CCM/CUF washambulia Wanaharakati- CDM wapinga kupitisha Mswada wa Mapitio ya Katiba

S

Sheba

JF-Expert Member
May 14, 2009
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Wanahistoria wanaamini 'History is Spiral' yaani historia hujirudia, wala hakuna jambo jipya kabisa juu ya ardhi. Mjadala wa Katiba huu wa sasa si mpya hata kidogo, pengine kizazi kinachoujadili ndicho kipya chenye upofu wa historia. Napenda kuanza kwa kumnukuu Mwalimu Nyerere katika hotuba yake kuhusu Katiba aliyoitoa mwaka 1962


"The point must be made that ultimately the safeguard of a people's right, the people's freedom and those things which they value, ultimately the safeguard is the ethic of the nation. When the nation does not have the ethic which will enable the Goverment to say: ' We cannot do this, that is un- Tanganyikan'. Or the people to say: ' That we cannot tolerate, that is un-Tanganyikan'. If the people do not have that kind of ethic, it does not matter what kind of constitution you frame. They can always be victims of tyranny....... What we must continue to do all the time, is to build an ethic of the nation, which makes the Heads of State whoever he is to say, ' I have the power to do this under the Constitution, but I cannot do it, it is un- Tanganyikan'. Or for the people of Tanganyika, if they have made a mistake and elected an insane individual as their Heads of State, who has the power under the Constitution to do XYZ if he tried to do it, the people of Tanganyika would say, 'We won't have it from anybody, President or President squared, we won't have it'.

I believe, sir, that is the way we ought to look at this constitution. We have got to have a little amount of faith, although I know that some Members have been questioning the idea of faith. But, sir, democracy is a declaration of faith in human nature, the very thing which we are struggling to safeguard here, the very idea of democracy is a declaration of faith in mankind. And every enemy of democracy is some person who somewhere has no faith in human beings. He doubts. He think he is all right, but other human beings are not all right.

28 June 1962 Hansard, 1st Session
Goverment Motion- Proposal for a Republic"

Naamini kwa dhati kabisa kuwa Katiba sio mwarobaini wa matatizo yetu kama taifa kwa sasa. Tunalo tatizo la kimaadili na kiuongozi kuanzia ngazi ya familia, Serikali, Chama Tawala na Vyama vya Upinzani. Tatizo hili tiba yake sio Katiba, bali ni kurudi katika misingi(Soul searching) ya Taifa hili. Tupitie upya na kuboresha yale mambo ya yaliyotuunganisha kama Taifa likiwemo Azimio la Arusha na kuliboresha kuweza kujibu changamoto za sasa. Pale ndipo kwenye agano la Taifa na zindiko la Tafa hili na si Katiba mpya.

Afrika Kusini ni nchi ambayo imepata Katiba mpya katika miaka ya karibuni. Katiba ambayo imesifiwa kuwa ilikuwa na mchakato wa wazi zaidi na ushirikishwaji wa hali ya juu. Katiba ile imeruhusu hadi haki za mashoga kwa mantiki ya kuheshimu haki za binadamu. Lakini maisha ya wazalendo wa Afrika Kusini bado yangali ni magumu na yaliyopoteza matumaini. Afrika Kusini ni nchi yenye mpasuko mkubwa pamoja na kuwa na uchumi imara.

Gharama tunazoingia katika kutafuta kile kinachoitwa Katiba mpya ni kubwa kuliko manufaa au matokeo yake kwa Mtanzania. Tutasimamisha uzalishaji na maendeleo na kuelekeza rasilimali zetu kwenye Katiba. Tutakuwa na Tume ambayo itazunguka na kufanya mikutano kwa miaka 2 na kutumia rasilimali; tutakuwa na Bunge la Katiba, Wabunge wale karibia 600 watalipwa posho na watachukua muda kufikia muafaka katika kujadili na Kamati kubishana sentensi zikaaje. Kisha tutakuwa na kura ya maoni nchi nzima ambayo ni sawa na uchaguzi mkuu, na mwaka mmoja baadae tutakuwa na uchaguzi mkuu. Gharama zote hizi zitabebwa na wananchi kwa gharama ya kuaihirisha utekelezaji wa miradi ya maendeleo.

Mwisho tutakuwa na document inaitwa Katiba mpya! ambayo haitabadilisha hali ya wananchi kwa kuwa tutakuwa hatujapatia jawabu tatizo letu la msingi.
 
mpushi said:
wadau kuna nn kati ya rashid hamad wa cuf na lissu wa chadema?
Click to expand...
Umeona nini mpaka umeuliza? Kwasababu swali lako ni open ended. Kwa mfano mtu anaweza akajibu apendavyo na akawa sahihi tu.
1.Kati ya Tundulisu na Rashid hamadi kuna Distance fulani ila sina uhakika na umbali.
2. ................................................
3..................................................
4......................................................
 
