Dismiss Notice
You are browsing this site as a guest. It takes 2 minutes to CREATE AN ACCOUNT and less than 1 minute to LOGIN

Wadau mnalia na Wazungu huku Mwenguo na Macha wanapeta kwa kodi yetu

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Lunyungu, Mar 30, 2008.

  1. Lunyungu

    Lunyungu JF-Expert Member

    #1
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Aug 7, 2006
    Messages: 8,827
    Likes Received: 29
    Trophy Points: 135
    Siku chache zilizopita nimeona wadau wa Utalii wanaia na wazungu kuvamia Utalii na kuwaacha wazawa wakiwa hoi.Wanasema wazunu wanatumia uzungu wao na kuwachukua watalii wengi na pesa kulipwa Ulaya ama US na wao kuleta senti kidogo kwa ajili ya operation.Wanasema wao wana insurance na uelewa mkubwa wa utalii wa Tanzania wana aminika kama vile Kenya walivyo tufanyia unyama.Matatizo haya yoye yanachangiwa na uongozi wa juu wa TTB na uingozi wa TATO , Brela Uhamiaji Tanzania .Kuna mengi yanafanywa huko na kuwadhalilisha wazalendo na mwisho sasa wazungu wanafanya biashara toka majumbani mwao na serikali inakosa mapato .

    Kibaya zaidi sijui kama JK anajua ama mamlaka zingine zinajua .Peter Mwenguo ambaye kapewa Ukurugenzi wa TTB yeye ana kampuni yake ya ABC Travel na Safari.Huyu kweli anaweza kusimamia kazi hii kwa usalama?

    Macha yeye ni Mkurugenzi wa Marketing yeye kila kona ya Dunia anaenda kuitangaza Tanzania na huku kabeba business na vipeperushi vya kampuni yake ya Utalii .Hapa panakuwa na fair game kweli ? Ushauri wangu ni kwamba kufanya biashara ukiwa Ikulu si sahihi .Hawa ndugu wanatumia vyeo vyao na pesa za walaal hoi kupata mishahara na huku wana makampuni ya utalii.Watapeleka watu wao kwenye maonyesho mbali mbali kwa kudanganya kwamba ni watanzania tu wajasiriamali kumbe ni kivuli chao.Nashangaa kama hawa jamaa wanaweza mwishowe kutoa maamuzi sahihi kwa manufaa ya wadau wa Utalii Tanzania , kabla hawajaanza kujipendelea wao wenyewe .

    Naomba sasa JK na mamla zingine muangale hili ni baya na linate conflict ya interest na ni kinyume kabisa na maadili ya Utumishi wa Umma at least nafikiria hili .

    Naomba kutoa Hoja .
     
  2. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

    #2
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Feb 4, 2007
    Messages: 3,742
    Likes Received: 14
    Trophy Points: 0
    The argument is at best underdeveloped and contradictory.

    Not enough vidence is given that Tanzanians are driven out.Undedeveloped.

    On the one hand the author raises a concern that indigenous Tanzanians are driven out, on the other hand, the author is against the few indigeneous "wajasirimali" pioneering the tourism business, just because they hold positions in the TTB.Is this against any rule or stipulation? If yes name it here, if no you have no right to accuse so.

    Ndiyo mambo yale yale, tusipoutangaza Mlima Kilimanjaro watu wanalalamika kwamba tunawaachia wakenya na sisi wenye mlima hatuutangazi.Tukiutangaza wanasema tunautangaza mlima disputed.

    Nashindwa kuelewa, au kuna kampeni ya siri dhidi ya watu wa TTB?
     
  3. Lunyungu

    Lunyungu JF-Expert Member

    #3
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Aug 7, 2006
    Messages: 8,827
    Likes Received: 29
    Trophy Points: 135

    Ushahidi ni mwingi juu ya wazungu kuchukua biashara hii kwa kiasi kikubwa
    Fika Arusha na uliza mamlaka zinazo husika utajua ukweli haya si madai pekee hata last week yalikuwa kwenye gazeti la Mwananchi ni hatari .

    Juu ya Mwenguo hili ni sawa la Siasa na biashara .Mwenguo hakatazwi kufanya biashara ya Utalii wala nini .Lakini uaminifu wake utakuwa wapi ? Abatakiwa kutoa maamuzi huyu je anaweza kutoa maamuzi ya kuimiza kampuni yake ?

