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WaSouth Africa wafunge virago-Mbiu

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Mwiba, May 24, 2008.

  1. Mwiba

    Mwiba JF-Expert Member

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    May 24, 2008
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    Wabongo mliopo Nyumbani umoja ni nguvu utengano ni udhaifu ili kuungana na wenzetu wanaotimuliwa huko South Afrika na hatusikii serikali ya huko ikisema lolote zaidi ya kuwakusanya na kuwaweka kwenye makambi kama wakimbizi ni wazi kabisa kuna mkono wa serikali yao katika vumbi hili ambalo wageni wanadhulumiwa kwa kupokonywa kila kitu na kuachwa weupe hawana hata kijisent cha kuwarudisha makwao kwa salama.

    Kama haitoshi wanawaua kama umbwa wenye vichaa huu ni unyama ambao itabidi ujibiwe kama walivyojibu Kenya baada ya Polisi kuwaua watu wanawahisi ni majambazi kule Moshi. Serikali ya Tabo Mbeki haijafanya lolote la maana angalau wageni hao kuwa na moyo pengine mambu yatatulia wala hatujasikia kukamatwa wahusika, yaani hata sisi WaTanzania tuliowapa ardhi zetu wakichimba madini, hawa wamevuka mipaka ni lazima wajibiwe tu ili na wao waipate pate, dawa ya moto ni moto. Tutagomaana wenyewe kwa wenyewe na mafisadi wetu lakini linapokuja suala la kitaifa ni lazima tuungane ili kuonyesha kutoridhika na mambo haya.

    Tanzania kuna vitega uchumi vingi tu vya Wasouth Afrika kuanzia kwenye mahoteli kwenye maduka, Fast Foods cafee na vingine tele, hivi ni lazima vifungwe aidha serikali ichukue hatua ya kuvifunga na waende wakafanye biashara huko kwao, mahoteli wayafunge waende kuanzisha mahoteli huko kwao kwanai kuna kombe la dunia linakuja watapata biashara nzuri tu.

    Machimbo yote yanayomilikiwa na waSousi yafungwe mara moja hakuna cha kulipwa wala kudai waondoke haraka. Tunao wachimbaji wetu wadogo wadogo wataingia machimboni hivyo hivyo na elimu zao za jadi za vichwa vya mazeru zeru watachimbua na kunufaika.

    Hii ni mbiu ya mgambo kwa Serikali na wananchi kwa ujumla, jeshi la ulinzi JWTZ tayarisheni vijana kuvamia mahoteli na machimbo na kuwafukuza na wao wajue wapi kwa kukimbilia, ila mtakaowatayarisha wavalie kiraia tu na mamgongo, mitambo, sime, wanaweza kuchukua magobole ili kuwakabili walinzi.

    Hakuna cha kusubiri hii ni ile mesali ya kizungu Tit For tat. Lazima na wao tuwaonyeshe kama wanavyotuonyesha, Muungwana peleka ndege ya Raisi ikawachukue Raia zako wenye hasira na wakifika hapa waungane na wengine katika kuwafurusha Wasouth, waTanzania tunaosifika kwa amai wameenda kutitumua, wamesahau kama damu za ndugu zetu zilikuwa mstari wa mbele kukabiliana na makaburu kwenye front line, wamesahau kama Mwalimu Nyerere alikaribia kupata kifua kikuu kwa kupigia makelele uzalimu waliokuwa wakitendewa, Wazulu hawa inaonyesha badu wapo katika wakati wa mawe hawajui kama bila ya raia wa nchi nyingine wenyewe hamuwezikujiendesha, kama hawatakuwa wafanya biashara ndani ya nchi yenu basi hata ununuzi utahitajia wateja kutoka nje.

