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Western exploitation of Tanzania for gold, moral outcry

Discussion in 'Biashara, Uchumi na Ujasiriamali' started by Delta4, Jun 15, 2012.

  1. Delta4

    Delta4 Senior Member

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  2. H

    Hute JF-Expert Member

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    this is all about kenya vs tz. mtazunguka sana lakini hatutaki kushirikiana na ninyi moja kwa moja, tutakuja kwa machale kwasababu nyie nyangáu h amuaminiki....arid kenya is poorer than tz, lakini mkenya akija tz au akienda nje anasema tz masikini sana, yet you have famine every year....
     
  3. H

    Hute JF-Expert Member

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    huyu agnes Gitau mpumbavuu wa kikenya, umeona point yake ya mwisho ndo ameonyesha hatred yake yooote aliyokuwa nayo tangu alipoanza kuongelea tz, point yake yote anamalizia kwa kusema "That's why we need to have strong regional institutions Eastern African Community (EAC), all of those institutions needs, we need to be each other's brother's keeper - we need to watch our brother and ensure that we are benefiting. alivyooongea kuwa maeneo yanayozunguka migodi hakuna maji na mengine mengi, mbona sisi tunaishi huku tunaona kuna maji.....pamoja na kwamba ni kweli kuna vijiji vina umasikini, lakini amesema utafiikiri yeye kule kwao kenye kuna utajiri....wakenya wapungufu sana wa akili.
     
  4. BAK

    BAK JF-Expert Member

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  5. livefire

    livefire JF-Expert Member

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    now to be sane, what has Kenya to do with this post? Honestly, I have never seen such an amazing lot...good heavens!
     
  6. livefire

    livefire JF-Expert Member

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    are you always like this? Seriously no word in ma dictionary defines you. Cool down, youl rupture a vital vein.
     
  7. Delta4

    Delta4 Senior Member

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    This response typifies what indeed defines watanzania - a people without imaginative redemptive energy that seem perpetually held hostage in their collectivized past which precluded personal initiative and responsibility.

    You will not fix your leaking roof because your neighbour lives in a mud house!! A ''sisi'' na ''wao'' mentality that explained hope and fear. Nini mbaya na huyu jamaa - mbona unashindwa ku-debate hili jambo la Western exploitation of the rich Mining Sector in Tanzania bila injecting Kenya and Kenyans into it? There is no mention anyway that Western Conglomerates AND KENYA are raping tanzanian Migodi. Bana wee, waacha ku-show ujinga wako.

    Ati ''sisi hatumtaki nyie'', you Kenyans are gluttonous of our ''wealth'', you will steal our lands, you will marginalize our people - well, dammit, get off your backsides and do something about it. Farm your so-called lands that lie fallow in millions of acres and feed Africa and get rich. Get your kids to school and really educate them with more than just ujamaa BS. Open technical colleges and polytechnics and get your youth into gainful competitive employment. Invest in your youth.

    STOP your endless WHINNING , and more important, stop these useless and tired vijigambo vienu about imaginative utajiri wenu, bana!! The Eastern Africa world moves on fast and relentless as wtz sit on their hands grumbling about Kenyans-this-Kenyans-that, joo!!
     
  8. Kabaridi

    Kabaridi JF-Expert Member

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    Wakati unasema kenya is poorer than tanzania, from what basis are you speaking about. wakati mwingine unapoteza fahamu. Hii imebaki tu ni nyimbo Tuko na madini mara makaa ya mawe na hakuna mafanikio ya madini haya kuboresha maisha ya mtanzania wa kawaida. Hiyo ni gazetti ya wapi inakuambia kuna ukame kila mwaka. Sources zenu za habari ni gani?.
     
  9. H

    Hute JF-Expert Member

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    sijasema kenya is poorer than tz, ninachosema ni kwamba, wakenya mnasahau kwamba hata nyie ni masikini wa kutupwa kama walivyo wa tz, you have not gone any further in development, bado mna safari ndefu sana katika maendeleo kama tulivyo sisi watz tu. kitu cha kuchekesha ni pale unaposikia masikini anamcheka masikini mwenzie wakati wote ni masikini, kwa mtu mwenye akili.

