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Ushindi ni lazima - Wangwe kaa pembeni!

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Mzee Mwanakijiji, Mar 25, 2008.

  1. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #1
    Mar 25, 2008
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    Saa na wakati huu vikosi vya majeshi ya Jumuiya ya Afrika vimeanza mapambano ya kukikomboa kisiwa cha Anjouan ili hatimaye kurudi katika shirikisho la Comoro. Vikosi hivyo vikiongozwa na Jeshi la Wananchi wa Tanzania wanashiriki katika Operesheni Demokrasia Komoro yenye lengo la kumuondoa Rais aliyejipachika Bw. Mohammed Bacar.

    Hivyo saa na wakati kama huu ambapo vijana wetu wako katika hali ya hatari na ambapo wanayaweka maisha yao hatarini ni kitendo cha kutokuwajibika kwa mwanasiasa kama Wangwe kudai kuwa Rais amevunja Katiba wakati kipengele alichokinukuu hakihusiki na mapigano haya. Kitendo cha kutumia mapigano hayo kujipatia pointi za kisiasa nakipinga na kinaonesha ni jinsi gani Bw. Wangwe siyo tu hajui Katiba lakini wakati wanajeshi wetu wako kwenye mapigano yeye anaongoza jitihada za kuwavunja moyo.

    Kama raia wa Tanzania naomba nitumie nafasi hii kutuma salamu za ushindi kwa Jeshi la Wananchi, kwa Amiri Jeshi Mkuu na kwa makamanda na wapiganaji wote huko Comoro ili hatimaye wafanye kazi tuliyowatuma kwa haraka, ufanisi na kuhakikisha kuwa maisha ya raia yanalindwa kwa kiasi chote kinachowezekana.

    Saa na wakati kama huu, hakuna Chadema, CUF, CCM au SAUT Tanzania ni moja na hatima yake ni moja, na ni jukumu la kila raia kusimama na kutakia ushindi vikosi vyetu na haya mambo ya kulalamika yaje baadaye siyo wakati risasi zinarushwa.

    Kwa jeshi letu, USHINDI NI LAZIMA!

    Mungu Ibariki Tanzania
    Mungu Ibariki Afrika.

    NB: Kwa matangazo yangu ya leo nikichambua hoja dhaifu za Mhe. Wangwe kama zilivyosikika BBC tafadhali tembelea http://www.klhnews.com na usisahau kutumia search injini yetu pale.
     
  2. N

    Ngurudoto JF-Expert Member

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    Mhe.Slaa na Mhe.Zito wamuwahi huyu Chacha anyamaze,BBC alifikaje kuongea?wakicheza watapoteza hilo Jimbo la Tarime, na hiyo nafasi ya Makamo Mwenyekiti CHADEMA ilikosa mtu?
     
  3. Masanja

    Masanja JF-Expert Member

    #3
    Mar 25, 2008
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    Nadhani hizi siasa tulizozianza Tanzania siyo nzuri. Personly namfahamu Wangwe just like my fellow countryman no more. Hivi huyu bwana alichokisema kibaya ni kipi? kwani kutokujua katiba ndo kunamfanya mtu asiwe na haki ya kutokutoa hoja kwa kitu asichoridhika nacho? argument ya mbunge Wangwe ni simple, if we are to take our uniformed men and women in harms way then ni vema wananchi wakashirikishwa kupitia wabunge wao. Kwa sababu sisi ndo tunalipa bill siyo AU ambao nao wamechoka. Kosa liko wapi? kwamba Katiba haisemi hivyo it doesnt mean wananchi wasiambiwe au wasiulize. Mpaka hivi serikali iko kimya all info we got ni thru BBC na CNN! lets think big. Ni mangapi hapa tunajua yako kwenye katiba lakini tunayapinga kwa kuyaona ni ujinga na udikteta?

    Not everything in the constitution that is constitutional!

    Mwanakijiji I beg to differ na wewe kwa kuchukua hii approach mufilisi ya Bush kwamba kila anyequestion sababu za watu kuwa vitani siyo PATRIOT. we have seen this game, especially Bush doing it on Kerry et al. Waliopinga vita ya Iraq waliitwa wasaliti, senator ambaye hakusupport hii vita alionekana ni mshirika wa maghaidi. 80% ya raia waliisupport hii vita ya Bush..lakini leo tunaujua ukweli na waliosupport hii vita wengine wako in trouble with their career! the likes of Clinton....

