East African Federation (EAF) public Views

[Dr.Khamis]

When our colonial power (UK) left East Africa it advised us to form the EAC since individual country such as Tanganyika or Uganda could not survive alone economically. So is the case even now. We still bear the economic burden of the breaking of the EAC. Now that we are extending this economic cooperation to Rwanda and Burundi is a good idea. Who caused the breaking up of the EAC if not POLITICIANS?

You have to build a house on good ground with a strong foundation and not in a swampy area with black mud clay.

Politicians can just talk without foreseeing the economic catastrophe of the fast tracking of their EAF.They think they can drive Wananchi like small toys! Yes the braves are busy filling their bottomless bellies and driving Wananchi in deep ravines of poverty.

 

[Mwanagenzi]

...and since when did Economics become separated from Politics?

 

[MkamaP]

Kuna jambo!!!! kwanini wanatulazimisha?????mhhh tuweni macho

Dua [COLOR=ten over ten

EU wants Dar to decide under which regional bloc it will negotiate EPAs

By WILFRED EDWIN
Special Correspondent

Tanzania has failed to register any significant progress in negotiating Economic Partnership Agreements (EPAs) with the European Union for the past 13 months.

The reason for this is seen as a crisis caused by the fresh regional membership configuration demanded by the EU. The new configuration requires that for effective negotiations, Tanzania must pull out from the Southern Africa Development Community (SADC) to negotiate either under the East African Customs Union (EACU), or East and Southern Africa (ESA) grouping.

Kenya and Uganda are likely to quit the Common Market for Eastern and Southern Africa (Comesa) and negotiate EPAs under the EA Customs Union.

Analysts say these revelations could help explain why it has taken so long for countries in Southern Africa, which are negotiating EPAs in sub-regions such as ESA, Comesa, SADC and the Southern African Customs Union (SACU) to forge ahead with negotiations.

Basil Mramba, the Tanzanian Minister for Industry, Trade and Marketing, said last week that the major conundrum troubling Tanzania and a few Least Developed Countries in SADC, Tanzania, Angola and Mozambique has not been to negotiate EPAs per se, but to sort out the membership configuration issue.

He said the EU has been pressing for Tanzania to negotiate the agreements under the EA Customs Union.

“We have not decided yet, so there is nothing to discuss until we sort out the issue of configuration,” he said, adding that Tanzania is still assessing the political and economic implications.

The minister noted that it has taken over a year for the EU to respond to the proposals sent by SADC 13 months ago. “For one full month, the EU has been silent. They only responded last month.”

But the trend shows that member states see negotiation under EA Customs as not feasible because of the infancy of the bloc and the weak economies of the member states.

According to Mr Mramba, Kenya and Uganda were reluctant to return to negotiate under EACU at the time, and Tanzania was left in a dilemma. As a result, “SADC proposed in 2003 that Tanzania continue negotiating EPAs under SADC.”

The economic blocs currently negotiating EPAs with EU are SADC, Comesa, ESA and SACU. However, countries like South Africa already have bilaterally negotiated agreements with the EU. According to Mr Mramba, there is an emergence of scenarios in SADC where negotiations are hitting a snag.

For instance, SADC is embroiled in three different agreements where South Africa, a strong member of the group, is in a bilateral free trade agreement with the EU.

Then there is SACU, the oldest Customs Union in the world, whose members are South Africa itself, Namibia, Botswana, Lesotho and Swaziland, both members of SADC but negotiating EPAs with EU in SACU.

SADC EPA members are Tanzania, Angola, Lesotho, Mozambique, Botswana, Swaziland, and Namibia.

The first four are also in the category of Least Developed Countries, which benefit from trade preferences under the Everything But Arms (EBA) initiative.

This political dimension of regional integration is one of the reasons why the economic integration situation in SADC is so complex, according to Mr Mramba.

The likelihood of EPAs succeeding, the minister said, will depend a great deal on sorting out the problems of Lesotho in SACU, which is also the LCD with special treatment.

According to the minister, the approach used by the EU to negotiate free trade areas is to divide the nations into Custom Unions — the SACU and EACU.

The suggestions are for Tanzania, Mozambique and Angola to look for an alternative body to join for EPA negotiations.

 

[sean pinto]

What best argument do you have? I don't want to dissuade you from commenting but you should understand that this thread started sometime in March 2006 and there is nothing new which you have said, I can't recall being discussed.

So what if there is nothing new I have said ? I simply logged in to voice my opinion. Whether its been discussed before is irrelevant. Is there a rule against discussing ideas that have been mentioned before ?

