Egypt refuses to give up one drop of its right to Nile water

[Amoeba]

Wabongo bana, hivi kuna mito mingapi Tanzania mnashindwa kuitumia?, huo Nile mna mipango gani nao? au ndy kawaida yenu kupiga kelele tu. Wamisri Nile inawaweka hai, wacha watetee uhai wao, mnataka wafe? Siku itapofika tunahitaji maji ya Nile kiukweli hakuna wa kutuzuia, nasema HAKUNA WA KUTUZUIA!!!..na wakati huo raisi wa TANGANYIKA atakuwa Amoeba Jr! nakuhakikishieni itakuwa man to woman, wafe wao tufe sisi!

 

[Monsignor]

[Egypt says it is still hoping to negotiate, failing that it has threatened legal action]

hapa kazi ipo.......ulizeni airforce ya egypt halafu compare na ya TZ?? ulizeni marine force ya
Egypt halafu compare na TZ?? siku 2 tu zinatosha kwa mafarao kuipundua hii nchi

Macho ya uzeeni shida tupu. Kumbe Legal action na Military action ni kitu kile kile! Either way TZ itapoteza kwa sababu haina wazalendo tena. Kama wanasheria wenyewe ndio hao wanaosaini mikataba ya Kimangungo hata huko mahakama za kimataifa watashindwa tu. Kuwa na Air Force imara hakumaanishi ndio kushinda vita, vinginevyo Markani wasingekuwa bado wako Afghanistan mpaka leo hii.

 

[Ab-Titchaz]

This is a very interesting read about this subject....

The Nile River - An Overview of the History of and Politics of the River Nile

 

[N-handsome]

kikwete hawezi ongea chochote kwasababu ni ndugu zake, chagueni rais ambaye atakuwa na uchungu na nchi regardless of rafiki zake....kikwete ni rafiki wa al bashiri gaidi, rafiki wa gaidi gadafi, rafiki wa egypt...ajabu hii. unafikiri atasema kitu hapo, hapo tutegemee response toka uganda, kenya etc. na sisi kama watz tunahitaji maelezo juu ya hili. hapo ndo tutamkumbuka Lowasa.

Kabisaaa namkumbuka Morani kwa hilo and in reality Morani is not that dirty though is one of the millionaires lakini si kama Chenge na Karamagi :angry:

 

[Ab-Titchaz]

Wabongo bana, hivi kuna mito mingapi Tanzania mnashindwa kuitumia?, huo Nile mna mipango gani nao? au ndy kawaida yenu kupiga kelele tu. Wamisri Nile inawaweka hai, wacha watetee uhai wao, mnataka wafe? Siku itapofika tunahitaji maji ya Nile kiukweli hakuna wa kutuzuia, nasema HAKUNA WA KUTUZUIA!!!..na wakati huo raisi wa TANGANYIKA atakuwa Amoeba Jr! nakuhakikishieni itakuwa man to woman, wafe wao tufe sisi!

Amoeba,

Kwa yote unayosema, I believe you are really missing the point. Hii ishu ya maji ya mto Nile is way bigger
than what you think na ukifuatilia vizuri utaona kua wa-misri hawataki mtu atumie maji kutoka vyanzo vya mto Nile na sio mto Nile pekee yake. Kwa hivyo all rivers that flow into lake victoria are challenged by the Agreement of 1959 between Egypt and Sudan. In that treaty Egypt was given 87% usage of the Nile waters.

Jiulize the following:

• 1.Mbona mkataba usainiwe kati ya Misri na Sudan pekee yao without regard to the other East African Countries?
• 2. How did they arrive at 87% figure?
• 3. Who were the signatories of the 1959 agreement?

The 1959 Agreement in PDF format iko hapa.... http://works.bepress.com/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1000&context=joseph_kieyah

The bone of contention is the sovereignity of African nations being bullied by these Egyptians. We were not independent of our colonial masters when this agreement was signed na kwa hivyo it only logical to assume that it was done to cater for the interests of the Briitsh and the Egyptians a that time. It almost 50yrs after the fact and I wonder what should the riparian countries be bound by a treaty that they had no part in signing?

Unaposema hakuna mtu kutuzuia kutumia maji ya mto Nile, basi nadhani hujasoma historia ya 'The Nile Water Conflicts'
ambapo unakutana na ishu kama hii:

Tanzania pipeline

The matter has begun to come to a head. In March Tanzania began building a 170-km water pipeline to supply dry inland towns from Lake Victoria, a project that contravenes the 1929 treaty. In early April the Ugandan President, Yoweri Museveni, criticised Egypt's longstanding monopoly of the Nile waters, demanding that "this egocentric approach on the uses of Nile water must stop" and a new treaty be negotiated. In addition, Kenya has said that it will not accept any restrictions on its use of Nile water. In response, the Egyptian government has stressed its willingness to extend technical and financial aid to the Nile basin countries, but has so far refused to back down.

