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Tanzania isidanganywe na Egypt

Discussion in 'International Forum' started by Mzee2000, Jul 28, 2010.

  1. M

    Mzee2000 JF-Expert Member

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    Yaani sasa Egypt wanaaidi kutuchimbia visima eti tusitumie maji ya victoria, tunahitaji maji ya bomba(piped water kutoka lake victoria) sio visima, hatuishi mwaka 47.

    Tanzania don't be fooled by this nonsense.

    Source:Ipp media

    Nations of the Nile Basin this week, amid reports that it has also offered to dig 230 water wells in Kenya and Tanzania to ease the pressure for need of river Nile waters.

    Talking to reporters in Kampala, Uganda, on at an African heads of State summit, the Egyptian Prime Minister Ahmed Nazif sounded a conciliatory note in the dispute over how Nile waters should be shared by the countries it passes through, Reuters has reported.

    "There are no strategic differences between us," Egyptian Prime Minister told reporters at the summit. "The issue is only on some technical points that need resolution. The purpose of the Nile Basin agreements is development."

    The words mark a softening of the Egyptian position since a meeting of water ministers from the nine countries last month in the Ethiopian capital, Addis Ababa, where Egypt had seemed to have taken a rather harsh stance.

    "Ask the Egyptians to leave their culture and go and live in the desert because you need to take this water and to add it to other countries? No," Egyptian Water Minister Mohamed Nasreddin Allam had told Reuters.

    After more than a decade of talks driven by anger over the perceived injustice of a previous Nile water treaty signed in 1929, Ethiopia, Uganda, Tanzania, Rwanda and Kenya signed a new deal in May without their northern neighbours.

    The five signatories have given the other Nile Basin countries -- Egypt, Sudan, Burundi and Democratic Republic of the Congo -- one year to join the pact but the countries have been torn by behind-the-scenes debate since the signing.

    The Nile, stretching more than 6,600 km from east and central African hiighlanda to the Mediterranean, is a vital water and energy source for the countries through which it flows.
    Egyptian state news agency, MENA, reported that Ugandan President Yoweri Museveni and Nazif agreed at the AU summit that a meeting of the nine states, to take place in Nairobi by November, should be attended by heads of state.

    Burundi and Democratic Republic of the Congo have not signed the deal yet and have so far been tight-lipped about whether they plan to or not.

    Under the original pact Egypt, which faces possible water shortages by 2017, is entitled to 55.5 billion cubic metres a year, the lion's share of the Nile's total flow of around 84 billion cubic metres. Some 85 per cent of the Nile's waters originate in Ethiopia.

    In a separate development, Egypt has pledged to dig a total of 210 water wells in Kenya and Tanzania, and to provide development assistance to the tune of USD200m, according to media reports. No time frame has been given for implementation of the projects aimed at reducing East Africa's dependence on the river Nile waters, nonetheless.

    A number of agreements are being prepared to strengthen cooperation with various countries of the Nile Basin, Allam has told the Holland publication Amsterday African Bulletin.
    The planned cooperative projects include the digging of 180 wells in Kenya, 30 wells in Tanzania and 200 million dollars aid to Uganda, the minister has said.

    The secretary general of the Egyptian Fund for Technical Cooperation with Africa, Fatma Galal, had earlier denied reports Egypt wanted to exclude from the fund experts from countries of the Nile Basin, in the wake of the new Nile basin agreement signature by five countries bordering the Nile about the fair use of the Nile waters.

    The Egyptian minister has said, however, that the support of Egypt to the Nile Basin countries is irreversible, despite the disagreement on the water use topic in which the upstream countries of Ethiopia, Rwanda, Tanzania, Uganda, Kenya signed the new agreement in May with Cairo and Sudan boycotting it.

    A 1929 colonial era treaty gives Egypt and Sudan the right to use approximately 90 per cent of the water resources of the Nile while Cairo also gets the right to veto any project affecting the river water flow. The new agreement seeks to annul this treaty.

    In the heat of this dispute, Egypt is seeking soft ways of finding a solution, which includes helping water source nations find alternative sources of water other than the river Nile.

    In the meantime, Nile Basin Initiative (NBI) countries agreed about four weeks ago to hold an extraordinary session in Nairobi, Kenya, for talks aimed at finding a solution to the disagreements sparked by the signing of the new agreement by five water source nations.

    Upstream countries strongly argue that Egypt and Sudan have kept an unfair water sharing advantage over other Nile source countries including Ethiopia which contributes over 80 per cent of the total waters to the Nile basin.

    Sudan has remained aloof and recently said it would cease cooperation with Nile Basin Initiative's countries until the bickering had stopped.

