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You must be kidding me! - 21.9Millions USD?

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Mzee Mwanakijiji, Feb 16, 2009.

  1. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #1
    Feb 16, 2009
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    DAR ES SALAAM (AFP) – Chinese President Hu Jintao signed cooperation agreements with Tanzania worth more than 20 million dollars Sunday, covering agriculture, communications and technical cooperation.

    The deals totaling 21.9 million dollars (17 million euros) were finalised after talks between Hu and his Tanzanian counterpart Jakaye Kikwete.

    "It has been a great visit," said Kikwete, hailing the friendly ties between the two countries.

    "China and Tanzania share a common position on many issues, particularly on global peace and development issues.

    "We all want an early conclusion of the Doha Round of the WTO talks, which we regard as beneficial to most developing countries," he added in a reference to the World Trade Organization talks towards a new global free trade pact.

    "At this period of global financial crisis Tanzania and many other developing countries look at China as a partner in solving our problems. It is our hope that China will be on our side."

    Hu said that China had been "impressed by Tanzania's role in the search for peace and conflict resolution in neighbouring countries and throughout Africa," particularly during Kikwete's time as chairman of the African Union.

    "China will continue working closely with Tanzania on many areas," he said.

    Hu arrived here late Saturday on the third stop of a whirlwind African tour that has taken him to Mali and Senegal and that finishes on the Indian Ocean island of Mauritius on Tuesday.

    His official welcoming ceremony included a parade, while he saluted in a statement 45 years of "exemplary" ties with Tanzania.

    Chief among the newly signed deals was a 17.5-million-dollar (13.6-million-euro) agricultural agreement. It was particularly important for Tanzania, where 80 percent of the population depends on farming.

    "The funds will largely be used to finance investments in agriculture, especially providing loans to importers of agricultural machinery," Tanzanian presidential spokesman Salva Rweyemanu said.

    China also inked a 4.4-million-dollar agreement to rehabilitate the state radio and television channels in the island of Zanzibar; and another to send Chinese volunteers to Tanzania to work in various fields including health.

    Hu later inaugurated a 56-million-dollar, 60,000-seat sports complex, financed mostly by the Chinese government.

    After their talks Kikwete also made it clear that Tanzania supported Beijing's one China policy and thanked Hu for China's continued economic support.

    Beijing's One China policy is its view that Taiwan is a breakaway territory awaiting reunification. China has waged a diplomatic offensive to persuade other countries to withdraw their ambassadors from Taipei.

    A Chinese embassy statement issued earlier quoted the president as praising the "sound and smooth way" the bilateral relationship had developed since ties were established in 1964.

    "It can be viewed as an exemplary relationship of sincerity, solidarity and cooperation between China and an African country and between two developing countries," Hu said.

    China is one of the top 10 investors in Tanzania, according to official figures. Trade between the two countries was worth 794 million dollars in 2007, 48.2 percent up on 2006.


    My Take:
    Thank you Mr. Jintao! Let me put this 21.9 in perspective:

    a. The money stolen from the Bank of Tanzania (EPA account) in one year totaled 133 Million USD. Your AID is six (6) times less than what we were able to afford to lose. Which renders it irrelevant!

    b. We bought a dual use radar from UK for about 40 Millions USD. Of that amount, 21Mil USD was diverted to Shaileth Vithlani (the dealer and broker) some of which ended in corrupt officials' pockets. Among them supposedly are Andrew Chenge (Former AG) and Dr. Idriss Rashid (former Bank Governor). This means, the amount of aid your country this morning could as well been easily given to Vithlani and his crook politician friends without causing any dent to our national economy or cause an outrage. Which still renders your aid irrelevant.

    c. Our leaders bought a Gulfstream 550 for about 50 million USD. So, we we could afford to buy such a plane at that price, we could have well afford to get some 22 Mil. USD somewhere!

    d. Of the money stolen from EPA account we were told that 70 Mil. USD was returned by the thieves and last week en directed towards agriculture. That amount is almost 3 times the money you gave us in aid at a fanfare with President Kikwete.

    e. We are currently planning to carryout a new ID project for about 200 million USD. That amount is 9 times your aid today. If we can budget the use of such an amount of money without thinking of the cost, we might as well just get some 22 million USD from somewhere!

    f. Last year when President Bush came to Tanzania he signed the biggest single foreign aid in the country worthy 978 Million USD. That is 44 times the amount you gave today.

    What I am trying to say in such a hurry is that; we really didn't need your 22 million USD. You could as well just come and open the new stadium, walk around and fly back home! Mchango wako wa aid ni tusi kwetu lakini pia ni ushahidi wa fikra za kuombaomba!

    My point is this, If we wanted we could as well built our own modern stadium - we have the money (remember it cost about 50 million USD). As a matter of fact we could have built a New Kirumba Stadium and and a new Jamhuri Stadium (We can pick either the one in Moro or the one in Tabora) as well as a modern Majimaji Stadium. And If we really felt like it we could have upgraded Mkwakwani as well as Amani Stadium (either one.. the Arusha one or the one in Zanzibar).

