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Nduli Idd Amin Dada or an African Hero.

Discussion in 'International Forum' started by Zawadi Ngoda, Aug 16, 2010.

  1. Z

    Zawadi Ngoda JF-Expert Member

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    Most of the propaganda launched by the ex President of Tanzania, Julius Kambarage Nyerere against the ex President of Uganda, Field Marshal Idd Amin Dada, were baseless. However Nyerere,s tactics succeeded and many Tanzanian’s and some people outside Tanzania believed him. But most of Ugandan’s continued to respect Idd Amin even when he was not in power, something that Tanzanian’s will never believe.


    Although many Tanzanian’s agree that decision of Nyerere returning Obote to power was a total miscalculation and one can move farther and question if he really achieved his goal. The truth is that Obote was completely unpopular compared to Idd Amin in Uganda.


    Recently I watched the film called “The last King of Scotland” in this film there are plus and minus about reality of Idd Amin. The most interesting part was the comment given by academicians. They explained him as a person who opened the African eyes. They were concerned on how the Ugandan’s with Asian origin treated the indigenous. This was a great turning moment ideologically, and gave self confidence not only Ugandan’s but African as well, they said.


    The second point was how he treated his masters that helped him to take the power, Great Britain and Israel. Their intension was to get another Mabuto, using him by plundering African natural resources to west. He was just too strong to accept such nonsense. If African leaders should act the same way he did, then Africa could be respected, they pointed.


    I personally support the above mentioned points, and due to that I don’t see the reason why should we not call him as a Hero of Africa instead of Nduli Idd Amin.
     
  2. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    One thing you are forgetting Ngoda is that Iddi Amin's tarnished image is not the fault of Nyerere. The international community by then already saw him as a dictator. So the question is that don't you believe the fact that he committed crimes against humanity?
    A second point is that Tanzania did not just out of know where invade Uganda. It is a known fact that Iddi Amin wanted to occupy the land bordering Tanzania and Uganda. The most sacred job of any president is to defend the borders of his country. You being a Tanzanian don't you believe in protecting our land?
     
  3. The Quonquerer

    The Quonquerer JF-Expert Member

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    Overall, Amin wa a fag. I hate these *********s (faggot indians) because of what they do to my country, including racism against natives but cannot support that moron. They are the same, all are faggots. As for not being used by his 'masters' , i am sure did a right thing unkwowingly. A person of Amin's brain couldn't have analysed and realize that he can be used. Purely accidental! Kunguru kumnyea binadamu aliyeko chini ya mti ni shabaha? I don't know if you are aware of the havoc he wreaked to his and other people including Tanzanians who were working for the then EAC and living in Uganda!
     
  4. k

    kwamwewe JF-Expert Member

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    Nyerere was the one who started silent invasion . What iddi amin did, was retaliation.

    The west hated amin because of his friendship with palestines against jews
     
  5. Z

    Zawadi Ngoda JF-Expert Member

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    I am not sure about the land, what I do know is that being land or not land, Nyerere prepared to remove him since 1971. The mission was much easier when he fumbled with British and Israel. But this is not the issue, the issue is about those two points I mentioned on the thread and the heading.
     
  6. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Listen Zawadi when someone is called good it does not mean they never do wrong and when somebody is called bad it does not mean they never do right. You mentioning probably two things that he might have done right does not justify him being a good man or for that matter an African hero. The question to ask yourself is why is he vilified? He is vilified because of the atrocities he cause. If you want I will cite for you many sources explaining the number of people he killed. Now the question to you is.....if a person is an armed robber but uses some of the money he gets to donate to church or mosque does that make the robber a good man? Does that justify his actions?

    And second if you do not know the land issue between Tanzania and Uganda then you do not know the complete history of Iddi Amin which ruins your credibility of trying to paint Iddi Amin as an African hero. I suggest you read everything on the man including the evil things he has done then come back and make a conclusion. And whether or not Nyerere wanted to remove him since 1971 is not a matter. The matter is that we invaded him after he touched our soil meaning the invasion might have never happened if he didn't regardless of Nyereres personal feelings towards him.
     
  7. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    So whose fault is it that Iddi Amin has a horrible public image? Nyerere? The Jews? Or the West?
     
  8. K

    KAPONGO JF-Expert Member

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    Amini is an unwanted hero: Its him who made his people OPEN their eyes, and boot out the indians, who for decades, selfishly exploited and undermined the indeginous populace and thus commanded the economy of the land. But Since his take over Ugandans were in a position to build up their economy and own properties and wealth... And we see now how Ugandans are in forefront in business and economic ventures ..be it real or petty, and the national economy is by far in the hands of the indiginous. But look back here. The economy is run by few Tanzanian mostly with indian descend marshaled by their few selfish indeginous elite .... And of course Amin was a human being thus he was not free from making mistakes...he committed many like any other african icon..but to sum up heDID wonders to his people especially sounding a wake up call to own national resources and NOT remain silent and destitute observers.
     