 

[Ab-Titchaz]

Meanwhile to all posters on this thread, hii ishu si kati ya wakenya na wabongo. That is a diversionary tactic by some people with personal motives. The issue here is between Egypt verses the upstream countries that supply water to Lake Victoria.

Lets debate this thing with the seriousness it deserves.

Thank you.

 

[Smatta]

Meanwhile to all posters on this thread, hii ishu si kati ya wakenya na wabongo. That is a diversionary tactic by some people with personal motives. The issue here is between Egypt verses the upstream countries that supply water to Lake Victoria.

Lets debate this thing with the seriousness it deserves.

Thank you.

Thanks AB, If they want to discuss about our supposedly lack of loyalty to the EAC, they should open another thread, yes, am talking to you Mwana Wa ''Mungu''.

 

[damn]

At some piont nashindwa kuelewa mantiki ya bongo kushabikia maji ya nile ili hali mto ruvu, wami and rufiji tunashidwa kuyatumia hata kwa 25%. It is ubsurd. River Nile supports life in Egypt, without Nile there is no life in Egypt. We have our own God given rights ya mito mingi sana ambayo hatuwezi na tumeshindwa kuyatumia kwa ujinga wetu and tunajifanya kuingilia issue za NIle. Ukiwa we can not use our rivers, ruvu, wami, rufiji are we going to use Nile?

Shame on this government?

 

[damn]

hivi mnaona namna kenya na burundi, walivyo wasaliti, ni kwanini hawajasaini? jamani wakenya kwanini hawajasain?

siyo wasaliti, ninyi watz ni wazushi, mto nile wapi na wapi? mnataka wamisri wafe. Mbona mito ya rufiji, ruvu, wami, ruvuma na mingine mingisana nchi hii, your own 100% God given rights hamitumii. Tumieni hiyo isipotosheleza ndiyo mkimbilie Nile.

 

[Mwana wa Mungu]

Thanks AB, If they want to discuss about our supposedly lack of loyalty to the EAC, they should open another thread, yes, am talking to you Mwana Wa ''Mungu''.

what kind of thread are you talking about?, I remember i was among the first to contribute on the thread started by ububungoubungo namely" kenya betrayed east frica", suddenly I think the admin moved it to combine with this one...so you have no point on your argument. Your country is betrayer, you are always the first to propose things and the first to be unfaithful..shame on you!

 

[Mwana wa Mungu]

siyo wasaliti, ninyi watz ni wazushi, mto nile wapi na wapi? mnataka wamisri wafe. Mbona mito ya rufiji, ruvu, wami, ruvuma na mingine mingisana nchi hii, your own 100% God given rights hamitumii. Tumieni hiyo isipotosheleza ndiyo mkimbilie Nile.

kwahiyo kwasababu tunayo mito rufiji na mingine, unataka misri wawe na province wanayomiliki ingine ndani ya tz? basi mwanza na mara si tz tena ni misri...unaweza kutoa maji toka rufiji hadi shinyaga, singida,dodoma wewe kwa hela ya tz? uwezo huo unao? na kama maji yako kwenye nchi yetu, si yetu?kwanini tusitumie? wewe ni mtz kweli wewe? nyie ndo wasaliti wa nchi, haujui unachoongea.

 

[Mwana wa Mungu]

At some piont nashindwa kuelewa mantiki ya bongo kushabikia maji ya nile ili hali mto ruvu, wami and rufiji tunashidwa kuyatumia hata kwa 25%. It is ubsurd. River Nile supports life in Egypt, without Nile there is no life in Egypt. We have our own God given rights ya mito mingi sana ambayo hatuwezi na tumeshindwa kuyatumia kwa ujinga wetu and tunajifanya kuingilia issue za NIle. Ukiwa we can not use our rivers, ruvu, wami, rufiji are we going to use Nile?

Shame on this government?

misri ni ndugu zako aisee, kama tunayo maji mengi tunaweza kuyatumia tupendavyo, na tunaweza kuanza na yoyote tupendayo. ukiwa na magari kumi nyumbani kwako, hauwezi kukubali jirani yako kuja kukwambia kuwa gari yako moja uliyojinunulia mwenyewe hautakiwi kuituumia kwasababu ni yake...yaani gari uliyonunua wewe anasema yake, wewe utamwachia gari kwasababu unazo zingine? akili gani hii mkuu, si utahakikisha unajitoa kwenye huo ukoloni? ili uwe huru utumie chako wakati wowote na vile upendavyo?...wewe una matatizo ya akili, unasema "if we cannot use our own rivers", kwani ziwa si "our own lake?", wewe bado uko kwenye ukoloni haujakombolewa bado. tunaingilia mambo ya nile, ndiyo, yanatuhusu, unafikiri hayatuhusu? maji tu tuliyotoa kwenda shinyanga misri walilalamika sana....

