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Naila Kiula aibuka - achagua kambi ya JK

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Mzee Mwanakijiji, Feb 26, 2008.

  1. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #1
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    Aliyekuwa Waziri wa Ujenzi na ambaye aliwahi kukabiliwa na kesi ya rushwa Bw. Nalaila Kiula ameibuka leo na kumshangaa Waziri Mstaafu Bw. Joseph Warioba kwa kitendo cha ukosoaji wake wa kamati Teule ya Dr. Harrison Mwakyembe.

    mambo mbalimbali yanayohusiana na matukio ya kisiasa nchini. Bw. Kiula amemshangaa aliyekuwa Waziri Mkuu Bw. Joseph Sinde Warioba kwa kitendo chake cha kushangaa kwanini kamati Teule ya Bunge iliyoongozwa na Dr. Harrison Mwakyembe hakumuita Waziri Mkuu aliyejiuzulu Bw. Lowassa kufuatia suala la Richmond.

    Bw. Kiula amesema kuwa Warioba siyo mtu wa kuzungumzia suala la "natural justice" kwani ni yeye katika wakati wake aliyeongoza tuhuma za rushwa dhidi ya Kiula na hakuna wakati wowote ambapo yeye Warioba alimuita Kiula kumuuliza juu ya tuhuma mbalimbali (zilizotajwa kwenye ripoti ya Warioba) na hatimaye kumuacha apoteze nafasi yake na hatimaye kukabiliana na mashtaka ya kihalifu ambayo baadaye alikutwa na hatia. Hata hivyo Bw. Kiula hatimaye aliweza kushinda rufaa yake.

    Bw. Kiula alizungumzia pia juu ya utawala wa Rais Mkapa na katika hilo anakubaliana na baadhi ya viongozi wengine wa zamani wanaotaka Rais Mkapa achunguzwe kutokana na matumizi ya nafasi yake kujitajirisha.

    stay tuned...
     
  2. M

    Mtanzania JF-Expert Member

    #2
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    Fisadi akalale, na yeye anataka kujisafisha kwa migongo ya watu wengine.

    Alituibia na labda zinaanza kuisha, sasa anatafuta hata ukuu wa wilaya.
     
  3. Kitila Mkumbo

    Kitila Mkumbo Verified User

    #3
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    Huyu ni ndugu yangu lakini ni ovyo kabisa. Ataibuka kwenda wapi? Huyu amezungukwa na utelezi kila kona, kila atakapojaribu kusimama ataanguka tu! Tena alipoteza nafasi muhimu sana. Mwinyi alimpa kila nafasi ili a-prove kwamba ana weza akashindwa, yeye apumzike tu. Ila nakubaliana naye sana kuhusu maoni yake kuhusu comments za warioba. Walichofanya akina Mwakyembe ndicho alichofanya Warioba kwenye kamati yake, alikuwa hana moral authority ya ku-criticise kamati ya Mwakyembe pamoja na mapungufu ya wazi yaliyopo.
     
  4. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Tume ya Warioba na Kmati ya Mwakyembe zilikuwa na objective mbili tofauti sana. Moja inahusu a specific issue na ilikuwa ya bunge, nyingine ilikuwa ya rushwa kwa ujumla na ilikuwa ya rais.

    Hakuna comparison.Warioba alikuwa sawa kutoa maoni kwama Mwakyembe ilibidi amuhoji Lowassa kutokana na specificity ya issue, Kiula alipata nafasi yake kujitetea mahakamani.In principle hata Lowassa naye alipewa nafasi kujitetea bungeni na anayo nafasi ya kujitetea mahakamani,chamani, TVT na hata bungeni.Tatizo ni kuwa Lowassa kwa watu wanaotaka kuspin inaweza kusemwa kuwa alifanyiwa pigo takatifu kwa makusudi na ninaamini Mwakyembe angeweza kuondoa misemo hii kama angemuhoji mapema.So I am with Warioba on this.
     
  5. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #5
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    Pundit, tume ya Warioba ilitaja majina, iliweza vipi kutaja majina ya watu kuwatuhumu rushwa bila ya kuwapa nafasi ya kujieleza?
     
