Mradi wa nyumba za kupanga wa Dr. Hussein Mwinyi Dar

[Jasusi]

Watu ni wapumbavu sasa kujenga apartment ndio ufisadi? Ever heard of a F**K*N BANK? Yani hii JF imekuwa choo cha baa..

Kinyambiss,
Ningekuomba na wewe uende benki tuone utajenga apartments ngapi. Ukishafanya hivyo rudi hapa ututukane sote kuwa ni wapumbavu.

 

[Kiranga]

Kuna haja ya ku substantiate accusation, hata hiyo document haifunguki, worse still mtu asiye na Microsoft Office 2007 or later hawezi kuifungua hata kama ikiwa downloadable.

 

[Lukolo]

Watu ni wapumbavu sasa kujenga apartment ndio ufisadi? Ever heard of a F**K*N BANK? Yani hii JF imekuwa choo cha baa..

Mods, mnaonaje kama huyu Kinyambiss akipigwa ban? Hivi great thinker anashindwa kutumia hekima yake ya u great thinker kujenga hoja ya kutetea au kuchochoa hoja iliyoko mezani anakuja na kauli za hovyo hovyo kama hivi? Mungu wangu!! Huu siyo ustaarabu kabisa. Ulipaswa ujenge hoja kutetea kauli yako badala ya kuvurumisha matusi. Na iwapo JF ni choo cha baa, uende zako, hakuna aliyekuita humu!

 

[Kinyambiss]

Mods, mnaonaje kama huyu Kinyambiss akipigwa ban? Hivi great thinker anashindwa kutumia hekima yake ya u great thinker kujenga hoja ya kutetea au kuchochoa hoja iliyoko mezani anakuja na kauli za hovyo hovyo kama hivi? Mungu wangu!! Huu siyo ustaarabu kabisa. Ulipaswa ujenge hoja kutetea kauli yako badala ya kuvurumisha matusi. Na iwapo JF ni choo cha baa, uende zako, hakuna aliyekuita humu!

There is no ustaarabu between Lions and men or more appropriate in this case, commonsense and nonsensical dispositions. Banning me would not solve anything, at least I speak very candidly and open heartedly about substandard threads that undermine the meaning of JF..l say we must discourage people from putting unsubstantiated, defamatory and malicious threads.. so that we can focus on nyani..

 

[Magezi]

Sasa ufisadi ukowapi?? Hii heading ni defamatory kwasababu hakuna ushahidi.. infact hakuna ata accusation ya maana.. Kujenga apartment ndio ufisadi??? Au kufanya project ya 10million dollars ndio ufisadi? Kwanini alieleta thread hajaongelea funding jamaa katoka wapi..ameconclude kabla hajatoa ushahidi wowote ata theoretical..lol That is too weak and too speculative ndio maana inakera watu wakiandika vitu vya hovyo namna hii. I'm just saying.

Wewe ndo mpumbavu sana na una mdomo mchafu kama choo cha baa wala siyo JF. Kama ulikuwa huna la kuchangia bora ukakojoe ulale.

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Sasa ufisadi ukowapi?? Hii heading ni defamatory kwasababu hakuna ushahidi.. infact hakuna ata accusation ya maana.. Kujenga apartment ndio ufisadi??? Au kufanya project ya 10million dollars ndio ufisadi? Kwanini alieleta thread hajaongelea funding jamaa katoka wapi..ameconclude kabla hajatoa ushahidi wowote ata theoretical..lol That is too weak and too speculative ndio maana inakera watu wakiandika vitu vya hovyo namna hii. I'm just saying.

I will side with you on this one. Mtoa mada kasha fikia conclusion bila kuelezea kwa nini anadhani ni ufisadi na hata hilo file alilotoa which I'm assuming ndiyo "ushahidi" wake haufunguki. I think most people are just surprised as to how you replied....as if it has touched you personally. Other than that ukijibu calmly I think you raised a very good point.

 

[Kinyambiss]

I will side with you on this one. Mtoa mada kasha fikia conclusion bila kuelezea kwa nini anadhani ni ufisadi na hata hilo file alilotoa which I'm assuming ndiyo "ushahidi" wake haufunguki. I think most people are just surprised as to how you replied....as if it has touched you personally. Other than that ukijibu calmly I think you raised a very good point.

Touche.. Well said, and I agree. I just get extremely agitated at times when I see such illogical suggestions. It is a tad beyond disappointment. I am undergoing therapy for it (not really) lol.. But I agree and retract any insult to members (poster notwithstanding )

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Touche.. Well said, and I agree. I just get extremely agitated at times when I see such illogical suggestions. It is a tad beyond disappointment. I am undergoing therapy for it (not really) lol.. But I agree and retract any insult to members (poster notwithstanding )

Hehe personally sijaona insult yoyote from you mkuu. I think hata some members wame overreact . Siku hizi mtu yoyote tajiri ni "fisadi" na mtu yoyote asiyempinga tajiri kila wakati ni "mtetea mafisadi". I think kuna class conflict za chini chini. Kama member mmoja alivyo sema "To be rich is not to be dirty & to be poor is not to be clean". Lazima accusations zetu ziwe fair, justifiable na provable.