    Kitendo hiki kama tuna kikubali basi Mkapa asinyoshewe kidole kwamba alifanya biashara akiwa Ikulu .Unasemaje nalo hili ?Ushahidi wa hawa jamaa kufanya biashara nitaumwaga hapa soon.

    Je maadili ya kazi je ?Sijajua sheria ya ajira inasemaje ila siamini inaweza kusema kwamba ukiwa mkurugenzi bado unaweza kuwa na kampuni ya huko huko ambako ualipwa pesa ya walalahoi.Hili si kutangaza Kaka .Ni swala la maslahi binafsi na wakati wa kufanya maamuzi na ku dominate hata contacts zote .Je ni haki ?
     
  4. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

    #4
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Feb 4, 2007
    Messages: 3,742
    Likes Received: 14
    Trophy Points: 0
    Tatizo siyo wazungu kuchukua biashara.Kama wazungu wanachukua biashara kwa kufuata sheria sioni tatizo.Kama sisi wenyewe tunalala na hatufuatilii wazungu watachukua tu, after all tupo katika free market economy.Tusianze kuleta racism katika kutetea incompetence yetu wenyewe.Kitu ambacho hujaonyesha na ukikionyesha nitaku support ni kama wazungu wanatumia njia za mkato au rushwa.Ukionyesha hivyo nitakuwa wa kwanza kuku support.

    Kwanza hii siyo siasa, ni uongozi wa shirika la umma.Tatizo ni kuwa hata kama ingekuwa siasa unachoongelea ni miiko ya uongozi ya Azimio la Arusha ambayo ilitenguliwa na Azimio la Zanzibar, ambalo nalo rais Kikwete ametoa kikauli controversial cha kuli reverse bila kutumia kikao chochote cha chama, kwa hiyo reversal hiyo inakosa credibility.

    Kama kuna issue specific inayoonyesha hawa watu wame abuse positions zao za TTB kupata an unfair advantage then ilete hapa tui discuss, lakini huwei kuwazuia watu kupata kipato cha ziada just because wao ni ma directors wa TTB.Hawa watu ndiyo wanatakiwa kuwa mifano kwa watanzania wanaotaka kufanya biashara ya utalii as long as hawatumii vyeo vyao kupata advantage.

    Kuna school of thought inayosema sababu moja ya rushwa ni kwamba professionals wanategemea kazi zao tu na hawana extra source of income.Kama tutaruhusu watu professionals (non politicians) kufanya biashara tutawapa mwanya wa kupata extra income na kuondoa vishawishi vya rushwa kazini.Of course hii itafungua mwanya wa abuse of position, lakini jibu si kufunga mlango kwa wote bali ni kutafuta specific cases of abuse of position, then hold those people accountable.Tusilete mambo ya mtego wa panya unaokamata waliokusudiwa na wasiokusudiwa.

    Prudence inaweza kufanya watu kama marais wasijishughulishe na baishara kabisa, kuondoa any possibility ya maswali kuhusu uadilifu.

    Tatizo la Mkapa siyo so much kuwa alifanya biashara akiwa Ikulu (Azimio la Zanzibar liliondoa huu mwiko wa uongozi wa CCM, ndiyo maana kina Msekwa na wengine wengi walikuwa board members Vodacom etc) bali tatizo ni kwamba Mkapa alichukua hela (Deep Green) na mashirika (Kiwira) kinyume cha sheria, alichukua tu, hakununua au kushindania katika tender.

    Usituambie unachoamini, tuambie unachojua.Lete facts sio speculations.Kama hata hujui maadili ya kazi yanasemaje kuhusu hili utawezaje ku accuse conflict of interest?

    Hizi kazi si kazi za kisiasa, ni kazi za utendaji.Whats next, mtasema engineer wa serikali asiwe na ki workshop chake mtaani kwa sababu itakuwa conflict of interest?
     
  5. KadaMpinzani

    KadaMpinzani JF-Expert Member

    #5
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Jan 31, 2007
    Messages: 3,752
    Likes Received: 13
    Trophy Points: 0
    safi sana hapo juu !
     
  6. Field Marshall ES

    Field Marshall ES JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Apr 27, 2006
    Messages: 12,659
    Likes Received: 39
    Trophy Points: 0
    Wakuu huko Arusha, nina mshikaji wangu anamiliki Multi-Service, hata hao wazungu wenyewe wanazimia naye maana service anazotoa kwenye kampuni yake hakuna mfano, yaaani wazungu wakirudi majuu huwaambia na wengine waende kwake, ni mbongo na kwa kweli hata wazungu hawawezi kumgusa maana kwanza na magari imara, security ya hali ya juu, na huduma zake ni superior haya tu ndio matatizo ya mzungu mtalii,

    sasa kama kuna wabongo wanajaribu kuleta usanii kwenye hiyo sekta, wajue kuwa wazungu hawatawapa hiyo nafasi na yes watawanyanyang'anya hizo huduma.
     