    Washenzi hawa ni lazima kama kufa wahame hapa Tanzania, mwanzoni nilifikiri ni wazungu kumbe ni watu wa jamii ya wazulu, hawa hawana adabu hata za kuvaa nguo, waache na ule ule utamaduni wao. Ila hawa waliopo hapa kama ni wazungu au wazulu wote watiwe chungu kimoja warudi, imetosha walichokivuna sasa kinawaletea usumbufu, yaani wanatuua kwenye machimbo yao na mali ni yetu kama haitoshi hata huko makwao tunauliwa na serikali yao haina msaada wowote. Ni lazima na wao wakione.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 24, 2008
  2. C

    Choveki JF-Expert Member

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    May 24, 2008
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    Hata miye naungana nawe kwa hilo hawa jamaa hazimo kabisa.....
     
  3. Gamba la Nyoka

    Gamba la Nyoka JF-Expert Member

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    duh!. itabidi sasa niisome vizuri historia ya south Africa. itabidi nisome pande zote mbili
    kutoka upande wa Kaburu, na kutoka upande wa weusi. inawezekana Kaburu aliamua kutawala kwa mkono wa chuma kwa sababu ya mambo kama haya wanayoyafanya baadhi ya wasauzi Afrika weusi kwa waafrika wenzao.
    simtetei Kaburu kwa unyama wa wazi alioufanya,unyama ni unyama haujalishi unafanywa na mtu wa rangi gani , lakini kwa jinsi walivyokuwa minority na kwa hii tabia walioionyesha waafrika ya kusini weusi, ninahofia kwamba wazungu wangekuwa legelege wangechinjwa wakamalizika.
     
  4. Kaa la Moto

    Kaa la Moto JF-Expert Member

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    May 24, 2008
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    Mwiba
    Na mimi nakuunga mkono. Sikujua kama hawa weusi wa SA wangekuwa na roho kama ya wale wazungu waliokuwa wanawafanyia ubaguzi. Kumbe ubaguzi ni ubaguzi tu, uwe kati ya Kaburu na mweusi au muunguja na mpemba ni ubaguzi tu. Nyerere alizema ubaguzi ni ushenzi na unyama. Na mimi nasema ubaguzi ni kiwango kikubwa cha ushenzi.
    Hata hivyo kwenye masuala ya diplomasia nchi moja ikifukuza wanadiplomasia wako na nchi hiyo ufukuza wa nchi ile. Sasa na sisi tunaamuru hatuitaji msouth afrika hapa. Wapende wasipende wakwende. Hawataki wasubiri na sisi tutawafanzia. Hawawezi kuwaua ndugu zetu na kuwajeruhi na sisi tukanyamaza na kuangalia tu kama serikali yao ilivyofanya. Wala hatutajali wanapewa ulinzi kiasi gani na mafisadi. Lazima tutawashughulikia. Tunawashauri kabla hatujawafikia wawe wameondoka.
     
  5. Kaa la Moto

    Kaa la Moto JF-Expert Member

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    May 24, 2008
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    Nikikumbuka shida nying za nchi hii na resouces nyingi zilivyotumika katika kuwasaidia na leo malipo ndiyo haya, nashindwa kuwavumilia. Miaka ile hata pesa ya kodi yetu ilitumika kuwasaidia katika mapambano ili kuwaweka huru. Walikuwa hata katika bajeti ya nchi hii wakati sisi tunatembea uchi na kuvaa tairi za gari na kuogea tope kwa kukosa hata sabuni. Leo tunalipwa fadhila kwa kuuwawa sisi. Waondoke mabaradhuli hawa.
     
  6. Gamba la Nyoka

    Gamba la Nyoka JF-Expert Member

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    Mimi ninadhani Mbeki amezubaa sana.

    Hii ishu ilikuwa ni kuidhibiti kwa nguvu za kutosha toka hapo mwanzoni. nimecheki CNN maaskari wameweka crime scene, na chini kuna mtu amelala chali amebondwa mawe(style ya mwizi) wala hata hawahangaiki kumpeleka hospitali au hata kumpa first aid.
    Commentor wa CNN akadai na mapolisi wanawasapoti waafrika kusini wenzao kichinichini.
     