    Still the biggest part of your population live under poverty line, the same it is to tz, sasa wewe masikini, utatuchekaje sisi masikini, masikini anamcheka masikini mwenzie....if these comments would have come from a western country, ningenyamaza kimya, kwasababu wao wamefanya maendeleo makubwa ambayo watz tunaweza kujifunza kwao, lakini kama comment hizi zinatoka kwa mkenya ambaye kila mwaka tunafunga mipaka ili mahindi ya ugali yasije kwenu kwasababu mnakufa kwa njaa, hapo ndio inakuwa kichekesho.

    Kuhusu kenya kushirikiana na tz, au labda unaposema tunazuia ardhi yetu...hauelewi kuwa kwa sasa tz imeuza ardhi kubwa mno kwa wawekezaji wa nje, hasa korea kusini, marekani, na nchi zingine za ulaya....ekari maelfu na maelfu kwaajili ya kilimo, but still kwa tabia zenu nyie wakenya hakuna mtu anayeweza kuwa na hamu hata ya kushirikiana na ninyi......
     
  10. Delta4

    Delta4 Senior Member

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    This is the most unintelligent comment I have read this year - that because we Africans are poor, we should glorify our common state of poverty, even despite the obvious fact that this state of poverty is actually relative and not uniform. That comments between poor Africans of this shameful state in inappropriate and ludicrous? What absolute rubbish!

    Doesn't the mere fact that Kenyans offer to exchange real MONEY to buy your Maize not indicate something to you at all? Just like the Kenyans import all other commodities from ANYWHERE ELSE IN THE WORLD - as a trade in Real Consideration? Ujinga hauna kipimo, kweli. Or do these proud Kenyan beg this maize from you as a donation, a gift or as food-aid?

    And why don't, the Rwandans, Burundi Ugandans for whom Kenya is a huge and valued market for their Farm-output make the same stupid comments that you do here? Eeeiish!!
     
  11. engmtolera

    engmtolera Verified User

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    Tanzania, the third largest gold producer in Africa is among the poorest nations due to decades of Western multinational exploitation and political corruption.


    Press TV in its program Africa Today has interviewed Agnes Gutau, CEO of London Africa Media Network, London about Tanzanian gold mining, multinational corporation exploitation, the poverty of the people and the impact of new players entering the region like Russia and China.

    Also interviewed on the program is Robert Oulds from the Bruges Group. What follows is an approximate transcript of the interview.

    Press TV: When you look at Tanzania, when you look at the amount they could be earning in gold and the amount that they're actually bringing in and the extent of which people are profiting from it, what do you see and what are you concerned about?

    Gitau: I'm very concerned about the ignorance of the Tanzanian and of the African people in general. The resource curse is just evident throughout Africa and also worried that how come in the 21st century we can continue letting multinationals take advantage of our resources. Haven't we learnt over the years?

    Tanzania, reporters say, is one of the poorest countries in the world yet they're the third largest producer of gold in Africa after Ghana and South Africa. Yesterday I was watching a documentary and I was shocked at the poverty levels.

    You know, around the areas where companies like Anglo-Gold Ashanti and Barrick produce, the people have no food, no access to clean water, access to sanitation. It is unbelievable and I think it's a moral outcry and if you ask me I would say it is a human rights abuse.

    It's unbelievable that this day and age even the consumers of these products can watch silently on the sidelines and let this continue to happen.

    Press TV: Robert (Oulds) seems to say directly we've got to look at the African government, we've got to look at corruption. You talked more about big companies and their corporate social responsibility saying it's a moral outcry.

    Isn't it fair to say that the African governments who are the custodians of this wealth below the ground want to point the finger at them - because in the end if they allow someone to come into the household and rob it and (the robbers) give them 10p or a couple of schillings... It's their fault they're letting down their people?

    Gitau:
    Corruption is two-ways so both the multi-nationals and the African governments obviously. But we must remember there is a lot of pressure on the African governments to sort of liberate the economies. The World Bank has called on African governments to come up with tax concessions to encourage foreign direct investment.