  6. M

    Mtanzania JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Feb 26, 2008
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    Mwanakijiji,

    Nilianza kukubaliana na Kitila lakini niliposoma hoja ya Pundit naona nimegeuka na kukubaliana naye. Tume ya Warioba ilikuwa inachunguza rushwa
    kwa ujumla na pia ilikuwa ya siri. Sikumbuki kama iliwahoji watu waliokuwa wanahusika na kashfa.

    Pia tume ya Warioba ilikuwa haina mandate, kwahiyo ilitakiwa serikali itumie report yake kuchunguza zaidi au kuwapelekea mahakamani wahusika.

    Hii ya Mwakyembe ilikuwa na nguvu zaidi na hivyo mtu ungetegemea kama kuna utata kuhusu ushiriki wa mtu fulani basi wangemhoji.

    Ila kijembe cha Kiula kina ukweli wa aina fulani. Ni vizuri kumhoji mtu kabla ya kumtuhumu kwa makosa makubwa makubwa.
     
  7. Lunyungu

    Lunyungu JF-Expert Member

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    Pamoja wizi wake wote lakini kasema point kwamba kwa nini sasa Warioba aje na hilo wakati yeye Warioba hakumpa nafasi ya kujieleza kama ambavyo anataka leo ?Double standards I guess
     
  8. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Mwanakijiji,

    Tume ya Warioba ilikuwa inaandika Ripoti juu ya hali ya rushwa nchini, haikuwa inachunguza kashfa fulani.Interviewing everybody was unrealistic.Tume ikakusanya ushahidi na ku document vitu ili kama Mkapa ana guts awapeleke hawa watu mahakamani wakajibu mashtaka.Mkapa kuona majina makubwa akapata cold feet, hakuwapeleka mahakamani kwa kisingizio classic kuwa ushahidi hautoshi.

    Nimesema in principle the same applies kwa Kamati ya Mwakyembe,kwamba Lowassa alikuwa na nafasi ya kujitetea bungeni na hata sasa anayo nafasi TVT, chamani na hata bungeni.Lakini tatizo linakuja Kamati ya Mwakyembe ilikuwa specifically targeted towards the Richmond issue in its scope and interviewing was not only not unrealistic, but also logical hususan ukiangalia repercussions za implications na the weight of the evidence hususan kwa Waziri Mkuu.

    Kiula is just bitter at Warioba, he should be glad walimtoa the then unpopular Permanent Secretary Dr. George Mlingwa, mtu ambaye hakuhusika lakini alichukiwa na watu wa ujenzi kwa kuwa mjivuni (anaripotiwa kusema "siwezi kuongea na mtu asiye na digrii") kama Bangusilo kwani ngoma ingeenda kwa Kiula na ma prosecutor objective angenyeshewa mvua kubwa sana tu.
     
  9. Lunyungu

    Lunyungu JF-Expert Member

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    Hivi ile tume ya warioba iliishia wapi na majina ? Isije ikawa ndiyo hao hao ambao baadaye warioba aliamua kukaa nao na kula nao hadi sasa.Msikilizeni Kiula pamoja na uchambuzi wenu please .Hoja inaendelea mie nimetia kaneno tu
     
  10. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Tume ya Warioba ili mu implicate Mpaka Mwinyi directly or indirectly.Mkapa akaona isije kuwa tabu na mimi kesho wakaniibulia Kiwira zangu zinazokuja huko mbele bure.Akaamua kuikalia kwa kisingizio cha kukosa ushahidi wa kutosha.Hii ndiyo maana Kikwete hawezi kumshitaki Lowassa au Mkapa kwa sababu anajua watu watasubiri presidential immunity yake iishe akiondoka Magogoni na yeye watamshika.Kwa hiyo Kikwete anaendeleza tradition ya Mkapa na CCM ya kulindana.Ndiyo maana mimi namuunga mkono Kitila kila siku anaposema as long as tuna CCM kwenye power hamna kitu significant kitakachobadilika, inabidi kiingie chama kingine.Tatizo wapinzani nao hawajajiandaa vya kutosha kwa sasa wanahitaji momentum zaidi ndiyo hii tunaitengeneza na kui gauge hapa.
     
