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Tuzo ya DOWANS kwa TANESCO ni utapeli kama Richmond ilivyokuwa; Hakukuwa na hukumu ICC!

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by nderingosha, Oct 15, 2011.

  1. n

    nderingosha JF-Expert Member

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    Oct 15, 2011
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    Imenibidi nilete changamoto hii kwa jukwaa la jamii forum ili ifanyiwe kazi haraka iwezekanavyo maana sisi kama watanzania tunaweza tukawa tumeingizwa mkenge uleule kama yalivyotokea mambo ya Richmund kwamba kampuni iligundulika feki kwa kujifanya mambo yao yamefanyika USA na kwingineko ulaya huku wakijua watanzania wana tatizo kubwa la kutafuta habari muhimu (kwa maana ya kutokutafiti mambo....yaani kutotaka kutafuta ukweli wa mambo haswa yale yafanyikayo nje ya mipaka ya Tz).

    Ili limekuwa tatizo hata kwa professionals wetu wa ndani (sijui ni kwanini kuna uvivu wa kujua issues haswa za nje zenye uhusiano na nchi yetu??....maana huku ndiko tunakoingizwa mikenge mikubwa....angalieni issue za rada...richmond na dowans na hata madini yetu yanavyouzwa nje...na hata ufisadi kwenye mabalozi yetu...huku ndiko tunakopigwa ipasavyo....maana hatufuatilii mambo yakishatoka nje ya TZ. Nimeanza hivyo nikitaka kuleta issue hii ya sakata la malipo ya hii tozo ya ICC kwa dowans.

    Nimefanya utafiti na kugundua yafuatayo kuhusu mchakato mzima wa jinsi dowans wanavyodai walipewa hii tozo...(tusijirizishe sana na documents zilizotumwa tz..kwani matapeli hawajulikani kwa documents). Hili linaweza likawa ni mkenge wa kufa mtu tumeingizwa kama nchi bila kujua(kwani mara ngapi hawa hawa professionals wetu wameingia mikenge???).Nianze kufafanua kama ifuatavyo alafu niwaachie mtafakari na mchukue hatua.....kila mtu kwa nafasi yake....


    • Kwa kuanza tu nianze kwa huyu bwana anayeitwa...Gerald Aksen. Huyu ameripotiwa kwenye magazeti kama ndie jaji aliyetoa eti hukumu katika kesi ya ICC International court of arbitration...yaani kesi imefanyika chini yake kama mwenyekiti. Katika profile yake huyu bwana ni retired prof.wa sheria katika law firm ya Thelen LLP-USA. Profile yake ni pana na amefanya kazi nyingi mojawapo ikiwa arbitration. Hajaandikwa kuwa aliwahi kuajiriwa na ICC ila kwasasa anafanya kazi kama self employed mediator and ADR Neutral. Katika hukumu ya ICC kwa Tanesco haijuklikani huyu bwana alitumikaje kwa ICC. Pata attachment yenye profile yake jumla hapa chini.

    • Katika ICC dispute resolutions...kazi ya ADR Neutral ni kama ifuatayo: kutumia busara,utaalamu na common sense katika dispute kati ya parties (pande husika).Pia kuonyesha imani kwa pande zote husika na kusaidia pande zote husika kufikia muafaka kwa manufaa ya pande zote mbili. Pia yeye ADR neutral kazi yake kubwa si jaji bali ni facilitator(mwezeshaji)kwa pande zote mbili kufikia muafaka.Yeye pia ndie anayeweza hata kuchagua ni lugha gani itumike katika shauri ili tu pawepo na muafaka na maelewano kwa manufaa ya pande zote mbili. Sasa kama hizi ndizo kazi za ADR Neutral wa ICC katika kutatua disputes...na kama huyu bwana alitumika na kwa experience yake ilivyo kubwa kwa maswala ya arbitration.....haiwezekani kabisa Tanesco washindwe kesi ile......haiwezekani hata kidogo.Sasa tujiulize nini kimefanyika?????.Nimeambatanisha document hapa yenye mchanganuo wa kazi za ICC ADR Neutral.Huyu bwana hawezi kuwa ametumiwa na ICC bila ya kuwa ADR Neutral na kama ametumiwa kama ADR Neutral na ICC basi haiwezekani Tanesco washindwe shauri lile.

    • Kama Gerald Aksen wanasema ametumika kama jaji wa ICC International court of arbitration.....pia haiwezekani kwani yeye si jaji na pia si mwanasheria tena kwani ameshastaafu.Profile yake inasema hajawahi kuwa jaji wa ICC court of arbitration.Soma attachment.