    What do we do? Obviously our government is worried that if they put up reforms, maybe these guys will go somewhere else.…

    Press TV: But if you've been reelected there in Tanzania and your pleased and you're strong and you see yourself as an emerging power in East Africa and across the continent, and you see what you have below the ground, thousands and thousands of tons of gold and you know people want it all over the world and the Europeans the Canadians the British as well are coming in… You are in the driving seat, surely?

    Gitau: I do agree with you, but transparency must come from everybody from the multi-national institutions, the World Bank, IMF and the companies.

    Look at Tanzania… only two companies are obviously taking the stake i.e. Ashanti-Gold and Barrick, the Canadian one.… and the government does not have a stake in these companies. So, obviously it's a call on the government to make sure that as they are the custodian over the natural resources and they are accountable to the people, but also, my call is to make sure that me as a consumer, when I go out there to buy a product I must find…

    Press TV: So you're saying that Africans or Europeans or whatever, when they're looking to buy gold they must look to see that it's been mined ethically and that there's a process… I mean, we have the Kimberley process for diamonds - there must be a process when it comes to the mining of gold, which will ensure that if you buy it, something is going back to the people who live on the land indigenously.

    Gitau: Yes. The consumer must be able to make that judgment and I think it's not untoward to call for that. But also Africans ourselves, we need to just wake up, we have to hold our governments accountable and how do we do it? In the ballot boxes.

    And now with the growth of technology, Africans are informed. Programs like these ones I guess they can log on and say Oh is this exactly what is happening? Mining is like 2.5 billion worth of gold revenues in Tanzania and only 28 million goes to the government - obviously there is a question mark…The public must ask where is this money going?

    How come the people living next to Gator Mines, they have no food to feed their country. You see those children at Oxfam this is the sight I was seeing next to Gator Mines.

    It's unbelievable. And I think the days have gone when Africa was a deaf continent - we have access to information and I think it's a challenge. We need to hold our governments accountable, but also the wider global community, before you go there and invest in gold you must really ensure that it's ethically mined and that there is no blood and human rights abuse associated with that.

    Press TV: We're talking about Western multinational companies and those organizations that like to invest, but are concerned let's say invest in Eurobonds … or in stock and shares on Wall Street or here in the City of London and they see a very poor return on their investment… they look to Africa.

    But Africans are being told, hmm, we need to watch out for these people, look at what they’ve done in their colonial past. Would they be better off then looking east to China or is China just as rapacious do you think?

    Gitau: Well, Africa is ripe for investment. It's the greatest destination for investment I must argue that.

    Press TV: Why do you say that?

    Gitau: We have much untapped wealth in various industries, the tourism sector, the infrastructure for example.

    Multinationals should not get scared. As long as the corporate social responsibility is open and clear and that the world also benefits - the local communities, so they shouldn't be scared.

    Press TV: What should as a minimum a mining company do? Imagine it goes to some part a very nice fertile part of Tanzania, the government is concerned of the flora and fauna there, but say Rio Tinto or any of the companies says there's so much we can do. Yes we will spoil the land for a number of years; however, we'll put so much back in.

    Should the minimum cost be a hospital, a school, roads, what should it be?

    Gitau: As much as they pay their taxes and these ridiculous concession are not there.

    We are not asking them to come in and feed us, no. Africans are ready to work. They must obviously utilize the local content - not just have Tanzanians working as the guards or the cleaners or the sweepers, but ensure training and development from the mining companies to achieve high level for Tanzanians to access employment.

    There is a UN report that says the mining companies have no impact on local employment at all. They bring expats from their country.

    Now, Russia, Brazil, there is competition for Africa. And what I think is we should align our priorities and our strategies to ensure that we get a better bargain and ensure that when everybody comes we ensure we get what is better for us, OK?

    We used to focus only the West, but now we have other players and whoever has the best bargain for Africa is the person we go with.

    But you know, it's a challenge for Africa. We can watch multinationals and also our fellow politicians taking so much of our resources - all we do is watch and clap after them and vote them year in and year out - it's unbelievable.

    Press TV: Closing thoughts - your final recommendations to President Kikwete of Tanzania, what would you say about this, about mining about gold?

    Gitau:
    Mining laws in Tanzania should be amended to ensure that the local communities benefit from the resources.