  9. bona

    bona JF-Expert Member

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    cha kujiuliza, baada ya kuwafukuza wahindi did the economy get better or worse? so killing his opponents made palestinians? yes nyerere alikua hampendi na alitaka kumtoa sasa na yeye amin si angekua anamletea nyerere chokochoko basi, sasa kuvamia ndio iliyomletea balaa lote hili, mbona vita tanzania tulishinda kwa urahisi tena kwa sababu ya backing ya wananchi wa uganda, kama walikua wanampenda si vita ingekua ngumu sana, kwa data amin alikua ana zana bora kuliko sisi na jeshi pia kubwa kuliko letu, basi si tungeshinda kwa causualities kubwa, lakini upinzan pekee tuliupata masaka!
     
  10. Baba_Enock

    Baba_Enock JF-Expert Member

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    The definition of "Heroism" changes with TIME!

    The definition of Nduli varies with TIME!
     
  11. Smatta

    Smatta JF-Expert Member

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    Sometimes a terrorist is a hero at home, it just depends on ideologies and school of thought.
     
  12. Smatta

    Smatta JF-Expert Member

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    Why do you wear your hatred like a badge of honor?
     
  13. BinMgen

    BinMgen JF-Expert Member

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    .that's right
     
  14. a

    asagulaga Member

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    Idi Amini aliua, aliharibu mali ya watanzania, akatangazia umma wa kimataifa kuwa makao yake yatakuwa Kagera, na mto Kagera ndio mpaka. Hakuishia hapo akatangaza kuwa anafikiria angalau na Uganda iwe na bandari yake kupitia uvamizi huo. Mwalimu aliomba umoja wa Afrika chini ya Jaffar Nimer ulaani jambo hili na kumkemea Amini kwa uvamizi huo. Nimer alikaa kimya. Mwalimu alikuwa shujaa na mzalendo kweli na kuhamasisha jeshi na wananchi wa Tanzania kukomesha uvamizi huu. Unayesema mwalimu alikosea ninkuogopa. Labda mwaka 1978 mwezi october hukuwepo.
     
  15. Mahesabu

    Mahesabu JF-Expert Member

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    HII ISIFUTWE KWANI SIANDIKI KUHUSU CHADEMA NA JINSI ITAKAVYOSHINDWA KWENYE UCHAGUZI HUU......!.........AMIN KAMA KWELI KWELI WANANCHI WA UGANDA WANAMPENDA ANGEENDA ISHI EXILE?.........WAKATI WA MAZISHI YAKE KUNA AMBAO HAWAKUTAKA MWILI WAKE UGUSE ARDHI YA UGANDA......! HESHIMA ANAYOPATA NYERERE UGANDA INAWEZA ZIDI HESHIMA TUNAYOMPA HAPA(sijatafiti vya kutosha)....!
     
  16. M

    Mgalatia JF-Expert Member

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    Nduli ni nduli tu.Alifanya maovu mengi sana lakini la kufukuza waasia lilikuwa la kishujaa,kwa ajili ya waganda tu.kwetu sisi alikuwa ni nduli tu.:amen:
     
  17. J

    Jasusi JF-Expert Member

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    Zawadi,
    You can call Amin a hero if you so wish. Haitatukosesha wengine usingizi.
     
  18. M

    Mzee Mwafrika Senior Member

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    Wanaolalamika kuhusu uamuzi wa nyerere wengi wao ni wa miaka ya 80 kwenda chini wasioijua vizuri Tanzania hata Nyerere pia,wanaopenda kusikiliza stori za vijiweni na simulizi za misikitini,wanaotaka kufuta historia waandike itakayofurahisha mioyo yao...Wanachekesha na kama alivyotamka Karume wa Zanzibar na mimi nawaambia kuwa zile silaha tulizompigia IDIOT AMINI DADA bado zipo, wakiendekeza chokochoko tutawapiga kama tulivyomfanya baba yao IDIOT AMINI DADA...kama walifikiri yalikuwa masihara wakamuulize baba yao mdogo GADAFi
     
  19. Mtazamaji

    Mtazamaji JF-Expert Member

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    Idd amin ni kama Hitler tu. Hata Hitler ingawa wanasiasa na viongozi wa ujerumani hawawezi kutamka wazi wazi wanajua Germany ilikuw fa behind mataifa mengine ya ulaya kama france na England. Ni baada ya michakatao ya hitller mataifa makubwa yakajikuta yako level moja.
     