    Serikali ingewaambia wananchi kwa nini tumeenda Comoro na maslahi ya taifa yatalindwa vipi tusingekuwa na hizi hoja, but people like Wangwe they are rightly acting in the vacuum of information. Kwamba rais ana madaraka ya kufanya lolote, yes he can, but is that right? is that what we want in our country? Vita si lelemama..Not at all.

    Lets stop this cheap politics za kuwalaumu wenzetu wanavyo question mambo legitimate ya kitaifa kwamba sio wazalendo. Kama JK angetutangazia kitaifa tusingekuwa na haya maswali. Huu mimi nauita ndo cheap uzalendo.

    Wangwe has legitimate questions and the powers would be ought to give answers tuache hizi cheap cheap politics za uzalendo usio na uzalendo.

    All in all I wish our men and women from African countries in Comoro all the best in their mission!
     
  4. Mtu wa Pwani

    Mtu wa Pwani JF-Expert Member

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    na mmm nnaliombea kila la heri jeshi letu huko comoro, na furaha ya ngu zaidi baada ya kusikia ndugu yangu wa damu yuko huko kurejesha demokrasia comoro.

    idumu tanzania, lidumu jwtz

    tuko pamoja na nyie mashujaa wetu


    wangwe ni mfata shangwe huenda akajirudi na kujielewa. sio kila kitu ni ushabiki.

    kila jambo na pahala pake
     
  5. Mlalahoi

    Mlalahoi JF-Expert Member

    #5
    Mar 25, 2008
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    Japo sina lolote la ku-comment kwenye madai ya Wangwe kwa vile bado sijapata fursa ya kuyasikia kwa makini (will do that later) napenda kutoa msimamo tofauti kidogo na Mkuu Mwanakijiji.Ni muhimu kuikomboa Comoro,lakini vita haina macho na hata akina Sun Tsu wanatahadharisha kuhusu overconfodence kwenye mapambano husasan pale uwezo wa adui ukiwa haufahamiki vizuri sana.Putting the military aspect aside,zoezi zima la kupeleka askari huko ni sawa na unafiki kwani JK anaonekana kuwa na ghadhabu sana dhidi ya dikteta whoever wa Comoro kuliko mafisadi ambao vita dhidi yao haihitaji hata mazoezi ya kijeshi let alone possibility ya umwagaji damu.Nani ata-replace maisha ya askari wetu wanaokwenda huko?Au ndio kulichangamsha jeshi baada ya miaka lukuki ya kula na kulala bure?Vita ya muhimu zaidi kwa watanzania ni dhidi ya mafisadi....hayo ya Comoro ni mithili ya kutaka kutoa kibanzi kwenye macho ya wenzetu ilhali sisi wenyewe tuna boriti machoni mwetu
     
  6. Icadon

    Icadon JF-Expert Member

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    Binafsi sijayasikia mahojiano ya Wangwe, ila kama ni wananchi kujulishwa nadhani serikali ilikosea kwenye hilo, ila Bunge kupitia kamati ya Ulinzi na Usalama walijulishwa mpango mzima.

    Mtu wa pwani kwa habari za haraka haraka zinasema majeshi ya Tanzania yameshaingia Anjouan na yamepokelewa vizuri na wananchi wengi na upinzani ulikuwa hakuna.
    Tuwaombe kwa mungu wamalize Operation yao salama.
     
  7. Mtu wa Pwani

    Mtu wa Pwani JF-Expert Member

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    kaka yangu icadon ningeomba uyasikilize hayo mazungumzo wamehojiwa yeye na mkuu wa upinzani bungeni utapata picha pili fatilia ile mada ya comoro utaona kuwa hakuna sheria au utaratibu uliovunjwa sina haja kurejea.

    pia nnakushukuru kwa habari ya kuwa wanajeshi wengi wameshaingia anjuan bila ya upinzani mungu ajaalie iwe salama na kanal bakari ajisalimishe amani ipatikane na demokrasia ikamate njia yake


    TANZANIA TANZANIA NAKUPENDA KWA MOYO WOOOTE
     
  8. Chakaza

    Chakaza JF-Expert Member

    #8
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    Ni kweli kuwa wakati ndugu zetu wako vitani si jambo zuri kulumbana kisiasa kuhusu kwa nini wako huko,bali kujiuliza umuhimu wa serikali yetu kushikia BANGO kwa nguvu zote suala la Comoro wakati tunayetu yanayohitaji majibu na hatua kali na imekaa kimya huo ni wajibu wetu.
     
