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Pork Projects

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Mlenge, Apr 19, 2010.

  1. Mlenge

    Mlenge Verified User

    #1
    Apr 19, 2010
    Joined: Oct 31, 2006
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    Let us tell our beloved members of Parliament to pass this suggestion of:

    1. Give Mara, parts of Arusha, Kilimanjaro and Tanga to Uganda (so that Uganda can have its own sea port and, and more land.

    2. Give the remaining parts of Kilimanjaro and Arusha (including all the mountains) to Kenya.

    3. Give Kagera region to Rwanda.

    4. Give Kigoma to Burundi.

    In return, they should leave our country free, and tell our Members of Parliament not to accept the EAC 'common market protocol' that essentially is giving our entire country.

    Let's do it!

    Mlenge
     
  2. Eliphaz the Temanite

    Eliphaz the Temanite JF-Expert Member

    #2
    Apr 19, 2010
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    That's sarcastic!
     
  3. Mlenge

    Mlenge Verified User

    #3
    Apr 19, 2010
    Joined: Oct 31, 2006
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    Seriously.

    Because our Members of Parliament, are about to endorse an agreement that will give entire country away.

    So, which is lesser evil, we give away a little part of country, or whole of it?

    Mlenge
     
  4. shugri

    shugri Member

    #4
    Apr 19, 2010
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    Mlege...
    I have never seen such kind of fear from ones writting! why do u thing we cant compete?
    Competition increases efficiency i am 100% for a common market cause i belive good things will
    come out of it. For how long shall we be afraid? Till when? Using what indicators can we judge that
    now is the right time? If we want growth we need to act.
    Let us not let political speeches blind us, parliamntarian's only wants votes now, they will say almost
    anything to make sure they get political apeal. Furthermore, most of what they say lacks emperical
    as well as emprical evidences- we need that expansive market, we need widernern labour opportunities
    we need easy mobility within these five countries.
    Why are we afraid- i can alomst say that the fear is pyschological- and self induced- which we can get rid with
    without any kind of therapies.

    Its time-no time to waste!
     
  5. Mlenge

    Mlenge Verified User

    #5
    Apr 19, 2010
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    Shugri,

    Yours, and arguments of fellow supporters of EAC are using Strawman Argument Fallacy to advance your point.

    Strawman -- effigy or a paper model -- and shoot it sort of argument.

    EAC supporters brand as "coward" anyone who opposes EAC. You misrepresent illegality of EAC and its ill-motives by suggesting we the opponent of EAC are "afraid", have "fears", "cannot compete" (all these strawmen), then you attack the strawmen you created, and pretend you have "won" the argument.

    Sheer crap!

    This is also Red-Herring Argument Fallacy -- You introduce a distraction ("you are cowards") so that the argument moves from the real one -- pork projects suggested, and that EAC is with evil intentions about Tanzania.

    So, if you have nothing meaningful to contribute, just hold on your peace, otherwise the topic of discussion here is the Pork Projects and ways of contributing.

    The your four countries can go on their cooperation, if only one country Tanzania pulls out. Right?

    Members of Parliamment, this is your last chance of showing that you care, and you know what you are doing. Do the right thing and reject this animus EAC.

    Mlenge
     
  6. Mpita Njia

    Mpita Njia JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Apr 19, 2010
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    I think MPs are going to reject the Common Market Protocol
     
  7. shugri

    shugri Member

    #7
    Apr 19, 2010
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    Mlege............i consider ur argument very potential,
    at the same time i consider it to be very emotional.
    As u reject common market in EAC, please give me
    ur line of arguments as to why? as i have mentioned few
    of the advantges of it, wider market and labour etc.

    Its important to argue wit evidence other than speculations,
    that Common market will harm TZ how?

    NB: Fancy philosophical words doesnt make strong argument

    Regards
     
  8. Mlenge

    Mlenge Verified User

    #8
    Apr 19, 2010
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    Shukli,

    There is no one benefit to get out of EAC that we cannot get elsewhere.

    If there are sane people remaining in our country, (we know there are MPs who are still sane and sober), let us reject the whole EAC thing.

    And No, you did not say anything to discuss about, rather than your red-herring and strawman fallacious arguments.

    If there is anything meaningful you can contribute, contribute it now, not the fallacious post.

    Are bona fide Tanzanian, by the way... not by the convenience of passport?

    Mlenge
     
  9. I

    Interested Observer JF-Expert Member

    #9
    Apr 19, 2010
    Joined: Mar 27, 2006
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    Hi
    WE have the sea, we have the lakes, we have fertile land, we have all big rivers, we are 44million people, we have the the longest railways connectionss; and we have access to those landlocked countries; moreever we have all minerals. That is to say we have all advantages against. What we need then? Our advantages give us more say, and better leverage. We are so stupid to vote for such EAC protocal. We are stupid!
     
