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Udini CCM? - viongozi waislam ni 75

Discussion in 'Jamii Intelligence' started by Mgaya, Nov 7, 2007.

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  1. M

    Mgaya JF-Expert Member

    #1
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    Kuna mtu aliwahi kusema hapa kuwa kuna makubaliano ndani ya CCM kuwa na uwakilishi sawa wa dini kubwa nchini za uislam na ukristo. Matokeo ya uchaguzi Dodoma yanaonyesha kuwa waislam sasa wana-nafasi asilimia 75 ya uongozi wa CCM.

    Ilivyokuwa CUF na viongozi wengi waislam watu waliita cuf, chama cha waislam. Sijui kama CCM itaitwa the same name? Viongozi wakuu wanne, Kikwete, Karume, Msekwa, na Makamba; ratio inaonekana tayari. Kwa kamati kuu (CC), ratio ipo wazi, cha ajabu hata NEC, ni the same trend.

    Haya ni makubaliano ndani ya ccm au ni mabadiliko ya yale makubaliano ya awali? Naomba kuwasilisha
     
  2. Ibrah

    Ibrah JF-Expert Member

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    Mgaya, hawa CCM siku zote hutumia ujanja wao na umbumbumbu wa Wtz kwa maslahi yao kisiasa; ni hao hao ndiyo huanzisha propaganda chafu dhidi ya wapinzani wao kisiasa kwa kuwaita CUF ni chama cha kidini na CHADEMA chama cha kifamilia!

    Nijuavyo mimi siku zote composition ya NEC ya CCM na CC yao wengi wao ni Waislam kwa maana ya kuwa NEC ya CCM huwa na idadi sawa ya wajumbe toka pande zote za Muungano. Mara nyingi utakuta upande wa Bara Wakristo wanazidi kidogo au inakuwa 50:50 lakini kwa sababu nusu ya Wajumbe wengine hutoka Zanzibar basi kule utakuta 99% ya wajumbe niu Waislam na hapo lazima NEC ya CCM inakuwa na Waislam wengi vivyo hivyo CC.

    Kwa miaka mingi hilo halikuwa tatizo hadi pale Mwalimu Nyerere alipofariki ndipo likanza kuw issue maana hatuna tena mtu wa kukemea upuuzi huo. Sasa hili suala la kazi linapata nguvu kwa kuwa Mwalimu hayupo na Serikali kwa influence ya Waislamu wengi kuwepmo katika NEC na CC ya CCM usishangae hayo unayosema yakawa kweli maana hili suala halikuwahata la kujadiliwa, lingekemewa mapema lakini kwa kuwa wanahisi umaarufu wao (CCM) umepungua wemelazimika kuweka hilo katika Ilani kwa ahadi ya kulitafutioa ufumbuzi suala hilo na ukweli ni kuwa hawawezi kulipatia ufumbuzi sahihi hadi pale watakaporuhusu Mahkama ya Kadhi ianzishwe.

    Kwa maoni yangu, madai hayo yanatiwa nguvu na udhaifu uliomo katika Serikali hii ya CCM.
     
  3. K

    Koba JF-Expert Member

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    ...bora hata tusijadili hili mpaka tuone matatizo yatokee kutokana na hiyo ratio,naogopa kuloose support ya wanajambo forum ya kupigana na mafisadi ....si unajua wengi kwao dini mbele maslahi baadaye!
     
  4. Rev. Kishoka

    Rev. Kishoka JF-Expert Member

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    Who cares if 75% of leadership belongs to Masjid? the question is not their religion but their organizational skills, efficiency, capability to lead and standing tall to deliver.

    Dini ni hisia and as long as people continue to feel inferior, they will always be inferior in their minds and actions.

    Wanaolalamika hata mkiwapa viti vyote vya Bunge kamwe hawataweza kuwa na maendeleo bali ni kubadilisha mbinu za kisisasa na kutumia udini badala ya kuleta maendeleo ya kweli kuondoa Ujinga, Umasikini na Maradhi!

    Do not worry, let them be 100%
     
  5. Gamba la Nyoka

    Gamba la Nyoka JF-Expert Member

    #5
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    Hivi hao watu walipachikwa ama wamegombea?

    Kama hawakupachikwa hivi waliowapigia kura watu hao ni watu wa dini gani?.

    Hivi makamba angepata kura za waislamu pekee angeshinda NEC?
    Au kepteni John Komba angepata kura za Wakristo pekee angeingia NEC?.

    Na hao Wakristu kina Lowassa walikaa tu wakiona wakristu wenzao wanapokonywa ushindi na waislamu?.

    Gentlemen what are you trying to say?
     