  9. Field Marshall ES

    Field Marshall ES JF-Expert Member

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    Kwenye hiii ishu ya majeshi yetu na Comoro hapa ndani, nasikia ka-harufu kamtego flani hivi hebu tusubiri tuone mwisho.
     
  10. M

    Mtanzania JF-Expert Member

    #10
    Mar 25, 2008
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    Mimi haya mambo ya kwenda kupigana kwenye nchi za watu siyaungi mkono kabisa!!!!

    Hii thread sitaki hata kuisoma tena. Tunasema tunaenda kuleta uhuru huko baadaye tunaishia kuiba kama Uganda.

    Mimi na vita niache pembeni. Vita pekee niliyo tayari kupigana na ya watu waliovamia nyumba yangu, kijiji changu, wilaya yangu, mkoa wangu na nchi yangu. Zaidi ya hapo mimi simo.

    Kuingilia mambo ya ndani ya nchi zingine ni Ubeberu hata kama umeungwa mkono na AU au UN. Siungi mkono vita kabisa!
     
  11. S

    Sir Leem JF-Expert Member

    #11
    Mar 25, 2008
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    Kama ndivyo hivyo tafuta kisiwa chako uishi peke yako!pamoja na mapungufu yalioyepo AU an UN bila kuwa na taasisi hizo leo dunia ingekuwa haikaliki dunia ingejaa madikteta sampuli ya hitler na iddi amin wangekuwa wamezajazana kila kona ya dunia!
    Kwa mfano leo hii ije nchi ivamie sehemu ya Tanzania halafu tushindwe kukiomboa eneo na sehemu ipo wilaya yako na kijiji chako wakija nchi marafiki kukiomboa utakataa???
     
  12. Mtu wa Pwani

    Mtu wa Pwani JF-Expert Member

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    nimeangalia kwenye aljazeera nimeona majeshi yetu yakipokewa kwa shangwe na wananchi wa huko.

    inaonekana mambo ni shuwari
     
  13. Gamba la Nyoka

    Gamba la Nyoka JF-Expert Member

    #13
    Mar 25, 2008
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    eti tunakwenda kurudisha demokrasia Comoro. kweli?.

    Tunashirikiana na SUDAN, LIBYA kuleta demokrasia, hii imekaaje kaaje?.

    Kwamba sisi tumekomaa sana katika uwanja wa demokrasia kiasi kwamba tunajihisi kwamba tuna haki na wajibu wa kupeleka majeshi yetu kuleta demokrasia katika nchi za watu.
     
  14. S

    Sir Leem JF-Expert Member

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    Wanaumwe wapo kwenye mitaa ya anjuan wakishangiliwa na wananchi wa visiwa hivyo!
    Kazi waliyo tumwa na taifa wanaietekeleza kiushujaa!
     
  15. Gamba la Nyoka

    Gamba la Nyoka JF-Expert Member

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    wewe sir leem, unafikiri kukamata kisiwa ni tatizo, vita ina tactics nyingi sana, Wamarekani walishangiliwa Baghdad miaka mitano iliyopita lakini wewe mwenyewe shughuli yake si umeiona?.

    isije ikawa hao jamaa wameamua kutumia insurgency statergy,hiyo ni noma.

    Unaweza kuingia lakini kutoka ikawa balaa.
     
  16. F

    Fisadi Mtoto JF-Expert Member

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    Naona haya ni matumizi mabaya ya nafasi mlionayo ya kuandika humu.Tupe mawazo yako na siyo unajimu kama shikh hasiyekuawa na dira,hatuna haja ya kujua pua yako kama inanusa kulikomya nguruwe bali tuambie ulichonusa.
     
  17. Kitila Mkumbo

    Kitila Mkumbo Verified User

    #17
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    Mzee Mwanakijiji: On this on this one you are extremely wrong. Hakuna ubaya wowote watu kupinga majeshi yetu kwenda Comoro na wala kupinga huko wasionekane sio wazalendo au watanzania nusu. Watanzania wanaopinga majeshi yetu kwenda Comoro hawajaanza wao; hadi leo kuna watu kila pembe ya dunia wanapinga majeshi ya America na washirika wake kwenda Afighanistan na Iraq. Kuna watu hadi leo wanapinga vita yetu na Uganda. It is too simplistic kumtaka Wangwe ajiuzulu eti kwa sababu kapinga majeshi yetu kwenda Comoro.