    The second thing, there should be no contracts issued and if there are the public must know with clarity what they involve and also the companies mining in Tanzania must make public declaration of how much they make and how much they pay back to the government.

    It's up to the people, the Tanzanian people to hold their government accountable. And I think we'll start to enjoy our god-given natural resources.

    Press TV: What if they say, well, across the border in Kenya, Uganda or any of these countries nearby, they're not being as strict, you know, they say hey come in, we want you - if they don’t want you in Tanzania we'll take you?

    Gitau: That's why we need to have strong regional institutions Eastern African Community (EAC), all of those institutions needs, we need to be each other’s brother's keeper - we need to watch our brother and ensure that we are benefiting.
     
  12. BAK

    BAK JF-Expert Member

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    Mkuu kwa maoni yangu huyu binti kasema kweli tupu sioni kama ilikuwa ni Tanzania VS Kenya.

    Yote aliyoyazungumza yangeweza kabisa kusemwa na Mtanzania bila hata kutoa neno moja na haya ndiyo tumekuwa tukiyapigia kelele hapa jamvini na kwingineko miaka nenda miaka rudi kwamba haya makampuni yaliyokaribishwa nchini kuvuna rasilimali zetu ni wezi maana wao wanafaidika kwa kuchukua 96% ya mapato yanayotokana na rasilimali za Tanzania na kutuachia 4% tena ambayo ilibidi wabembelezwe ili kuiongeza kutoka 3% to 4%.
     
  13. BAK

    BAK JF-Expert Member

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    Tanzania, the third largest gold producer in Africa is among the poorest nations due to decades of Western multinational exploitation and political corruption.


    Press TV in its program Africa Today has interviewed Agnes Gutau, CEO of London Africa Media Network, London about Tanzanian gold mining, multinational corporation exploitation, the poverty of the people and the impact of new players entering the region like Russia and China.

    Also interviewed on the program is Robert Oulds from the Bruges Group. What follows is an approximate transcript of the interview.

    Press TV: When you look at Tanzania, when you look at the amount they could be earning in gold and the amount that they're actually bringing in and the extent of which people are profiting from it, what do you see and what are you concerned about?

    Gitau: I'm very concerned about the ignorance of the Tanzanian and of the African people in general. The resource curse is just evident throughout Africa and also worried that how come in the 21st century we can continue letting multinationals take advantage of our resources. Haven't we learnt over the years?

    Tanzania, reporters say, is one of the poorest countries in the world yet they're the third largest producer of gold in Africa after Ghana and South Africa. Yesterday I was watching a documentary and I was shocked at the poverty levels.

    You know, around the areas where companies like Anglo-Gold Ashanti and Barrick produce, the people have no food, no access to clean water, access to sanitation. It is unbelievable and I think it's a moral outcry and if you ask me I would say it is a human rights abuse.

    It's unbelievable that this day and age even the consumers of these products can watch silently on the sidelines and let this continue to happen.

    Press TV: Robert (Oulds) seems to say directly we've got to look at the African government, we've got to look at corruption. You talked more about big companies and their corporate social responsibility saying it's a moral outcry.

    Isn't it fair to say that the African governments who are the custodians of this wealth below the ground want to point the finger at them - because in the end if they allow someone to come into the household and rob it and (the robbers) give them 10p or a couple of schillings... It's their fault they're letting down their people?

    Gitau:
    Corruption is two-ways so both the multi-nationals and the African governments obviously. But we must remember there is a lot of pressure on the African governments to sort of liberate the economies. The World Bank has called on African governments to come up with tax concessions to encourage foreign direct investment.


    What do we do? Obviously our government is worried that if they put up reforms, maybe these guys will go somewhere else.…

    Press TV: But if you've been reelected there in Tanzania and your pleased and you're strong and you see yourself as an emerging power in East Africa and across the continent, and you see what you have below the ground, thousands and thousands of tons of gold and you know people want it all over the world and the Europeans the Canadians the British as well are coming in… You are in the driving seat, surely?

    Gitau: I do agree with you, but transparency must come from everybody from the multi-national institutions, the World Bank, IMF and the companies.