  7. Lunyungu

    Lunyungu JF-Expert Member

    #7
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Aug 7, 2006
    Messages: 8,827
    Likes Received: 29
    Trophy Points: 135

    Es unaweza kusema kampuni gani hiyo kubwa ambayo ina hayo uyasemayo ? Maana mkubwa kabisa haoa Arusha ni Leopard tours ya Mhindi , Ranger Safari ni ya Moledina Mhindi,A & K ni mzungu anaitwa Abercombie Mmarekani,Thompson Safari ni Mmrekani,Warner Safari Wahindi hawa,Good Earth ya Mzalendo hii ,Sun Safari ni Wahindi , East Travel ni ya wahindi ,Utra Travel ni ya Warusi,

    Hawa ndiyo ma giant hapa sasa sema huyo unaye mpa sifa ni yupi .Pia Guys you are missing the whole point.Wazungu wanatanza biashata Tanzania.Wako US ama Ulaya .Wao wanachukua pesa kwa wateja wao na zinabaki Ulaya ama US.Wazungu wanasema wana waamini wao na hivyo wazawa kukosa wateja na swala la usanii hapa linatokea wapi ?

    Wao wakianza biashara wanakuwa na support ya serikali yao kuanzia insurance na mengineyo unlike na watu wetu wana struggle na hata matangazo ni shida .Hili ndilo tatizo kwamba sasa wageni wanachukua kila kitu .

    Bado nataka kujua kama Mwenguo kuwa Mkurugenzi na Macha Director marketing na wana makampuni at the same time wanatakiwa kutoa maamuzi wataweza kuenda haki?Kama wao ni sawa kufanay biashara mahali ambapo wao ni viongozi basi sioni sababu ya kumsakama Mkapa na biashara zake Ikulu
     
  8. Field Marshall ES

    Field Marshall ES JF-Expert Member

    #8
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Apr 27, 2006
    Messages: 12,659
    Likes Received: 39
    Trophy Points: 0
    Jamaa yangu anaitwa Hilary, anamiliki multi-choice Services, ni bwana mdogo mbongo na mambo yake ni safi mkuu!!
     
  9. Lunyungu

    Lunyungu JF-Expert Member

    #9
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Aug 7, 2006
    Messages: 8,827
    Likes Received: 29
    Trophy Points: 135

    Nirushie website mkuu maana mie hii kampuni sijawahi kuona hata magari yake hapa Arusha .Si lazima niwe najua kila kitu lakini angalau akiwa na magari kibao easy to detect movement ama kuijua kama ninavyo kutajia kampuni kubwa za Utalii hapa Tanzania na hasa Arusha .
     
  10. Field Marshall ES

    Field Marshall ES JF-Expert Member

    #10
    Mar 30, 2008
    Joined: Apr 27, 2006
    Messages: 12,659
    Likes Received: 39
    Trophy Points: 0
    Mkuu mara ya mwisho mke na watoto wangu walipoenda huko waliitumia kampuni hiyo, inaitwa Multi-Choice Safari Service, that is all I know na kwamba kijana huyu mpaka leo anaendelea vizuri sana na wazungu wanampenda sana kutokana na umakini wake kwenye hiyo shughuli ya utalii na kupeleka wazungu kwenye mbuga za wanyama, zaidi ya hayo siielewi sana hii ishu.
     
  11. Kibunango

    Kibunango JF-Expert Member

    #11
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: Aug 29, 2006
    Messages: 7,558
    Likes Received: 122
    Trophy Points: 160
    nikiangalia hata hapa kwenye ukumbi wetu wa JF biashara ya utalii imepamba moto. Ukiandika chochote kile chenye kulenga utalii basi matangazo ya biashara ya hoteli mbalimbali za hapo nyumbani upamba hoja yako. Hii ina maana kuwa hao watalii wanaweza kupanga vyumba vya kulala kupanga sehemu za kutembelea wakiwa majumbunani mwao bila ya kushirikisha watu wa kati.

