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Wanasiasa Waliopanda Chati na Kushuka, Halafu...?

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Buchanan, Jan 16, 2010.

  1. Buchanan

    Buchanan JF Diamond Member

    #1
    Jan 16, 2010
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    1. Kuna baadhi ya wanasiasa waliowahi kupanda chati sana kisiasa na baadaye kuporomoka kwa kupoteza umaarufu kwa kiasi kikubwa sana! Mfano wa wanasiasa hao ni Augustine Lyatonga Mrema. Huyu ni mpinzani ambaye aliwahi kupata kura nyingi zaidi kiasilimia kuliko wapinzani wote waliowahi kugombea kiti cha urais.
    2. Mwanasiasa mwingine ambaye kuna kila dalili za kushuka kisiasa ni Mbunge wa Kigoma Kaskazini Mh. Zitto Zuberi Kabwe. Kauli zake za hivi karibuni na vitendo vyake vinaashiria kushuka huko kisiasa. Sina haja ya kuzirejea kauli hizo, kama wachangiaji watahitaji tuzirejee nitafanya hivyo. Sina haja vile vile ya kuwataja wanasiasa wengine waliopanda na kushuka, wachangiaji mkihitaji nitawataja, nimetaja hawa wawili kama mfano tu.
    3. Maswali yangu ni haya:
    (a) Wanasiasa hawa ambao walituaminisha kwa kiasi kikubwa kwamba walijitoa kwa dhati kuwatetea watanzania halafu baadaye wakaonekana kuwa si lolote tunajifunza nini kwa jambo hilo?
    (b) Tufanye nini ili tuchague viongozi ambao kweli hawatatetereka kwa namna yoyote ile hata kama itatumika nguvu ya dola kuwadhibiti kama ilivyofanyika kwa Mrema, labda na Zitto maana mpaka sasa hatujui yaliyomkumba?
    (c) Tutawajuaje wapinzani "feki" ambao wamepandikizwa na Chama Tawala wakituminisha kwamba ni wapinzani kiukweli kumbe ni kiinimacho matokeo yake wanatupotezea muda wa kuwapigia kura na baadaye tunaanza kuvuna matunda mabaya ya kiutendaji na upandikizaji wa migogoro na migawanyiko isiyoisha inayosababishwa na wao? Hapa namlenga tena A. L. Mrema ambaye ametajwa mara kwa mara kuwa ni pandikizi la CCM.
     
  2. Waberoya

    Waberoya JF-Expert Member

    #2
    Jan 16, 2010
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    are we looking for an angel?

    definitely not!

    Kuhusu Mrema kinachonipa shida ni kusema yeye ndiye aliyepata kura nyingi za wapinzani kuliko mwingine yeyote , tangu 1995 mpaka 2005 hakuna mwingine upinzani aliyepata kura nyingi kama mrema! then kuanzia sijui lini ikajulikana ni pandikizi la CCM, swala ni je 1995 alikuwa pandikizi au issue za pandikizi zimekuja baadae?

    I have different opinion here; hawa wote unaowaita wapinzani ni binadamu na wana hisia cha uvumilivu kama binadamu. Ni kwa kiasi gani sisi kama raia tuko tayari kuwajali kwa hali na mali wale tunaodhani ni viongozi? tunaweza kunyoosha vidole kwa hao jamaa, at the same time tukasahau mchango wetu kama wataka mabadiliko.

    Ni nani aliyetayari kumpa fedha Baregu baada ya kukosa fedha za chuo, au nani aliyemkumbuka Lamwai baada ya kuporwa vyeti vyake vyote vya kazi? nani anayeweza kuwaza au kufikiri shida wanazozipata hawa viongozi?

    watanzania wengi hawapo kwa ajili ya mabadiliko, labda utajiaminisha ukiwa JF! but believe me out there people are like fish they may swim as the water course directs! hamna michango kwa vyama, wala viongozi hawa wanapopata shida.wanapoamua kusema haya narudi CCM basi ''ndio tunaanza kusema mapandikizi''

    Kuna mchango mkubwa sana wa raia wenyewe kuwarudisha nyuma hawa wapiganaji!

    Kuhusu Zito limejadiliwa sana, na nimekuwa na challenge sana great thinker to see this problem in many dimensions. Zito huyu leo anabebwa na watu jangwani, kesho anaonekana msaliti, ghafla tu!!-siamini!! kutatua tatizo la Zito ndiyo kutatua matatizo ya vyama vyetu.

