Je! Mungu ni yule yule?

[Kichwa Kichafu]

Huyo jamaa sijawai kukutana nae humu JF, ila kuna kijana fulani nimepata kukutana nae mara nyingi Dar city center asee yule jamaa ana hoja zenye nguvu sio mchezo,

Yani akianza kukupa hoja zake wether awe kwenye upande wa MUNGU yupo au upande wa MUNGU hayupo asee huchomokii....kile kichwa sijui ni cha wapi na aliwezaje kuijua biblia vile, mm mpaka nikahisi yule alikua na mapepo/majini

Kama ni huyo yupo humu kwa ID ya kiranga basi namsalimia tu

Mimi nikasema "Ya Kiranga Muachie Kiranga"

 

[hearly]

Nukuu ya Adolf Hitler..."It is easy to fight knowledge than to fight faith"
Na nnachoona hapa huyo jamaa ana knowledge ndo maana anatumia facts,lkn wanaomjibu wana Imani tu bila knowledge,hvyo wanakosa facts na kuishia kutukana tu.

Anyway...mambo ya kiroho ctakag kubishana..Nbak tu na Mungu wangu,kathibitika kwangu wala c kwa mwngne.

safi sana .."""

 

[hearly]

Me pale kwenye bustani ya Eden ndio huwa sipaelewi kabisa.Tunaambiwa Mungu ndio mueza wa yote na alitujua kabla hata hajatuumba (Yohana) na anatujua mpaka mwisho wetu (yesu msalabani alivyomjibu yule aliyekuwa msalabani) ila sasa tunaambiwa Adamu alikatazwa asile tunda la kati(si mungu asingeuweka huo mti kabisa kwenye bustani) na wakila watakufa.

Kwa kuwa tunaambiwa Mungu anatujua kabla hajatuumba na mwisho wetu pia anaujua hivyo ule mti aliuweka makusudi pale kati wakina Adamu wale(Alijua kama watakula kabla hata hajawaumba).

Walipokula wakaadhibiwa!

Life is not fair

shangaa wewe mkuu

 

[Vyamavingi]

Kiranga anasema mtumie hoja sio matusi. Hiyo biblia kiranga haiamini kwahiyo hata kilichoandikwa humo hakuamini

Sijamtukana Kiranga ila nimenukuu Biblia na nimeiweka hilo andiko, na hata Kiranga naye kuna mahali ameni-qoute na hajanilalamikia isipokuwa amedai Biblia yenyewe inajichanganya .

Vv

 

[Makanyaga]

Inawezekana wewe ndio umeshindwa kulielewa swali kwa utashi japo swali lineulizwa kiufasaha

Nimekwambia nguvu zaidi ya hilo jua, sijui hujaelewa nini

Halafu mtu kushindwa kuthibitisha jambo flani lipo haimaanishi halipo. Mfano miaka ya nyuma, kabla ya kuthibitisha, hakuna aliyethibitisha kwamba kuna sayari nyingine zinazolizunguka jua.

Jambo lingine, huwezi kuthibitisha uwepo wa roho kwa kutumia mbinu za kimwili (ambazo wewe ndio unaziamini kama mbinu pekee za kuthibitisha jambo). Mshana alitangulia kusema hapo awali.

Ni kweli. Emperical Science na Spritual Science haziwezi kutumia tools zilezle katika kutafuta solutions, kwa sababu hizi ni sayansi mbili tofauti mno, japo naweza kukiri kuwa baadhi ya solutions zinazopatikana kutokkana na sayansi hizi zinaweza zikafanana. Tatizo letu sisi wabongo tukisahasoma, tunataka kila kitu kitumie emperoicism approach, kitu ambacho siyo kweli.
Zaidi ni kuwa hata Emperical Sayansi haijawahi kulazimisha kwamba Sayansi zingine zote ambazo hazina base kwenye empericism, lazima zitumie emperical approach, hapana haijasema hivyo ila ni sisi tukisahasoma sayansi, basi tunalazimisha hata ziile zingine ambazo siyo emperical Science ziwe emperical Sayansi. Sasa sielewi kama huu ni usomi au ni fujo. Basi watengeneze Kamera ya kuchukua video ya roho ya mtu inapokuwa inatoka wakati wa kufa!

