EAC should be limited to business only

[Swat]

You better deal with terrorist first then come and discuss about EAC.

In my opinion we should limit integration to business only and put off any other form of the structure. I've been keenly following Tanzanians debate on their new constitution here in Jamii forums and they seems to have made up their mind into forming a bloated and expensive three government system. Tanganyika, Zanzibar and one national state.

Reading through their debates, the united republic as we know it is only on the papers but practically there seems to be deep seated mistrust and conflicts between citizens of the two states. For a Tanganyika from Mainland to own a piece of land in Zanzibar is normally next to impossible and so many other critical issues.

This explains why Tanzania has been sluggish as far as the EAC community is concerned, they have experienced the merits and demerits of a union. We should learn from it too and avoid falling into such a trap. Each country should keep its dirt and only relate business-wise.
Our constitution is the most advanced and if we implement it carefully and painstakingly, we will succeed as a nation. We simply need to develop every part of our nation including Northern side, finish up the LAPPSET project and Kenya will never be the same again.

 

[AfPoliFed]

I hate Kenyans with all my heart...sijui kwanini Jumuiya ya Ulaya inatulazimisha kutuunganisha na hawa manyang'au ....hawa wanataka ardhi yetu, hawa wanajiona wa maana wakati ni washamba wa kutupwa wako aggressive ile mbaya ...level yao ya arrogance iko juu kuliko mbingu! Hawa hatuendani nao kwa vyovyote vile ... mademu wao wabayaaaa.....

Wow! You have mate all 40 million Kenyans. Jumuiya ya Ulaya hataki Afrika kuungana so that they continue plundering Africa. The idea ya kuungana si ya waKenya ni idea ya Africa founding fathers that fought for your freedoms including hating people you have never mate.

 

[MK254]

I hate Kenyans with all my heart...sijui kwanini Jumuiya ya Ulaya inatulazimisha kutuunganisha na hawa manyang'au ....hawa wanataka ardhi yetu, hawa wanajiona wa maana wakati ni washamba wa kutupwa wako aggressive ile mbaya ...level yao ya arrogance iko juu kuliko mbingu! Hawa hatuendani nao kwa vyovyote vile ... mademu wao wabayaaaa.....

Tatizo lenyu mko sana introvert hamuendani na yeyote. Juzi naona mnalumbana na Mmalawi kwingine mpo na vurugu na Mrwanda hapo hapo ndo hao nyie hamuwataki Wakenya. Ukiona majrani wako wote unakosana nao basi jiangalie wa makini una tatizo mahali na ndio labda unaona hata Wanzazibar hamuelewani ila wote nyie Watanzania.

Tatizo la ardhi lipo kote Africa hata huku watu hukatana kwa mapanga hivyo naelewa jazba yenyu linapotajwa ila inawezekana tukaweka maswala ya ardhi pembeni kabisa na tuangalie nini kingine Waafria wanaweza fanya pamoja.

Halafu nyie siku zote unawaita Wakenya manyangau unafaa uelewe ulimwengu wa sasa umebadilika na kila mtu yuko kimaslahi zaidi. Hivi sasa Wabongo wamekua manyangau hata kuwaliko Wakenya. Munafahamika sana wa tuhuma za unga na pembe za ndovu. Hivi sasa Tz takwimu zinaonyesha munaongoza EAC kwa mafisadi huko wenyu. Dunia tena haina ukaka wala udada na imeoza ila sehemu.

 

[MK254]

You better deal with terrorist first then come and discuss about EAC.

Terrorism is a global challenge and won't stop people from going about their businesses. Our plan to build modern railway that will encompass six countries is underway. Port and airport expansion is a priority ... in simple terms life has to continue in the midst of Alshabaab bombs. Your cowardice is retrogressive. Our economy the other day shot to 5% growth despite the flying bombs we are a resilient and aggressive people.

 

[mwana uk]

Tatizo lenyu mko sana introvert hamuendani na yeyote. Juzi naona mnalumbana na Mmalawi kwingine mpo na vurugu na Mrwanda hapo hapo ndo hao nyie hamuwataki Wakenya. Ukiona majrani wako wote unakosana nao basi jiangalie wa makini una tatizo mahali na ndio labda unaona hata Wanzazibar hamuelewani ila wote nyie Watanzania.

Tatizo la ardhi lipo kote Africa hata huku watu hukatana kwa mapanga hivyo naelewa jazba yenyu linapotajwa ila inawezekana tukaweka maswala ya ardhi pembeni kabisa na tuangalie nini kingine Waafria wanaweza fanya pamoja.