The majority of Tanzanians are voicing their intention to stop this nonsense Federation.

I don’t care about this. I am here to voice my opinion. If Tanzanians choose not to Federate then that’s fine. Believe me I will not loose any sleep. I am here to discuss the merits and demerits of a federation. And I will continue to do so. I am simply saying that people ought to be educated on the merits and demerits. Let them debate it and make a sound judgment. I am not here to force Tanzanians or Rwandese to do anything.

You talk about EU whilst it isn't a political federation. Can you tell me which EU member state want to be in a political Federation?

Go back and look at my posts. I never said the EU was a political federation. I used the EU as a frame of reference. All EU countries have benefited immensely from having a common currency, common passports and the easing of travel restrictions.

(Wherever they voted they refused the constitution) At least in EU they published a constitution for everyone to see. You better recall all political federations i.e. Russia (USSR), Yugoslavia, etc. none of them worked, and right now the governments are diverting resources in this doomed Federation.

This is a lousy comparison and its ill informed. Eastern bloc federations were done by force. Ukrainians never asked to live under Soviet rule. Croatians never asked to live under Serbian rule. I am not advocating this. I am simply saying that East Africans need to be educated on this issue. After that they can all vote and decide what they want to do. ITS CALLED DEMOCRACY. Let the people decide. Let them make a well informed decision.

Whereas the Eastern bloc countries failed, you conveniently forgot to mention the United States which has become the most powerful nation in the world by fusing various regions that were previously under Spanish, French and British control.

Another point which you are missing; if all member countries unite they will have a population equivalent to that of Nigeria, then what? Why Nigeria is not leading in direct investment at the moment? Why are Nigerians poor up to now? They've oil, and other natural resources.

According to the CIA world factbook, Nigerias unemployment rate is 5.8% which is impressive. In East Africa its closer to 40%
And even without Oil , Nigerias FDI inflows dwarf those of all other African countries bar South Africa. Go and check for yourself. The statistics don’t lie.
As for the problems Nigeria is having, they are self inflicted and I would hope we have enough common sense not to make the same mistakes.

In any case Nigeria is a lousy example. Just because Nigeria has certain problems does not mean they directly translate to East Africa. East Africans can learn from other countries what works and what does not work. People have brains don’t they ?

Look at other larger countries and see the way they have leveraged their size to attract significant amounts of FDI. China has raised 100 million people from poverty over the last 10 years in large part due to FDI inflows. China and India are the worlds most popular FDI destinations. And it has a lot to do with their populations.

You don't have doubts about Western Nations because you do not know how they operate, we know them.

I know perfectly well how western nations operate. Which is why I said that larger countries are less likely to be pushed around by the West. As things stand now, African countries are small and fragmented. As a result, the west can extract as many concessions as they want. Small countries have no leverage.

Can you tell me for example why IMF and World Bank were created? You just see things and think you know, you better recall after second World war the only country to obtain an open check was UK. No any other country in the world will have that prevelege.

What does this have to do with what we are discussing here ?

Your analysis here is wrong. The countries which disagreed on community want a union? Give me a break! You better continue with your friends in other forums rather than wasting your time on things which you do not know. There is no way a Tanzanian with his right mind can allow Kilimanjaro or Serengeti to be part of Kenya, Rwanda, Burundi or Uganda for that matter. WE CAN CONTINUE TO HAVE THE COMMUNITY NOT A FEDERATION.

Oh so that’s what you are concerned about. You are worried that other countries will benefit from the Serengeti and such. What you don’t see is that Tanzania can get even higher tourism inflows if travel restrictions are lifted. Kenya gets far more tourists than Tanzania. Besides tourism, there are other aspects where Tanzania can benefit. I have enumerated all of them. I am looking at the bigger picture. I am looking at how pooling together the available resources can dramatically raise the standard of living rather than selfishly looking at what Tanzania can hog from other countries. You are stuck in the 19th century. The various countries have learned from past mistakes.

Finally let me say that I am not saying that there needs to be a federation right away. This is something that needs to be discussed and debated. People need to be educated on what it involves. They can then start by doing basic things like easing travel restrictions. Continue to go step by step and gauge people’s reaction at each stage. Let the people experience the merits and demerits of such a federation. If after all this the people decide that they don’t want a federation then so be it. At least you let them make an informed decision and did not stifle debate or force anything down their throat. The important thing is not to stifle debate and let people make informed decisions. Africans can show the west that they can do things in an orderly

But all this rigmarole about those who live in Canada versus those who are toiling is utter clap trap.