  7. H

    HuXiang Member

    #7
    May 24, 2008
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    Jamani muda sasa umefika tuoneshe uzalendo,Baada ya mwenge wa Olimpic kupata shuruba kuwa Ufaransa na UK wachina walirespond kwa kuandamana nchi nzima na kuwekea mgomo miradi yote ya Ufaransa na Uingereza,nakumbuka ilikuwa ukiingia Carrefour wachina wanakutwanga ingawa polisi walikuwa wanawatimua,hii ni nchi ambayo haina hiyo democrasi,sasa sisi tunasubiri nini?? Tuanze na kuandamana na kuwafukuza wao toka kwetu.Nina imani watapata funzo kwani hawa tumewasaidia mno so kama wanaleta u**** hakuna haja ya kuwaonea huruma. Andamaneni wakuu na sisi tunazidi kutawanya sumu kwenye mablog yote ya kimataifa.
    Action wakuu sio tunalonga longa tu kama kelele za chura kwa tembo.
     
  8. W

    Wandugu Masanja JF-Expert Member

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    May 24, 2008
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    Kwa maoni yangu hakuna kusubiri sirikali isipokuwa tu wapewe notisi ya kuhama sisi wadanganyika bado wastaarabu, wapewe notisi wahame kwani kwao kuna machimbo ya almasi sasa ya kwetu wanaitakia nini? kwao kuna wanyamapori wetu watuachie, wao wana utalii wa daraja la mwanzo wetu wa chini watupe wenyewe, kipindi fulani wakati Msumbiji inapata uhuru wake sisi watafutaji tulifika pale na wapo RENAMO askari walikuwa wakitulinda kwa vile tu ni WaTanzania,
    kwahiyo South Africa better go back home,
     
  9. Dua

    Dua JF-Expert Member

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    May 24, 2008
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    Mada ya longo longo la wageni hadi lini? Ndio maudhui yake haya, kuna mengi ambayo serikali inaficha vitendo vya kiovu ambavyo Watanzania wanafanyiwa na nchi ambazo zinajifanya ni marafiki wa Tanzania. Kama mnakumbukumbu mtanzania alipoteza mwanae kule Japan, Watanzania walifukiwa kwenye migodi kwa makusudi Mozambique, Watanzania kunyang’anywa mali zao SA bila sababu yoyote, uonevu wa wazi wazi kwenye nchi za Angola, Zimbabwe n.k.

    Serikali ya JK na CCM wameweza kuwakumbatia wageni kwa manufaa yao binafsi. Tukumbuke kwamba JK alisema kazi ambazo WTZ wanaweza kuzifanya wasifanya raia kutoka nje ……………..…..Je, amefika wapi na hili? Rais wetu amekuwa mwingi wa maneno na hakuna vitendo, hii kero itaendelea hadi pale WTZ wenyewe watakapoamua kuchukua uamuzi wa kuwaondoa viongozi na vyama vibaraka wa makuwadi wao wa nje. Swala la wageni sio Tanzania tu ni kila nchi na sisi hatuwezi kuwa Moses wa kila Tom, Dick amd Harry.

    Thats why we say liberation of Afrika finished long back, lets sit and build our country without the interference of others. Tanzania sio shamba la bibi.
     