 

[Ab-Titchaz]

kwa hiyo kwa sababu tunayo mito rufiji na mingine, unataka misri wawe na province wanayomiliki ingine ndani ya tz? basi mwanza na mara si tz tena ni misri...unaweza kutoa maji toka rufiji hadi shinyaga, singida,dodoma wewe kwa hela ya tz? uwezo huo unao? na kama maji yako kwenye nchi yetu, si yetu?kwanini tusitumie? wewe ni mtz kweli wewe? nyie ndo wasaliti wa nchi, haujui unachoongea.

Yaani umeongea poa sana mkuu. Kamata tano ya nguvu.

Kitu watu humu hawaelewi ni kua Misri wanataka wawe na mandate on all rivers..ALL RIVERS...that supply Lake Victoria and the Nile with water. Whatever ever we do to these rivers, Egypt will make noise.

 

[Masikini_Jeuri]

hivi mnaona namna kenya na burundi, walivyo wasaliti, ni kwanini hawajasaini? jamani wakenya kwanini hawajasain?

Sijapata sababu lakini kutoka kwenye maandishi inasemekana Kenya wako mbioni kusign

 

[Ubungoubungo]

Sijapata sababu lakini kutoka kwenye maandishi inasemekana Kenya wako mbioni kusign

wanatakiwa kufanya hivyo..lasivyo sidhani kama tutawaelewa.

 

[Percival]

Yaani umeongea poa sana mkuu. Kamata tano ya nguvu.

Kitu watu humu hawaelewi ni kua Misri wanataka wawe na mandate on all rivers..ALL RIVERS...that supply Lake Victoria and the Nile with water. Whatever ever we do to these rivers, Egypt will make noise.

Misri walikua wanatuamia haya maji ya mto Nile miaka maelfu kabla hata mtu hajakaa sehemu za ziwa. Na wanao ushahidi wamejenga miji mikubwa ya zamani na kusimamisha ustaarabu and utamaduni mkubwa tangu kabla hata ya enzi za nabii Musa. Sasa leo watanzania tumejua kuoga tinataka kuwakatia maji wakati sisi tunayo maji mengi sehemu nyingi na wao in haya ya Nile pekee. Ndio maana kuna mikataba ya kimataifa kama mkataba uliokuwepo sasa tanzania wanasaini nini kiya ? . Baina ya Sudan na Misri kuna watu zaidi ya million 100 wanaotegemea haya maji. maji tulio nayo hatuyatumii tunataka kuwakatia wengine maji. Dar Es Salam kila siku tabu ya maji na mito imeejaa. Hii ni njama ya serikali kutaka kuwasahaulisha wananchi matatizo na uzembe wao hasa karibuni na uchaguzi - kaeni macho , mnayotaka kufanya ni magumu kwenu.

 

[Aza]

for that matter no one can stop us from using our lake nyanza for water supply wether in tanzania,kenya,uganda etc...coz that agreement was signed btn egypt n sudan ONLY right???
if they make noise let them be coz we wont stop using our waters in our OWN lands.
and let the Nile in their countries be used for themselves...if we need to seat down to discuss this of lets talk (but ofkoz if we do have brain leaders anyway!)
what the fuss???

thax mtoa mada kwa kunifumbua jicho kuhusu MKATABA HUU lol..!!!

 

[Ubungoubungo]

Misri walikua wanatuamia haya maji ya mto Nile miaka maelfu kabla hata mtu hajakaa sehemu za ziwa. Na wanao ushahidi wamejenga miji mikubwa ya zamani na kusimamisha ustaarabu and utamaduni mkubwa tangu kabla hata ya enzi za nabii Musa. Sasa leo watanzania tumejua kuoga tinataka kuwakatia maji wakati sisi tunayo maji mengi sehemu nyingi na wao in haya ya Nile pekee. Ndio maana kuna mikataba ya kimataifa kama mkataba uliokuwepo. Baina ya Sudan na Misri kuna watu zaidi ya million 100 wanaotegemea haya maji. maji tulio nayo hatuyatumii tunataka kuwakatia wengine maji. Dar Es Salam kila siku tabu ya maji na mito imeejaa. Hii ni njama ya serikali kutaka kuwasahaulisha wananchi matatizo na uzembe wao hasa karibuni na uchaguzi - kaeni macho , mnayotaka kufanya ni magumu kwenu.

hii ni akili ya madrassa, well, wateteeeni hao miungu yenu waarabu, tunajua watu wengi tz watawatetea waarabu si kwasababu wako halali, bali ni kwasababu ya dini, ndo maana hata mkwere hana cha kusema hapa..kimyaaaa, miungu hiyo.