 

[Dua]

Go back and look at my posts. I never said the EU was a political federation. I used the EU as a frame of reference. All EU countries have benefited immensely from having a common currency, common passports and the easing of travel restrictions.

This is what I call blantant lies, can you tell me which countries in Europe have common passport? little lies like this are uncalled for; You want people to believe this, only poor countries like Poland, check and the like are the ones who cries for subsidy from the EU. Even you can recall the French arguing with the Brits about farm subsidy. UK has never joined the Euro and it will not be easy for them to do that and at the present moment they say NO. Easy transportation in tourist places are already there, all this are non sensical reasons given to hoodwink us.

Whereas the Eastern bloc countries failed, you conveniently forgot to mention the United States which has become the most powerful nation in the world by fusing various regions that were previously under Spanish, French and British control.

The USA managed to do that very early and if you look back at history Nyerere (RIP) wanted that to happen for the whole continent, but alas he sacrificed too much for other countries and now everyone else is laughing at us as the poorest country in the world (Check your CIA report), after the liberation of Southern Africa now we have concentrated on our economy, and you just come with this ill-advised federation to divert our attention. Where were you when we were fighting for our brothers in the SADC? Stop cheating yourself we have been there before. Where is Kenya today the darling of the west? Where is Somalia today the Darling of USA? We know what they want to achieve to reap where they didn't saw.

According to the CIA world factbook, Nigerias unemployment rate is 5.8% which is impressive. In East Africa its closer to 40%

No suprise there where else can you get information? Did CIA tell you how they killed P. Lumumba? Congo today is in that state because of them.

As for the problems Nigeria is having, they are self inflicted and I would hope we have enough common sense not to make the same mistakes.

May be this will be a story which you do not know, remember Biafra? There is no different with what happed in Rwanda or what is happening in Darfuw. I still believe you are still a junior in Africa politics and the big brothers work at the back of the door.

hat's what you are concerned about. You are worried that other countries will benefit from the Serengeti and such. What you don't see is that Tanzania can get even higher tourism inflows if travel restrictions are lifted. Kenya gets far more tourists than Tanzania. Besides tourism, there are other aspects where Tanzania can benefit. I have enumerated all of them. I am looking at the bigger picture. I am looking at how pooling together the available resources can dramatically raise the standard of living rather than selfishly looking at what Tanzania can hog from other countries. You are stuck in the 19th century. The various countries have learned from past mistakes.

We are not worried about that, but a thief who advocate your wife is his does not merit an invitation to your house. We don't want to pool together with anybody, we want to remain Tanzania as we are - FULL STOP! WE KNOW WHAT THE KENYANS AND RWANDESE WANT FROM TANZANIA. DON'T FOOL YOURSELF WE ARE NOT SLEEPING.

Finally let me say that I am not saying that there needs to be a federation right away. This is something that needs to be discussed and debated. People need to be educated on what it involves. They can then start by doing basic things like easing travel restrictions. Continue to go step by step and gauge people's reaction at each stage. Let the people experience the merits and demerits of such a federation. If after all this the people decide that they don't want a federation then so be it. At least you let them make an informed decision and did not stifle debate or force anything down their throat. The important thing is not to stifle debate and let people make informed decisions. Africans can show the west that they can do things in an orderly. But all this rigmarole about those who live in Canada versus those who are toiling is utter clap trap.

WE WILL DEBATE THIS WHEN WE WANT, NOT TO BE TOLD BY UNCLE TOM. AND THIS IS WHERE IT COMES PEOPLE LIKE YOU WHO WANT TO INFLUENCE YOUR OPINION WHEN YOUR KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THE REGION IS NOT THAT SOUND.

 

[Dua]

Can you tell me for example why IMF and World Bank were created? You just see things and think you know, you better recall after second World war the only country to obtain an open check was UK. No any other country in the world will have that prevelege. What does this have to do with what we are discussing here ?

World Bank and IMF has got everything to do with what is happening today in Africa, if you do not know this there is no need to urgue with you.

 

[Malick]

Nalazimika kuungana na jamaa mmoja anayeitwa Miontini ambaye aliandika makala kwenye jaida la Rai yenye kichwa cha habari "Wanaiangalia Tanzania yetu kwa jicho la Husda"

Ni ukweli usiopingika kwa sasa watanzania hatujajiandaa kwa namna yeyote ile kufaidika na jumuiya hii, na vilevile ni ukweli usiopingika kwamba wenzetu wanaitazama fursa hiyo huku mate yakiwadondoka, moyono wanajiambia si ipite tu hiyo tukafaidi rasilimali zilizopo Tanzania!