    Weakness pekee aliyoifanya Wangwe ni kusema Rais kavunja katiba, hili kaliongea kisiasa na ni katika jitihada za wanasiasa wetu kujitafutia umaarufu kwa bei rais, which I resent, lakini siamini kwamba ni jambo linamfanya ajiuzulu.

    Binafsi nimejizuia sana kutoa comments kuhusu majeshi yetu kwenda Comoro na ninaipa the benefit of doubt serikali. Hii ni kwa sababu katika jambo zito kama hili la jeshi, serikali ina taarifa muhimu ambazo zimewafanya wafikie maamuzi waliofikia, lakini sisi wengine hatuna taarifa zozote za maana zaidi ya kujenga hoja zetu kwa mujibu wa hisia.
     
  18. Gamba la Nyoka

    Gamba la Nyoka JF-Expert Member

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    Tatizo litakuja kama kweli hizo taarifa walizonazo zinatosha kutufanya tupeleke majeshi yetu huko ili kurudisha demokrasia Comoro.
    ndiyo maana tunahoji maamuzi hayo,je bacar anaua watu wake?, je kulikuwa na possibility ya genocide au massacre, kwangu mimi hizo ndizo sababu za msingi kabisa za kupeleka majeshi yetu popote duniani ili kuyakomesha mambo hayo.

    lakini "kuleta demokrasia" kama operation inavyoitwa "operation democracy in comoro" mimi ninadhani hilo ni jukumu la wana comoro wenyewe na ikibidi jumuia ya kimataifa kuwasaidia katika mlengo wa diplomasia.

    wewe angalia nchi zenyewe tunazoshirikiana nazo kuleta hiyo demokrasia ,nchi kama libya, hawana demokrasia, nchi kama sudan wanapata wapi moral authority ya kuleta demokrasia kwa wanacomoro wakati kwao darfur moto unawaka na wanalaumiwa kuwafanyia kitu mbaya raia wake wenyewe?

    sisi kwetu Mambo hata ya Zanzibar hatujayamaliza then tunakwenda kuleta demokrasia katika nchi za wenzetu kwa kutumia majeshi yetu.

    By the way uliona wapi vita ikaleta demokrasia?
     
  19. M

    Mitomingi Senior Member

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    Mimi kama wewe Mtanzania na nadhani Wangwe ana haki kama vile wale pro war ama mabavu walivyo na haki sasa kumkandamiza .
     
  20. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #20
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    Mheshimiwa Spika, naomba nijibu hoja za waheshimiwa wote kwa mpigo!

    a. Kwa wale ambao hawajasikia alichosema Wangwe na mnajitokeza kuunga mkono sijui mnafanya hivyo kwa misingi gani? Chukua muda kumsikiliza alichosema ili angalau ujue ninachozungumzia nini na kwanini nimempinga, sikumpinga toka hewani.

    b. Sijahoji uzalendo wa Wangwe kwani siwezi kwani uzalendo ni nani anaweza kuupima? Nimehoji ujuzi wake wa Katiba na hususan madai yake yasiyo na msingi kuwa "Rais Kavunja Katiba", ambayo si madai madogo kama wengine wanavyotaka tuamini. Rais kuvunja Katiba kunaweza kumuondoa madarakani.

    c. Wengi mnatumia neno "Vita" loosely. Tanzania haiko vitani. Kila mahali ambapo vikosi vya majeshi vinapigana haina maana nchi iko vitani. Ndio maana madai ya Wangwe ya kutumia kipengele cha 44 cha Katiba hayana msingi kwani yanatokana na false assumption i.e Tanzania iko vitani.

    d. Naona neno la "kaa Pembeni" limetafsiriwa nimemtaka Wangwe ajiuzulu, ningetaka kusema ajiuzulu nisingesita kufanya hivyo. Sijasema Wangwe ajiuzulu ati kwa sababu kasema kitu ambacho si sahihi. Hapana, nimesema kimsingi kama hajui katiba na anainukuu vibaya kwa malengo ya kisiasa, akae pembeni.

    e. Vijana wetu wako kwenye mapigano na wako hatarini, haisaidii kuwavunja mori, kwa kudai ati amiri jeshi mkuu kavunja Katiba. Kama alikuwa na hoja ya merit ya sisi kushirikiana na AU kwenye hiyo operesheni angeweza kutoa hoja hiyo kama wengine walivyotoa hapa, lakini kudai kuwa Tanzania iko vitani na Rais kavunja Katiba siyo tu ni ufinyu wa kuelewa Katiba lakini pia ni hatari kwa kiongozi wa juu wa kisiasa kama yeye.
     
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