    In short.. thanks for your kindness but no thank you!
     
  2. Mwiba

    Mwiba JF-Expert Member

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    Msaada ni msaada haina haja ya kuupiga teke,msaada hupokewa hizo milioni unazozungumza ni hewa hazijulikani zimekusanywa kwa miaka mingapi wala zimetoka wapi hivyo zinaweza kuwa nyingi zaidi ya hivyo unavyofikiria.Na wala hesabu zake hazijulikani zinatumika wapi na nani anezitunza ,ila kwa msaada utaonekana wapi unapelekwa na ukishamalizika hesabu zake zitakuwa zinaonekana ,tusitoe jeuri kwa mahesabu yasiyokuwepo mkononi ,wizi uliotokea ndio sababu ya kusaidiwa. Maana hata jirani akiibiwa na kuachwa mweupe hutokea wasamaria wema wakamsaidia ,hivyo Mchina ametoa kwa uwezo wake.Hujui Kikwete amefarijika vipi maana kwa hali ya uchumi wa Dunia kutoa fedha hiyo basi inataka moyo ,kwa kwetu na tulivyo si kidogo.
     
  3. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Heheheheheeee....wewe Mwanakijiji ni adui wa maendeleo....
     
  4. K

    Kwame Nkrumah JF-Expert Member

    #4
    Feb 16, 2009
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    Right on M.M, kwa sababu tu tumepewa MSAADA, basi inabeba uzito sana, aibu sana. Milioni 21 ni ndogo sana for our president to say 'ziara hii ilikuwa na mafanikio sana". Inawezekana kabisa gharama za mgeni na ulinzi na ujumbe wake labda ni mamilioni tayari !! Mbona milioni 21 ni hela alizoiba mtu mmoja tu katika EPA?
     
  5. Kana-Ka-Nsungu

    Kana-Ka-Nsungu JF-Expert Member

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    Beggers can't be choosers!
     
  6. G

    Ghwakukajha Senior Member

    #6
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    Kha,tujifunze kuwa na shukrani waTanzania.Nadhani huu ni msaada tu(au ni mkopo?).Kama kiasi hiki kilichotolewa kitatumika vizuri/ipasavyo nadhani zitasaidia.Something is better than nothing!!!Hizo zilizoibiwa if possible we will recover some/all.Ila naona si sahihi pale tunaposaidiwa tukaanza kukebehi msaada huo.Unless if there are demands from him as a result of such an aid.
     
  7. B

    Bobby JF-Expert Member

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    Kuna mmoja amemwita mwanakiji adui wa maendeleo lakini me nadhani jina linalomfaa ni adui wa "dependence syndrome" Mwanakijiji nia yangu pengine si kukusupport katika hilo lakini nadhani nimekusoma unachomaanisha. Infact nashawishika kwamba hata hao wanaokupinga wasingekupinga endapo usingekuwa wewe uliyesema hivyo. Ni huo uanakijiji wako ndio umepelekea kupingwa na hao waliokupinga.

    China ni moja ya nchi zinazochuma mabilioni ya USd hapa kwetu mbali ya kwamba ni kwa kufanya kazi, lakini kiasi kikubwa ni kwa policies mbaya za uwekezaji zilizopo na mianya kibao ya kukwepa kodi. So kwangu mimi mbali ya kwamba msaada ni msaada me mwenzenu naona kama Jintao katutukana kabisa. To say a little sioni kama hata kulikuwa na ulazima wa kuja angetuma hata ujumbe tu ungetosha.Maana gharama za kumhandle raisi wawezakuta net ya huo msaada ni mil USD 17 tu. Huyu jamaa huko kwingine alikokwenda amesaini deal kubwa sana, mfano mmojawapo ni South Africa. Lakini pia huu uwe ujumbe wa raisi ambaye kwa maoni yangu anaamini katika mandeleo kupitia misaada kitu ambacho kimepitwa na wakati kwani hata hao wafadhili wetu tunapanga nao foleni IMF kuomba misaada.

    Mungu isaidie Tanzania.
     
  8. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Nadhani wewe utakuwa mgeni hapa.....maana hujaelewa "tone" niliyotumia na labda hujui mimi msimamo wangu nini kuhusu Afrika na Miafrika.
     
  9. Cynic

    Cynic JF-Expert Member

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    Fact Check - $698 million

    Ila nadhani tutakuwa hatuwatendei hawa Wachina. Tanzania is one of the largest African recipients of Chinese aid. Huko nyuma tulishawahi kupewa $500 million interest-free loan kwa ajili ya TAZARA (US walitutolea nje), tukasaidiwa kujenga UFI, URAFIKI, Mang'ula Machine Tools, tukaletewa madaktari bure, nk.
     
  10. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Kama walitusaidia hivyo kwa nini bado tuko masikini/ mafukara?