  10. Mwiba

    Mwiba JF-Expert Member

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    Kwa wale walio na ujuzi ni mahoteli gani na kitu gani na gani vinamilikiwa na wa South Africa ,embu wekeni majina yao hapa watu wasicheze mbali ikianza pora pora lazima na wao waondoke chupi mkononi. Yaani isikosekane hata moja kuchomwa moto ,yaani inahuzunisha sana ukikumbuka siku zile hawa jamaa wanapigania uhuru hapa ilikuwa ni mshike mshike tu ndugu zetu wangapi wa JWTZ walipelekwa huko na hadi hii leo wengine hawajulikani walipo ,yote kutaka kuwakomboa wao ,lakini leo ndio wanalipa ,yaani kama ningelikuwepo pale jeshini wakati yanatokea haya ningeshaondoka na wezangu kama ishirini na kuziwasha moto hoteli zao zote , yaani kwa siku moja tungetekeza Hoteli kama nne tu kwa kugawana watazo watano ,naamini na wao wangesikia majibu ya WaTanzania na kwamba bado tupo alive.
    Ngadu hawa wasiojua kuchamba ,jusi nilisoma wakisema WaTz sita leo jamaa anasema wengi hajawaona na hawana mawasiliano Tanzania ondosha watu wako haraka huko Ndege ya Raisi huu ni wakati wa kutumika na sio kusafirishia mihogo na ndizi , Muungwana utahusika moja kwa moja ikiwa waTanzania ambao wameshajulikana walipo na wamewasiliana na balozi ambao wamewekwa kwenye mahema ,fedha za walala hoi hazitakuwa zimetumika vibaya ikiwa ndege itajazwa mafuta na kwenda kuwachukua WaTanzania hao ,naona hata ndege za Jeshi za mizigo zilizokuwepo ziende kwa haraka tusingoje ushahidi kamili.WaTanzania wanahitaji msaada na hawako mbali itakuwa ni aibu ikiwa hata hao walioomba msaada na kusikika wakielewana na balozi wataachwa wapoteze roho ,wazulu ndio washasema hawataki mgeni hapo mnawawekea kiwingu.Ikiwa mwandishi wa CNN anaguna kwa kusema polisi wanawapa go ahead wauaji japo kwa siri lakini ndio pale niliposema Serikali ya Mbeki ina mkono japo leo ameonekana akijidai kusema si ubinadamu yaani leo zimeshapita siku kadhaa alikuwa kimya ila kwa kiasi fulani wamefanikiwa kuuwa na kuwatimua.
     
  11. Kuhani

    Kuhani JF-Expert Member

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    May 25, 2008
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    Kuna wakati Muungwana hata maneno ya kutuzuga zuga yanamkosa anaamua kusema hakuna kibaya kilichotokea.

    Jana Kikwete kadai fujo za South Africa sio Xenophobia, bali ni ujambazi/uharamia tu. Yani, jinai jinai za kila siku. Tena anaongea kama Mkuu wa AU.

    Daily News May 24th
    …The president said branding the killings in that country as xenophobia was a bit overdone. In a terse statement to the media, the president painted a scenario of hope and despair almost sitting side by side saying: "Acts in South Africa are nothing but acts of thuggery.."


    Hawa ni majambazi wa kawaida kwenye hizi picha?

    http://bp1.blogger.com/_CcHV2wFn640/SDQ4xx3Mt7I/AAAAAAAACd4/hhYbiHdtYec/s1600-h/South+Africa+List.jpg

    http://bp1.blogger.com/_CcHV2wFn640/SDRDjx3Mt8I/AAAAAAAACeA/gffuBUE1y9M/s1600-h/South+Africa+List+2.jpg

    Hawa jamaa hapo wanatafuta wageni wawafanyie uharamia. Jambazi wa kawaida huwa anatafuta mali, au kama hatafuti mali, anatafuta lingine bila kujali Uraia wako - kama jambazi anaeua mtu ili asiibue siri za ufisadi. Hawa wanatafuta wageni, sio majambazi wa kawaida. Muungwana anafikiri nini kuiambia dunia, akiiongea kwa niaba ya Africa, kwamba hii sio Xenophobia?

    Muungwana ana hulka moja ya kujaribu kuficha matatizo au kuzima makamio, kwa maneno mengine ‘kuua soo.'

    Kama alivyosema viongozi wasiogope kuitwa mafisadi. Ni kama vile anasema ufisadi ni uzushi. Watu hawana dogo, ni ‘wanoko.'
     