Anaongea pumba bungeni, then wabunge wa ccm wanashangilia. Kweli nimeamini cuf siyo wapinzani.
 
Na kamalizia kwa kuunga mkono hoja. Hawa kweli ni sehem ya CCM, wanakera sana hawa CUF.
 
Sheba said:
Wanahistoria wanaamini 'History is Spiral' yaani historia hujirudia, wala hakuna jambo jipya kabisa juu ya ardhi. Mjadala wa Katiba huu wa sasa si mpya hata kidogo, pengine kizazi kinachoujadili ndicho kipya chenye upofu wa historia. Napenda kuanza kwa kumnukuu Mwalimu Nyerere katika hotuba yake kuhusu Katiba aliyoitoa mwaka 1962


"The point must be made that ultimately the safeguard of a people's right, the people's freedom and those things which they value, ultimately the safeguard is the ethic of the nation. When the nation does not have the ethic which will enable the Goverment to say: ' We cannot do this, that is un- Tanganyikan'. Or the people to say: ' That we cannot tolerate, that is un-Tanganyikan'. If the people do not have that kind of ethic, it does not matter what kind of constitution you frame. They can always be victims of tyranny....... What we must continue to do all the time, is to build an ethic of the nation, which makes the Heads of State whoever he is to say, ' I have the power to do this under the Constitution, but I cannot do it, it is un- Tanganyikan'. Or for the people of Tanganyika, if they have made a mistake and elected an insane individual as their Heads of State, who has the power under the Constitution to do XYZ if he tried to do it, the people of Tanganyika would say, 'We won't have it from anybody, President or President squared, we won't have it'.

I believe, sir, that is the way we ought to look at this constitution. We have got to have a little amount of faith, although I know that some Members have been questioning the idea of faith. But, sir, democracy is a declaration of faith in human nature, the very thing which we are struggling to safeguard here, the very idea of democracy is a declaration of faith in mankind. And every enemy of democracy is some person who somewhere has no faith in human beings. He doubts. He think he is all right, but other human beings are not all right.

28 June 1962 Hansard, 1st Session
Goverment Motion- Proposal for a Republic"

Naamini kwa dhati kabisa kuwa Katiba sio mwarobaini wa matatizo yetu kama taifa kwa sasa. Tunalo tatizo la kimaadili na kiuongozi kuanzia ngazi ya familia, Serikali, Chama Tawala na Vyama vya Upinzani. Tatizo hili tiba yake sio Katiba, bali ni kurudi katika misingi(Soul searching) ya Taifa hili. Tupitie upya na kuboresha yale mambo ya yaliyotuunganisha kama Taifa likiwemo Azimio la Arusha na kuliboresha kuweza kujibu changamoto za sasa. Pale ndipo kwenye agano la Taifa na zindiko la Tafa hili na si Katiba mpya.

Afrika Kusini ni nchi ambayo imepata Katiba mpya katika miaka ya karibuni. Katiba ambayo imesifiwa kuwa ilikuwa na mchakato wa wazi zaidi na ushirikishwaji wa hali ya juu. Katiba ile imeruhusu hadi haki za mashoga kwa mantiki ya kuheshimu haki za binadamu. Lakini maisha ya wazalendo wa Afrika Kusini bado yangali ni magumu na yaliyopoteza matumaini. Afrika Kusini ni nchi yenye mpasuko mkubwa pamoja na kuwa na uchumi imara.

Gharama tunazoingia katika kutafuta kile kinachoitwa Katiba mpya ni kubwa kuliko manufaa au matokeo yake kwa Mtanzania. Tutasimamisha uzalishaji na maendeleo na kuelekeza rasilimali zetu kwenye Katiba. Tutakuwa na Tume ambayo itazunguka na kufanya mikutano kwa miaka 2 na kutumia rasilimali; tutakuwa na Bunge la Katiba, Wabunge wale karibia 600 watalipwa posho na watachukua muda kufikia muafaka katika kujadili na Kamati kubishana sentensi zikaaje. Kisha tutakuwa na kura ya maoni nchi nzima ambayo ni sawa na uchaguzi mkuu, na mwaka mmoja baadae tutakuwa na uchaguzi mkuu. Gharama zote hizi zitabebwa na wananchi kwa gharama ya kuaihirisha utekelezaji wa miradi ya maendeleo.

Mwisho tutakuwa na document inaitwa Katiba mpya! ambayo haitabadilisha hali ya wananchi kwa kuwa tutakuwa hatujapatia jawabu tatizo letu la msingi.
Click to expand...