    The Chinese news agency Xinhua reported that the country had requested the other Nile basin states to freeze its membership until the current dispute over an agreement signed by the Nile source countries is resolved.

    "Sudan has affirmed that signing of the framework agreement by five countries is violating the basic principles upon which the Nile Basin Initiative was established," Kamal Ali Mohamed, Sudanese minister of irrigation, was quoted by Xinhua as saying from Addis Ababa

    "Sudan sees that continuation in activities of the Nile basin, after five countries have unilaterally signed a framework agreement, contradicts the basic law and principles for dealing with the Nile Basin countries where it is stipulated that decisions should be taken unanimously," he said.

    But Ethiopia, Uganda, Tanzania, Rwanda and Kenya have reiterated that they would not backtrack from the framework agreement which they signed on May 2010 on the Nile water sharing in the absence of Sudan and Egypt.

    NBI is a partnership of the Nile Basin Countries which includes Burundi, DRC, Egypt, Ethiopia, Kenya, Rwanda, Sudan, Tanzania, and Uganda. Eritrea enters as an observer nation. The partnership was established to achieve sustainable socio-economic development through equitable utilization of and the benefits from the common Nile Basin water resources.

    It provides a unique forum for these countries to move forward a cooperative process to realize tangible benefits in the Basin and build a solid foundation of trust and confidence.
    Speaking at the opening of the meeting in Addis Ababa on Sunday, Asfaw Dingamo, Ethiopian Minister of Water Resources, said NBI member countries should further strengthen efforts to maintain the long-term vision of the Initiative.

    "We need to demonstrate to the world now, as we have done before, that despite our disagreements we are capable of working together, maintaining the long-term vision. We have to demonstrate to the world that we are still focused on addressing our long-term concerns: eradicating poverty and hunger from our region, jointly and effectively responding to climate change, reversing environmental degradation, turning our region into a zone of peace, tranquility and economic growth and development," the minister said.

    "Let us give chance to reason, justice and fairness to provide us the foundation for building an enduring partnership and cooperation of riparians along the 7,000 km of our Great Nile," he added.
  2. RealDeal

    RealDeal JF-Expert Member

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    Absolute NO to Egypt's plan. If we agree to get any assistance, it will be tantamount to selling Lake Victoria to them and we will have no control of the water anymore. They can take back their assistance, we don't need it.
  3. Mpeni sifa Yesu

    Mpeni sifa Yesu JF-Expert Member

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    tusiende mbali hivyo. mimi ni mmoja wa watu ambao hawana urafiki na misri kwasababu tu ya haya maji ya victoria. lakini kwa hali halisi ilivyo, hatuna njia ingine ila kufanya nao diplomacy kwa njia hii, kama tunahitaji maji, basi wachimbe hata hivyo visima, na walete hela nyingi za kutunzia mazingira tz kama vile kupanda miti etc. tukienda ktk uadui na misri ambao ndio viongozi wakubwa sana wa umoja wa nchi za kiarabu, watu wanaoweza kufanya lolote tukanyimwa hata mafuta etc, tutakula jeuri yetu. kama tunataka bifu, tusubiri hadi tutakapokuwa na mafuta ya kwetu hapa tz ndo tuanzishe, la sivyo tunaweza kula jeuri yetu..unakumbuka gadafi alichotufanyia kipindi cha amin?....waje tu wachimbe visima, tz kuna maji mengi tu si ziwa victoria peke yake..tanganyika, nyasa, manyara, natron etc...
  4. Wacha1

    Wacha1 JF-Expert Member

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    Hakuna lolote mafuta tunaweza kununua Angola Nigeria etc. Hakuna mambo ya kuoneana aibu. Tena shida ya maji hata sisi tunayo, vijisenti vyao isiwe nyenzo. Si walikuwa wanataka kuleta jeuri? Tanzania iliwang'oa wakoloni na masultani itakuwa hawa wamisri wanaotaka tusitumia maji yetu.
  5. Who Cares?

    Who Cares? JF-Expert Member

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    u said so but ur very lovely good leaders wakionbgozwa na rais "omba-omba" wetu wanao ubavu wa kuwakatalia ma-pharao juu ya hilo??
  6. shiumiti

    shiumiti JF-Expert Member

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    Let us be proud of our own resources. The resources are for Tanazanian, let them enjoy........
  7. R

    Renegade JF-Expert Member

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    Within no Time Mafuta yatakuwa Uganda, hamna shida.
  8. Bantugbro

    Bantugbro JF-Expert Member

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    Badala ya kutuchimbia sisi visima Egypty wakachimbe mifereji kutoka Suez Canal wavute maji yao huko Mediteranian au Red sea
  9. M

    Mzee2000 JF-Expert Member

    Jul 30, 2010
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    Logic ya wapi hii,

    Uganda kuanzia mwaka kesho wataanza kuchimba mafuta, Ghana, Angola na nigeria hao wanayo kibao, halafu unaongea mafuta ya uarabuni?

