Kujenga highway Arusha-Musoma ni kuzuia great migration?

[blackpepper]

wakenya ni Wasanii...this time tumewashtukia ina maana wanyama havuki barabara ya Lami??

 

[Zhule]

Kwanza it is not a new Arusha-Musoma road, bali it is upgrading what has been living along with animals for years. Pili mifano ya reli na barabara ya mombasa-Nairobi na hata nairobi-kericho kupitia narok zote zinapita kwenye mbuga za wanya huko kwenu. Na sisi tuna experience na barabara na railways za aina hiyo hapa kwetu. Hata hivyo umeonyesha kujali ajira na uchumi wa wakenya wenzako jambo ambalo nadhani ni muhimu kwa kila raia, kwaiyo nakupa bravo. Hiyo ya environment umetumia kama mwavuli tu. Ila nadhani ungesubiri hiyo feasibility study inayoendelea iishe ili ujue tume-deal vipi na hiyo emigration. Hata hivyo you are a whistleblower.

 

[Kilembwe]

Kenyans are now acting like spoilt child, they are very selfish and individualist! wanawafikiriaje watanzania are they fools? Tanzania kabla ya kuja na mradi huu tumefikiria yote hayo ndio maana tukaamua ku upgrade hiyo barabara, si waseme ukweli tu wanajali zaidi maslahi yao wanajua tu kukamilika kwa barabara hii kutaondoa kabisa ule utegezi wa kupitia Nairobi kwenda Mara na Mwanza kutoka Dar. Kenyan do remember that we value our wildlife more than you do, that is way we have more than 14% of our land reserved for wildlife protection! we have a have a Tanzania- Zambia highway passing through the middle of our fourth largest national park, Mikumi national park and still the natural migration of animals from mikumi to a nearby Game reserve, the Selous Game reserve is maintained by animals like elephants, not only this but also despite of this road the animals still migrate unaffected between mikumi and Udzungwa national park and mikumi and Ruaha national Park! Yes I ahve to admit there are some incidents of roadkills by tracts and other vehicles travelling along this road, but the kills are not that much to become a potential threat to animals as Kasmaan is trying to explain. I urge my Kenyan brothers please do not exaggerate the threat of this project, it is not the way you are trying to put it, or otherwise just be open that you cry is a cry for tourism interest and not wildlife protection the thing which is not good especially now when we are talking of EAC! You did it once with ivory stock, but do not think you can do it again this time! kwa taarifa yenu MTOTO WA KAMBO HADEKI!

 

[Bantugbro]

Hawa wakenya siyo wenzetu kabisa, mimi nimekuwa nalifahamu hilo tangu mwaka 1977, ndiyo maana sikubaliani kabisa na huu upuuzi wa shirikisha. Juzi juzi hapa jamaa mmja kaandika kuwa Tanzania haina barabara ni chafu; tukitaka kujenga wanakuwa wa kwanza kupiga kelel tusijenge. Ngoja tuone kama serikali ya CCM itakubaliana nao, ni hapa ninapoanza kufikiria kuwa na kiongozi kama Lowasa ( minus tamaa ya mali).

Wote mnaokubaliana na madai ya kenya mnakosea kwa sababu kadhaa, nitajaribu kusema chache hapa chini.

(1) Sehemu kubwa ya mbuga ya Serengeti iko Tanzania, ni sehemu ndogo sana iliyoko upande wa Kenya ambako inaitwa Masai Mara. Kwa hiyo kufuatia mzunguko wa wanyama, ni wachache sana wanaokatisha mpaka baina ya nchi hizo. Wengi wao wanaishi Tanzania; hebu angalia ramani hii hapa.

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(2) Barabara kupita kwenye mbuga za wanyama siyo jambo la ajabu kabisa; kuna mbuga nyingi ambamo barabara zinapita na wala wanyama hawajawahi kuhama. Mifano ni kama ifuatavyo:

a) Hapo Serengeti kuna barabara inayotoka Arusha kwende Mugumu kupitia humo humo Serengeti. Barabara hii ndiyo ambayo serikali inataka kuwekea lami; ni barabara ya siku nyingi sasa, na kwa miaka nenda rudi ilikuwa inatumiwa na maloli ya mzigo kusafirisha biadhaa katia ya Musoma na Arusha, Tanga na DSM. Kwa miaka yote hiyo barabara hiyo imekuwa inatumika huku ikitimua vumbi sana wakati wa kiangazi na wakati wa masika kujaa matope yanayoweza kukwamisha magari na kuhatarisha maisha ya abiria. Ubovu wa barabara hii ndio uliosababisha raia wa Tanzania wakawa wanaamua kupitia Kenya kutoka Arusha kwenda Musoma au Mwanza.