Thats how it is!
EAC federation should wait until we have atleast 20 recognized universities, thats where we'll have potentials to share the available resourses available in either countries.

Regards; Janus

 

[sean pinto]

This is what I call blantant lies, can you tell me which countries in Europe have common passport? little lies like this are uncalled for; You want people to believe this, only poor countries like Poland, check and the like are the ones who cries for subsidy from the EU. Even you can recall the French arguing with the Brits about farm subsidy. UK has never joined the Euro and it will not be easy for them to do that and at the present moment they say NO.

Man U R so clueless. Read this website:
http://www.mic.org.mt/EUINFO/qeua/Q&A55.htm

Citizens of EU countries have a passport with a uniform design. This facilitates free movement, enhances security features but also serves to "strengthen the feeling among nationals of the Member States that they belong to the same Community", as the EU resolution on passports puts it.
This does not mean that there is one single EU passport or that citizens of EU countries have one single EU citizenship. Each passport continues to reflect the nationality and citizenship of each respective country. A Maltese passport will continue to reflect Maltese citizenship in the same way as an Italian passport still reflects Italian citizenship.
However, in addition to national citizenship, the EU passport also gives rights and obligations that arise out of an added citizenship; EU citizenship.
EU citizenship exists over and above national citizenship. It does not replace it. EU citizenship gives freer movement in and out of the EU territory.

The USA managed to do that very early and if you look back at history Nyerere (RIP) wanted that to happen for the whole continent, but alas he sacrificed too much for other countries and now everyone else is laughing at us as the poorest country in the world (Check your CIA report), after the liberation of Southern Africa now we have concentrated on our economy, and you just come with this ill-advised federation to divert our attention. Where were you when we were fighting for our brothers in the SADC? Stop cheating yourself we have been there before. Where is Kenya today the darling of the west? Where is Somalia today the Darling of USA? We know what they want to achieve to reap where they didn't saw.

So you are suggesting that I came up this idea ? Stop this nonsense. You are the one diverting this debate with cheap shots by trying to portray me as a colonialist. You are a total hypocrite. When you run out of arguments you resort to cheap shots because you know your arguments cannot stand.
The fact that the US managed very early does not mean it cannot happen again. In any case no one is saying it absolutely has to happen. I am saying that East Africans ought to be given an opportunity to experience some of the aspects of a federation so they can make an informed choice. You on the other hand are behaving like a classic big man dictator trying to tell everyone what should be done.
As for all that stuff about Somalia being the darling of the west, its just nonesense that has nothing to do with the debate at hand. You are just running around in circles saying irrelevant stuff.

No suprise there where else can you get information? Did CIA tell you how they killed P. Lumumba? Congo today is in that state because of them.

Again you are a hypocrite. When its convenient you use CIA statistics and then when its not you pretend like its not true.. In any case you can check other sites such as this one
http://www.photius.com/countries/nigeria/economy/nigeria_economy_unemployment.html
The point is that Nigeria is doing a lot better in that regard due to increased FDI which creates employment opportunities.

We are not worried about that, but a thief who advocate your wife is his does not merit an invitation to your house. We don't want to pool together with anybody, we want to remain Tanzania as we are - FULL STOP! WE KNOW WHAT THE KENYANS AND RWANDESE WANT FROM TANZANIA. DON'T FOOL YOURSELF WE ARE NOT SLEEPING.

You can shout at the top of your voice. You can use all caps all you want. But this debate will continue. This is not up to you. Who do you think you are ? Are you suggesting that you can speak for all Tanzanians ? You think there are no Tanzanians who might be inclined to support the idea ? What nonsense. You are just worried that if this exercise continues, some Tanzanians might change their minds. Stop acting like a dictator trying to tell everyone what must happen\

As for Kenyans wanting anything from Tanzania, that appears laughable to me. The Kenyans I have spoken to seem not to even know what is going on. But this is again the narrow minded approach where you only choose to look at the small picture. You are only looking at what Tanzanians can hogg from Rwanda. You are so obsessed with this kind of selfishness to the point that you refuse to even consider how Tanzania might benefit.

WE WILL DEBATE THIS WHEN WE WANT, NOT TO BE TOLD BY UNCLE TOM. AND THIS IS WHERE IT COMES PEOPLE LIKE YOU WHO WANT TO INFLUENCE YOUR OPINION WHEN YOUR KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THE REGION IS NOT THAT SOUND.

