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Cutting off Aid- a condition to lift Africa from Poverty?

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by MzalendoHalisi, Feb 25, 2009.

  1. M

    MzalendoHalisi JF-Expert Member

    #1
    Feb 25, 2009
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    Wandugu nimeenda kule kwa Michuzi MICHUZI

    kuna majadiliano mazuri ya dada wa Zambia aliyesoma Oxford na Havard!

    Je Africa tukikatiwa misaada na hii ikaelekezwa kwa wajasiriamali moja kwa

    moja ndo tutatake off?

    Yaani misaada kama Budget Support tusipewe..wapewe tu wananchi wajasiriamali in the forms of micro-credits!



    My position: hata mimi nakubali kuwa misaada Afrika ndo chanzo cha kurudi nyuma ktk maendeleo!

    Haiingii akilini UK kutoa 100 Billions Budget Support kila mwaka na pesa hii kutumika kununulia mashangingi ya bei mbaya na ndege ghali ya raisi!

    Mnasemaje? Bora hii pesa wangepewa wajasiriamali wadogo au benki za kutoa mikopo kuliko serikali?
     
  2. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #2
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    duh!! tumeandika hapa na Michuzi nimemtumia ile makala ya "Tanzania Addicted to Aid?".. but well vya wageni kwa kweli vizuri sana! Labda mzungu akipendekeza tukatiwe misaada ndiyo utakuwa mjadala au mtu yeyote beside a fellow "mmatumbi!"

    I probably need to go to Harvard and Oxford haya ya community College hayana ujiko kwa kweli..
     
  3. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

    #3
    Feb 25, 2009
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    Heheheheee...naona ume mind mzee...Lol
     
  4. Maarifa

    Maarifa JF-Expert Member

    #4
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    Nitatumia lugha yetu ya kiswahili ili kuweza kuchanganua hoja hii. This is a serious issue ambayo iko bayana na haihitaji minjonjo. Nimesoma mahojiano ya mwanadada moyo Mhavard na moxford. hayo majina ya vyuo yanatisha, kwani ni vyuo mahiri. Ila sio kigezo kuwa kila aliyesoma katika vyuo hivyo basi ni kipanga na jawezi kutoa pumba.

    Kabla ya kuchukua uamuzi mkato wa kusitisha misaada kwa Africa kwanza swali la msingi ni kwa nini Africa inaomba au inategemea misaada? Je tatizo ni misaada au ni namna ya kudhibiti ni misaada itumiwe? je ni nani anaamua namna ya msaada? ni muombaji ama ni mtoaji msaada? Rushwa, Ubadhirufu na ufisadi ni miongoni mwa vikwazo vya maendeleo. Africa umaskini wetu unatokana na watu. Nafikiri miss moyo amekuwa mno radical. Kila nchi ina competitive advantage yake. na hiyo ya kutumia kuinua uchumi. Mfano kwa Tanzania tumepata misaada kibao lakini matumizi ni machafu mno. radar, wizi, ufisadi, n.k Nadhani mojawapo ya kukidhi haja ya misaada ni kuhakikisha kuwa msaada unawafikia walengwana hilo ni ndoto kama uongozi na utawala wa nchi ni bomu.

    watakaoumia mama moyo ni watu wa chini zaidi. maana hata hicho kidogo kinachowafikia kitakauka na huenda basi kuhatarisha maisha ya watu.

    Ki usalama then si vema ku direct misaada yote katika sekta binafsi. kumbuka kuna ku finance terrorism. vikundi kama hivyo vikiwa vinapata misaada unmonitored sijui kama tutafika mbali.
     
  5. Zakumi

    Zakumi JF-Expert Member

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    Feb 25, 2009
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    If you go there you would be too good to come here.
     
  6. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #6
    Feb 25, 2009
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    of course not, I'll go to Michuzi's
     
  7. K

    Kevin Luande Member

    #7
    Feb 25, 2009
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    Wakuu nakubaliana na hilo, hii misaada imeshatolewa sana, lakini kwa ukweli ndio kama tunarudi nyuma, nadhani kinachohitajika sasa Africa ni kufufua manufacturing industry, tuweze kuuza bidhaa nje. Kwa msaada zaidi naomba mwenye nafasi akanunue kitabu kinaitwa "Aid and other dirty business" ambacho kimeandikwa na jamaa mmoja ambaye alikuwa akifanya kaza DFID, utaweza kuona ni jinsi gani Aid has failled Africa.
     
  8. Z

    Zungu Pule JF-Expert Member

    #8
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    Naunga mkono hoja. But many leading economists (Jeffrey Sachs, Calestous Juma etc.) would argue otherwise. Prof. Juma once said "Doubling aid to Africa would do what the invention of electric guitar did to Bob Geldof". Meaning more aid is the panacea. While it's not easy to prove (empirically) that aid doesn't work, it's just plausible to think that it doesn't work! The question remain, can we make it without foreign aid? Do you think we will be considered for aid if we are self-sufficient? Why are we not making it at the first place? Think of aid as a subsidy (meaning something that reduce the cost of achieving development). Ideally, it should be easy to achieve development when we there's a subsidy. Blaming foreign aid, are we not looking for an answer to the wrong question?
     
