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Nani chokochoko baraza la wakilishi la zanzibar?!

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Grader, Jul 14, 2009.

  1. Grader

    Grader JF-Expert Member

    #1
    Jul 14, 2009
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    kwa mara ya kwanza ilianza chokochoko kwenye kikao kilichopita nafikiri cha mwezi wa 4 mwaka huu,walidai kuliondoa suala la mafuta na gasi kwenye mambo ya muungano- ikafikia wakati Rais wa jamhuri wa muungano Jakaya Mrisho Kikwete kuingilia kati na kulizungumzia katika hotuba yake ya mwezi huo.
    Chakushangaza katika kikao hiki kinachoendelea hivi sasa baraza la wawakilishi limepitisha ya kuwa wameliondoa suala la gasi asilia pamoja na mufuta kwenye masuala ya muungano baada ya kuona wao wanauhakika ya kuwa wa kupata hivyo vyote hapo kwao.
    Wiki kama moja iliyopita kulikuwa na utata kuhusu mambo ya michezo nani anatakiwa kujulikana kati ya ZFA au TFF?
    Jana wanataka kujiunga katika jumuiya ya Afrika Mashariki kwa sababu sijui wana Rais wao!
    Naomba tusaidiane kwenye haya,
    1. Maana halisi ya muungano,ukijumuisha maudhui yake ikizingatia faida na hasara ya muunagano.
    2. Mambo yanatakiwa kwenye muungano
    3.Kwa nini kusiwe na serikali tatu.
    4.Huu mkanganyiko mpaka lini?
     
  2. M

    Mugerezi JF-Expert Member

    #2
    Jul 14, 2009
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    Kila kitu kiko wazi kwani watz visiwani wao kwakuwa wana raisi wanadhani wanaweza kutambuliwa wakati hawana sovereignty, hivyo inajulika Tanzania. Hila wao ndani ya Tanzania tunawaterm kama nchi si mkoa.

    Lakini wao wanataka kukiuka makubaliano kwani haiwezekani nchi mbili zote zitambulike kimataifa.

    Kuhusu mambo ya mafuta na gesi basis yao ni kuwa hicho kitu hakikuwa kwenye makubaliano ya hawali ya muungano hivyo kwakuwa kipengele kiliingizwa baadaye ndiyo wanashikia bango kuwa MAFUTA NA GESI KILA MMOJA HAJITEGEMEE. Lakini sheria ilishapita na wao waliipitisha kwani wana wawakilishi katika bunge hivyo hizi kelele inabidi zifanyiwe kazi na RAISI WA JAMHURI YA MUUNGANO KWANI YEYE YUKO JUU YA WOTE HAO. HATA WAO WANAJUA. Hivyo kuendelea kuwaachia watachanganya watu khali iwe mbaya zaidi.

    Kama kulalamika huku bara ndiyo tungelalamika kwani kila kitu cha TANGANYIKA kilichukuliwa na kuingizwa kwenye muungano mbona watu hawasemi? Japo kinauma ni kwakuwa hatutaki mambo yasiyo ya msingi yatupotezee muda kama tumeweza kudumu kwa miaka 45 almost nusu karne TUWEKE MAMBO MENGINE SAWA THEN NA HILI KAMA ITAONEKANA LINA UMUHIMU LIFANYIWE KAZI LAKINI SI KAMA WANAVYOFANYA HAWA JAMAA.

    I STAND TO BE CORRECTED.
     
  3. N

    Ndivyo Ilivyo JF-Expert Member

    #3
    Jul 14, 2009
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    Bwana Muregezi "U stand to be corrected-kweli". Kila kitu cha Bara kilichukuliwa na kuingizwa katika Muungano -ni kweli hilo. Lakini ni kweli pia kuwa Serikali ya Jamhuri ya Muungano inawahudumia Wananchi wa Bara kwa kila kitu. Haifanyi hivyo kwa Wananchi wa Zanzibar. Isipokuwa wananchi wa Zanzibar wanahudumiwa mambo mengi tu na Serikali yao ya Mapinduzi ya Zanzibar. Be corrected Brother.
     
  4. Barubaru

    Barubaru JF-Expert Member

    #4
    Jul 14, 2009
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    UKIMUONA MTU ANATEMA ASALI NA KUTAMANI PILIPILI usimwone kichaa bali mambo yamemshinda.