Who is this Uncle Tom you are talking about ? Is this another childish cheap shot at me ? If so I laugh at such childishness. Is it a cheap shot at the other people on this forum who would like to debate this issue ? For the record, the idea for the EAF is coming from East Africans themselves. So please keep up the puerile juvenile behaviour so you can show other forummers how immature you are. Let people discuss this like mature grown adults who are capable of making up their own minds without dictator DUA telling them what to think.

I am always amazed by people who when they find that they cannot debate issues based on facts , they resort to name calling to ruin a debate that was going quite well. But even you succeed in destroying this debate, rest assured that it will continue in other places no matter how much you shout. This issue is not going anywhere. If you think you are the one who will decide for everyone you are sadly mistaken. The debate and education is going on we speak. IF you dont like it then swallow a razor blade or something

 

[sean pinto]

World Bank and IMF has got everything to do with what is happening today in Africa, if you do not know this there is no need to urgue with you.

Everyone with at half a brain knows what theIMF is doing in Africa but what does it have to do with this issue ?

 

[Frank K]

Mr. Pinto, I had decided to give up posting anything on this forum again because of irrational, childish, biased, abusive, xenophobic...name it...people like Mr. Dua, the "Senior Member" of the forum. But I feel I should give you thumbs-up for the researched, smart arguments and issues you raised yesterday and today. Dua needs an adult education programme, I can't blame him if he didn't have a chance to see even a black board, many Africans have that problem and we have to live with it!

 

[sean pinto]

Frank well said

I have been on message boards going on 12 years now. I have noticed that there are certain types of people who lack the ability to debate using cogent arguments. So they resort to killing the debate by using name calling , obscenities and other cheap shots. The idea is to shout on top of everyone else. Thats why I urge you and others not to give up. None of us here will decide for Ugandans, Tanzanians, Rwandese, Kenyans or anyone else. We are just here to discuss the merits and demerits of this issue. Dont let yourself be shouted down by any raving lunatic no matter how many cheap shots and insults he resorts to.

As for me being a fool, I will let others judge. One person approached this issue from a logical standpoint. the other resorted to childish name calling.
One person wants all East Africans to get educated on the issue, discuss it among themselves, experience it then make an infomed decision. The other wants to dicate his will to everyone on this forum.
You decide.

 

[Dr.Khamis]

Well gentlemen such things do happen since we are all human beings liable to make mistakes. I have been contributing to the betterment of Budgets in forums (Esrf) since year 2000 and have come across attacks sometimes but I ignored. This concerned about irrigation farming and the use of modern Solar Energy, Windmills and waves. I suggested this before the famine and the dry period that affected Tanzania.
1. One attacked me it was very expensive experiment to conduct irrigation farming.
2. Another one attacked my experiment on Solar/Wind/ Waves, as alternative sources of energy were idiotic. The country will continue to depend on hydroelectric power generation.

So what happened when the draught period came to Tanzania (and the whole of East Africa)? We had no enough food reserves and had to ration our electricity. Those who called me idiot had to shallow the bitter pill.

Let us give our views on the EAF in peace and harmony .The government wants our views and please ignore when someone attacks you.

I am myself living outside Tanzania in one of the EU countries but I feel obliged to contribute for the benefit of all the people of East Africa. I have also lived in Kenya (Nairobi) and Uganda (Entebe) and have just good memories from these countries.

Yes while moving from one country to another within EU I don’t have to show my passport. There no police control at the border between Denmark and Sweden but was there before the formation of EU.
An extended EAC comprising Rwanda and Burundi could also have its citizens move freely between the countries without forming the EAF.Let us first see how this extended EAC works, analyse its results after some years and the decide to form or not to from the EAF.

LET THE PEOPLE HAVE THEIR SAY IN A DEMOCTRATIC WAY.


Our Swahili saying gives us wisdom:HARAKA HARAKA HAINA BARAKA.

 

[DAR si LAMU]

Well gentlemen such things do happen since we are all human beings liable to make mistakes. I have been contributing to the betterment of Budgets in forums (Esrf) since year 2000 and have come across attacks sometimes but I ignored. This concerned about irrigation farming and the use of modern Solar Energy, Windmills and waves. I suggested this before the famine and the dry period that affected Tanzania.
1. One attacked me it was very expensive experiment to conduct irrigation farming.
2. Another one attacked my experiment on Solar/Wind/ Waves, as alternative sources of energy were idiotic. The country will continue to depend on hydroelectric power generation.