    Sasa iwapo tatizo ni la watu wa kati sawa, lakini vinginevyo sioni ni namna gani Lunyungu unalalamika
     
  12. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

    #12
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: Feb 4, 2007
    Messages: 3,742
    Likes Received: 14
    Trophy Points: 0
    Tatizo nchi yenyewe haijajiweka tayari halafu tunataka kulalama.

    Kuondolewa kwa mtu wa kati ni phenomena ya world economy ya sasa pamoja na mambo ya mtandao, do not fight change, embrace change.

    Siye bado hatutaki dual citizenship, moja ya vitu ambavyo vingewapa watanzania walio nje advantage ya kufanya biashara hii.

    Kwa hiyo tunarudoi pale pale, wenyewe hatuko tayari halafu tunalaumu.
     
  13. K

    Kimbembe Senior Member

    #13
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: May 14, 2006
    Messages: 122
    Likes Received: 0
    Trophy Points: 0
    Does one need Dual to do tourism business in Tanzania ? Mbona watu wako na bado hawaonyeshi njia wala faida za dual na wanashiriki uchafu na ufisadi kwa remote ?
     
  14. T

    TechMaro Senior Member

    #14
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: Feb 8, 2008
    Messages: 102
    Likes Received: 0
    Trophy Points: 33
    Kuhusu Mwenguo na Macha, siwezi kusema chochote bila kuwa na facts, kwamba how did they use public office for their personal benefit?? Hilo la safari za kutangaza Tanzania na kutoa business card, linahitaji ushahidi ni kivipi litamuumiza another player in the market, na pia uthibitisho kwamba aliitoa kweli....

    About biashara ya utalii, kama Lunyungu ulivyotaja, makampuni makubwa ni wazungu na wahindi (ambao wengi ni wazalendo).

    Kampuni kama A&K ni kubwa duniani katika utalii, they have a worldwide marketing network na pia service zao ni za hali ya juu sana. Kwa kampuni kama hii, kwanza they benefit Tanzania kwa kutangaza utalii wetu (kitu ambacho GoT imeshindwa kwa kiasi kikubwa) ambayo inasaidia pia kwa kampuni ndogo katika kupata wateja wale ambao wameshindwa kubook safari zao kupitia hao kina A&K. So hawawezi kuhodhi the benefit ya marketing ya rasilimali zetu, kampuni zote Tanzania zinapata hii faida.

    Pili ni learning ground kwa watanzania, to see how this things are being done. Cha kwanza kujitangaza, na pili aina ya huduma. Hawa A&K na wengine kama Grumeti they treat their customers as kings (ofcourse they charge high pia) ila ni kwa good service wanaoitoa. Tatizo makampuni ya watanzania, wanataka wavizie wazungu wanaotua KIA pale, na hata wakiwapata hao huduma zinakuwa za ubabaishaji...Mara gari bovu, chakula kibaya, hoteli chafu, mwenye biashara na wahudumu kujiona miungu watu, wafanyakazi kuwaibia wageni etc...sasa how can they compete na hao wazungu na wahindi unaowataja??

    Kuna umuhimu wa kuwawezesha watanzania, but dont close the door for the foreign companies. Kuna mtu atakwenda safari only because the agent ni fulani, otherwise he/she will choose another destination. Tanzania ni kuhakikisha tu they have proper system to tax the whole revenue.
     
  15. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

    #15
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: Feb 4, 2007
    Messages: 3,742
    Likes Received: 14
    Trophy Points: 0
    Kimbembe,

    One does not need dual citizenship to do tourism business in Tanzania. However, in this increasingly global business that is shrouded in the global market this is certainly an added and vital advantage. A person with dual has the advantage of operating on multiple home fronts, while the one with no dual citizenship cannot.

    This is just one illustration to show where we adopt self defeatist and non competitive attitudes and policies and then blame our failures on wazungu and the emerging middle class.

    I do not believe in abuse of public office for personal gain and it migh very well be very probable that this is the case here, but if it is so let's build the case by some credible facts and not blanket the whole enterprise of doing business while a public official as sinful.

    I would hate to find myself a director at TTB that cannot even operate a personal tourist kiosk.The saying "Mbuzi hula kulingana na urefu wa kamba" may have many interpretations, some of them ripe in ufisadi, but the one I like is "kila mtu atakula kwa ujuzi/profession yake"

    As long as hakuna abuse of public office for personal gain mimi sioni tatizo.
     
