloni kujenga makoloni yao pengine yalikuwa ni ya kuwanufaisha wao zaidi lakini vilevile na sisi waliotuachia tumenufaika na tunaendelea kunufaika pia. Tungeona kuwa vyote walivyotuachia havina faida yoyote basi baada ya wao kuondoka tungeondokana navyo vyote.

Kuna raisi mmoja huko Afrika Magharibi, Sekou Toure wa Guinea kama sijakosea ambaye aling'oa hadi milingoti ya taa za umeme za barabarani baada ya Wafaransa kuondoka na baadaye kujikuta anaomba msaada wa vile vile alivyovibomoa kutoka kwa rafiki yake Kwame Nkrumah. Now how smart was that?

Mkuu mbona tunarudi tulipo toka tena? Hivyo vitu si nilisha kubali vipo? Lakini nilicho sema mimi ni kwamba hiyo reli, hizo shule na hayo majumba walijengaje? Si wali chukua rasilimali zetu na kwenda kuvitumia kwenye viwanda vyao? Sasa hauoni hivyo vitu vyote wamejenga kutokana na kilicho kuwa chetu tayari? Utamuibiaje mtu halafu utumia a fraction ya ulicho muibia kumjengea nyumba then huyo mtu aku shukuru? Kwa nini hawakujenga vyote hivyo bila kutu tawala? Wange fanya vyote hivyo isingekuwa kutu tawala? You can't say they benefited us while they were stilling our "fishes" then feeding us of them them to us.

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Mkuu mbona tunarudi tulipo toka tena? Hivyo vitu si nilisha kubali vipo? Lakini nilicho sema mimi ni kwamba hiyo reli, hizo shule na hayo majumba walijengaje? Si wali chukua rasilimali zetu na kwenda kuvitumia kwenye viwanda vyao? Sasa hauoni hivyo vitu vyote wamejenga kutokana na kilicho kuwa chetu tayari? Utamuibiaje mtu halafu utumia a fraction ya ulicho muibia kumjengea nyumba then huyo mtu aku shukuru? Kwa nini hawakujenga vyote hivyo bila kutu tawala? Wange fanya vyote hivyo isingekuwa kutu tawala? You can't say they benefited us while they were stilling our "fishes" then feeding us of them them to us.

Well, you can spin it any way you want to but the fact is we didn't have those things before they came, before the imposition of colonialism. Had we have them before they came, your argument would have made sense.

Vitu hivyo walivijenga kwa kutumia ujuzi wao na wakaviacha walipoondoka. Tungekuwa tunao ujuzi waliotumia wao basi tungevibomoa na kujenga vya kwetu au tungekuwa tayari tumeshajenga kabla ya wata wao kuja.

Hata mfumo wa kisheria tunaoufuata sasa tumerithi kutoka kwao. Kwa nini mtu urithi kitu unachojua kuwa hakina manufaa kwako?

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Well, you can spin it any way you want to but the fact is we didn't have those things before they came, before the imposition of colonialism. Had we have them before they came, your argument would have made sense.

Vitu hivyo walivijenga kwa kutumia ujuzi wao na wakaviacha walipoondoka. Tungekuwa tunao ujuzi waliotumia wao basi tungevibomoa na kujenga vya kwetu au tungekuwa tayari tumeshajenga kabla ya wata wao kuja.

Hata mfumo wa kisheria tunaoufuata sasa tumerithi kutoka kwao. Kwa nini mtu urithi kitu unachojua kuwa hakina manufaa kwako?

Walijenga kwa kufanyia biashara zao Afrika na wala wasinge vijenga kama isinge wanufaisha wao. The fact remind they built all that infrustructure to facilitate they actions of robbing us blind. Kwa nini wasinge tufanyia yote hayo bila kutu colonize?

 

[Nyani Ngabu]

Walijenga kwa kufanyia biashara zao Afrika na wala wasinge vijenga kama isinge wanufaisha wao. The fact remind they built all that infrustructure to facilitate they actions of robbing us blind. Kwa nini wasinge tufanyia yote hayo bila kutu colonize?

Kuna kipindi Kenya walikuwa wanajitapa kwa kuwa na uchumi mzuri Afrika Mashariki na kati kwa sababu wakoloni waliijenga Kenya kuliko nchi zingne za eneo hilo. Sasa kwa nini wajitapie kurithi uchumi au misingi mizuri ya uchumi waliyorithi kama kila kitu cha wakoloni kilikuwa kibaya?

Zimbabwe kuna kipindi ilikuwa ni nchi yenye moja ya chumi nzuri Afrika. Mugabe alirithi nchi iliyokuwa na uchumi uliokuwa imara. Angalia sasa alivyoharibu. Nakumbuka wakati niko dogo kwenda Zimbabwe ilikuwa kama vile kwenda kiwanja. Sasa linganisha hali waliyonayo sasa na hali iliyokuwepo mwaka 80,81,82,83,84.....