  12. Nzokanhyilu

    Nzokanhyilu JF-Expert Member

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    May 25, 2008
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    Jamani, si huwa ulimwengu unamtegemea Mandela?Mbona hatatui matatizo?Kuna watu wamemsifia sana Mandela hapa. Yuko wapi? I thought he was special?
     
  13. Dua

    Dua JF-Expert Member

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    Issue ya N. Mandela tuliiongelea sana yeye alikaa jela karibu miaka 40 kwa hiyo alipitwa na mambo mengi sana na muda wake wa kufanya shughuli nyingine ni mfupi sana. Hivi sasa kutokana na kuandika vitabu mbalimbali pamoja na maisha yake hana muda wala nafasi ya kuweza kusema kila kitu muoneeni huruma mzee wa watu tule sahani moja na hawa kina Mbeki, na kundi zima la vijana.

    Wa kushangaza ni JK anaendelea kusisitiza kwamba Japan kuna wezi huwezi kulala mlango wazi na Mbeki kwamba Zimbabwe mambo ni shwari at 165,000% inflation. These are our leaders, what a shame!
     
  14. Kuhani

    Kuhani JF-Expert Member

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    Kutegemea Mandela aibuke kokote alipo anyooshe mkono mambo yatengemee labda ni zaidi ya anachoweza. Hata hivyo, we ni mmoja wa wachache mno ambao hawana nyimbo za pambio kwa Mandela. Nihesabu na mimi.

    Nadhani Mandela alikuzwa na wa Magharibi, wakiongozwa na Marekani ya Bill Clinton, kwa sababu walitegemea angeweza kuwa-Mugabe wazungu wenzao alipotoka jela. Lazima nitilie shaka nia ya wa Magharibi waliomsujudia Mandela ghafla alipotoka jela wakati walikuwa marafiki wakubwa wa watesi wake enzi za kina Reagan.
     
  15. Nzokanhyilu

    Nzokanhyilu JF-Expert Member

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    Asante Mkuu. Kuna watu wanamheshimu sana Mandela kupita kiasi. Sasa katika kipindi hiki kama kweli ana msemo na anaheshimika, asimame, acheze, anyoshe kimkono matatizo yaishe.

    Sasa haya yanayotokea ndio watu watajua yametokana na uchemshaji wa Mandela na Mbeki's first government. Watu wako frustrated. Yaani kipindi hiki, nadhani watakuwa tayari kumsikiliza Zuma kuliko hata Mandela wala Mbeki.

    I never bought the hype ya kumnyanyua Mandela. Wazungu walimwita gaidi hapo zamani, alipotoka akawa kama saint fulani.
     
  16. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

    #16
    May 25, 2008
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    Wanaotaka kufanya retaliation wanachanganya mambo.

    Awali ya yote South Africa is a country in two.TTorn asunder by racial and classic lines.Kwa hiyo klabla ya ku adopt positions zitakazoiathiri De Beers na kina Ramaphosa inabidi tujue mzizi wa fitina ni nini.

    Mzizi wa fitina ni xenophobia ambayo the world over ni rahisi kuwashawishi the economically didadvantaged on.From Hitler against Jews (Mein Kampf) to Mtikila and maganbacholi.It is the same thing almost to the letter.You are poor/ unemployed because of these foreigners.No black African has it better than the South AAfricans.All they have to do is go to school.They are at the point our fathers were in the sixties and seventies when a university degree was pasport to a prestigious job, in a developed country nevertheless.But it is easier to blame the immigrant.

    Bob Mugabe cannot escape blame for this, along with Mbeki.They madeit viable for three million Zimbabweans to flee into SA.One has to ask oneself why now? The Zimbabwe situation is the last staw that broke the camel's back.I am writing from the perspective of Tanzanians going to School at Wit and UCT.A sound education at a fraction of the price of a sometimes mediocre US or UK college.Sadly these clowns are setting the clock back for years.
     