Mkuu nadhani ukiufikirisha ubongo wako zaidi utagundua kuwa tatizo la msingi ni katiba, kwanini ni katiba? huwezi kuwa na viongozi wenye maadili wakati una katiba yenye kuzaa viongozi wsio kuwa na maadili,
baadhi ya mambo ambayo yanasababishwa na katiba kuweza kuzaa viongozi wasio waadiliifu,mengine wana JF wataongezea
1.tume ya uchaguzi sio huru,ipo kwa mujibu ya mtawala kwa maana ndiye aliyeiteua inawajibika kwake so kwa akili ya kawaida tu haiwezi kumuangusha yeye na chama chake,
2.Mamlaka makubwa aliyonayo raisi katika teuzi pia zinaweza kuzaa viongizi wasio na maadili na hasa kama mkuu huyo wa nchi hatakuwa na maadili mazuri,fikiria teuzi kama mkuu wa takukuru,mwanasheria mkuu,mwendesha mkuu wa mashitaka ya serikali,mkuu wa polisi,mkuu wa majeshi,Mkuu wa usalama wa Taifa na wateuliwa wengine mbalimbali ambao kikatiba hawana kinga yeyote kuondolewa madarakani na rais,enadapo rais ataamua kuwaondoa pengine tu kwa kwenda kinyume na matakwa yake hata kama yana athari kwa wananchi
3. Matokeo ya rais hayapingwi popote baada ya kutangazwa,hapa haijalishi matokeo yalichakachuliwa na ushahidi wa wazi upo,huwezi kupinga
4.Upigaji kura kwenye kupitisha mambo mbalimbali bungeni kuwa wa wazi badala ya kuwa siri, unadumaza demokrasia
Kuna mambo mengi ndugu yayotakiwa kwanza kubadilika katika katiba ndipo utaweza kupata hayo unayoyaaita maadili.
 
Bhbm said:
Anaongea pumba bungeni, then wabunge wa ccm wanashangilia. Kweli nimeamini cuf siyo wapinzani.
Click to expand...
Kwani umesahau kuwa CUF ni CCM B?Kwa sasa nao ni watawala na wanatekeleza ilani ya CCM hivyo hawana cha kukataa,ni sawa na mwanamke kuolewa na baadae kukataa kutoa tendo la ndoa hivyo mimi sishangai Hamad na CUF kwa ujumla kufanya wanayofanya sasa.
 
Mh Rage wakati akichangia bungeni amesema jukwaa la katiba ni wahuni maana wanafanya kazi ya kukusanya maoni ya watz na wakati hawajachaguliwa na wananchi. anasema wanapokonya kazi ya wabunge amba ndio waliochaguliwa na wananchi.
Makinda kamwambia aondoe hayo maneno ya wahuni na ameyaondoa!
Source TBC
 
Nimeshangaa jana wakati wabunge wa CUF ,CCM na Dr (?) Lyatonga Mrema wanaposema suala la katiba ni huruma ya Raisi asingetaka Raisi eti lisingeweza kujadiliwa na kupelekwa bungeni.

wanadai eti mbona huko nyuma kuna tume kibao ziliundwa kwa ajili ya kujadili mambo ya katiba na maraisi waliokuwepo wala hawakuhangaika kulileta hilo suala bungeni,nafikiri hawa ndugu wamesahau kuwa KILA KITABU NA NYAKATI ZAKE,suala la katiba kwa sasa halifuati matakwa ya raisi bali ni la lazima kutokana na wakati tulionao.

Hakika hawa CUF na Mrema wamesahau walikotoka ,au wameyasahau yale waliyokuwa wanayahubiri huko nyuma hadi kuzalisha Watanzania wakimbizi huko Uingereza ,Mombasa,pia wamesahau ndugu waliojitao muhanga kwa kuuwawa na kupata vilema vya maisha,sasa wanaonyesha ubinafsi wao baada ya kupewa fursa ya KUPEWA MIKASI YA KUKATIA UTEPE
 
Katika hali ya kushangaza Mbunge wa Tabora Mjini Aden Rage amewaita Jukwaa la Katiba kuwa ni wahuni tu, na Spika ikabidi aingilie kati na kumwambie aondoe maneno hayo, huyu jamaa anapata jeuri hii wapi?

Nawasilisha.
 
msikilize naye Aden Rage naye anachangia. Domo limeumuka kama kalambishwa amila ya kipembe
 
Sheba said:
Wanahistoria wanaamini 'History is Spiral' yaani historia hujirudia, wala hakuna jambo jipya kabisa juu ya ardhi. Mjadala wa Katiba huu wa sasa si mpya hata kidogo, pengine kizazi kinachoujadili ndicho kipya chenye upofu wa historia. Napenda kuanza kwa kumnukuu Mwalimu Nyerere katika hotuba yake kuhusu Katiba aliyoitoa mwaka 1962