    Tuangalie vyama vinaongozwa vipi, vinafanyaje uchaguzi, uwazi, makundi, na tunaposema chama tunamaanisha chama chenye sifa zote za kuwa chama, na sio chenye sura za kibaguzi wala kutokueleweka katika jamii.

    wakati Buchanan unasema la zito, nimekuwa nikitoa challenge kuangalia tatizo la chadema pia, kama source ya haya matatizo ya Zito yanatokana na chadema then we have to find out why, how, and possibly to remedy the problem for future! vyama vingi vimekuwa vikileta matatizo na sisi tumekuwa tukiwalaumu waathirika. na pengine kwa kupenda sana, (na hapa ni tatizo) tumekuwa tunashindwa kusimamia ukweli na kuwa watu wa double standard! challenge yangu ni kuwa , haya yasipodhibitiwa basi aidha hatutakuja kupata mpinzani makini kama akina Tsavangirai au tutaishia hivi hivi, tangu 1992 mpaka leo 2010, still hakuna chama tegemeo la kuitoa CCM madarakani, still unataka kuangalia individual hapa!!

    Lingine sijui wewe, huwa namchukulia Zito kama binadamu mwingine, mwenye uhuru wa kutoa maoni yake, na anapotoa maoni hawi rais wa nchi hii, kama wengine wanavyotaka aonekane hivyo. Tatizo la Zito ni kuchallenge idea na kusimamia anachokiamini na hili kwetu wengi ni tatizo!... La kuwa aliye-kinyume chetu ni adui! Juzi juzi sera ya afya ya Obama ilikuwa na ina kuwa challenged hadharani yeye akisikia na kuona yet anajibu vizuri na kutetea hoja zake.

    Hayati Nyerere alikuwa mbishi na utakuta Idea na ushauri wa kama akina Mtei hakuuchukua na baadae kuja kugundua was too late. Viongozi wengi leo wa taifa hili ni wabishi miungu watu na ukitaka kugombana nao wewe bishana nao. Hawa viongozi ndio sisi, ndio kioo chetu na mengi wanayoyafanya ndiyo yanaonekana kwa watanzania wengi. JAMANI ANAYEKUJA NA IDEA TOFAUTI SI KUWA NI MBAYA!!

    samahani, ila sisi wengi tunatabia ya ubishi, one dimensional thought, sawa kabisa na viongozi wetu, tunachotaka na kuamini kwetu ndiyo sahihi asilimia 100! leo hii tumefika hapa ni kwa sababu hatuna open debate, hakuna watu wa kuchallenge viongozi(zidumu fikra za mwenyekiti), viongozi wanakimbia mijadala na hata kutoa maoni hawapatikani.Katika nyakati ngumu kabisa za watanzania kutaka viongozi wao waseme jambo huwa wako kimya!!! yet we call them leaders

    Jamii inayoendelea na iliyokuwa ni ile inayochallenge Idea na si mtu. Zito kwangu mimi sioni ni mtu tishio kabisa, siyo rais, wala PM, sioni woga unatoka wapi wa kutozisikiliza idea zake na kuzichallenge, sorry to say this! issue za Zito zinaonyesha jamii iliyovivu kufikiri, katika watanzania millioni 40, anayesema mambo ni Zito tu? jamani Buchanan haya si matusi kwetu sisi wengine? wewe usiwe mmoja wao!

    who is Zito? wengi huwa naona watu wanajidharaulisha, inferiority complex, wengine woga wa kusema, wengine uvivu wa kufikiri, wafuata Mkumbo n.k Mbona hatupati maoni tofauti ya Zito na serikali? yako wapi? nani anasema? mbona hatuyasikii? jamani hapa mimi naona kuna tatizo! Haiwezekani aogopwe mtu asiye rais , PM wala waziri!!! think about it!!

    So in long run , kutokana na thread yako na mtazamo wako, tusipojiangalia sisi wananchi na nafasi yetu katika mageuzi, tusipoangalia vyama hivi vinaongozwaje, tusipojiangalia mmoja mmoja, samahani kusema hivi CCM may rule FOREVER, kila siku tutatafuta mchawi

    By the way, chart inaonyesha wapinzani wanapata kura chache kadiri miaka inavyoenda mbele! hili hali tuna maendeleo ya teknolojia! tatizo hapa ni Zito na Mrema?

    we need to dig deep and see our problem jamani, tusiwabebeshe mzigo wasiostahili, vyama leo vinawaza uchaguzi ili hali kuna mengi ya kurekebisha, wakishindwa --MREMA amesababisha!


    watanzania wenzetu kuwapokea kwa mazuria mekundu akina EL, RA, Karamagi n.k still ni matatizo ya akina Mrema!!!

    we are not ready to support these opposition leaders at any cost and condition! that is our problem!!

    Probably we should wait for an angel!