(b) Vile vile kutoka Mto Wambu kuna barabara nyingine inayopita hapo hapo Serengeti kwenda hadi Lamadi; hii nayo ni kama ile inayokwenda Mugumu.

(c) Barabara ya Bunda Musoma karibu na Lamadi ndiyo mpaka wa mbuga za Serengeti, lakini wanyama wale hutembea sehemu zote za barabara kwenda ziwani na kila ukiipta saa za jioni utakutana nao mbona hawajahama eneo lile.

(d) Huko Kenya kwenyewe, ile highway inayotoka Mombasa kweda Nairobi inapita katikati ya mbuga za Tsavo. Vile vile ile reli inayotoka Mombasa nayo inapita hapo hapo Tsavo; na barabara inayotoka Moshi kwenda Taveta nayo inapita katikati ya mbuga ya Tsavo.. Mbona wanyama wa Tsavo hawajahama.

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(e) Kwa upande wa kusini mwa Tanzania, reli ya Tazara inapita katikati ya mbuga za Selous wakati Barabara ya Southern Highway nayo inapita ndani ya mbuga za Mikumi na wala wanyama wale hawajadhurika.

Hizi propaganada za kenya ndiyo changamoto kwetu watanzania kujiuliza tena kama kweli hili shirikisho lina maana yoyote kwetu. Nimesoma kelele wanazopiga kule facebook nikalinganisha na jinsi walivyotufanyia kwenye swala la uuzaji pembe za ndovu, na mgogoro wa maji ya mto nile nikaona hapa hakuna ushirika wowote; ni utapeli mtupu.

Kwakweli Kichuguu umemaliza ubishi wote katika suala hili. Hizi ramani na maelezo yako yatawafungua macho watanzania wengi...

 

[Mpeni sifa Yesu]

siku zote wakiona tunafanya kitu cha maana, huwa wanapiga kelele ili waendelee kutuita mabwege...kalagabaho Tz!

 

[MchunguZI]

I never heard some of our leader are thinking of that, i am Tanzanian but for sure this is the issue which does not need to be kenyan or tanzanian!

There should be no tarmac road in national parks for whatever reason, infact personally i am furious with the government after it allow normal passenger buses goin to Musoma to pass across Serengeti as transit, this route should be the last alternative, all passengers should be passing to Mwanza via Singida and goin to Musoma!

This plan should be condemned by all concerned individuals!

Try to bring down your classroom knowledge to practices and economic benefits. The biggest problem with fresh mind is balancing the equation of classroom theory and practical implementation.

We learn a lot of theories but when it comes to practices some are avoided. If we hold such theories nobody will cut tree in this world, nobody will kill insects (biodiversity), no body will practice irrigation (consumptive use of water), etc.

We need road. Let us not hear book theories.

BTW, when it comes to Kenyans, I am unhappy with them by their pretence of knowing everything. They know Kilimanjaro is in Kenya and similarly know Serengeti is in Kenya.

Where have they ever favoured us? If it is necessary let the Masai mara die.

 

[Jasusi]

Safari ni Safari,
Airport ya Mugumu inamnufaisha mtu mmoja tu. Tudor.

 

[Safari_ni_Safari]

Safari ni Safari,
Airport ya Mugumu inamnufaisha mtu mmoja tu. Tudor.