  6. R

    Rwabugiri JF-Expert Member

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    Hii issue ndugu nashauli tu tuiache make ukiendelea fukua yaliyo funikwa acha kwenye chama njoo kwenye teuzi za wakuu wa Wilaya, Mikoa na teuzi zinginezo hutoamini utakacho kutana nacho!.

    Funikeni kombe tusonge mbele, Kwani 'ukichokonoa alacho nyuki hutolamba asali'
     
  7. Gamba la Nyoka

    Gamba la Nyoka JF-Expert Member

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    Rev Kishoka.
    What you are saying in this post is a great insult not only to Moslems But to Tanzanians at large.

    You just call the leadership chosen By the people on basis of their own party principles a MASJID LEADERSHIP!. what a distortation of facts!!!.

    according to you The one who signed the buzwagi contract is From Masjid leadership, and according to you has no skills, he cant deliver,and so on!

    according to your statement, the one who did illegal bussines and authorized heavy-burden Radar deal while in the state house is From Masjid leadership and according to you he has no skills, he cant deliver and so on!

    Look mr Rev.The problem in our country is not how many people of which religion or tribe are in which posts. the real problem is accountability, adhereing to rule of law, ability to lead and the desire to put national interests before personal interests.

    To be a christian doesnot make you a born-good leader,a born-efficient ,a born-able to deliver, etcetra.

    This kind of comment is an insult, and i hope you as a rev you will play a role to mend and not to devide.
     
  8. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Humu jamboforums waislamu ni wangapi na wakristo ni wangapi? Na wapagani ni wa ngapi?
     
  9. Mfamaji

    Mfamaji JF-Expert Member

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    Who cares if they are 110%?
     
  10. K

    Koba JF-Expert Member

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    Gamba la nyoka nafikiri hujaelewa aliyosema Rev Kishoka,sijaona any insults kwa waislam hapo,seems he care less kama atakayechaguliwa ni muislam au mkristo as long wata deliver!
     
  11. D

    Dr.Khamis Member

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    Mtu ukiwa ni kiongozi unatakiwa usipendelee dini yeyote kwani wewe ni kiongozi wa umma wote wa Watanzania. Dini zote hizi ni sawa na ndio kwa sababu hii nadhani mlimuona Rais J.Kikwete kenda Rome.
    Kitu kikubwa hapa ni kuwtaka hao viongozi wakiwa ni wa CCM au serikali waiongoze Tanzania ili tuondowe umasikini na watu wapate maisha bora. Waweze kuwapatia vijana wetu elimu ya kutosha katika ngazi zote za elimu na pia waweze kuwapatia vijana wetu fursa ya kufanya kazi. Waweze kuendeleza uchumi na kuboresha afya za Watanzania na kufanya juhudi ili tuepukwa na magonjwa kama Malaria, HIV(AIDS), CANCER na RUSHWA.
     
  12. FairPlayer

    FairPlayer JF-Expert Member

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    Ndugu Mgaya,

    Asubuhi nilikuomba uje na mawazo mmbadala na endelevu. Badala yake umekuja na kioja.

    Wakati wa Mkapa, mwenyekiti, makamu na katibu wote walikuwa wakristo, mbona hatukusikia waislamu kulalamika?

    Tafuta hoja mmbadala ya kuupondea CCM. Kama wewe huna chama au ni mpinzani basi ninthubutu kusema huna HOJA!
     
  13. Gamba la Nyoka

    Gamba la Nyoka JF-Expert Member

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    Koba inabidi kusoma between the lines ili kuelewa comment ya Rev Kishoka.
    hebu angalia hii rhehoric Question aliyoitumia kuanzia comment yake
    hebu jiulize ni leadership gani inayobelong to a Masjid?. hakuna leadership Tanzania inayobelong to a masjid.

    unless otherwise hapa kutumia neno Masjid hapa anageneralize Waislamu, hazungumzii mtu mmoja mmoja hapa, bali anazungumzia Waislamu kwa sababu Masjid inasimama inplace of moslems.

    Kisha angalia sentensi ya mwisho.
    .kwa sababu watajwa ambao ni hiyo 75% mleta hoja kasema ni Waislamu. Rev kishoka anawaambia wenye mashaka na hilo kwamba hata wala wasijali, waacheni hao waislamu wawe hata asilimia mia moja.

    kwanza kutumia neno wawe asilimia 100 ni exageration , yaani kutia chumvi mambo. ambapo Rev mwenyewe anafahamu wazi kwamba hilo haliwezekani. lakini effect ya kauli kama hii ni kuchochea hisia za jazba kwa wale wanaoamini Waislamu wameteka CCM kwa hiyo asilimia 75% wazidi kuwa na kinyongo ambacho hakipaswi kuwepo
     
  14. M

    Mwafrika wa Kike JF-Expert Member

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    Mgaya,

    Kwani hata kama 100% ya viongozi wa ccm ni waislam lakini wanaongoza vizuri wewe una tatizo na hilo?