    • Sheria za ICC zinasema ADR Neutral anachaguliwa kwa makubaliano ya pande mbili husika au ICC wenyewe kwa kukubaliana na pande husika. Swali: je Tanesco walishiriki vipi kumchagua Gerald Aksen kama alitumika kama ADR Neutral?

    • ICC Dispute Board Centre inafanya kazi separate from the ICC International Court of Arbitration, the ICC International Centre for Expertise na pia ICC ADR Secretariat.Kama Tanesco hawakuridhika na maamuzi yaliyotolewa juu ya tuzo bado wangeweza kupeleka malalamiko kwenye ICC Dispute Board Centre au ICC ADR secretariat kama hawakuridhishwa na utendaji wa ADR Neutral. Swali: je Tanesco walifanya hivyo?????kwa mujibu wa ICC...tozo hutolewa baada ya makubaliano muafaka ya pande zote mbili.

    Types of ICC ADR techniques:

    · Under the ICC ADR Rules, parties may freely choose the settlement technique they consider most appropriate to their situation.Je hili tozo lilikuwa appropriate kwa Tanesco kama mdau mmojawapo?????

    · 1) Mediation: The Neutral may meet each of the parties separately to help them find common ground for resolving the dispute amicably. Je common grounds zilifikiwa na pande zote mbili???

    · 2)Neutral evaluation: The parties seek the Neutral's non-binding opinion on such matters as:

    · An issue of fact:-Did the maintenance teams do what was expected of them?

    · A technical issue. Were the girders supplied in accordance with stress specifications? or did the generators produce emergence power to the country???(Tanzania)

    · An issue of law. Did the floods that held up delivery of essential spare parts constitute force majeure?

    · Then the panel either seeks a solution acceptable to all the parties or expresses an opinion on the positions of each side.

    • Ukifatilia hizi techniques za ICC dispute resolution kwa vyovyote vile kama zingefuatwa kweli kweli kwa hakika Tanesco wasingeshindwa kesi. Nimeambatanisha hapa attachment yenye haya yote please read!!!!!!.Pia nimeambatanisha sheria....rules document ya ICC dispute resolution hapa.Someni muamue kama watanzania hatuingizwi technical mkenge hapa....na hawa wanasheria wetu haya mambo hawasomi?????hawa kina mwanasheria mkuu wanafanya nini jamani??????

    • Kwa kumalizia tu nimtaje mshiriki mwingine katika shauri hili alikuwa huyu bwana Switilin Munyantwali.Huyu ni Mganda mwanasheria anayefanyia kazi marekani na alitumika nadhani kwa dowans. Yeye profile yake (attached) inaonyesha ni executive director wa African law institute in USA na pia ana majukumu chungu mzima....na ukiangalia huwezi amini alipata wapi muda wa kukaa kwenye shauri na kuwashinda Tanesco kwa hoja.Hawa jamaa wote wako nje ya nchi wakati Dowans walifanya kazi Tz.......na tatizo lilkuwepo tz, sasa vipi hawa jamaa washinde kesi???inaonyesha mapungufu makubwa yalikuwepo kwa upande wa Tanesco (walifanya kwa makusudi kabisa ili washindwe kesi...)kwani hakuna kigezo ambacho kingewazuia kushinda...

    • Mjamaa mwingine aliyeshirikishwa na dowans kama inavyosemwa ni huyu.....Jonathan Parker....huyu bwana nimeshindwa kujua ni Jonathan yupi haswa maana wako wengi (unapo search). Nimejikuta nikifikiri kuwa ni labda mcheza cricket...maana yupo pia mcheza cricket mwenye hili jin...naomba mumtafute profile....now that you get the tip and food for thouth as Great thinkers....

    Mwisho kabisa naungana na wote kupinga hii hela kupewa hawa matapeli......na nina uhakika hii hela ni utapeli.....kama kawaida unaofanywa na mitandao ya wajanja nje ikiwashirikisha wanasiasa wa maji tak tulio nao tz........nawasilisha.....find all the attachments please....