  10. shugri

    shugri Member

    #10
    Apr 19, 2010
    Joined: Mar 22, 2010
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    Interested Observer,

    What good is a resource if not utilized?
    in a global world creationg a regional
    block is very important, having a common
    say create a stronger block in world
    political economy.

    U have all the resources and yet u
    dont benefit from it, cry now or cry then
    i belive we can take all of them and we can
    mutually benefit in a EAC common market.

    Mlege....ur proving my theory correct..ur emotional!
    Anyway i have proposed argument- u falsify as the
    concept u sue without reasoning, i though ur using
    philosophy, is so how can u jump in a conclusion that
    its a falacy without reasoning premises!

    NB: am Tanzanian and a proud one- yet- i have no fear and i believe we can
     
  11. shugri

    shugri Member

    #11
    Apr 19, 2010
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    Well its me once agan,
    happly just because i have been told that
    Common market -was blessed by the parliament.

    Now its time
    Regards
     
  12. mtuwatu

    mtuwatu Member

    #12
    Apr 19, 2010
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    Am sick n' tired of all political leaders we have in Tz parliment,honestly Tanzania we are not yet there to fit in EAC!!!!!
    Kenyans gonna it us alive!!!,that's much i can tell.
    I have nothing to answer my children and grand children on this,upon a time!!!!!!!!

    Mungu wabariki watoto wetu,watusamehe kwa makosa tunayoyafanya leo!
     
  13. Kaa la Moto

    Kaa la Moto JF-Expert Member

    #13
    Apr 19, 2010
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    Na hapo ndipo history itakapojirudia tena kwa yale yaliyotokea 1977. Believe me itatokea tena. Wakati huo hawa watawala watakuwa mavumbini na wana wao hawatakuwa na sauti tena.
     
  14. Mlenge

    Mlenge Verified User

    #14
    Apr 19, 2010
    Joined: Oct 31, 2006
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    That is exactly the point.

    Mababu zetu tunasema hawakwenda shule. Haya sisi?

    Future generations, if you will read this, remember some of us did not have ugali in our crania, only that we, nor our dissenting views, were not allowed in the decision-making.

    Forgive us indeed! There was only so much we could do!

    Mlenge
     
  15. shugri

    shugri Member

    #15
    Apr 20, 2010
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    fellows have faith in the power of a human being- dont judge the future by looking at the past mistakes- even though i know th eimportance of understanding history and other history- for me i would prefer tanzania to go in FTA with all EAC counties not just a common market- cause i belive that is where we can learn to be agreassive- and take life seriously.

    May God make Tanzania better
     
  16. Mlenge

    Mlenge Verified User

    #16
    Apr 20, 2010
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    Makala ya Boaz Boazi hii hapa!

    Nukuu (mkolezo wa wino umeongezwa):

    "Hata Watanzania wanaounga mkono shirikisho wamekuwa wakiwaeleza Watanzania wenzao wanaopinga shirikisho kuwa ni watu waoga au watu wasiojiamini.

    Lakini kwa mtazamo wangu, katika Tanzania naona suala la kutojiamini lipo hasa kwa wasomi wanaounga mkono shirikisho."


    "Kuna kundi la wasomi wameamua kuunga mkono shirikisho au kunyamaza kabisa kwa sababu inadaiwa hawataki waonekane wao ni duni, waoga na hawajiamini mbele ya wasomi wenzao wa Uganda na Kenya, ambao wako mstari wa mbele kuunga mkono shirikisho."

    "Kwa hiyo njia ya haraka ya kujipambanua kuwa wewe ni msomi unayejiamini na si mwoga wa ushindani na huna hofu ya eti ya kunyang'anywa kazi na Wakenya au Waganda ni kuunga mkono shirikisho hilo. "
     
  17. C

    Chuma JF-Expert Member

    #17
    Apr 25, 2010
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    Mlenge kwanini umeita "Pork Project" labda ungewafahamisha wana JF..

    Kuhusu EAC...nafikiri TZ inapasa kujipanga kwanza na kurekebisha mambo mengi sana ya kibiashara before hawajaingia into FULL...Binafsi nashangaa kwanini tunataka iwe kwa speed hio?....Tungejipa alau 2-4 years au 5 si mbaya ili wananchi wa Kila nchi wajue umuhim wake.

    Then...Umoja kitu kizuri lkn Umoja ambao tunao wa ZNZ na Tanganyika bado una matobo kibao haujazibwa tunataka tuongeze matobo mengine....!!!

    Secta ya Biashara yatakiwa kufanywa ya Kitaalamu sana si hii sasa ya Kimachinga, Biashara za Kimachinga zimejaa sana na watz wengi tunafikiri biashara za style Hii...sasa ukiingia ktk Cooperation bila maandailizi utapigwa mabao..sana.!!!
     
  18. Mlenge

    Mlenge Verified User

    #18
    Apr 25, 2010
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