Ongeze na article hii hapa:
argument to ignorance (argumentum ad ignorantiam)
The argument to ignorance is a logical fallacy of irrelevance occurring when one claims that something is true only because it hasn't been proved false, or that something is false only because it has not been proved true. A claim's truth or falsity depends on supporting or refuting evidence to the claim, not the lack of support for a contrary or contradictory claim. (Contrary claims can't both be true but both can be false, unlike contradictory claims. "Jones was in Chicago at the time of the robbery" and "Jones was in Miami at the time of the robbery" are contrary claims--assuming there is no equivocation with 'Jones' or 'robbery'. "Jones was in Chicago at the time of the robbery" and "Jones was not in Chicago at the time of the robbery" are contradictory. A claim is proved true if its contradictory is proved false, and vice-versa.)

The fact that it cannot be proved that the universe is not designed by an intelligent creator does not prove that it is. Nor does the fact that it cannot be proved that the universe is designed by an intelligent creator prove that it isn't.

The argument to ignorance seems to be more seductive when it can prey on wishful thinking. People who want to believe in immortality, for example, may be more prone to think that the lack of proof to the contrary of their desired belief is somehow relevant to supporting it.

Using this fallacy is a tactic sometimes used to discredit people who can't disprove your claim. For example, when CBS News anchor Dan Rather was challenged about the authenticity of documents that indicated that George W. Bush had not fulfilled his National Guard duty as an honorable man, Rather was accused of using forged documents to discredit the president. Rather couldn't prove the documents weren't forgeries, but that doesn't prove that they were.* To argue this way is to make an argument to ignorance. Likewise, not being able to prove a document is a forgery doesn't mean it isn't, but given the sophisticated methods of document examiners these days it would go a long way toward establishing the probability that the document is genuine.

Your belief is not provided with any support by the fact that others can't prove to a high degree of probability that what you saw was a spacecraft from an alien world, or what you heard was the voice of your long-dead mother, or that only psychic ability can explain what you've witnessed. Lack of proof that your interpretation of perceptions is incorrect doesn't affect the probability that they're correct.

Source: argument to ignorance (argumentum ad ignorantiam) - The Skeptic's Dictionary - Skepdic.com

 

[dawa yenu]

Sijamtukana Kiranga ila nimenukuu Biblia na nimeiweka hilo andiko, na hata Kiranga naye kuna mahali ameni-qoute na hajanilalamikia isipokuwa amedai Biblia yenyewe inajichanganya .

Vv

Basi mkuu yaishe... ila kwenye ile hoja ya kiranga nimejifunza kuwa hatutakiwi kuogopa kuitwa wapumbavu bali tuuogope upumbavu wenyewe.

Mfano tukiambiwa kumkosoa rais ni upumbavu hivyo ukimkosoa wewe ni mpumbavu basi wasiopenda kuitwa wapumbavu daima hawatamkosoa rais hata pale anapokosea.

Upumbavu wenyewe ni kutokuhoji kwanini kutokumkosoa rais ni upumbavu?

 

[dem boy]

Lakini yeye alithibitisha vp ya kwamba Mungu hayupo???

 

[lukubuzo Samsis]

hahaa utaskia wewe amini tu yupo "" kwani huoni vitu kama peni ..magari .nyumba etc uwepo wa hvyo vitu unabainisha kuwa kuna aliyeviweka ambaye ni binaadamu "" kwa hiyo na uwepo wetu wa binaadamu hapa duniani kuna ambaye amehusika kutuweka......anatokea kiranga anajibu KWAHOJA YAKO HIYO INAMAANA UNADHIHIRISHA WAZI KUWA HUYO ALYEKUWEKA NAYE KUNA AMBAYE ALIMUWEKA .....!!!!
??

HAHAAA mwisho wa siku wanaomuamini MUNGU wanaishia kula chochoro ...kiranga acha kabisaaa yule mtu

huyu mseng.e amenifany nikasome degree nyingine ya philosophy n religion...inshallah mwakani.

 

[lukubuzo Samsis]

Wlimleftisha jamaa, sidhani kama anatumia JF tena

fundi yupo kwa id hyo na nyingine.

 

[hearly]

huyu mseng.e amenifany nikasome degree nyingine ya philosophy n religion...inshallah mwakani.

hahaaaaa ukishamaliza hayo masomo yako njoo utupatie nondo huku "" huwenda ukajitahidi kujibu hoja zake ...lakini sio rahisi

 

[hearly]

Basi mkuu yaishe... ila kwenye ile hoja ya kiranga nimejifunza kuwa hatutakiwi kuogopa kuitwa wapumbavu bali tuuogope upumbavu wenyewe.