    Believe me uone tulivyoingia kwenye huu mtego wa 'pandikizi, kanunuliwa, n.k'' leo hii kutokana na haya maendeleo mtu yeyote aliye kiongozi yeyote anaweza kuzushiwa kitu, watanzania tumesahau kuna dudu LINAITWA CCM, badala ya kupigana nalo TUNAPIGANA WENYEWE! tunaitana majina, BELIEVE ME kwa miaka 20 ijayo usitegemee kuna kiongozi yeyote wa upinzani atakayekuja kama hao hapo juu! believe me akitokea KAPU NA HATIMA YAKE NI KUITWA 'pandikizi' CCM haoooo....wanapeta

    Siamini kabisa kama Mrema ni pandikizi, alikuja kwa walio wake walio wake wamemkataa! wamemwacha frustrated! yet ndani ya CCM mpaka leo ni mmoja wa wenye rkodi nzuri, mtanzania anasema pandikizi.. mnataka ccm leo wasamabaratike watokee akina Mrema, muwaite nao pandikizi

    SIFA YA MREMA KWENYE MAGEUZI HAITAFUTIKA KAMWE!!
     
  3. Buchanan

    Buchanan JF Diamond Member

    #3
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    Nashukuru ndg Waberoya kwa mchango wako mzuri, sikutarajia kama ningepata mawazo mapana kama ya kwako! Kwa kuwa mimi ni mtoa hoja naomba wengine nao wachangie kabla ya mimi kuendelea kutoa ufafanuzi!
     
  4. Field Marshall ES

    Field Marshall ES JF-Expert Member

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    - Eti Tanzania tuna viongozi waliowahi kupanda chati? Labda tuelimisheni walipokuwa huko kwenye kupanda chati walitufanyia nini taifa?

    es!
     
  5. Waberoya

    Waberoya JF-Expert Member

    #5
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    Nadhani anamaanisha popularity in general.

    Mrema alifanya mengi mazuri na ya kukumbukwa akiwa CCM, NA Zito issue za bungeni na hoja murua.
     
  6. Buchanan

    Buchanan JF Diamond Member

    #6
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    Ndiyo, kupanda chati maana yake ni kupendwa na na kuaminiwa na wengi (popularity), labda nipatiwe maana nyingine, kama ipo! Hivi kweli Tanzania hii inahitaji wanasiasa wenye "vifafa vya kisiasa" ili ijikwamue? No, tumedharauliwa kiasi cha kutosha, tumepuuzwa kiasi cha kutosha,...!
     
  7. Field Marshall ES

    Field Marshall ES JF-Expert Member

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    - Ooooops! Thanks guy! kwa kunielimisha.

    es!
     
  8. T

    T_Tonga Member

    #8
    Jan 16, 2010
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    mbona mmemsahau mapalala aliye kuwa mwenyekiti wa mwanzo cuf leo hata hatajikani sijui yuko wapi
     
  9. Buchanan

    Buchanan JF Diamond Member

    #9
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    Nilishatangulia kusema kwamba sikuwataja wote ila niliowataja ni kama mfano tu! Kwa hiyo ukiongezea wengine si vibaya! Hata hivyo sijaona mtu aliyejikita kujibu maswali niliyouliza!
     
  10. Nostradamus

    Nostradamus JF-Expert Member

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    Jan 18, 2010
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    Nashukuru sana kaka(WABEROYA)...looh kumbe bado kuna GREAT THINKERS wa ukweli.
    nimekuwa nikipingana na mawazo ya wengi juu ya ZITO KABWE na CHADEMA,imefika mahali hata moderator hataki kuzipitisha thread zangu.lakini huo uliouongelea ndio mtazamo wa kweli na ndio ukweki wa kweli.
    Ukitaka kujua CHADEMA kuna matatizo,soma gazeti la TANZANIA DAIMA uone jinsi wanavyojaribu kumsafisha raisi mstaafu BEN MKAPA.
    Kwa chama ambacho tumekipa imani yetu ili kitukomboe kutoka katika utawala wa kiimla wa CCM, Kinatakiwa kijipambanue na kuwa tofauti na vyama vingine kisera,mtazamo,mienendo ya viongozi wake,ukweli wa dhamira yake na demokrasia ndani ya chama chenyewe.
    Naanza kuwa na wasiwasi juu ya dhamira ya viongozi wetu wa CHADEMA na kwa hivyo naanza kukata tamaa.
     
  11. Mponjoli

    Mponjoli JF-Expert Member

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    Jan 18, 2010
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    Zitto kapotea tayari, yani analeta mambo ya umaarufu kuliko chama chake kama kikwete. Anapenda sifa kiasi cha kuweza kuangamiza upinzani kw amtakwa yake binafsi.
     
  12. Chakaza

    Chakaza JF-Expert Member

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    Jan 18, 2010
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    Kama ni kupanda na kushuku katika chati kwa wanasiasa msimsahau JK. Maana chati yake 2005 na sasa ni tofauti kabisa. 2005 wapo waliomfananisha na Nyerere, wengine walisema Chaguo la Mungu nk. Ukiwauliza watu hao leo watakupa majibu tofauti na ya wakati ule. KASHUKA. Sasa twende kwenye swali la mtoa mada, ................HALAFU?
     
  13. Waberoya

    Waberoya JF-Expert Member

    #13
    Jan 18, 2010
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    halafu??? hatumtaki hatumtaki! tunataka rais mpya
     
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