    NYONGEZA:

    The ICC ADR Rules offer a framework for the amicable settlement of commercial disputes with the assistance of a neutral. They were launched in 2001 to replace the 1988 Rules of Conciliation. Under the ICC ADR Rules, parties may freely choose the settlement technique they consider most appropriate to their situation. This may be mediation, whereby a neutral helps the parties to settle their differences through negotiation; a mini-trial, in which a panel comprising a neutral and a manager from each party proposes a solution or gives an opinion; or a neutral evaluation of a point of law or fact. Common to all these techniques is the fact that the decision reached by or in collaboration with the neutral is not binding upon the parties. The success of the chosen technique will depend largely on the qualities of the neutral. He or she may be designated directly by the parties or appointed by ICC. In the latter case, the parties may specify certain requirements as to the qualifications or attributes the neutral should possess. Lastly, the parties are not limited to a single technique, but may find it useful to apply a combination of settlement techniques.


    Maswali ya kujiuliza:

    · Uamuzi wa usuluishi kati ya pande mbili husika si binding kati ya pande husika (yaani hauzifunganishi pande husika….yaani waweza kubadilishwa kama kulikuwa na tatizo kwenye mkataba…si lazima uwe wa mwisho).Je hii imekuwaje kwa Tanesco kubebeshwa tozo kirahisi???hapa kuna walakini.Huu ni mchezo mchafu….hii kitu ni feki jamani.

    · Mafanikio ya usuluhishi hutegemea ubora wa Neutral aliyetumika.Huyu bwana Gerald Aksen alitumikaje kwenye hii issue…maana inasemwa tu kuwa ndiye jaji….wakati sheria za ICC zinasema hamna jaji kwenye haya maswala bali facilitator (mwezeshaji).

    · Kanuni za ICC zinasema huyu Neutral huteuliwa na ICC au pande husika.Je Tanesco walihusishwaje kwenye uteuzi wa huyu bwana Gerald Aksen?

    · Pande husika zinatakiwa zitumie njia tofauti za usuluhishi na si moja tu ili kufikia muafaka, mfano, mediation, mini trial, etc (hii ni kw mujibu wa kanuni za ICC---someni).Je njia hizi tofauti zilitumika mpaka ukatoka uamuzi uliotoka????

    · Maswali ni mengi na mkisoma kwa makini mtagundua hii tozo si kweli na inaweza kuwa imepikwa kijanja kama ilivyowahi kutokea kuwa Richmond ilikuwa kampuni feki…….tufatilie….hapa kuna uwezekano kuwa Tanesco wamebebeshwa hukumu kihuni na kijanja……..haya mambo yanweza yasiwe na connection hata kule ICC kwenye Dispute secretariat or ADB ICC boards (ninaamini hivi)…you will tell me….time will tell……
     

    Attached Files:

  2. JamboJema

    JamboJema JF-Expert Member

    #2
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    Swali ni: ikiwa yooote uliyosema ni kweli, inakuwaje hawa ICC wanakuwa kimya wakati tunataka kutapeliwa kwa jina lao? Something fishy is happening here!
     
  3. M

    Mkandara Verified User

    #3
    Oct 15, 2011
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    Nderingosha,
    Shukran sana mkuu wangu unajua tena wengine hapa hatufahamu sheria wala vyombo vyake hasa hivi vya kimataifa.. Mimi binafsi nilikuwa na mashaka sana na hili na bado ninayo mashaka kwa sababu nijuavyo mimi na ujinga wangu ICC ni International CRIMINAL Court na hili swala la Tanesco na Dowans ni Kesi ya MADAI ilikuwaje swala hili likaenda huko!

    Sasa kwa kutokuwa na uhakika na kuona vyombo vyote vya sheria na wanasheria nchini wamekaa kimya nikasema pengine ndivyo inavyokuwa japokuwa hatukuisikia kesi ikindeshwa kama tunavyosikia kesi nyinginezo, mfano ya Kenya na kadhalika. Licha ya hivyo niliwahi kutafuta kesi ya Dowans Vs Tanesco au Tanzania ktk records za ICC sikupata jibu zaidi ya kutokuwepo habari yoyote inayohusiana na kesi hiyo... Kwa hiyo, mimi nadhani wananchi tunatakiwa kukaza uzi kupinga malipo haya kwa nguvu zote hadi ukweli upatikane. Na ikiwezekana bunge likifunguliwa wabunge wetu waombe nakala za kesi hiyo ili kufuatilia wahusika wote ili kupata uhakika wa kile kilichotokea hadi ICC kutoa maamuzi ya hukumu na sii muafaka kama serikali ilivyodai.
     
  4. G

    Gagnija JF-Expert Member

    #4
    Oct 15, 2011
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    Mkuu Mkandara,

    Kama sijakosea, msuluhishi hapo alikuwa ni International Chamber of Commerce na siyo ile Criminal Court. Nafikiri tulifungwa goli kwenye kipengele cha usuluhishi pale mkataba ulipokuwa unatengenezwa kwani waliotengeneza dili walikuwa wanafahamu wanachokifanya.
     