  17. F2S

    F2S JF-Expert Member

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    Ni masikitiko makubwa sana. Thus why sisi tulioko huku nje swali tunaloulizwa ni are you from africa ukijbu ndio swali la pili is it safe in your country au bado mnapigana. Inakuwa ni vigumu sana kujibu swali hilo kwani huku far east wengi wanajua africa ni kama nchi moja hivyo kila wanalosikia wanajua ni africa na sio nchi ndani ya afrika. Hawa wazulu ni watu waajabu na sio wastaarabu na hawjui umoja wa kiafrika ni wahuni tu. Nashangaa mzee wa usuluhishi Mbeki hatoi commet. Je hawana jeshi la kuzuia uovu huu. Bado naamini ili uingie katika nchi nyingine unatakiwa uwe na proper documents vinginevyo wewe ni mkimbizi au mhamiaji haramu. Kwa wale waTz nadhani wana proper documents na sio wakimbizi kwani hatuna vita bongo labda vita ya uchumi. Sasa kwanini serikali ya south isichukue hatua muafaka kwani ndugu zetu wanaangamia. Nafikiri wazuru wengi wamekimbia umande hivyo wanaogopa ushindani ktk ajira watuige sisi mbona hatuwafukuzi wakenya japo wanakuja zero nao kuchukua jkazi za wasomi wa bongo?
    Kikwete jitahidi kuongea na mbeki mrekebishe mambo sikubaliani na ninyi katika kuwatimua wasouth kwani wapo kisheria kupitia 10% za mikataba feki hivyo kama kuwafukuza tuanze na waliosign mikataba hiyo mingi ktk serikali ya Che nkapa.
     
  18. Manda

    Manda JF-Expert Member

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    I personal think that the solution of escalating of violence in SA cant be solved by the way Mwiba and other pundits says, of coz that can be a Solution but Not a Best solution.

    What we a looking here ni kuja na best solution ambayo haita haribu diplomatic relationship btn our historical frnds countries, of coz we can demostrate lakini physical confrontations dhidi ya hawa makaburu i think is not a best solution so far, tukumbuke pia ni risk kwa uchumi wetu ambao hawa jamaa wanachangia kwa kiasi kikubwa, rejea yaliyotokea Uganda during the regime ya Idd Amin na yaliyotokea Zimbambwe in the foot of this decade.

    Nevertheless sisi kaka wa-tz na serikali yetu lazima tujue na iwe kama caution kwetu kwamba as much as the natives they will be denied access to such salient basic needs then yale yaliyotokea SA are likely to happen kwetu hapa.
     
  19. J

    Jamco_Za JF-Expert Member

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    Matatizo ya SA yamekuwa makubwa zaidi wakati wa uongozi wa bwana mbeki, hali ya uchumi imekuwa ngumu sana kiasi kwamba watu wasio na ajira wameongezeka sana kuliko hata wakati wa ubaguzi, nchi imeingia kwenye cris ya nishati, hali ya chakula imekuwa mbaya sana, wenyeji wakajikuta hawana kazi za kufanya kazi zote zinafanywa na waamiaji.

    Hili liwe fundisho kwa serikali zetu kwa kuruhusu waamiaji kufanya kazi ambazo zinaweza kufanywa na wenyeji, hii inaweza kutokea hata tanzania kwani wachina wanafanya kazi za umachinga kariakoo na serikali inawaangalia tu bila sababu ya msingi.
     
  20. G

    Game Theory JF-Expert Member

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    population movement is a world phenomena that will not abate as people will move to where they can find security and jobs. People in search of jobs and or security are not going to look at a line on a map and say it would be illegal for me to cross therefore let me sit here and rot. That you can't expect freedom of movement for capital without movement of people.

    That it is also inefficient to spend so much on trying to keep people out (or in) when investments both in country of origin and target country would do more.

    Do you see Japan following the world trend? If yes, does it have a problem with legal and illegal immigration? If not then try to think why not? Is it legislation? Border patrols? Or something else?
     
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