Mfano tukiambiwa kumkosoa rais ni upumbavu hivyo ukimkosoa wewe ni mpumbavu basi wasiopenda kuitwa wapumbavu daima hawatamkosoa rais hata pale anapokosea.

Upumbavu wenyewe ni kutokuhoji kwanini kutokumkosoa rais ni upumbavu?

naaaam naaam exactly indeed"""

 

[Uswiss]

We are all in the same game, just different levels, dealing with the same hell, just different devils.

But bora huamini yupo huende humkose, kuliko kuamini hayupo halafu mwisho wa siku unaenda unamkuta.

 

[BUSARA ZANGU]

Hapa naona kuna wanaoamini kwamba kama huwezi ku prove uwepo wa jambo kwa kutumia milango 5 ya fahamu basi hilo jambo kwao halipo (MATERIALISTS)

Na kundi la pili ni wale wanaoamini iwe jambo unaweza kulithibisha kwa milango 5 ya fahamu au laa.... Kama lipo, basi lipo tu (IDEALISTS)

HUU UBISHI HAUJAWAHI KUPATA MSHINDI.

Kiranga anaonekana ana hoja kwa kuwa hoja zake zinathibitika kisayansi, zinaonekana hivyo ni rahisi kushawishi wengine.

Wale wenye hoja ambazo hazithibitiki kimwili/kisayansi ndio wanapata shida kushawishi, lakini hiyo haimaanishi kwamba wanachosema si kweli

 

[nkobhe255]

kila kitu kina chanzo chake bro,, we human being ,we exist sababu kuna jambo lilifanya sisi tuexist ,,creation ,,and who created us is the most high GOD

According to Physicist Stephen Hawking, Creation started from Big bang to black holes due to the laws of nature. So ilikuwa lazima itokee kama zilivyotokea sayari zote wakati wa GREAT EVENT.

 

[babalao 2]

Mungu ni Roho na Wamwaminio humwamini katika Roho.

 

[busy bees]

hata wenzio wakiishiwaga hoja huwa wanajibu kama wewe ..hivi hivi

Asante kiongozi na hongera pia kwa kuwa miongoni mwa GREAT THINKERS ...

 

[mathew2]

HAKUNA ANAYEWEZA KUMJIBU KIRANGA HOJA ZAKE ....WOTE WANAOJARIBU KUZIJIBU WAMEKUWA WANAISHIA KUONGEA BLAAA BLAA TU "''Jamaa ana maswali mazito mtu ambayo mtu mwenye upeo mdogo hawezi kung'amua kitu

Jambo ambalo ni tatizo hapo ni kuwa vitu vya imani havijibiki kwa mtazamo wa muuliza swali. Akihitaji ushahidi kama wa maabara wa kuona, kuonja, kusikia, kuhisi ...HAUPO. Biblia imesema katika Zaburi 10:4 kuwa "Mpumbavu husema moyoni hakuna Mungu..." Je ni haki kubishana na mtazamo wa Biblia kwa anayesema hakuna Mungu?

 

[lukubuzo Samsis]

Hapo katika logic umefanya kosa linaitwa non sequitur.

www.dictionary.com

non se·qui·tur

ˌnän ˈsekwədər/

noun

a conclusion or statement that does not logically follow from the previous argument or statement.




Umeunganisha premise na conclusion wakati hazina uhusiano.

Ni kama vile umesema.

1.Kila mwanamke ni mtu.

2.John Magufuli ni mtu.

3.Hivyo, John Magufuli ni mwanamke.

Tukikubali kwamba kila kitu kina mwanzo wake (nitarudi hapa kama ukiweka kwenda nami), hujathibitisha chanzo chetu ni Mungu. Umelazimisha bila kuonesha kimantiki umetokaje kwenye "kila kitu kina chanzo chake" ukafika kwenye "chanzo chetu ni Mungu".

Umeruka step na kufikia conclusion uliyoitoa hewani kama yuke aliyefikia conclusion ya "John Magufuli ni mwanamke".

Hujajibu suala la "the problem of evil".

Kama Mungu yupo, ana uwezo wote, ujuzi wote na uoendo wote, kwa nini kaumba ulimwengu ambao mabaya yanawezekana kutokea?

Je, alikuwa na uwezo wa kuumba ulimwengu ambao mabaya hayawezekani, lakini hakutaka tu?

Kama ni hivyo, je, ni kweli ana upendo wote?