 

[TIMING]

Kinyambiss,
Ningekuomba na wewe uende benki tuone utajenga apartments ngapi. Ukishafanya hivyo rudi hapa ututukane sote kuwa ni wapumbavu.

Good one, lakini lets go further... mwende na terms alizopeleka yeye! tusije kushindanisha bajaji na VX V8.... we cant judge anything hadi tuone proposal yake, legal docs, collateral, security, refernece na vitu vingine mkuu...

Ka mwendo huu hata yule wa milioni kumi alizokopa kwa kuwa na msharaha wa millioni moja ataambiwa aliupata kifisadi

we can do better than this!!

 

[August]

ufisadi unaanza kwenye kupata kiwanja hapo Sea View, mimi nimetafuta saana kiwanja hapo to 1980 kabla alhaji hajawa Rahisi sikupata kiwanja.

 

[mmakonde]

Waziri wa Ulinzi ni mtumishi wa serkali.Hata mkopo wa 10 billioni it is too much!
Kinyambiss huwezi kutetea huu ufisadi!eti mkopo?Oh my God!

Je mtu wa kawaida unaweza kupata mkopo huo,if so?

Mwanzilishi wa hii thread,fungua hili file tuone majambo.

 

[Kiranga]

ufisadi unaanza kwenye kupata kiwanja hapo Sea View, mimi nimetafuta saana kiwanja hapo to 1980 kabla alhaji hajawa Rahisi sikupata kiwanja.

August,

Sawa, wewe hukupata, lakini hujatuonyesha ni wapi Mwinyi kapata kiwanja kifisadi.

Vipi kama watu wa ardhi bongo wana tabia ya kutetemekea majina ya watu wakubwa, na wewe hukupewa, Mwinyi kapewa, kwa sababu ya ufisadi wa watu wa ardhi na wala si ufisadi wa Mwinyi?

Vipi kama mtaji wako ulikuwa haufanani na mahitaji ya sehemu hiyo, na huyu mjanja kaja na mtaji husika?

Post yako haiwezi kusimama bila qualification.

Sipingi kwamba Mwinyi anaweza kuwa fisadi, in fact familia ina kila harufu ya ufisadi, lakini, kama tunataka kuwa serious, kama tunataka watu wasituone a bunch of bitter exiles and losers, inabidi tukimuita mtu fisadi tuwe na data.

Mwinyi kafanya ufisadi wapi exactly? tunataka a valid expose, sio ushabiki ambao unaweza kuwa dismissed as "wivu" kirahisi tu. This is in the interest of "vita against ufisadi", when you come come correct.

Vilio vya aina hii kuhusu ufisadi vinanikumbusha vilio vya racial discrimination, kuna watu wakikanyagwa kwenye a crowded commuter train wanalia racial discrimination, they make it bad on the people who are experiencing real racial discrimination. Tusitake kui cheapen hii stance against ufisadi kwa kuallow kila mtu asiye na ushahidi kuja hapa kulia ufisadi, tutake ushahidi mzuri ili tuwe na a stronger case, hata kama mtu anataka kuanzia hapa kwenda mahakamani ajue anaanzia wapi, sio blah blah tupu zisizo data.

Mwinyi kadhulumu wapi? Kahonga wapi? Kivipi? Hakufuata utaratibu wapi? Kavunja sheria wapi?

Tupeni data tumlime fairly, otherwise anakuwa enterpreneur tu.

Hatutaki tufikie mahali pa kumuita kila mtu ambaye ana deal la $ 10 m fisadi.

 

[Regia Mtema]

Jamani hii nchi.Kila tukiamka tunasikia ufisadi mpya.Duu!

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

Waziri wa Ulinzi ni mtumishi wa serkali.Hata mkopo wa 10 billioni it is too much!
Kinyambiss huwezi kutetea huu ufisadi!eti mkopo?Oh my God!

Je mtu wa kawaida unaweza kupata mkopo huo,if so?

Mwanzilishi wa hii thread,fungua hili file tuone majambo.

Kwanza hatujui kama ana partners or not. Hizo bilioni 10 zina weza zikawa za group zima la uwekezaji. Pia pamoja na waziri kuwa mtumishi wa serikali ana ruhusiwa kuwa na legal businesses. Watumishi wangapi serikalini wana miradi nje ya kazi inayo wapati kipato mara dufu ya mishahara na marupurupu serikalini?