    Look at Tanzania… only two companies are obviously taking the stake i.e. Ashanti-Gold and Barrick, the Canadian one.… and the government does not have a stake in these companies. So, obviously it's a call on the government to make sure that as they are the custodian over the natural resources and they are accountable to the people, but also, my call is to make sure that me as a consumer, when I go out there to buy a product I must find…

    Press TV: So you're saying that Africans or Europeans or whatever, when they're looking to buy gold they must look to see that it's been mined ethically and that there's a process… I mean, we have the Kimberley process for diamonds - there must be a process when it comes to the mining of gold, which will ensure that if you buy it, something is going back to the people who live on the land indigenously.

    Gitau: Yes. The consumer must be able to make that judgment and I think it's not untoward to call for that. But also Africans ourselves, we need to just wake up, we have to hold our governments accountable and how do we do it? In the ballot boxes.

    And now with the growth of technology, Africans are informed. Programs like these ones I guess they can log on and say Oh is this exactly what is happening? Mining is like 2.5 billion worth of gold revenues in Tanzania and only 28 million goes to the government - obviously there is a question mark…The public must ask where is this money going?

    How come the people living next to Gator Mines, they have no food to feed their country. You see those children at Oxfam this is the sight I was seeing next to Gator Mines.

    It's unbelievable. And I think the days have gone when Africa was a deaf continent - we have access to information and I think it's a challenge. We need to hold our governments accountable, but also the wider global community, before you go there and invest in gold you must really ensure that it's ethically mined and that there is no blood and human rights abuse associated with that.

    Press TV: We're talking about Western multinational companies and those organizations that like to invest, but are concerned let's say invest in Eurobonds … or in stock and shares on Wall Street or here in the City of London and they see a very poor return on their investment… they look to Africa.

    But Africans are being told, hmm, we need to watch out for these people, look at what they've done in their colonial past. Would they be better off then looking east to China or is China just as rapacious do you think?

    Gitau: Well, Africa is ripe for investment. It's the greatest destination for investment I must argue that.

    Press TV: Why do you say that?

    Gitau: We have much untapped wealth in various industries, the tourism sector, the infrastructure for example.

    Multinationals should not get scared. As long as the corporate social responsibility is open and clear and that the world also benefits - the local communities, so they shouldn't be scared.

    Press TV: What should as a minimum a mining company do? Imagine it goes to some part a very nice fertile part of Tanzania, the government is concerned of the flora and fauna there, but say Rio Tinto or any of the companies says there's so much we can do. Yes we will spoil the land for a number of years; however, we'll put so much back in.

    Should the minimum cost be a hospital, a school, roads, what should it be?

    Gitau: As much as they pay their taxes and these ridiculous concession are not there.

    We are not asking them to come in and feed us, no. Africans are ready to work. They must obviously utilize the local content - not just have Tanzanians working as the guards or the cleaners or the sweepers, but ensure training and development from the mining companies to achieve high level for Tanzanians to access employment.

    There is a UN report that says the mining companies have no impact on local employment at all. They bring expats from their country.

    Now, Russia, Brazil, there is competition for Africa. And what I think is we should align our priorities and our strategies to ensure that we get a better bargain and ensure that when everybody comes we ensure we get what is better for us, OK?

    We used to focus only the West, but now we have other players and whoever has the best bargain for Africa is the person we go with.

    But you know, it's a challenge for Africa. We can watch multinationals and also our fellow politicians taking so much of our resources - all we do is watch and clap after them and vote them year in and year out - it's unbelievable.

    Press TV: Closing thoughts - your final recommendations to President Kikwete of Tanzania, what would you say about this, about mining about gold?

    Gitau:
    Mining laws in Tanzania should be amended to ensure that the local communities benefit from the resources.


    The second thing, there should be no contracts issued and if there are the public must know with clarity what they involve and also the companies mining in Tanzania must make public declaration of how much they make and how much they pay back to the government.

    It's up to the people, the Tanzanian people to hold their government accountable. And I think we'll start to enjoy our god-given natural resources.

    Press TV: What if they say, well, across the border in Kenya, Uganda or any of these countries nearby, they're not being as strict, you know, they say hey come in, we want you - if they don't want you in Tanzania we'll take you?