  20. J

    JokaKuu Platinum Member

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    ..matatizo ya Mwalimu na Amin yalianza na Tanzania kumpa hifadhi Obote na wapinzani wengine wa Amin.

    ..pia Tanzania ili-sponsor jaribio la kumuondoa kijeshi Amin. Jaribio hilo lilishindwa na kusababisha vifo vya waasi wa Uganda na uharibifu wa mali za Tanzania. kwa mfano: kuna ndege ya ATC ambayo ilikuwa itue "kijajusi" Entebe ikiwa na makomando wa Kiganda, ndege hiyo ilitua vibaya kilimanjaro na ikawa ndiyo mwisho wake.

    ..baada ya tukio hilo yalifanyika mazungumzo ya amani kati ya Tanzania na Uganda yaliyokuwa sponsored na SOMALIA. mazungumzo hayo yalizaa mkataba wa amani ulioitwa Mogadishu accord. pamoja na madai mengine Uganda ilijaribu kuilazimisha Tanzania isiwape hifadhi ya kisiasa kwa Waganda.

    ..Mzee Cigwiyemisi John Malecela, waziri wa mambo ya nje wa wakati huo, alikataa na kumuonya waziri mwenzake wa Uganda kwamba awe makini kwasababu siku moja inawezekana na yeye akawa mkimbizi wa kisiasa. Haikupita muda mrefu aliyotabiri Malecela yakatokea, waziri wa mambo ya nje wa Uganda went into exile!!

    ..makubaliano ya amani ya Mogadishu yalielekeza kwamba Tanzania haitatoa mafunzo au msaada wa kijeshi kwa wakimbizi wa kiganda walioko nchini. sasa hiyo ndiyo ikapelekea Museveni na wenzake kwenda kuchukua mafunzo yao kwenye makambi ya Frelimo.

    ..toka wakati huo, which i think was btn 1972 to 1974 hakukuwa na matukio yoyote yale ya kijeshi baina ya Uganda na Tanzania. Hali ilibadilika ghafla mwaka 1978 ambapo Amini alivamia eneo la Kagera, akaua watu na kuharibu mali, na kuitangazia dunia kwamba eneo hilo ni la Uganda.

    ..Nyerere aliweka condition kwamba Uganda wa-denounce their claims to Tanzanian territory na walipe fidia kwa uharibifu uliotokea. Amini alikataa, na OAU chini ya raisi Jafar Nimeiri wa Sudan walishindwa kum-condemn Idi Amin. ndiyo maana kuna wakati Nyerere made a few harsh statements about Nimeiri.

    ..Tanzania ilikuwa imeshtukizwa kijeshi kwasababu kulikuwa na kikosi kidogo cha JWTZ ambacho kilikuwa run over na majeshi na vifaa vizito vya Amin. focus yetu wakati huo ilikuwa imehamia kusini ambako tulikuwa tunawasaidia Frelimo wa Msumbiji. vikosi vilivyokuwa battle ready vilikuwa kusini ya Tanzania.

    ..kwa kifupi very few ppl thought we had any chance of defeating Amin. wapo hata wanaodai Mwalimu alisita sana kupigana na Amini na waliompa moyo ni makamanda wa kijeshi na Samora Machel wa Msumbiji.

    ..Tanzania ilibidi iji-organise ikiwa ni pamoja na kuhamisha vikosi toka kusini kupeleka kaskazini. kuimarisha mafunzo ya mgambo[people's militia] ili kuwapeleka mstari wa mbele. sehemu kubwa ya askari wa Tanzania ilikuwa ni wananchi waliojitolea kwenda kumtoa nduli. kila mkoa ulipewa quota ya idadi ya wananchi watakaokwenda frontline. Mkoa wa Mara uliongoza kwa wananchi kufurika ktk vituo vya kujiandikisha.

    ..nawashauri mtafute vitabu vinavyoelezea vita ile. You will be amazed on how we pulled it off. siyo kazi rahisi hata kidogo kuingia kijeshi ktk nchi nyingine na kuisambaratisha serikali iliyoko madarakani. Tulipomtoa Amini, tulisimika serikali ya wananchi wa Uganda. baada ya muda ukaendeshwa uchaguzi mkuu, na Tanzania ikajitoa kijeshi!!

    ..kuna mambo mengi sana yalikuwa yanakwenda simultaneosly.wakati vita inaendelea tuli-mobilize Waganda watakaounda serikali, na vilevile tulifundisha vikosi vya jeshi jipya la uganda.
     
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