    Halafu ujui kuwa maji ni muhimu kuliko mafuta?kama hujanywa maji unaweza kuendesha gari kweli?
  10. M

    MC JF-Expert Member

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    Japo ni Uhuru wa maoni, .. sikutegemea nitakuta comment kama hii. Wewe bila shaka hujui ukweli halisi wa hili swala, Hatuhitaji hivyo visima, hatuhitaji kura ya Veto iendelee kuwa kwa nchi moja huko mwishoni mwa mto Nile, hatuhitaji nchi nyingine ituamulie pale tunapotaka kufanya jambo letula kimaendeleo. Visima?? what a joke..!
  11. Nyati

    Nyati JF-Expert Member

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    shiumiti is online now
    Senior Member
    Be at your age. Why are you quoting the whole script??!!!! And there is no any comment of yours​

    Back to the point we are supposed to reject all this. At one point one of their Ministers was quoted saying that "They have many rivers and should leave Nile / Victoria to us". Mwalimu rejected this right from the beginning and we are not supposed to let him down. The agreement in 1929 is NULL and VOID since we were not involved. Hata kama tunakufa njaa, lazima tuwe maskini JEURI
  12. Nguruvi3

    Nguruvi3 Platinum Member

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    The question here is not ''visima''. The riparian states want to use water to avert humanitarian catastrophies which would have not happen in first place. It is inconceivable to see Ethiopia which contributes 80% of nile water, her people are dying of famine every year. They could use it for irrigation. As of now, Ethiopia is constructing Hydro dam bigger enough to supply power for domestic purpose and for export.
    Think about this! Shinyanga residents are living in semi desert like egypt. Yet we want to deprive them of water to appease the Egyptian!
    So, Kenya and Tz can construct 210 visima! we don't need help from Egypt. Again 200M $ is equivalent to Richmond cash, or EPA, do we real need 200M!!!
    The best way is to initiate irrigation project around maasai mara in Kenya, mwanza-dodoma irrigation schemes, develop the Owen falls for power domestically and for export in EA.
    By the way, for the last 80 years, Egypt never helped the riparian states, why now!
  13. K

    Kindimbajuu JF-Expert Member

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    kauli yako ndugu haina mvuto. ni vizuri ungechunguza kabla hujasema. mpaka sasa tanzania haichukui hata tone la mafuta kutoka Misri. ni kweli mafuta yanayoingia Tanania hutoka AG na huko Med Italy , lakini si Misri. mafuta yao yanawapa uwezo wa kiuchumi wao wenyewe ukilinganisha na Tanzania , lakini uchumi wetu hautegemei mafuta yao. Sioni kwanini tukubai maji ya visima wakati maji ya nile tunayo???? tusifikiri maji ni kunywa tu! tunatarajia kilimo cha kutegemea mvua kitaendelea siku zote Tanzania???? tunapo ingia kwenye hayo makubaliano lazima tuangalie mipango yetu ya maendeleo ya badae, kama tuna andika mikataba inayo kinzana na mipango yetu tunajimaliza wenyewe. tusikurupuke, tufikirie mustakabari wa taifa na si njaa zetu za leo.
  14. Anyisile Obheli

    Anyisile Obheli JF-Expert Member

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    hapa pana walakini, kama ni shida ya maji nao si wachimbe visima
    ili waachane na maji ya ziwa viktoria, wana ajenda nyingine ya
    kujifanya kuchimba visima sehemu za buzwagi, n.k?
  15. Chamoto

    Chamoto JF-Expert Member

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    Watu wenye mawazo kama wewe ndiyo hatuwataki
    Tanzania, namaanisha Waoga, Wavivu wakufikiri na
    wasio jiamini.

    Hata Yesu unayempa sifa hakutufundisha kuwa waoga
    au sijui ni Yesu gani unaye mwamini.

    Yaani unaogopa anachosema Gaddafi? Kuomba omba
    tuu na kujipendekeza ndiyo kunatufanya tuwe wanyonge.

    Damn! umeniboa.

    Sisi tunataka kutumia maji yetu ya Victoria na mengine
    yote yanayo tuzunguka. Tuta innovate and to make
    use of whatever we've got for the best of our people.