    Gitau: That's why we need to have strong regional institutions Eastern African Community (EAC), all of those institutions needs, we need to be each other's brother's keeper - we need to watch our brother and ensure that we are benefiting.
     
  14. Delta4

    Delta4 Senior Member

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    It all about the quality of political leadership and the involvement of the people in their leadership. While there is some level of abuse by foreign companies in Kenya, in Tanzania it is endemic almost as if Tanzanians ''are not home''. Even on just the single question of employment in Multi-Nationals, the open and shameful discrimination you find expressed in Tanzania by Racist South Africans is impossible to witness in Kenya.

    Tanzanians seem to preoccupied in demonizing Kenyans and gloating of the heady Ujamaa History to pay attention to the international rapists they open they doors to - as I Kenyan, it always amazes me to be treated more of a foreigner in Tanzania than the Boers in Tanzania!!
     
  15. engmtolera

    engmtolera Verified User

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  16. B

    BINARY NO JF-Expert Member

    #16
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    That is facts am Tanzanian and am from where these mines are exploited much....try to visit kishapu mwadui shinyanga come across Mara nyamongo tembelea Geita yani utaria na kinachoendelea uko...

    I've been in Mwadui pale kuna DIAMOND kibao lakini angalia kishapu ikoje ata maji hakuna na kuna uwanja wa ndege yani wanajibebea watakavyo tembelea migodi mingine same story...

    Mie nadhani apa atujadiri ukenya wala uTanzania ata km ni Mkenya ndo ameposti au ndo alikua anahojiwa na PRESSTV mie nadhani tumshukuru mungu kwani hiki chombo kinajaribu kufichua wizi unaofanywa na wazungu na huwezi ona BBC,SKY NEWS,CCN, FOX kwani sera zao ni kutuibia so we must b thankfull kuliko kupondana.

    Leo deni la Taifa ni 22TRL in 2012 from 6 trl in 2006..so madini yetu yanatunufaisha nini? ata km angekua Mtanzania ndo amepata fursa hiyo angeongea kitu kilekile...so tusiwe wanafiki wakati nchi yetu inabakia mashimo tu na utajiri wote unapotea
     
  17. k

    kwamwewe JF-Expert Member

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    wale wanaoimba wimbo wa kanisa waarabu watarudi waje wachukue mali ,wako wapi ???

    Hivi hawaoni kuwa hawa ndio waaalabu wenyewe haswaaaaa
     
  18. B

    Bukyanagandi JF-Expert Member

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    Mkuu nimejaribu kumsoma vizuri Mama Agnes Gitau, for the first TIME nakubaliana na Mkenya kwa 85%, anayoyasema humu niya kweli ingawa mengine kaongeza chumvi kidogo. Kwa kweli Watanzania hatuwezi kusimama kifua mbele tukajifanya tumefaidika/nufaika na madini yetu, mikataba ambayo Serikali inaingia na wanyonyaji hawa ni aibu tupu - wewe mtu na akili yako timamu unawezaje kumwambia mgeni/munyonyaji eti awe analipa sijuhi kodi ya asili mia 3% repeate 3%; si hilo tu tulikuwa wakati mwingine tunawapa tax holiday ya miaka mitano.

    Siku moja nilishikwa na asira nikamwendea Geologist nikamuhuliza: hivi mantiki ya kusema hawa jamaa walipe kodi ya 3% inatokana na sababu gani hasa - maana haingii akilini kabisa! Unajua alicho nieleza: Kasema kodi hiyo wamei-peg kwenye kodi zinazo tozwa kwenye kokoto zinazotoka kwenye Quarry!!!!! Majibu ya uwenda wazimu kabisa - hivi thamani ya GOLD unaweza kuilinganisha na mawe ya kokoto kweli? Viongozi walio someshwa bure na TAIFA hili, wakapewa dhamana ya kusimamia sekta hii muhimu ya madini wanajisahau na ku-sign mikataba fake wakishirikiana na wanasheria uchwala kwa kulifanya TAIFA letu lipoteze fedha chungu mzima as if hawa kuwahi kwenda shule; sasa kama sisi Watanzania mambo kama haya yanatukasirisha, je mtu mgeni kama MKENYA akisikia vitu kama hivyo atapata picha gani kuhusu baadhi ya mambo yetu yanayo tia simanzi, watatuona tumelala usigizi wa pono katika suala la madini na wala mtu hawezi kuwalahumu WAKENYA katika hilol!