So what happened when the draught period came to Tanzania (and the whole of East Africa)? We had no enough food reserves and had to ration our electricity. Those who called me idiot had to shallow the bitter pill.

Let us give our views on the EAF in peace and harmony .The government wants our views and please ignore when someone attacks you.

I am myself living outside Tanzania in one of the EU countries but I feel obliged to contribute for the benefit of all the people of East Africa. I have also lived in Kenya (Nairobi) and Uganda (Entebe) and have just good memories from these countries.

Yes while moving from one country to another within EU I don’t have to show my passport. There no police control at the border between Denmark and Sweden but was there before the formation of EU.
An extended EAC comprising Rwanda and Burundi could also have its citizens move freely between the countries without forming the EAF.Let us first see how this extended EAC works, analyse its results after some years and the decide to form or not to from the EAF.

LET THE PEOPLE HAVE THEIR SAY IN A DEMOCTRATIC WAY.


Our Swahili saying gives us wisdom:HARAKA HARAKA HAINA BARAKA.

dr,

kweli elimu unayo!...yaani,umewapoza jamaa halafu ukamalizia na kitu logical kupita vyote! kwamba...mtoto hatoki kuketi..akaanza kukimbia...lazima afuate steps za makuuzi. i salute you sir!. infact hiyo ndio mtazamo yangu tangu awali.

ukifuatia historia ya eac huko nyuma[ya kwanza]utaona kuwa kuna issue za ku-settle kwanza na kuziangalia hazijirudii ili tuweze songa mbele.

hakuna mtu asiyependa nchi kubwa kama eac[kigali kuzuri bwana!],ila,lazima tuishi kwa kuaminiana..na si kushambuliana...wewe hivi..wewe vile! hatutafika!

dharau haitatuunganisha kamwe[wapo wenye kuwadharau wenzao kwenye jumuiya] na kubaguana hakutatujenga[wapo wenye ubaguzi pia].

dhambi hizi kama hazitarekebishwa kabla ya federation,itakuwa vita tupu na tutagawanyika!

hivyo basi ni kweli kwamba tujenge kwanza community madhubuti na yenye mafanikio,halafu ndio tuone kama tutasonga mbele au la!

kila mtu ana haki ya kutoa maoni yake..after all,si tunataka kujua kama tunaweza kuishi pamoja kwa amani na utulivu?sasa,lazima tusikilizane!

 

[DAR si LAMU]

...and since when did Economics become separated from Politics?

mzee,

good politics = good economics. and yes they are not separated,but one must be careful about this! je?tuna good politics in eac?. halafu tunataka good economics...si ndio[kama hoja zinavyojenga hapa].

kuna watu wanasema kuna nchi zina-perform vizuri gdp wise compared to tanzania...we fuata hizo data,ukiziona juu juu utaamini. ukweli ni kwamba...wanafaidika na resources ambazo si zao,zimekwibwa nchi jirani nazo. si mnafahamu haya!

sasa niambie,huo mrija ukikatwa!si tutatafutana hapa. mi nadhani mtoto akuwe,awe na adabu ya kujenga hali yake..halafu apewe hayo majukumu!

otherwise tutatafutana ubaya bure....yatakuwa yale yale...the blame game[huyu ndio kasababisha,yule alikataa,huyo anachochea]allover again!

 

[Dr.Khamis]

Kwa bahati mbaya hiyo mirija imekithiri upana na urefu.Afadhali tuyape jina la “MABOMBA”.
Ni kweli kawaida yetu ya kulea mtoto ni kama hivyo usemavyo lakini hata akikomaa na akapewa majukumu yake lawama hazitakwisha!
Mzee hakunifundisha hivi! Mama hakunieleza hivi na kadhalika. Tutalaumiana tu kwani sisi binadamu ndio kawaida yetu. Lazima tutatafuta kisingizio au dosari!

Sungura alisemaje wakati kila akizirukia zambibu hazipati. AH SITAKI ZABIBU MBICHI ZILE.

Wakianza kutiana makonde watasema:JE TULISEMAJE SISI KUHUSI HII FEDERATION? HAWA WATU HAWAFAI KWA VILE WAMEJAA DAMU MIKONONI MWAO...... .....nakadhalika.

LISEMWALO LIPO AU LINAKUJA. Msemo wetu huo wa Kiswahili.