basi itabidi tz tuondoke baadhi ya maeneo tuwaachie wamisri...mbona ziwa victoria linatunzwa na tz,uganda and kenya? mbona magugu maji yakianza kuota sisi ndo tunahangaika kuyatoa, mbona sisi ndo tunaopanda miti ili mvua iendelee kunyesha mito isikauke? anayetunza hayo maji ni nani? aliyekwambia kuwa misri walikuwa na haki ya kutumia hayo maji tangu enzi hizo ni nani? si wamekuja kupata haki juzi tu hapa wakati wa ukoloni?

na kusema ukweli, waingereza walifanya vile kwasababu ya interest si za wamisri, bali interest za waingereza...kwani miaka yote hiyo walikuwa wanasubiri waingereza waingie nao mkataba?, na je, mbona wao wametaifisha suez canal hata leo ukiaka kupta na meli yako pale itabidi upitie kwao kwanza?...why, kama wako fair na vitu...acheni kutetea mambo kwasababu ya dini, teteeni utanzania..OK

 

[Ab-Titchaz]

Misri walikua wanatuamia haya maji ya mto Nile miaka maelfu kabla hata mtu hajakaa sehemu za ziwa. Na wanao ushahidi wamejenga miji mikubwa ya zamani na kusimamisha ustaarabu and utamaduni mkubwa tangu kabla hata ya enzi za nabii Musa. Sasa leo watanzania tumejua kuoga tinataka kuwakatia maji wakati sisi tunayo maji mengi sehemu nyingi na wao in haya ya Nile pekee. Ndio maana kuna mikataba ya kimataifa kama mkataba uliokuwepo sasa tanzania wanasaini nini kiya ? . Baina ya Sudan na Misri kuna watu zaidi ya million 100 wanaotegemea haya maji. maji tulio nayo hatuyatumii tunataka kuwakatia wengine maji. Dar Es Salam kila siku tabu ya maji na mito imeejaa. Hii ni njama ya serikali kutaka kuwasahaulisha wananchi matatizo na uzembe wao hasa karibuni na uchaguzi - kaeni macho , mnayotaka kufanya ni magumu kwenu.

Wewe sasa unaanza kuleta hoja za dini mahali ambapo hata haziingiani kabisa.Nani aliyekuambia ni wamisri waliojenga hio miji?Are you talking about the present day Egyptians ama the ancient Egyptians? Kuna tofauti kubwa sana kati ya hawa watu.

Pili unamtazamo finyu unapojadili hii kitu in the light of Tanzania pekee yake. Hii ishu inajumuisha nchi karibu saba dhidi ya Misri...nchi inayoongozwa na serikali dhalimu ya Hosni Mubarak.

Tatu, unataka kuniambia watu Afrika Mashariki wasitumie maji ya mto Nile kwa sababu waarabu watakufa huko North Africa?...Are you really serious?

All countries that lay on the course of the River Nile and its tributaries have equal rights to use the waters just like the Egyptians have. Hawana misingi ya kutukataza kutumia maji ya Nile au vyanzo vyake...for whatever reasons.

 

[Ab-Titchaz]

hii ni akili ya madrassa, well, wateteeeni hao miungu yenu waarabu, tunajua watu wengi tz watawatetea waarabu si kwasababu wako halali, bali ni kwasababu ya dini, ndo maana hata mkwere hana cha kusema hapa..kimyaaaa, miungu hiyo.

basi itabidi tz tuondoke baadhi ya maeneo tuwaachie wamisri...mbona ziwa victoria linatunzwa na tz,uganda and kenya? mbona magugu maji yakianza kuota sisi ndo tunahangaika kuyatoa, mbona sisi ndo tunaopanda miti ili mvua iendelee kunyesha mito isikauke? anayetunza hayo maji ni nani? aliyekwambia kuwa misri walikuwa na haki ya kutumia hayo maji tangu enzi hizo ni nani? si wamekuja kupata haki juzi tu hapa wakati wa ukoloni?

na kusema ukweli, waingereza walifanya vile kwasababu ya interest si za wamisri, bali interest za waingereza...kwani miaka yote hiyo walikuwa wanasubiri waingereza waingie nao mkataba?, na je, mbona wao wametaifisha suez canal hata leo ukiaka kupta na meli yako pale itabidi upitie kwao kwanza?...why, kama wako fair na vitu...acheni kutetea mambo kwasababu ya dini, teteeni utanzania..OK

Tuko pamoja mkuu.

Kwa ufupi sisi nd'o tunaopika na wa-Misri nd'o walaji....Gaadeem!!!!

Hizi hisia za kidini samtaimu zinauzi kweli na kuziba watu fikra. Yani kwa vile ni waislamu ndio iweje
sasa? Tuwaache watuangamize?..Watu wengine bana.