    Kama nakumbuka vizuri, wakati wa enzi za Nyerere kuna wanafunzi wengi walikwenda nje kusomea Geology na Mining Engineering, je hao watu waliyeyukia wapi? Kwa nini TAIFA lilishindwa kuwatumia wataalamu hawa kikamilifu, kila mtu anajua madini hayaozi tungeweza kusubiri kwa muda huku tukisomesha wataalamu zaidi na kuwapeleka nje for handon experience alafu tukachukua mikopo tukanunua mashine za kuchimba madini na viwanda vya kuya yeyusha hapa hapa TANZANIA tukauza nje finished products! Tanzania wataalamu wapo tatizo wanawekewa kibano kwa kutukuza wageni matokeo yake ndio hayo yanayo tuingiza kwenye mikenge ya ajabu.Tusipo badilika kwenye masuala haya ya madini wanyonyaji hawa watatuachia MASHIMO - tuta kuja kunalaaniwa na vizazi vijavyo.

    Nataka niongezee hapa kwamba nazungumzia mambo ya madini tu hapa, lakini masuala mengine sitakaa chini nikakubaliana na Wakenya mpaka mtakapo badirika TABIA na kuheshimu majirani zenu, alafu nataka kuwakumbusha kitu kwamba: Uchina ni nchi ya Kikominist/Kijamaa lakini Wamerikani walikwenda kuomba msaada wa kifedha walipo kwama, siku hizi uwezi kusikia Merikani au Uingereza inaponda Ukominist au Ujamaa wako kimya kabisa, sasa na nyinyi it is a question of time; tukijiweka sawa kwa kulekebisha mambo fulani fulani baada ya hapo tutawapa a surprise of a CENTUARY, mwisho niongezee kwamba mtu ukiwa una njaa na fedha lakini huna chakula huwezi kupika fedha ukala - remember "money is not everything" Watanzania tunajari UTU zaidi.
     
  19. H

    Hute JF-Expert Member

    #19
    Jun 16, 2012
    Joined: Nov 25, 2010
    Messages: 3,516
    Likes Received: 412
    Trophy Points: 180
    you believe this is rubbish, because you have reached the maximum level of your reasoning, you cannot think beyond that, and you think you are at least cleaver.how many times you have seen tz discussing about kenyan poverty in other countries, what i was saying is that, though tz is poor, kenya is not on the safer side, the poverty level between tz and kenya is just the same, whether you agree to it or not, you are still so poor and should discuss how to eradicate your poverty first before stepping to discuss about tz's. you have no qualification to wash someones buttocks while yours is full of kenyan shit.
     
  20. introvert

    introvert JF-Expert Member

    #20
    Jun 16, 2012
    Joined: Sep 21, 2010
    Messages: 764
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    Trophy Points: 80
    Ignorance, nothing else.

    We have all these resources but lack the education of how to explore and trade with it to our advantage. We sign dubious contracts, heck, a good number of our MPs do not even know the rough price of an ounce of gold, barrel of oil, carat of diamond, tanzanite and these are our policy makers. We do not know the value of what we have, the worth of our resources and those who know - a few politicians and a few concerned citizens, are either being bribed. quiet or punished for speaking up.

    Knowledge is everything and we neglect it. Look around, our education system is messed up and we will import expatriates and pay them hefty salaries unless we invest in our education and stop fooling around. The sooner we look into the mirror, the better.

    At the same time, we are quick to throw blame on bad leadership. I believe bad leadership is a result of a corrupt society. You cannot have a sensible clean society voting in bad leaders and if that ever happened, they wouldn't take **** like we do. Here you have a number of Kenyans who would vote for their tribes, not principles. And you have us Tanzanians, voting on the basis of what's written in the tabloids, not principles. The end product speaks for itself, nations of jokers.

    I do not see this as a Kenyans vs Tanzanians thingy, this is more of a wake-up call, either we smarten up or have it on our behinds. And i bet a good number of us here can afford a cup of coffee whereas on both sides of the border, shit messed up.
     
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