  5. Lambardi

    Lambardi JF-Expert Member

    #5
    Oct 15, 2011
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    Kesi yenyewe ilifanyika hapa hapa dar na wahusika wote walidhaminiwa na king maker sasa unategemea nini???
     
  6. Mzee

    Mzee JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Oct 15, 2011
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    Naomba Tanesco waharakishe kuwalipa hawa jamaa. Mwanzoni deni lilikuwa 94bl, sasa limefika 111bl. Tunazidi kuchelewesha malipo.

    Maji yakishamwagika hayazoleki.
     
  7. Anko Sam

    Anko Sam JF-Expert Member

    #7
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    Zote ni sarakasi za kujipatia hela za kampeni
     
  8. Felixonfellix

    Felixonfellix JF-Expert Member

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    Asante sana mkuu
    Huu nao ni ujumbe mpya
    Natamani wenye ujuzi na sheria watupanue mawazo
    Ikiwa ni vyema pia unaweza kuiweka kure katika jukwaa la sheria ili kuwapata kirahisi
    Tafadhali wanasheria jitokezeni ili tujue nini kinaendelea hapa
     
  9. M

    Mkandara Verified User

    #9
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    Shukuran sana ndio naelewa hivyo sasa hawa ICC ni Org inayotambuliwa na UN kama ile Criminal Court au ni kitu gani maanake naona kuna members!
     
  10. W

    We know next JF-Expert Member

    #10
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    REX Attorneys mansemaje Hapo??
     
  11. C

    Chesty JF-Expert Member

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    Usicheze hata kidogo na serikali za kimafioso.
     
  12. N

    Ngonini JF-Expert Member

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    Hii nzuri umefikiria nje ya box! Wanasheria tuanzeni kuboresha hii argument inaweza ikawa ndo kete yao iko hapo sasa Mungu ameamua kufunulia watakatifu wake. Kinachoonekana hapa hii siyo hukumu ya kisheria bali yalipashwa yafanyike mashauriano mbele ya ADR mpaka pande zote mbili zikubaliane. Inamaana TANESCO wao hawakuwa hata na uchungu wakaona ni sawa tu kulipa hizo pesa. Haiingii akilini huyo ADR aone ni sahihi kwa TANESCO kuilipa kampuni ambayo at the first place ilidanyanya uhalali wake katika mkataba. Kama kweli Tanesco walikuwa na option ya kumkataa huyu ADR kwa nini hawakumkataa? Hapa Tanesco,Mwanasheria mkuu, Serikali(JK) na wengine wote lao moja. Pesa hizi ni kwa matumbo ya watu wala si za downs. Kama ingekuwa kweli pesa hii inatoka kwenye budget ya TANESCO NA KUINGIA NA DOWNS PASIPO WAO KUMEGA CHOCHOTE hamna ambaye angekubali kushindwa kwa urahisi namna hii.
     
  13. Bigirita

    Bigirita JF-Expert Member

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    Hii ngumu sana kumeza hii!!!
    hapa kuna mawili tu,
    1) CCM wawauzie hawa wahuni sehemu ya nchi yetu bila sisi kujua, au
    2) CCM iparanganyike na hawa wahuni waridhike.

    Katika hali ya kawaida, hawa jamaa hawalipiki mchana kweupe kwani hawakuja mchana kweupe. And they knoww what they are doing.

    I tell you me, Kikwete yanamgonga saa hizi!!
     