    Na kila siku tunapewa misaada....lakini hatuendelei. Why? Tatizo liko wapi? What is lacking? Na hii misaada tutaendelea kupewa hadi lini?
     
  11. The Invincible

    The Invincible JF-Expert Member

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    Kama unadhani kuna taifa linalotuheshimu sisi wababaishaji(watz), fikiria mara mbili.
     
  12. BAK

    BAK JF-Expert Member

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    Naam ni fikra potofu za kuombaomba huku "Viongozi" wetu wakitaka tuamini kwamba nchi yetu ni maskini sana na wkati huo huo wakisaini mikataba isiyo na maslahi na wachukuaji toka nchi za nje ambao wanachukua 97% ya mapato ya dhahabu yetu na kutuachia sisi 3%. Kweli hatukuhitaji kabisa hizo $22 million toka kwa Jintao maana watakachovuna China kutokana na huo urafiki wa uwongo na kweli kitakuwa mara 10 au hata zaidi ya huo msaada wao.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2009
  13. B

    Bobby JF-Expert Member

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    Nyani Ngabu, probably hujanielewa pia. Mimi nilikuelewa vizuri sana infact hiyo tone yako iko so clear haihitaji genius kuilewa. Nilichofanya nilikuwa najaribu kuundeleza na kuutanua zaidi mjadila. Ninaelewa msimamo wako kuhusu Africa na miafrika kwa ujumla. Actually comments zako mbili za mwisho zimenisaidia kuconfirm kile ninachokijuwa kuhusu wewe katika hii topic. So tuko pamaja katika hili. Thanks!
     
  14. M

    MzalendoHalisi JF-Expert Member

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    We cut our court according to our cloth!

    Nakubaliana na wengi kuwa we actually do not need misaada!

    Tukusanye kodi..hiyo 35% ya bajeti kwa ufadhili..tupunguze tu kununua mashangingi..safari za JK nje zisizo na tija, semina za ujinga..nk

    Narudia tena misaada na umatonya ndo umeifikisha Tz hapa tulipo!

    Yet think ni less than 30% ya kodi huwa inakusanywa na TRA!

    Do we really need aid???
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2009
  15. Kapinga

    Kapinga JF-Expert Member

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    Inaumiza akili mtu unapoanza kufikiria kwanini bado tunaombaomba...kikwete akianza kufagia bot, nic, tra, atcl, ttcl, dawasco, bandarini na mikataba ya madini anaweza kujikuta na 5billion USD mikononi mwake...nadhani sasa hela inayotumika kwenda nje kuomba misaada itumike ku audit haya mashirika yote na tuone tunapoteza sh ngapi kwa siku!! wabaya wetu ni sisi wenyewe!!
     
  16. g

    geek Member

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    nadhani nia ya Mwanakijiji ni njema kabisa, kuchochea debate au discussion ya mwenendo wa uongozi wa kitanzania.

    hakuna asiyependa bure, au kupewa.hata tajiri kuliko wote duniani akipewa msaada halali ataupokea japo hauhitaji - katika hali ya kibinadamu.

    haya maneno ya Mwanakijiji ameyakusudia kwa viongozi wetu, siyo rafiki zetu China.wao hawana makosa yoyote.
     
  17. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Miafrika Ndivyo Tulivyo
     
  18. D

    Dotori JF-Expert Member

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    Kama hizo USD 20 wangekuwa wanatupa bure ingekuwa sawa. Lakini kwa makubaliano haya Wachina watafaidika zaidi kuliko sisi Watanzania.
    Tulikuwa na nafasi ya ku-negotiate a better deal lakini tumelala na nafasi imepotea.
     
  19. A

    Alpha JF-Expert Member

    #19
    Feb 16, 2009
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    This country is doomed!

    Not only do we shamelessly beg for money, but we have the nerve to complain about how much we are given.

    The culture of begging and expecting something for nothing has gotten to the point where we feel we deserve a particular amount of money and if we don't get it we get angry. This is what we want to teach our kids? What happened to hard work and self reliance?

    Sad, Pathetic and embarrasing does not even begin to describe this nonsense.

    :(
     
  20. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

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    the point is kuna misaada ya kijinga ambayo mtu mwenye akili timamu hastahili kuipokea. Hivi mtu akija nyumbani kwako akupe msaada wa godoro la kulalia na mke wako/mume wako utapokea, ukizingatia kuwa una magodoro yaliyo bora zaidi kwenye hifadhi yako?

    Mpenda misaada ataseema "ndiyo nitapokea kwani msaada ni msaada"

    Mpenda kujitegemea atasema "tatizo langu siyo magorodo ni paa!" so "help me with the paa ambalo sina uwezo nalo lakini hili la godoro I got it covered".

    Sisi tunataka kutengenezewa paa, godoro, na kitanda.. tunachotaka ni kuwa tuwe na mahali pa kulala bila kulipa gharama ya kupapata mahali hapo!
     
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