  9. Masanja

    Masanja JF-Expert Member

    #9
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    Check your facts properly!!
     
  10. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #10
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    Yawezekana nchi inayopokea misaada mingi ya kigeni kuwa na corruption ya kiwango cha juu? kwanini?
     
  11. Recta

    Recta JF-Expert Member

    #11
    Feb 25, 2009
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    Foreign Aid is good for poor countries. Endapo nchi masikini zisipopata msaada, ni dhahiri kuwa malengo yake mengi ya kimaendeleo yatashindikana au yatadorora kwa kiasi kikubwa.

    Tatizo kubwa tulilonalo waAfrika halitokani na kupewa misaada. Linatokana na jinsi tunavyoitumia misaada hiyo (priorities na accountability). Hatuko structured kufanikisha maendeleo kwa kasi kutokana na kiasi kidogo cha misaada tunayopata. Hata misaada ikiondolewa, si kweli kuwa tutapata utashi/uwezo wa kutumia kidogo tutakachoweza kudunduliza kuleta maendeleo.

    Ni vyema kuwa na njia za binafsi (kitaifa) za kuongeza mapato. Tatizo ni kuwa, kila njia hizo zinapobuniwa (kodi), anaeumia zaidi ni mwananchi wa chini kuliko watu wengine wenye uwezo zaidi.

    Mambo yafuatayo ni dhahiri kuwa yatajitokeza endapo misaada itakatwa;

    1. Uwezo wa kutoa huduma mbalimbali utapungua sana (40% ya Bajeti ya serikali inatokana na misaada kutoka kwa wahisani). Afya, Elimu, miundombinu n.k. haitaweza kuendelezwa kwa kasi inayokusudiwa
    2. Umasikini utaongezeka kwa kiasi kikubwa kutokana na ukosefu wa ajira. Misaada (ambayo ndio sehemu kubwa ya bajeti zetu huzalisha ajira kubwa pia)
    3. Nchi itashindikana kuongozeka. Kwa kuwa serikali haitakuwa na uwezo kifedha, itakuwa vigumu kwa nchi kufanya shughuli zake ipasavyo.

    Pamoja na kuwa misaada ni chachu kubwa ya maendeleo, ni ukweli usiofichika kuwa kujitegemea ni njia pekee ya kuweza kujenga taifa lenye heshima na ustawi wa kweli. Nchi inayotegemea misaada zaidi, hujikuta ikifanyiwa maamuzi makubwa ya kimaendeleo na wahisani wanaoitoa misaada hiyo. Uhuru wa nchi yeyote unakuwa na maana kama nchi hiyo inajenga misingi imara ya kiuchumi, kiusalama, kijamii bila kuingiliwa na mataifa mengine kwa kisingizio cha misaada. Tumeshuhudia mara nyingi serikali ikitishiwa kupunguziwa misaada kutokana na mambo fulani fulani inayoyafanya ambayo hayakubaliki kwa wahisani.
     
  12. M

    MzalendoHalisi JF-Expert Member

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    50 years sasa Tz net recepient of AID!

    Nina wasi2 hili debe linavuja!

    Mtu unajaza maji ktk debe linalovuja..na wewe unaona linavuja..na wewe unaendelea kutia tu..je hii inaingia akilini??

    Si bora kuacha kutia maji na kuziba matundu kwanza?
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2009
  13. Mpita Njia

    Mpita Njia JF-Expert Member

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    Inawezekana pia hata kusipokuwa na misaada wakaendelea ba rushwa yao kwa sababu nadhani hiki ni kirusi ambacho kinatafuta fedha, bila kujali zimetoka wapi... zikikosekama za misaada, kitakuwa za kodi ya wananchi
     
  14. Liz Senior

    Liz Senior JF-Expert Member

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    Feb 25, 2009
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    Tatizo ndugu yangu ni kuwa hao wanaojaza hili debe wanafanya hivyo kwa ajili yao. Divide and rule + Power politics + na vile vile kusaidia kusahihisha maswala ya kiuchumi katika nchi zao...control of inflation. Ndio maana hawajali tunatumiaje aid inayoingia katika HIPC na wala hawapo tayari kufanya monitoring + evaluation ya mipesa wanayoleta maana italeta matatizo kwa wapiga kura wao. Wanafahamu vizuri kabisa haziwafikii walengwa lakini wanatumia kisingizio cha "we do not want to interfere internal politics" ili wafikie malengo yao ambayo si maendeleo ya Africa.
     
  15. K

    Kwame Nkrumah JF-Expert Member

    #15
    Feb 25, 2009
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    Tujipongeze kidogo, bajeti ijayo utegemezi umeshuka kutoka asilimia 34 mwaka jana hadi 25 bajeti mpya inayokuja.
     
  16. Mag3

    Mag3 JF Gold Member

    #16
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    Sawa lakini bila misaada uwajibikaji utaongezeka kwa kuwa atakayechezea hicho chetu kidogo tulichokichuma juani hatutamvumilia. Kumbuka ule usemi- come easy, go easy. Naamini misaada ni inversely proportional to uwajibikaji na kwa nchi kama yetu inatumika zaidi kusubsidize ubadhirifu.