Could be true....and untrue as well....he is clever kwamba anajenga kwa hela yake...anainflate costs...halafu ana-recover toka kwenye taxes and levies...but the airport will be there and we will all use it...akiondoka ataicha...
Watalii hawatahitajikla kushuka Nairobi au Arusha but deep into Serengeti.....mahoteli yetu yatapata mapato na watalii kupunguza travel time

 

[Mkandara]

Ni Wakati Watanzania tunatakiwa kuanza ku focus ktk Utalii mbali na mbuga za Wanyama. Kwa mwaka mmoja tunapata 1/10 ya watalii wanaokwenda Brazil au Bahamas, tunazidiwa na hata visiwa vidogo vya Dominican republic hawana mbuga hawa..Utalii sio mbuga za wanyama, hiyo Zanzibar inavutia watalii zaidi ya Serengeti yenyewe kwa sababu kuna historia kubwa.
.
Tunapozungumzia Ujenzi wa barabara tusihusishe kabisa na Utalii bali Umuhimu wa barabara hiyo tukizingatia mazingira yetu na wala tusitazame Kenya wamefanya nini kwani wao ndio hamnazo kabisaaa.

Hiyo barabara ya Arusha - Musoma ipo miaka kibao, sisi tumesafiri kupitia njia hiyo toka miaka ya 70, hivyo sii jambo geni kabisa. Cha kuzingatia ni jinsi gani barabara hiyo ya lami inaweza kuathiri migration ya wanyama na kuondoa maana ya HIFADHI YA WANYAMA.

Ifanyike study na laukama kupita kwa magari makubwa na Ma bus kunaweza kuathiri mazingira ya Wanyama tuachane na ujenzi wa barabara ya lami au Ijengwe kwa kuzingatia sehemu za migration ya wanyama kwani mara nyingi wanyama kupitia eneo moja kuvuka..

Hiyo mifano ya Mikumi na Selous haiwezi kuwa mfano bora kwa sababu wanyama wengi wanakufa kila siku wakigongwa na magari yaendayo kasi Usiku. Na wanyama wengi wamezihama mbuga hizo huwezi kabisa kulinganisha na miaka ya 70.. - Binadamu are the most destructive of biosphere! Sipingi wala siungi mkono ujenzi wa barabara ya lami pasipo kuzingatia mazingira yetu....

 

[JokaKuu]

Hawa wakenya siyo wenzetu kabisa, mimi nimekuwa nalifahamu hilo tangu mwaka 1977, ndiyo maana sikubaliani kabisa na huu upuuzi wa shirikisha. Juzi juzi hapa jamaa mmja kaandika kuwa Tanzania haina barabara ni chafu; tukitaka kujenga wanakuwa wa kwanza kupiga kelel tusijenge. Ngoja tuone kama serikali ya CCM itakubaliana nao, ni hapa ninapoanza kufikiria kuwa na kiongozi kama Lowasa ( minus tamaa ya mali).

Wote mnaokubaliana na madai ya kenya mnakosea kwa sababu kadhaa, nitajaribu kusema chache hapa chini.

(1) Sehemu kubwa ya mbuga ya Serengeti iko Tanzania, ni sehemu ndogo sana iliyoko upande wa Kenya ambako inaitwa Masai Mara. Kwa hiyo kufuatia mzunguko wa wanyama, ni wachache sana wanaokatisha mpaka baina ya nchi hizo. Wengi wao wanaishi Tanzania; hebu angalia ramani hii hapa.

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(2) Barabara kupita kwenye mbuga za wanyama siyo jambo la ajabu kabisa; kuna mbuga nyingi ambamo barabara zinapita na wala wanyama hawajawahi kuhama. Mifano ni kama ifuatavyo:

a) Hapo Serengeti kuna barabara inayotoka Arusha kwende Mugumu kupitia humo humo Serengeti. Barabara hii ndiyo ambayo serikali inataka kuwekea lami; ni barabara ya siku nyingi sasa, na kwa miaka nenda rudi ilikuwa inatumiwa na maloli ya mzigo kusafirisha biadhaa katia ya Musoma na Arusha, Tanga na DSM. Kwa miaka yote hiyo barabara hiyo imekuwa inatumika huku ikitimua vumbi sana wakati wa kiangazi na wakati wa masika kujaa matope yanayoweza kukwamisha magari na kuhatarisha maisha ya abiria. Ubovu wa barabara hii ndio uliosababisha raia wa Tanzania wakawa wanaamua kupitia Kenya kutoka Arusha kwenda Musoma au Mwanza.