 

[DAR si LAMU]

Kwa bahati mbaya hiyo mirija imekithiri upana na urefu.Afadhali tuyape jina la “MABOMBA”.
Ni kweli kawaida yetu ya kulea mtoto ni kama hivyo usemavyo lakini hata akikomaa na akapewa majukumu yake lawama hazitakwisha!
Mzee hakunifundisha hivi! Mama hakunieleza hivi na kadhalika. Tutalaumiana tu kwani sisi binadamu ndio kawaida yetu. Lazima tutatafuta kisingizio au dosari!

Sungura alisemaje wakati kila akizirukia zambibu hazipati. AH SITAKI ZABIBU MBICHI ZILE.

Wakianza kutiana makonde watasema:JE TULISEMAJE SISI KUHUSI HII FEDERATION? HAWA WATU HAWAFAI KWA VILE WAMEJAA DAMU MIKONONI MWAO...... .....nakadhalika.

LISEMWALO LIPO AU LINAKUJA. Msemo wetu huo wa Kiswahili.

uliyoyasema yamenikumbusha huku kwetu uswahilini!....kila siku fitna na kusemana,na mengine huwa kweli tupu...yaani hafichwi mtu kitu!.

sasa,nyumba yetu hii imejaa fitna tele...ila, nadhani tutazishinda na viongozi wetu watajaaliwa busara za kuamua mambo kwa kufuata dalili za nyakati.

mungu ibariki eac!

 

[calvinelias]

Napingana na waandishi wa magazeti wanaodai kwamba wataalam wenye shahada za kujadili mikataba yenye kuleta manufaa kwa taifa wapo. Ukweli ni kwamba hawapo kwa kusema kwamba rushwa ndiyo tatizo sio sahihi.

Ukilizungumzia suhala la rushwa kuwa ndio mzizi wa matatizo napingana na wewe kama rushwa ndo tatizo basi wausika wameiua taaluma yao hivyo mh jk anavyosema wataalam hawapo ni sahihi kwasababu huwezi ukasema unamadaktari wa meno wakati hawawezi kung'oa.

 

[MkamaP]

Shikirisho kwa mtazamo chanya kweli nakubali ni chombo wezesha na kinachoharakisha maendeleo hii ni sahihi tu kama watawala na watawaliwa wote kwa pomoja wana malengo sawa ,mtazamo thabiti na wakamilifu(ideal)

Lakini kwa bahati mbaya hakuna ideal ila tuna uharisia(real) hivyo basi kutokana na uharisia huo kuunda shirikisho ni kujitumbukiza ktk balaa na tutakuja kujuta.

Ni ukweli usiopingika wa kua bado sisi waafrika tuna uchu wa madaraka wa kujinufaisha, huo ni upande mmoja na upande wa pili mataifa ya magharibi bado yana uchu na malighafi na njia ya kuzipata nadhani kwao ni vita,sasa wanapokuta Taifa lenye malighafi na likiwa na amani inawapa sana taabu.

sasa kitendo cha federation kitakua kimetoa mwanya na mlija ulio makini kwa mataifa hayo kujinufaisha maana ushawishi wa kuvuruga amani ktk federation hiyo utakua ni rahisi mno,nakututia ktk khari tete.
Tuangalie mfano wa nchi zilizokua na federation zote zimesambaratishwa USSR, kule YUGOSLAVIA,CHECHENIA,SERBIA na kwingine na federation iliyo hai nadhani ni USA tu, hata hii jumuia ya ulaya bado hawajaweza federation bali wana jumuia tu.

Pili tofauti za ki itikadi si rahisi kuzibadili yani utanzania ,ukenya n.k kwa mwendo wa rocket "the said fast track" bado kutakua na mbaguano ktk utendaji mzima na hivyo maendeleo tegemewa kushika kasi ya mchampko hasi(deceralation)

Tatu hakuna demokrasia iliyo halisi ktk ukanda huu (region) na kutokana na sababu hii litakua halina mda mrefu wa kuishi
Nne kuna khari ya kudharauliana au kutojali masilahi ya state moja au jingine kwa baadhi ya viongozi ktk ukanda huu,na hata mheshimiwa rais kikwete amewahi kunukuliwa akisema kuna taifa moja ambalo lilikua limeshaandaa roadframe.Na hii ni hatari sana .