"The point must be made that ultimately the safeguard of a people's right, the people's freedom and those things which they value, ultimately the safeguard is the ethic of the nation. When the nation does not have the ethic which will enable the Goverment to say: ' We cannot do this, that is un- Tanganyikan'. Or the people to say: ' That we cannot tolerate, that is un-Tanganyikan'. If the people do not have that kind of ethic, it does not matter what kind of constitution you frame. They can always be victims of tyranny....... What we must continue to do all the time, is to build an ethic of the nation, which makes the Heads of State whoever he is to say, ' I have the power to do this under the Constitution, but I cannot do it, it is un- Tanganyikan'. Or for the people of Tanganyika, if they have made a mistake and elected an insane individual as their Heads of State, who has the power under the Constitution to do XYZ if he tried to do it, the people of Tanganyika would say, 'We won't have it from anybody, President or President squared, we won't have it'.

I believe, sir, that is the way we ought to look at this constitution. We have got to have a little amount of faith, although I know that some Members have been questioning the idea of faith. But, sir, democracy is a declaration of faith in human nature, the very thing which we are struggling to safeguard here, the very idea of democracy is a declaration of faith in mankind. And every enemy of democracy is some person who somewhere has no faith in human beings. He doubts. He think he is all right, but other human beings are not all right.

28 June 1962 Hansard, 1st Session
Goverment Motion- Proposal for a Republic"

Naamini kwa dhati kabisa kuwa Katiba sio mwarobaini wa matatizo yetu kama taifa kwa sasa. Tunalo tatizo la kimaadili na kiuongozi kuanzia ngazi ya familia, Serikali, Chama Tawala na Vyama vya Upinzani. Tatizo hili tiba yake sio Katiba, bali ni kurudi katika misingi(Soul searching) ya Taifa hili. Tupitie upya na kuboresha yale mambo ya yaliyotuunganisha kama Taifa likiwemo Azimio la Arusha na kuliboresha kuweza kujibu changamoto za sasa. Pale ndipo kwenye agano la Taifa na zindiko la Tafa hili na si Katiba mpya.

Afrika Kusini ni nchi ambayo imepata Katiba mpya katika miaka ya karibuni. Katiba ambayo imesifiwa kuwa ilikuwa na mchakato wa wazi zaidi na ushirikishwaji wa hali ya juu. Katiba ile imeruhusu hadi haki za mashoga kwa mantiki ya kuheshimu haki za binadamu. Lakini maisha ya wazalendo wa Afrika Kusini bado yangali ni magumu na yaliyopoteza matumaini. Afrika Kusini ni nchi yenye mpasuko mkubwa pamoja na kuwa na uchumi imara.

Gharama tunazoingia katika kutafuta kile kinachoitwa Katiba mpya ni kubwa kuliko manufaa au matokeo yake kwa Mtanzania. Tutasimamisha uzalishaji na maendeleo na kuelekeza rasilimali zetu kwenye Katiba. Tutakuwa na Tume ambayo itazunguka na kufanya mikutano kwa miaka 2 na kutumia rasilimali; tutakuwa na Bunge la Katiba, Wabunge wale karibia 600 watalipwa posho na watachukua muda kufikia muafaka katika kujadili na Kamati kubishana sentensi zikaaje. Kisha tutakuwa na kura ya maoni nchi nzima ambayo ni sawa na uchaguzi mkuu, na mwaka mmoja baadae tutakuwa na uchaguzi mkuu. Gharama zote hizi zitabebwa na wananchi kwa gharama ya kuaihirisha utekelezaji wa miradi ya maendeleo.

Mwisho tutakuwa na document inaitwa Katiba mpya! ambayo haitabadilisha hali ya wananchi kwa kuwa tutakuwa hatujapatia jawabu tatizo letu la msingi.
Click to expand...





Wewe unafkiri mwanzo wa hayo maadili mabovu ni nini?????
 
Sio lazima kila mpinzani ashikwe masaburi na Chadema! CUF wana haki ya kutafsiri maslahi ya taifa kulingana na muono wao! Sio lazima wapokee amri kutoka Moshi!!!!!!!!!!!
 
mh. Aden rage amewaita wanaharakati wahuni, amesema hayo wakati akichangia spika amemtaka afute hayo maneno, akasema ameyafuta ila asamehewe alikua na uchungu, nadhani dhidi ya nchi hii anayoipenda,

nawasilisha
 
Amewakosea sana,yeye anajiona anahaki kutoa maoni sababu kachaguliwa na watu watabora hajui yy ni sehemu tu ya maoni ya watanzania watu wana haki ya kutoa maoni popote walipo kuhusu Tanzania.

Inaonekana mbunge ila hajui katiba aliyonayo mkononi
 
Hivi hata darasa la 7 huyo rage alimaliza.. Hajui kuwa hao jamaa walikuwa wanatembea nchi nzima kukusanya maoni ya wananchi.
 
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