(b) Vile vile kutoka Mto Wambu kuna barabara nyingine inayopita hapo hapo Serengeti kwenda hadi Lamadi; hii nayo ni kama ile inayokwenda Mugumu.

(c) Barabara ya Bunda Musoma karibu na Lamadi ndiyo mpaka wa mbuga za Serengeti, lakini wanyama wale hutembea sehemu zote za barabara kwenda ziwani na kila ukiipta saa za jioni utakutana nao mbona hawajahama eneo lile.

(d) Huko Kenya kwenyewe, ile highway inayotoka Mombasa kweda Nairobi inapita katikati ya mbuga za Tsavo. Vile vile ile reli inayotoka Mombasa nayo inapita hapo hapo Tsavo; na barabara inayotoka Moshi kwenda Taveta nayo inapita katikati ya mbuga ya Tsavo.. Mbona wanyama wa Tsavo hawajahama.

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(e) Kwa upande wa kusini mwa Tanzania, reli ya Tazara inapita katikati ya mbuga za Selous wakati Barabara ya Southern Highway nayo inapita ndani ya mbuga za Mikumi na wala wanyama wale hawajadhurika.

Hizi propaganada za kenya ndiyo changamoto kwetu watanzania kujiuliza tena kama kweli hili shirikisho lina maana yoyote kwetu. Nimesoma kelele wanazopiga kule facebook nikalinganisha na jinsi walivyotufanyia kwenye swala la uuzaji pembe za ndovu, na mgogoro wa maji ya mto nile nikaona hapa hakuna ushirika wowote; ni utapeli mtupu.

Kichuguu,

..asante sana kwa huu msaada wa kutuletea ramani za hifadhi ya serengeti na bararabara zinazopita ndani yake. this is very valuable for our discussion.

..sikubaliani na hoja kwamba Tanzania tunapaswa kuiga mfano wa Wakenya ambao wamepitisha barabara na reli katika hifadhi za wanyama. baadhi ya barabara hizo zilijengwa na wakoloni, na hata kama tawala za kizalendo zilizi-maintain bado hiyo siyo hoja yenye nguvu kutulazimisha kuiga mfano huo mbaya.

..vilevile kulingana na maelezo yako barabara zipo ndani ya hifadhi ila ni za vumbi. sasa naona tumeziendekeza mpaka tunahitaji za barabara za lami. sasa tukijenga ya lami sasa hivi, na nina hakika itakuwa two lanes, twenty to thirty years later, with an increased traffic volume, we may end up needing a four-lanes super highway.

..binafsi napendekeza tutafute njia mbadala ya kutoka Arusha kwenda Musoma. Viongozi na wataalamu wetu watueleze kuna tatizo gani kujenga barabara itakayopita Arusha -- Mbulu --Dongobesh -- Mhunze -- Nyalikungu -- Banadi -- Bunda -- Nyamuswa -- Musoma.

..ramani aliyoileta Kichuguu inaonyesha alternatives nyingi tu za kutoka Arusha kwenda Musoma bila kulazimika kukatiza ktk hifadhi ya Serengeti.

 

[Ubungoubungo]

tujenge tu katikati ya mbuga, pengine na wale wasokuwa na pesa watapata pa kuangalia wanyama wetu. achaneni na wakenya hawa hawataki maendeleo yetu. kwani kati ya kuijenga barabara hiyo na ile ya kutojenga ipi yenye faida zaidi?, kwani wanyama wa mikumi wanakufa kwa magari? unafikiri barabara hiyo itakuwa busy kuliko ile ya mikumi?...tunatakiwa kujenga iyo barabara mara moja bila kipingamizi chochote...

 

[Jasusi]

Could be true....and untrue as well....he is clever kwamba anajenga kwa hela yake...anainflate costs...halafu ana-recover toka kwenye taxes and levies...but the airport will be there and we will all use it...akiondoka ataicha...
Watalii hawatahitajikla kushuka Nairobi au Arusha but deep into Serengeti.....mahoteli yetu yatapata mapato na watalii kupunguza travel time

Nitakubaliana na wewe siku nikiona uwanja huo unatumiwa na watu wengine mbali ya Tudor na wageni wake.

 

[Magezi]

Inatakiwa wizara ya malia asili apewe mtu kama magufuli uone kazi.....hao wakenya wanamtambua