    Wakati wa uoga umeisha ni lazima tudindishie wote
    wanotishia maslahi yetu.
  16. B

    Bettina Member

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    Hivi kumbe hayo mafuta twapewa bre? sikujua
  17. Kimey

    Kimey JF-Expert Member

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    Sio kama nawatetea Egypt ila naangalia logic ya watu hapa kua wanataka maendeleo kwa kuanzisha irrigation scheme lakin egypt wanagoma! Mbona kwenye mito na maziwa ambayo hakuna hata wa kutuzuia sioni izo scheme? Kigoma pamoja na kua na ziwa bado hawana maji! Hapo utasema egypt imewakataza? Siasa zetu za kumtafuta nani mchawi ndo zinatumaliza!
  18. P

    Percival JF-Expert Member

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    Roho mbaya itatuletea laana na umasikini tu. Katika maziwa yote yalioyopo Tanzania ni Victoria tu tumeiona ? Maji kila siku hakuna Dar na Rufuji imeeja. Hapa hakuna shida ya maji ila ni upungifu wa akili tu.
  19. Mpeni sifa Yesu

    Mpeni sifa Yesu JF-Expert Member

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    nilichokuwa namaanisha, kwakweli misri hawana haki kutuambia sisi tusitumie au tutumie maji ya victoria...zaidi ya yote, maji ya victoria hayana athari saanaaa (white nile) kuliko yale ya blue nile ya ethiopia....pamoja na kwamba athari zipo...uganda walishatumia victoria, kenya na tz ndo hawatumii sana...ethiopia hivi ninavyooongea wanatengeneza bwawa kubwa sana la umeme ambalo misri wamesema wanalisubiria tu wamalize halafu walipige mabom (ethiopia wamesema wakilipiga mabom na wao watapiga mabom aswan na vingine)....

    misri ina watu million 80 (mara mbili ya watz)....maisha yao yote tangu awali wanategemea maji ya mto nile....na hawatakuja kukubali kabisa kuona maji hayo yanakaushwa kitu kitakachomaanisha kuwauwawao kabisa....hawawezi kuishi bila nile....hata kama tz tunataka au hatutaki, tunahitaji kulifikiria jambo hili la upande mwengine wa shilingi...wamisri nao ni wanadamu...na wanaishi kwenye dunia hii hii ambayo tumepewa na Mungu...uchumi wao wote ulishakuwa established kutegemea hayo maji tangu enzi hata kabla tz haikuwepo...hivyo ni bora tukawafikilia.

    simaanishi kwamba tuendelee na mkataba ule wa kikoloni, ule umeshavunjwa na tumeingia mpya..cha maana ni kutumia maji hayo kwa umakini ili wenzetu wasidhurike, na kwasababu sisi tunayo mengi sana hapa tz. pili misri walete miradi huku itakayosubsdise sisi kutotumia maji..

    misri hawana uwezo wa kutuletea sisi misaada, ni nchi masikini, mafuta yao nayo ni machache ambayo mengi yake wanayauza israel, wametengeneza bomba toka misri hadi israel. hivyo tz hainunui mafuta toka misri, ila misri ni nchi yenye influence kubwa kwa waarabu, halina ubishi, hivyo tunapotangaza vita hiyo tuwe tumejiandaa kupigana na waarabu wote, ndicho nilichokuwa namaanisha....

    Maji ya Rufiji yanayoingia baharini bure hayo tumeyafanyia nini, mengine yapo hapo Ruvu lakini kimara hawana maji...ziwa Tanganyika, ziwa Rukwa, ziwa eyas, natron, manyara, ziwa nyasa, mto wami, malagalasi, na mito mingi hii tumeifanyia nini..morogoro peke yake ina mito ya kuweza kumwagilia tukalisha tz nzima lakini hatutumii...MAJI TUTATUMIA, ILA HATUTATUMIA KIASI CHA KUWADHURI WANADAMU WENZETU KULE CAIRI, MKATABA WA KIKOLONI HATUTAUANGALIA, HAUTUHUSU. i hope mmenielewa kwa sasa. tuwe na ubinadamu kidogo jamani...
  20. Njowepo

    Njowepo JF-Expert Member

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    Tunakomaa na mambo yasiyo ya msingi kwetu.Misri apunguze jeuri na kibri tuu basi na ajue hayo maji twaweza yafuja na akaambulia patupu.
    Ila nasi sisi tuwe makini twagombania maji ya nile,je hayo yaliyopo kama mto rufiji,kilombero,pangani,songwe,kiwilia,mbaka,rufilyo,malagarasi tumeyafanyia nini?
    Suala la visima iyo ni dharau kuvikataa ni jambo la mbolea.
    December tuu Uganda wataanza zalisha mafuta yao nA Museveni hana hiyana na Tz