  14. n

    nderingosha JF-Expert Member

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    Ngonini umenielewa vizuri....
    Kwa logic hata ya mtu asiyejua sheria za huwezi kuiamini hii eti waliyoita hukumu na tozo kutakliwa kulipwa.kwa kifupi mimi nina uhakika asilima 100% kuwa hukumu haikuwepo na Tanesco hawakushirikishwa katika maamuzi kinyume na sheria za dispute resolution za icc zinavyosema kama nilivyochambua juu. Mkienda kwenye web site ya ICC mkatafuta mtakuta sheria zote za masuluhishi ziko pale.Kwa kifupi hukumu huwa haitolewei bali makubaliano ya pande mbili tena baada ya pande zote husika kukubaliana kwa mujibu wa sheria za ICC. Hata kumchagua ADR Neutral kunahusisha pande zote.Pia kuna njia tofauti za kutafuta muafka ambazo lazima zote zifutwe ili kufikia makubaliano kwa faida ya pande zote mbili.Hata kama mmoja wa wahusika hatakubaliana na maamuzi au mtitiriko mzima wa shauri anaweza kukataa kuendelea na ICC wanakubali hivi kwa mujibu wa sheria. Pia kuna bodi ya ICC ADR board au ICC Dispute Secretariat ambao ndio wanashughulikia hizi dispute resolutions ambao kama upande mmoja hawaridhiki wanaweza kulalamika kule. Nasema tena hata kama mkataba wa biashara ulikuwa mbovu au ulifunga upande mmoja,sheria za iCC zinasema mikataba hii ni non-binding,yaani inaweza kubadilishwa hata kama kulikuwa na makosa ya kisheria. Kwa mtizamo huu.....na kwa kuangalia kuwa waliokuwa na makosa zaidi ni hawa dowans waliokuwa wamerithi mkataba feki richmond, utaona kuwa aliyekuwa na nguvu kubwa ya kushinda kwenye shauri hili ni Tanesco lakini mambo yakawa the opposite, hii haikubaliki ndugu zangu.......watu wanalalamika hapa kuwa pesa zisilipwe, lakini wangejua kuwa hata hiyo tuzo yenyewe ni utapeli, yaani imepikwa..........kama ilivyokuw richmond.....walioingizwa mkenge si hawa hawa Tanesco??na wizara ya ngeleja?........someni kwa makini hapa...


    ADR techniques: This may be mediation, whereby a neutral helps the parties to settle their differences through negotiation; a mini-trial, in which a panel comprising a neutral and a manager from each party proposes a solution or gives an opinion; or a neutral evaluation of a point of law or fact. Common to all these techniques is the fact that the decision reached by or in collaboration with the neutral is not binding upon the parties. The success of the chosen technique will depend largely on the qualities of the neutral. He or she may be designated directly by the parties or appointed by ICC. In the latter case, the parties may specify certain requirements as to the qualifications or attributes the neutral should possess. Lastly, the parties are not limited to a single technique, but may find it useful to apply a combination of settlement techniques.
     
  15. maulaga

    maulaga JF-Expert Member

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    Huna maana hata kama unanufaika na huo ufisadi.
     
  16. umkhonto

    umkhonto Member

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    du sasa ndio najua kwanini haitakiwi tuelemike sisi watanzania,haya mambo yatakuwa magumu kufanyika...mie nilidhani kiwango cha elimu kushuka ni uzembe wa serikali ya CCM,kumbe ni mkakati wa utawala mrahisi...
     
  17. Mwakalinga Y. R

    Mwakalinga Y. R Tanzanite Member

    #17
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    kweli huu ni mkenge mwingine
     
  18. eliakeem

    eliakeem JF-Expert Member

    #18
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    hayo yanawezekana.......maana kama kampuni zenyewe Richmond au hata Dowans haijulikani na hazipo popote........hata hiyo hukumu inawezekana ni ya kutunga....hilo linawezekana kabisa...halafu mbona kwenye mwenendo wa shauri lenyewe hatukusikia popote...tukaja kusikia mwishoni kuwa tanesco walipe tozo...........hapo kuna kitu tu......mbona kesi ya rada tulikuwa tunasikia hata mwenendo wa kesi......na hata tukifuatilia nyaraka kwenye mtandao tunazipata? mimi nashauri tufuatilie kwa msajili wa ICC ili tuone mashauri yaliyoisha na kupatiwa tuzo....na ikiwezekana kama taratibu zote zilifuatwa....kwa maana ICC hawawezi kuendesha shauri baina ya Tanesco na dowans kisirisiri huku wakijua fika kuwa shauri hilo linagusa maslahi ya umma....
     
  19. eliakeem

    eliakeem JF-Expert Member

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    May be you are right.........I remember one of African American literature......'why are you giving education to a slave......you are destroying a good slave'. so a good slave can be destroyed by education. that holds water ..... we can not be good slaves if we are educated.
     
  20. Patriote

    Patriote JF-Expert Member

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    Maji gani yaliyomwagika!!!!!??? Najua wale wote wenye asili ya ufisadi na kuneemeka nao wana mawazo kama yako ya kutaka malipo yafanyike haraka kabla wazalendo hawajashtukia ubabaishaji na utapeli uliofanyika. Hakuna malipo hadi tuelewe ni malipo ya nn hasa. Serikali ya kifisadi na ya kibabaishaji haiwezi kuaminiwa hata pale inapolazimu kuaminiwa, katika hili wananchi wazalendo naomba tusaidiane kumulika mwizi.
     
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