    Bila misaada I bet you vyama vya kifisadi vitasambaratika kwa kuwa vinasitawi kwa kutumia hiyo misaada kama viraka kuziba matundu yanayosababishwa na na sera yao kuu ya wizi. Bila misaada matobo yatabaki wazi kwa yeyote mwenye macho na mwananchi hataweza tena kukaa kimya.

    Mzoga unapokwisha, manyang'au huanza kutafunana wenyewe kwa wenyewe.​
     
  17. M

    MzalendoHalisi JF-Expert Member

    #17
    Feb 25, 2009
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    Kenya wakati wa Moi walikatiwa misaada na Scandnavia..na wakajifunza kujitegemea kwa budgeti ya kawaida 100% ni internally financed!

    Taabu pia hii misaada jamaa huleta watu wao..the so called 'technical advisors'..wale walioshindwa kazi kwao yaani ndo wanatushauri..je mnakumbuka ile saga ya yule Mswisi wa MOI pale M,mbili?

    Ila kweli hakuna ushahidi misaada ikikatwa rushwa itaisha!

    Mag3 unadhani mzoga utaisha ndugu yangu? Manyang'au sii watakula tu kodi ya ndani?

    Ila angalau tukikatiwa misaada.. basi tutakuwa na national debate ..jamani tunabana wapi?

    Na may be mashangingi hatakuwa priority!
     
  18. Liz Senior

    Liz Senior JF-Expert Member

    #18
    Feb 25, 2009
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    Hakuna nchi imepunguza, licha ya kuondoa umaskini kwa kupitia misaada. Misaada ni mazalio ya uzembe na kubweteka! Unafikiri kina Mkullo wanawaza sana jinsi ya kuongeza pato la ndani? Wanafanya upembuzi wa kina kutafuta vyanzo badala vya kuongeza pato? Kwanini wasumbue akili zao wakati kuna mahali "wataonewa huruma" watarushiwa 40% au which ever %!

    Na tusisahau misaada hii hawana mtu wa kuwawajibisha nayo...mkiuliza mnaambiwa si kodi yenu! Lakini ni umaskini wenu, % za wasiofikiwa na huduma za afya, elimu, na social service zitakazowafurahisha donor na picha za kusikitisha za watanzania walala hoi zinatumika kuomba misaada hii. Hata watu wakikwepa kulipa kodi kwao ni ahueni ili wasibanwe na kuwajibishwa. Wapo tayari kujibu kwa donors na si kwa waliowaweka madarakani! Nguvu ya kisiasa wananchi wanayo pale tu wanapowapigia kura baada ya hapo wapiga kura wao wanageuka donors wanawajibika kwao si kwa watanzania

    Misaada ni laana
     
  19. M

    Mkandara Verified User

    #19
    Feb 25, 2009
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    Wakuu zangu,
    Jamani tatizo sio misaada isipokuwa ni unaipata toka wapi na kwa matatizo gani kwani kama navyosema siku zote WATU na MAZINGIRA ndilo somo la kwanza...
    Kwa nini misaada tunayopata haijabadilisha kabisa maisha ya Mtanzania ni kwa sababu tunapewa dose kwa maradhi tofauti kabisa..hao IMF na World bank ni mzigo kwetu...na bahati mbaya wengi hawakumwelewa mwalimu enzi zake kutokana na njaa tuliyokuwa nayo!
    Someni kipande hiki toka wataalam waliokuwa wakitazama misaada ya Malaysia, pengine tunaweza jifunza mengi..

    The IMF was expected to play a central role in dealing with the crisis. However, its policies were quite harsh, which raised doubts about the adequacy of the IMF's measures. Some economists suggested that attention should be paid to the particularities of each of the East Asian economies and criticised the IMF for setting very strict conditions as the prerequisite for receiving rescue funds. For example, Professor Jeffrey Sachs of Harvard University maintained that the IMF had made a wrong diagnosis and prescribed the wrong 'medicine' to Asian countries. As Sachs pointed out, the IMF's rescue packages were workable for those countries where the problems were caused by the public sector's debts and government's overspending. In Asian countries, on the other hand, the private sector was at the root of the problem. Therefore, the IMF's demands that the countries hit by the crisis further cut government expenditure, tighten credit and carry out emergency bank closures were deemed too harsh for the already weakened economies. Furthermore, it was also argued that such measures were pushing the region into an even deeper recession (Khor 1997).
    source:- hii hapa
     
  20. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #20
    Feb 25, 2009
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    najiulizana sana kwamba endapo misaada ya kigeni itasitishwa:

    a. tutaendelea kuwa na NGOs nyingi hivi?
    b. Je watanzania wanaweza kujitolea fedha zao kufanya kazi za kujitolea?
    c. Itakuwaje kwenye misaada ya visima iliyoanzishwa na fedha za wahisani, tutamudu kuiendeleza?
    d. Vipi kuhusu miradi mingine inayosapotiwa na wahisani nayo itakuwaje?
     
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