Halafu nyie siku zote unawaita Wakenya manyangau unafaa uelewe ulimwengu wa sasa umebadilika na kila mtu yuko kimaslahi zaidi. Hivi sasa Wabongo wamekua manyangau hata kuwaliko Wakenya. Munafahamika sana wa tuhuma za unga na pembe za ndovu. Hivi sasa Tz takwimu zinaonyesha munaongoza EAC kwa mafisadi huko wenyu. Dunia tena haina ukaka wala udada na imeoza ila sehemu.

mi nakubaliana na mtoa maada alichoongea ni kwel

 

[Kobello]

Thats what EAC is for from the gets go!
Pseudo-Conglomerates going multinational. It wasn't meant for peasants and workers that constitutes the majority of its citzenry.
We are neighbors, but that doesn't mean people should just roam arround and cross borders like cows (according to Uhuru) or Serengeti's wilderbeasts.
We also are not interested in Security and Defense treaties with countries like yours or Rwanda, we have our brothers down south and you have SPLA.
Constitution is just a piece of paper unless it's well instituted and reflected in the workings of the state apparatus. Respect the views of your muslim brothers and follow the due process instead of hunting them down. They can be pests sometimes but thats why you have the judiciary.

In short, we are not that interested.

 

[CattleRustler]

Constitution making process is the most strenuous exercise a country can go through. Takes time and efforts and wasn't easy at all for us. Tanzania is on the right track. The only mistake have seen so far is that most of the delegates involved seems to take parties position as opposed to being patriotic and choosing what's right for the nation. There comes a time when the nation is bigger than an individual or a political party.

Unfortunately Warioba is the only person i can think off who has shown to be patriotic so far. I hope you will not get offended that i real believe 2008 post election violence is what real woken kenyan politicians and brought patriotism to both politician and civilians. The evidence of change is kenyan constitution reform process and the new constitution itself. The process Tanzania use to elect member constitution assembly and the type of people elected for once made me think it would have been better if Tanzania had gone through similar post election violence after 2010 election. There is a statement that American conservative like use close to " The tree of liberty needs to be watered with the blood of patrons once in a while" that statement has never made sense to me until now with what i see in constitution reformation process.

 

[MK254]

Unfortunately Warioba is the only person i can think off who has shown to be patriotic so far. I hope you will not get offended that i real believe 2008 post election violence is what real woken kenyan politicians and brought patriotism to both politician and civilians. The evidence of change is kenyan constitution reform process and the new constitution itself. The process Tanzania use to elect member constitution assembly and the type of people elected for once made me think it would have been better if Tanzania had gone through similar post election violence after 2010 election. There is a statement that American conservative like use close to " The tree of liberty needs to be watered with the blood of patrons once in a while" that statement has never made sense to me until now with what i see in constitution reformation process.

Though at some degree I agree wth you that post electon violence invoked insatiable desire for a good new constitution. But wouldn't even for second encourage that line of thinking to be your approach. Conflicts are retrogressive look around you tell me which country has stabilized successfully after civil conflict. Even Rwanda research shows there is deep seated hatred and mistrust that is a result of post genocide attitudes. Here in kenya we are still healing and actually our conflict lasted for very few months.
The only one thing alarmng in Tz s the general mass are not well charged up to discuss the document. Awareness seems to be lacking probably wrong strategy was used. I see it in my Tanzanian friends here in kenya. Whenever i bring up debate on the doc most are just not interested and dismisses the whole process as a sham. Very few even knows what is written in there.
Contrary to our case where the debates ranged from the city to the remotest villages. We discussed the document door to door. in the surburbs to the slums. You need to engage each other and make it a priority such that the delegates n parliament will see the emphasis and begin to respect the process.

 

[MK254]

Thats what EAC is for from the gets go!
Pseudo-Conglomerates going multinational. It wasn't meant for peasants and workers that constitutes the majority of its citzenry.
We are neighbors, but that doesn't mean people should just roam arround and cross borders like cows (according to Uhuru) or Serengeti's wilderbeasts.
We also are not interested in Security and Defense treaties with countries like yours or Rwanda, we have our brothers down south and you have SPLA.
Constitution is just a piece of paper unless it's well instituted and reflected in the workings of the state apparatus. Respect the views of your muslim brothers and follow the due process instead of hunting them down. They can be pests sometimes but thats why you have the judiciary.

In short, we are not that interested.

Are you giving your own opinion here as have noticed to many "we" such that it feels like you making a government statement.

 

[Kobello]

Are you giving your own opinion here as have noticed to many "we" such that it feels like you making a government statement.

"We" is a reflection of decisions made by our government. Just because Maasai cows aren't asked for a passport, it doesnt mean people shouldnt be asked for it .... thats dumb and that the main reason for hesitation, dumb partners.