    Kuna mengi a kuzungumza katika muungano.
    1. Suala la mambo a nje na uwakilishi ( hapa kuna hoja nzima a kujiunga na OIC ili wa Znz wapate misaada)
    2. Mgawanyo wa misaada inaotolewa nje ikiwa pamoja na mikopo.
    3. Suala la mgawano wa BOT.
    4. Suala la uwakilishi katika michezo katika nchi za nje ( TFF na ZFA)
    5. Suala la ushuru (TRA) na mgawanyo wake
    6. Suala la magari yenye namba za Zanzibar kutozwa kodi kama magari ya kigeni kama ya kenya, uganda katika ardhi ya Bara.

    Yapo mengi saana , ndio maana sasa Znz anataka haki yake
     
  5. m

    mbarbaig Senior Member

    #5
    Jul 14, 2009
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    Mie nadhani nawao walipie ardhi hapa $50,000 kwa mwaka kama mtu wa bara akitaka kwao ardhi..kisa ardhi yao kidogo...halaf wanakuja huku na maneno megi tu..kweli yahitaji uvumilivun
     
  6. Tumain

    Tumain JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Jul 15, 2009
    Joined: Jun 28, 2009
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    Mambo mengi wanayodai wanzinzibar hata hayana ugumu wowote kutekeleza, isipokuwa nafikiri CCM wameshindwa kuongoza kabisa, vikao lukuki vya muungano, tume hakuna hesabu lakini hakuna kinachobadilika kwenye ground..sama story different day why??
    Kodi (TRA) what is so difficult kuangalia pro-rata ya vitu vinavyotoka zanzibar na kugawana effectively kama tunahitaji muungano
    serikali tatu au moja: lazima tuwe progressive tuende mble nafikiri tunahitaji serikali moja ndiyo itakuwa mwisho wa kelele na kila mtanzania atakuwa kwenye market iwe siasa au biashara...
     
  7. P

    Pakacha JF-Expert Member

    #7
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Usijizonge ndugu yangu hatuhitaji Serikali moja wala tatu. Hizi mbili za sasa ni muwafaka. na ninafikiri Bunge lingekaa pale na kupitisha sheria bayana kuwa nchi yetu ni ya Jamhuri ya Muungano wa Tanzania na inaendeshwa na Serikali mbili. -basi kwisha. Sasa msituletee habari za mbili kuelekea kwenye moja . Hakuna hiyo kitu. Wala msituletee hadithi za federation (tatu) hakuna hiyo kitu. Mfumo wa Muungano wetu ni mzuri na tuuuendeleze. Tuache hizo tamaa nyengine.
     
  8. W

    WildCard JF-Expert Member

    #8
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Moja ya mapungufu ya wazi ya Rais wetu JMK ni kutokuisimamia/kuilinda/kuitetea KATIBA ya JMT ipasavyo kama alivyoapa. Chokochoko zote hizi zinatokana na pungufu hilo.
     
  9. Ndahani

    Ndahani JF-Expert Member

    #9
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Ila tusisahau siasa mchezo mchafu sana...huu upepo ukibadili mwelekeo kuna baadhi ya wanasiasa wataachwa hawana pa kushikilia.Sidhani kama dola haijui inachofanya. Inavuta subira
     
  10. N

    Ndivyo Ilivyo JF-Expert Member

    #10
    Jul 15, 2009
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    kama wataachwa hao watakuwa si wanasiasa bali ni matapeli. Wanasiasa haswa hawatoachwa. Songa mbele!!!
     
  11. SMU

    SMU JF-Expert Member

    #11
    Jul 15, 2009
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    "We sent our police to Zanzibar. After overcoming various problems we united. We ourselves voluntarily agreed on union. Karume and I met. Only the two of us met. When I mentioned the question of the union Karume did not even give it a second thought. He instantly asked me to call a meeting of the press to announce our intention. I advised him to wait a bit as it was too early for the press to be informed." Mwalimu Julius Kambarage Nyerere when he addressed the mass rally at Dar es Salaam on November 15, 1964 (as quoted by Martin Bailey).

    Kuna kila sababu ya kukaa chini na kujadili matatizo ya muungano ili kuondoa manung'uniko ya kila upande. Ikiwezekana ifanyike referendum kupata msimamo wa wananchi wa kila upande wa muungano (kama ilivyofanyika kwa uharakishaji wa East African Federation).
     