 

[TIMING]

Jamani hii nchi.Kila tukiamka tunasikia ufisadi mpya.Duu!

huu si ufisadi mpya wala wa zamani... tunaharibu neno ufisadi kwa kulitumia kila sehemu, kushindwa ku-substantiate na kuwafanya mafisadi watucheke kwamba tunajichanganya

Lets uncover this kama ilivyokuwa kwenye richmond, EPA nk...

otherwise we will make ufisadi so the most unserious business ever made by wanaharakati

 

[Kinyambiss]

Waziri wa Ulinzi ni mtumishi wa serkali.Hata mkopo wa 10 billioni it is too much!
Kinyambiss huwezi kutetea huu ufisadi!eti mkopo?Oh my God!

Je mtu wa kawaida unaweza kupata mkopo huo,if so?

Mwanzilishi wa hii thread,fungua hili file tuone majambo.

I understand some of you are suprised at this level dough. How do you know he is the sole shareholder? Maybe he is representing someone else. And if it is him how do you know ana assets gani zakupata collateral? Mashamba, investments nyingine? Huyu mtu kaja na thread isiyo na malelezo yoyote na nyie mnaleta ujamaa hapa na kumsupport... Being rich does not make anyone mchafu and yes there are people worth several million dollars so what? Nchi ikiwa na matatizo ndio kila mtu awe maskini? Toeni sababu au muacheni mwinyi apete tuu. SO you think he stole 10billion and is using it to build apartments.. Are you insane.lol No one invests using their own money to do things like that.. It is almost always the bank's money.. (and nasema haya as a corporate lawyer often dealing with these types of arrangements and furthermore I myself do modest investment in real estate) So swala la watu walizoea mishara ha laki 5 ama 1.5m kuanza shangaa mtu anacheza na 10 million dollars (it doesnt mean hizo hela anakula.. it is an investment portfolio sio sawa na mshahara..) MwanaFA umepatia kusema kuwa kuna watu wana some kind of class-beef. I am not a fan of social strata myself but it is a natural consequence of human interaction a special in the Capitalistic world.

I myself plan to retire with around 100 million dollars..does that mean I have ufisadi in my plans..NO way. Its just personal ambition and vision. Mtu asi invest, fisadi..

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

ufisadi unaanza kwenye kupata kiwanja hapo Sea View, mimi nimetafuta saana kiwanja hapo to 1980 kabla alhaji hajawa Rahisi sikupata kiwanja.

Your information is not complete.

1.Ulitafuta kiwanja ukakosa wa kukuuzia? Kwa maana kama ardhi ni ya mtu ana haki ya kukuuzia au kukunyima.
2.Kama ulipata ardhi ulinyimwa kwa sababu zipi?
3.Cost ya viwanja sea view ilikua ni ngapi at different times ya utafutaji wako na najeti yako ilikua ngapi.

Sikatai ufisadi unaweza ukawa umefanyika but its time watanzania tuka fahamu ile concept ya sheria ya "Innocent until proven guilty". Inatakiwa ushahidi na hoja zinazo weza kusimama hata kwenye mahakama kabla ya kumhukumu mtu.

 

[Lukwangule]

Sasa ufisadi ukowapi?? Hii heading ni defamatory kwasababu hakuna ushahidi.. infact hakuna ata accusation ya maana.. Kujenga apartment ndio ufisadi??? Au kufanya project ya 10million dollars ndio ufisadi? Kwanini alieleta thread hajaongelea funding jamaa katoka wapi..ameconclude kabla hajatoa ushahidi wowote ata theoretical..lol That is too weak and too speculative ndio maana inakera watu wakiandika vitu vya hovyo namna hii. I'm just saying.

Thats good but not the other one.

 

[MwanaFalsafa1]

This mentality in Tanzania we are building now to say that every rich person is a "fisadi" is going to cost as badly one day. We as a country want to develop. A country develops through taxes. Thus, the richer individuals are the more taxes paid hence more funds for development.

Tutake tusitake maskini anamhitaji tajiri na tajiri anamhitaji maskini. It is a two way relationship. The working class provide the labor and the rich provide the employment and taxes. If it riches are point we build a subconscious mentality that just being rich is a bad thing then we won t reach anywhere.

I am in support of fighting corruption and all those who seek wealth illegally but if it riches a point where just being rich is a crime then we have a problem. How many of us here dont use connections in our daily lives? We use people we know to get jobs, get certain services more quickly or to buy land somewhere. All of us use connections in one way or another in our lives. So are we going to be angry at a person just because he is more connected then us?

 

[rmashauri]

Kwani kila anayewekeza ni fisadi? Did you check where he got the money?
Banks are nowadays available and they are offering loans. Before you just blame estblish source of funds and hence come with your topic, as far as this is it now, looks myopic!

Lakini jamani kupewa 10 bilioni loan na benki si mpaka uwe na bond yenye thamani kama hiyo? Kama ni hivyo ina maana Dk. Mwinyi ana assets zenye thamani ya 10 bilioni si ufisadi tayari huo jamani? Au? Au kama ni mfanyabiashara, je anafanya biashara gani ya kumwingia pesa nyingi hivyo?