Na ikumbukwe Mhimili wa maisha bora ni amani na si maendeleo,unaweza ukawa na maendeleo lakini kama amani ni tete maendeleo hayo ni BIG ZERO ,mfano tuangalie IRAQ ,walikua na maendeleo wakawa na amani tete leo wanalia na kusaga meno .(A God see mercy).

shirikisho kwa sasa si njia njema ,inabidi kurekebishwe na kujengwe misingi iliyo imara ya demokrasia,kuheshimu katiba,umoja wa kitaifa,maendeleo makini ktk kila state ,na ndipo baada ya miaka kama 25 tuangalie kuanzisha jumuia na sio shirikisho, tuepukane na viongozi kwa namna moja wanaotaka kujinufaisha au kujiwekea historia ktk uongozi wao .

Na pia Mh rais kikwete alinikuliwa nchini Norway akikiri kua Tanzania haina wataalamu wa kuingia mikataba iliyo na manufaa kwa watanzania mie nafikiri yupo sahihi kabisa ,kwa mtazamo huo ningependelea shirikisho liwekwe kando mpaka pale Tanzania itakapopata wataalam wa kuingia mikataba yenye manufaa.

Na ikubukwe huu ni mkataba mkubwa kuliko yote tangu tupate uhuru.
sasa kutuingiza ktk shirikisho ni kama kututupa na kututia kaburini tukiwa wazima na kufukiwa humo.
Mungu Ibariki Tanzania .

 

[Ibrah]

Tusivuke mto kabla hatujafikia kingo zake; nadhani ni vema kwenda hatua kwa hatua. Hivi hawa viongozi wetu wanatutaka nini Watanzania? Tuwa na wataalamu au hatuna, nasema shirikisho muda wake bado. Ya Watanganyika na Wazanzibari bado hatujayamaliza, kila siku maneno, shutuma, lawama na kutoridhika kwa baadhi ya Watanzania na Muungano wetu sasa twataka kujiongezea mengine. Lets solve our union's problems then we will cross over to another end!

Hao wazungu wenyewe walioendelea miaka hiyo sisi tukiwa bara la giza hadi leo hii bado wanavutana kuhusu muungano wao katiak European Union, sisi wa juzi tena na matatizo lukuki ya vita vya wenyewe kwa wenyewe, maendeleo duni, demokrasia zezeta tunataka kujifanya wajuvi wa mambo, Marais wetu tafadhalini, ninyi mwakutana kila uchao na mnafahmiana vema sana, sisi wananchi wa Afrika Mashariki hatujafahamina kiasi cha kuunda Shrikisho! Ni vema tukaenda hatua kwa hatua- tuanzie kweny uchumi baadaye tutaangalia mambo yakoje, kama iko haja ya kuungana au hakuna lakini kwa sasa muda bado.

Hao wenzetu wa EU walianza tangu mwaka 1957 huko Rome Italia kwa mkataba wa Rome kwa nia ya kuondoa vizuizi vya kibiashara baina yao na kuunda soko la pamoja ambapo waliunda European Economic Community (Jumuiya ya Uchumi ya Ulaya au EEC), baadaye waka-transform na kuwa na European Union (Umoja wa Ulaya yaani EU) mwaka wa 1992. Hadi sasa hivi miaka 50 baadaye bado hata huo muungano wa kiuchumi bado haujafikiwa kimilifu kwani baadhi ya nchi kama vile Uingereza wamegoma 'kuiua' sarafu yao kwa ajili ya sarafu ya Euro! Shirikisho la kisiasa na lenyewe bado bado shughuli ni pevu isipokuwa katika mambo fulanini fulani tu.

Sisi, makabwela ni akina nani tukimbilie kwenye Shirikisho la Kisiasa? Ni vizuri kujifunza kwa historia, tuangalie wenzetu walipo, walipotoka na tuweze kutumia udhaifu wao kujenga umoja imara na sio huu unaoamuliwa na viongozi watatu wa Afrika Mashariki kwa maslahi yao binafsi.

Mheshimiwa JK hata hiyo tume ya Wangwe ulioyoiunda mimi nina mashaka nayo makubwa maana kabla ya kukusanya maoni inaanza kwa kampeni ya kulipigia debe Shrirkisho! After all, ni vema tukakubaliana kuwa hili ni suala zito na si utafiti wa kitaaluma (academic research) ambapo unachukua sampluli (sample), suala hili ni mustakabali wa nchi yetu kwa hiyo maoni ya watu wachache (sample) hawawezi kuchukulia kuwa ndiyo matakwa ya wengi, tunajidanganya! Ni vema tupige kura kuhusiana na mustakabali wetu!

 

[MkamaP]

kwa walio nje na walio bongo
tunaweza kuchangia moja kwa moja maoni yetu kwa kamati ya mh.prof wangwe
bofya linki hii
http://www.meac.go.tz/new/meac/