  12. N

    Ndivyo Ilivyo JF-Expert Member

    #12
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Mawazo yako ni mgando. Unataka referendum leo? Kwa nini hujataka 1970, 1980, 1990, 2000. Usiwazonge kizazi chetu cha hivi sasa na kijacho. Muungano is here to stay. Tumezaliwa katika Muungano na tutabakia katika Muungano. Lete hoja za namna gani ya kuendesha Muungano wetu.
     
  13. G

    Game Theory JF-Expert Member

    #13
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Hawataki muungano nyinyi ndio mnaowangangania

    get over it
     
  14. SMU

    SMU JF-Expert Member

    #14
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Inawezekana yako pia ni mgando (I take it to mean 'static'!). Hoja yangu ni ushirikishwaji wa wanaanchi katika mambo ya msingi. Kuna faida gani ya kuwa na muungano ambao wananchi hawautaki? Au kuna faida gani ya kuvunja muungano kama wananchi bado wanautaka? Kama kwa mfano wanzanzibari 'hawataki' kuwa sehemu ya muungano huu kwa nini watanganyika tuwalazimishe?
     
  15. B

    Bunduki Member

    #15
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Siasa ndio iliunganisha watu na ndio itakayowatenganisha. Ukiangalia kwa makini hakuna sababu ya kuwa na jazba sana kuhusu mambo ya muungano lakini wanasiasa ndio wanataka kutuharibia mambo, wanazungumza kama watoto sometimes. Makubaliano tele lakini utekelezaji wa hovyo hovyo na mwishoni wao ndio wanaotoa kauli za kupotosha wananchi ili kujiwekeka mazingira mazuri ya kisiasa ili walisha matumbo yao
     
  16. Mpita Njia

    Mpita Njia JF-Expert Member

    #16
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Tatizo kubwa katika hili ni kuwa hakuna kiongozi, wa Muungano au Zanzibar, who is bold enough kusema kuwa zabnzibar hawautaki Muungano. tatizo kubwa ni kwa wazanzibari wenyewe kwa sababu wanalijua hili lakini wamebaki wakizunguza kwa kutafuta visababu. lakini wabara nao wanajua hilo na hawataki kueleza ukweli, kila amebaki anafukuzakai na vivuli tu
     
  17. B

    Bunduki Member

    #17
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Nani kakuambia wazanzibari "hawautaki" muungano? Na una ushahidi gani kwamba watanganyika wanalazimisha muungano? Matatizo ni sehemu ya kila mtu na kila jamii na kila muungano, kwa hiyo kama issue ni kero ziko kila upande. Kama ni kweli wazanzibari hawautaki muungano wao waseme hapo ndio itaonekana kama wanalazimishwa au la!
     
  18. SMU

    SMU JF-Expert Member

    #18
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Bunduki,
    Naona tunashindwa kuelewana lugha tu. Soma kwa makini post zangu hapo juu. Sentensi yako ya mwisho ndio hasa msingi wa hoja yangu na kwa maoni yangu 'wanzanzibari' wanaweza kusema wao wenyewe kupitia referendum na si kwa matamshi/matendo ya viongozi peke yao!
     
  19. SMU

    SMU JF-Expert Member

    #19
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Tunawang'ang'ania kwa nini? Kitendawili hiki pengine ambaye angeweza kukitengua ni Mwalimu Nyerere pekee.

    Mwishoni mwa miaka ya 1950 (58 au 59 hivi) kabla ya uhuru wa Tanganyika, Nyerere alionyesha hofu na wasiwasi wake wa Zanzibar kuwa karibu na Tanganyika. Mwalimu aliseme yafuatayo bila kufafanua:

    "Sitanii; kisiwa hiki kitatupa taabu kweli kweli (Watanganyika) huko mbele; kitatuumiza kichwa, na kama ningekuwa na uwezo wa kukisukuma kiende mbali katikati ya bahari (ya Hindi), ningefanya hivyo" (ili kuepuka shari),

    Pengine, kwa Mwalimu, muungano ulikuwa ni njia ya kujaribu ku'contain taabu ambazo ukaribu wa Zanzibar ungeiletea Tanganyika.
     
  20. B

    Bunduki Member

    #20
    Jul 15, 2009
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    Heshima kwako mkuu!!!!!!
     
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