 

[Kobello]

Though at some degree I agree wth you that post electon violence invoked insatiable desire for a good new constitution. But wouldn't even for second encourage that line of thinking to be your approach. Conflicts are retrogressive look around you tell me which country has stabilized successfully after civil conflict. Even Rwanda research shows there is deep seated hatred and mistrust that is a result of post genocide attitudes. Here in kenya we are still healing and actually our conflict lasted for very few months.
The only one thing alarmng in Tz s the general mass are not well charged up to discuss the document. Awareness seems to be lacking probably wrong strategy was used. I see it in my Tanzanian friends here in kenya. Whenever i bring up debate on the doc most are just not interested and dismisses the whole process as a sham. Very few even knows what is written in there.
Contrary to our case where the debates ranged from the city to the remotest villages. We discussed the document door to door. in the surburbs to the slums. You need to engage each other and make it a priority such that the delegates n parliament will see the emphasis and begin to respect the process.

Yeah .... by making a constitution that grants freedom of religion and not allowing Kenyan sikhs to erect their monuments.

 

[AfPoliFed]

Yeah .... by making a constitution that grants freedom of religion and not allowing Kenyan sikhs to erect their monuments.

They can erect their monuments on private property not public. Its called separation of state and religion.

 

[AfPoliFed]

"We" is a reflection of decisions made by our government. Just because Maasai cows aren't asked for a passport, it doesnt mean people shouldnt be asked for it .... thats dumb and that the main reason for hesitation, dumb partners.

Those Masai cattle are smarter than we are! They have refused to accept the borders that colonists gave us on 26 Feb 1885.

 

[Kobello]

Those Masai cattle are smarter than we are! They have refused to accept the borders that colonists gave us on 26 Feb 1885.

Yeah ... whatever!

 

[Kobello]

They can erect their monuments on private property not public. Its called separation of state and religion.

If you have a permit to advertise on a City's Roundabout or roadside and you paid for it, then whats the problem?
Those people show ignorance of their own constitutinoal rights ... thats the main point.
Stop telling us we're ignorant while you are ignorant morons yourselves ... get it?

 

[kadoda11]

I hate Kenyans with all my heart...sijui kwanini Jumuiya ya Ulaya inatulazimisha kutuunganisha na hawa manyang'au ....hawa wanataka ardhi yetu, hawa wanajiona wa maana wakati ni washamba wa kutupwa wako aggressive ile mbaya ...level yao ya arrogance iko juu kuliko mbingu! Hawa hatuendani nao kwa vyovyote vile ... mademu wao wabayaaaa.....

mkuu jaribu kwanza ku focus ktk issue aliyo ileta mada.

 

[CattleRustler]

I hate Kenyans with all my heart...sijui kwanini Jumuiya ya Ulaya inatulazimisha kutuunganisha na hawa manyang'au ....hawa wanataka ardhi yetu, hawa wanajiona wa maana wakati ni washamba wa kutupwa wako aggressive ile mbaya ...level yao ya arrogance iko juu kuliko mbingu! Hawa hatuendani nao kwa vyovyote vile ... mademu wao wabayaaaa.....

RockSpider,
The author of the thread made it clear that land issues should not be included in EAC so there is no point of complaining wanataka ardhi yetu. If you are so concerned with land issue may be you should start with land situation between Tanganyika and Zanzibar. I personal will rather have Kenyans benefit from Tanganyika land than Zanzibar arab wanna be. We should not be against any kind of cooperation because there are lot of issue that can be beneficial to Tanganyika. But i'm a firm believer of the following statement which may sound a bit beneficial to Tanganyika. But i'm a firm believer of the following statement which may sound a bit Oprah type but still very true. You should take care of yourself to be able to take care of somebody else.You should love yourself to love some body else. Likewise whatever cooperation or union( EAC, SADC or Tanzania ) Tanganyika choose to involve should protect and benefit Tanganyikans and not ohh tumuenzi Nyerere or we are all brothers in East Africa ----.

 

[MK254]

If you have a permit to advertise on a City's Roundabout or roadside and you paid for it, then whats the problem?
Those people show ignorance of their own constitutinoal rights ... thats the main point.
Stop telling us we're ignorant while you are ignorant morons yourselves ... get it?

Waste of time to engage a d.imwit like you.
The constitutional rights cut both ways. Both freedom of religion and freedom of expression are guaranteed and entrenched rights for everyone
Images are powerful tools of communication. They are more powerful than words. Images captivate the mind and human soul. Images inspire. But they can also create doubt, despondency and even war. That is why the most intoxicating images are often controlled and regulated by law. Because Kenya is a multicultural, multi-religious and multi-linguistic country, we must be careful not to elevate any single religion, cultural group and/or linguistic image above all others.
Tolerance cuts both ways.