  16. K

    Kimbembe Senior Member

    #16
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: May 14, 2006
    Messages: 122
    Likes Received: 0
    Trophy Points: 0
    Naomba sasa nikubaliane namawazo ya Lunyungu na wewe mwenyewe kwamba ule kadiri ya urefu wa kamba .So Mkapa he did exactly the same na Lowasa and the likes kwa nini tunapiga kelele sasa na wakati miiko ya Azimio ilisha futwa na azimio la Zanzibar ?
     
  17. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

    #17
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: Feb 4, 2007
    Messages: 3,742
    Likes Received: 14
    Trophy Points: 0
    Tafadhali kuwa makini usi distort maneno yangu, NIMESEMA

    Nimesema ule kwa kutumia profession yako, maana yake kama Mkapa mtu wa PR na uandishi angeanzisha ki PR firm, au kigazeti cha Africa Now Type nani angemkalia kooni?

    As a matter of fact hii issue ya Kiwira imem expose Mkapa kama bonge la mpuuzi na mlafi, kwa sababu alichotakiwa kufanya ni kuweka ki tender cha uongo na kweli pale, na kukopa vimilioni vichache halafu kama kawaida yetu watanzania tungempendelea rais hata bila ya yeye kusema lolote.At the end of the process wangetaka kumsakama angesema mimi nilipeleka tenda kama mjasirimali, mtanzania mwenye uchungu wa kutaka kuonyesha mfano wa uwekezaji wa kizalendo.Hamna mtu ambaye angemgusa.

    Sasa huu ulafi wa kutaka vya bure na kuchukua mgodi kwa saini na influence huenda utamtokea puani, kama si kwa mikiki ya kesi basi hata kwa kufuta legacy yake ya uchumi/inflation control.

    Tatizo la Mkapa ni kwamba kachukua mgodi wa makaa ya mawe bila tenda wala kulipa hela, kakwiba simple and clear.

    Lowassa ana accusations za gross corruption, mpaka waziri wa cabinet aliyoiongoza kasema.

    Hawa watu (Macha na Mwesiumo) ninachowatetea ni kuwa wana haki ya kuanzisha makampuni ya utalii, ninachojaribu ku establish ni kama kuna ukweli kwenye tuhuma kuwa wame abuse advantage yao ya kuwa na access pale TTB.

    Kufanya biashara kama public official na hata mwanasiasa (kwa mujibu wa Azimio la Zanzibar) ni ruksa.

    The devil as almost always is the case, is in the details.
     
  18. Mtu Mzima

    Mtu Mzima JF-Expert Member

    #18
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: Oct 4, 2007
    Messages: 379
    Likes Received: 2
    Trophy Points: 33
    Main point hapa kwenye suala la TTB:Wanasafikiri kwa pesa na rasilimali za TTB na kutumia nafasi hiyo kutangaza biashara binafsi.

    Hizi ni tuhuma haziwezi kupingwa kwa sasa au kukubalika hadi hapo mtoa hoja au mzalendo mwingine yeyote atakapoleta viambatanisho muhimu si lazima awe Lunyungu
     
  19. K

    Kimbembe Senior Member

    #19
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: May 14, 2006
    Messages: 122
    Likes Received: 0
    Trophy Points: 0
    Kusafiri nan kutumia TTB na wao kuwa na business zao on the very same field next to that ndiyo issue kubwa hapa .Ushahidi sasa uje watu tujue .
     
  20. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

    #20
    Mar 31, 2008
    Joined: Feb 4, 2007
    Messages: 3,742
    Likes Received: 14
    Trophy Points: 0
    Now we are getting to the bottom of the issue.

    Can this be proven? Kuna ushahidi gani?

    Ndiyo maana wenzetu wana strict revenue/ spending rules. Hapo Albany mji mkuu wa New York lawmakers hawaruhusiwi hata kununuliwa chakula zaidi ya $ 50 (typical semi-fancy restaurant dinner in Albany) kwa nini? Kwa sababu wanajua kuna watu wanaweza kufanya mambo ya lobbying hapo.

    Sasa na sisi inabidi tuwe na tax returns kama za IRS.Hawa viongozi wenye kazi za umma na biashara binafsi waweze kuonyesha mapato, matumizi na kodi ndiyo tutaweza kuwabana.

    Lakini kwa set up ya sasa hivi kuwabana ni vigumu sana unless mtu mwenyewe kabweteka na system hawi mwangalifu (kama li Mkapa na ulafi wake)

    Otherwise tutajuaje kama hawa watu wanatumia safari za TTB kupromote biashara zao? Ni vigumu sana unless una inside info.
     
Loading...