    Haya ndiyo nilimkatalia Mchambuzi hapa alivyokuwa analazimisha kuwa kiongozi ajaye Tz lazima awe mkristo. Mimi naona dini isiwe kigezo kabisa cha kutambua viongozi.

    Sidhani kama mbinu chafu za ccm za kuita cuf chama cha kiislam eti kwa sababu viongozi wake wengi walikuwa waislam ndiyo itumike kwa ccm pia. Ni kweli asilimia 75% au zaidi ya viongozi wa ccm ni waislam BUT this should never be a reason kuanzisha ugomvi wa kidini Tanzania!
     
  15. M

    Mwafrika wa Kike JF-Expert Member

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    mhh Ibra,

    Siasa ni mchezo mgumu sana. Maelezo mazuri sana haya though.
     
  16. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Hi Mamacita..
     
  17. Nungunungu

    Nungunungu JF-Expert Member

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    And who cares if you are Rev Kishoka or Rev SHETANI?
     
  18. Nyambala

    Nyambala JF-Expert Member

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    Nadhani tumeanza kuusahau wosia wa baba wa taifa. Nanukuu "Itakuja tokea wakati kukawa na viongozi woote waislamu au woote wakristo. Hiyo si hoja maana hatuchagui shehe, padri wala mchungaji. Suala ni vigezo vinavyohitajika vimetimia kwa kiongozi huyo na katika vigezo hivyo ikumbukwe dini haipo hata kidogo?"

    Hiyo basi ndugu zangu huko tunakotaka kwenda siko, the issue ni kwamba tuchague viongozi wenye sifa zinazotakiwa na pia let's hold viongozi wazembe, mafisadi accountable bila kujali dini zao. Dini itakuwa inclusive kwenye vyeo vya kidini maana mkristo hawezi kuwa imamu, au mwislamu kuwa mchungaji.

    Safari yetu ni ngumu na bado mbichi kuelekea maendeleo sasa tukianza kuchanganya na haya, well I don't know!
     
  19. K

    Koba JF-Expert Member

    #19
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    hii topic sio siasa tena ila ni udini tuu,nilijua topic kama hizi zinainvolve emotions za watu kwa hiyo hapo dini mbele then siasa baadaye...dini is so powerfull,bora hamishia hii kule kwenye imani na dini ili mkakutane na kina mtindio wa ubongo muone alivyochanganyikiwa
     
  20. Rev. Kishoka

    Rev. Kishoka JF-Expert Member

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    Gamba,

    I will repeat in a different mannaer. I do not care if 75% of CCM leadersship is made up of people of Islamic faith. Same thing if it was 100% Islam or Christian.

    May be you jumped into conclusion that I am vindicative due to my REV. title.

    Bottom line I do not care about your religion, what i care is if you have passion to lead and delibver and not otherwise. In the past, there have been outcries that Waislamu have no enough representation in Bunge, Serikali or Mawaziri. I say let them take over 100% because at the end what matter it not about your faith but if you can be faithful to Jamhuri and deliver results.

    I despise anyone who thinks having religious upper hand makes them better deliveres of quality leadership or that they will resolve critical issues that affect our nation.

    May be you do not know my stand on issues and you come in here assuming that just because I am a Rev. then I am short sighted.

    Matatizo ya Watanzania si ya Waislamu pekee, ni ya Wapangani na Wakristo. ndio maan animesema, sijali ni dini gani uliyonayo, wajibu wako ni kuhakikisha kama kongozi unaongoza kupiga vita Ujinga, Umasikini na Maradhi. la nyingeza ni kuwa Utatumia uongozi wako na madaraka kwa hekima kuhakikisha kuwa Haki na Usawa unatumika na sii Imani yako ya kibaguzi ya kidini.

    Finally, as Christian I have no fear if 110% of leadership is made up by Moslems!

    My own progression as human being and development to get away from poverty does not come from going to church and preach that Islam is bad religion. My success will come due to hard working, being ethical and just.

    Yes I am christian by faith and I care about my faith and religion, however if I am strong on my faith and spirituality, why should I be worried about Moslems being leaders? how does that interfere with my progression? Yes i will be vocal if they will try to impose their faith as the only way of living in my country, if they will decide that I as Christioan has no place in Tanzania where I can enjoy my Freedom, than I can have Kiti Moto without fear of kutupiwa moto or Fatwa!

    Tanzania as country and its constitution and laws have no rligion. Its people though are from different faiths. So what leads and governs Tanzania is its Constitution and Laws, not a Bible, Quran or Mbuyu!
     
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