Au, alitaka kuumba ulimwengu ambao mabaya hayawezekani kuwepo, lakini hakiweza tu?

Kama ni hivyo, je, ni kweli ana uwezo wote?

Mungu huyu yupo kweli au ni hadithi za mapokeo tu?

hapa bamkumbuka dr Mihonjo udsm akivunja kwenye'critical thinking and argumentation'.

 

[hearly]

Jambo ambalo ni tatizo hapo ni kuwa vitu vya imani havijibiki kwa mtazamo wa muuliza swali. Akihitaji ushahidi kama wa maabara wa kuona, kuonja, kusikia, kuhisi ...HAUPO. Biblia imesema katika Zaburi 10:4 kuwa "Mpumbavu husema moyoni hakuna Mungu..." Je ni haki kubishana na mtazamo wa Biblia kwa anayesema hakuna Mungu?

hzo hoja mbona Tayari tumeshazijibu !!?

kwa sbabu hiyo biblia yenyewe ina maandiko kibao yanayo jichanganya yenyewe ...kwa mfano biblia inasema kuwa Mungu anaupendo kwa watu wote na pia Mungu nimuweza wa yote ..sasa kama nimuweza wa yote alikuwa wapi kipindi ambacho watu wa kagera walipobomolewa nyumba zao na tetemeko kwanini asingewaepusha na mtihani ."" mbona watu wakimara wamebomolewa nyumba zao ilhali mchungaji rwakatare jumba lake ambalo lilipaswa kubomolewa bado lipo ufukweni mpaka leo "" huyo Mungu alishindwa nini kuzuia nyumba za watu zisibomolewe ..Mbona hana double standard alipaswa kuwashinikiza walio wabomolea wananchi wa Kimara nao wambo molee rwakatare ""
haya watu wanaokufa Sudan ..Syria.Congo. na Pakistan.Libya"huwaoni ?? huyu mungu muweza wa yote anashindwa nini kuzuia hiyo hali "" kama watu bado wanakufa kila leo huo uweza wake wa yote uko wapi .....
kwa mantiki hii nikisema biblia inatudanganya nitakuwa nakosea au..???

 

[Kiranga]

Basi mkuu yaishe... ila kwenye ile hoja ya kiranga nimejifunza kuwa hatutakiwi kuogopa kuitwa wapumbavu bali tuuogope upumbavu wenyewe.

Mfano tukiambiwa kumkosoa rais ni upumbavu hivyo ukimkosoa wewe ni mpumbavu basi wasiopenda kuitwa wapumbavu daima hawatamkosoa rais hata pale anapokosea.

Upumbavu wenyewe ni kutokuhoji kwanini kutokumkosoa rais ni upumbavu?

Shukurani kwa kuelewa.

Tena ukifikiria sana, utaona kwamba mfano wako wa rais una mantiki sana.

Kwa sababu dhana ya Mungu imeendana sana na dhana ya mamlaka ya serikali. Watu waliotawala walipotaka kuwalainisha waliotawaliwa wakubali kutawaliwa waliunganisha utawala na dini.

Ndiyo maana mpaka leo falme kama za Uingereza mfalme/ malkia ni mkuu wa kanisa.

Vatican Papa ni head of state.

Hata huku kwetu, hata watu ambao walikuwa kanisani hawakanyagi, kanisa lao Palm Beach Hotel na komunio yao ni Scotch Whisky, walipopata urais wakageuka wacha Mungu kila Jumapili wapo St. immaculata pale Upanga. Halafu walipomaliza urais wakaishia hatuwaoni tena.

Falme za kale za China, Misri, Ubabeli, Persia, Mesopotamia mpaka ufalme wa Ufaransa wa Ancien Regime, zote zilisema zina "mandate of heaven". Kwamba ni falme zilizowekwa na Mungu. Ukizipinga unampinga Mungu.

Watu wakaonewa lakini wakaogooa kupinga kwa sababu wanamuogooa Mungu. Ambaye hayupo. Kasemwa tu na wafalme ili wafalme wapate unafuu kutawala bila fujo.

Sasa katika muktadha kama huo, mfalme anaweza kusema kiandikwe kitabu kitakachosema asiyeamini Mungu ni mpumbavu. Halafu watu wakaogopa kuitwa wapumbavu.

Na katika uoga huo ndipo wanapogeuka wapumbavu kweli.

Wanaogopa kuitwa wapumbavu kuliko wanavyoogopa upumbavu wenyewe.