  11. Field Marshall ES

    Field Marshall ES JF-Expert Member

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    Feb 27, 2008
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    Warioba, hawezi kuweka mikono kwenye kunde na nyama kwa pamoja, huku anaandika ripoti ya rushwa, na huku anashirikiana na Mahalu, ameandika ripoti ya wizara zote lakini Elimu na Sayansi, kwa Mkapa, na Mahalu hakwenda, mgombea wake Salim kushindwa Dodoma makelele mengi kuwa viongozi wa CCM wamejaa rushwa hawamjali Mwalimu, leo Warioba kabadilika tena kuna wenzetu humu wanasema anafaaa kuwa rais, ubunge Bunda wamemkataa, hata Mwalimu mwenyewe mentor wake hakumpa urais,

    Hivi waandishi wetu huwa hawaweki kumbu kumbu? Kwa nini wasimuonyeshe Warioba, maneno yake mwenyewe baada ya uchaguzi wa rais CCM Dodoma, kwenye TV ili aeleze kuwa kwa nini hayalingani na ya sasa? Kulikoni hasa?

    Lowassa, hakufukuzwa na ripoti ya Mwakyembe, ameikimbia ripoti mwenyewe kitu ambacho kinaonyesha incompetence yake na kwamba haikuwa right yeye kuwa Waziri Mkuu in the first place anyways, maana kama leo anakimbia ripoti tu kesho tutamwamini vipi adui wa kweli akitushambulia? Analia lia nini badala ya kukubali yaishe na kuanza upya? Ameonewa na nani hasa wakati serikali tumeambiwa ilikuwa ni yake na washikaji wake watupu, sasa aliyemuonea ni nani hasa? Yeye kwenye uchaguzi wa rais amechafua majina ya wenziwe weee mbona hawakulia? Sasa leo amejichafua mwenyewe na matendo yake halafu anlilia wengine? Hivi bongo ni lini tutajifunza kubeba respondibility zetu wenyewe na kuacha kulaumu kila mtu mwingine badala ya kujiangalia kwenye kiooo na kukubali vivuli vyetu?

    Hebu mlio karibu naye mwambieni kuwa kujiuzulu kwake, kilikuwa ni kitendo kizito na chenye heshima kwa watoto wetu wa taifa la baadaye, kuwa kujiuzulu nafasi kubwa kitaifa, sio death sentence, sasa kabla hatujampa full heshima analia lia tu na nwengine wanamlilia tuuuu, aka jamani huko kwenye power kuna nini hasa?
     
  12. Mlalahoi

    Mlalahoi JF-Expert Member

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    Feb 27, 2008
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    Pengine ni vema kuangalia mantiki ya anchokisema badala ya kumhukumu kwa makosa aambayo mahakama ilimwona hana hatia.Let's be honest,kati ya alichosema Kiula na pongezi za JK kwa EL kipi cha maana na kipi ni pumba?

    Motto wetu ni "Where we Dare to Talk Openly",and Kiula did just that.Kwani sie tunaoongea hapa hadharani pia tunawinda ukuu wa wilaya?Give the dude his credits!
     
  13. Kitila Mkumbo

    Kitila Mkumbo Verified User

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    FMES: sisi watanzania tuna katatizo ka-kumbukumbu, na vilevile wengi wetu hatuwezi ku-pay attention kwenye details. Sasa huyu Warioba kaongea ka-sentesi kamoja cheaply ameshaonekana ni hero, agombee urais. Haya huyu naye Kiula ambaye alijifunza uzuri wa mapesa ukubwani hadi yeye na mke wake wakawa wanavunja magari ya serikali, kaongea kasentesi kamoja cheaply, tunaambiwa "kaibuka"!

    Halafu nchi yetu ni nzuri sana, ukiwa na akili "nyingi kidogo" kama Warioba basi umeshakuwa unafaa kuwa Rais, yaani hakuna kazi inayowafaa watu wenye akili isipokuwa ya urais. Tuna kazi, tutakomboka lakini, polepole!
     
  14. Mlalahoi

    Mlalahoi JF-Expert Member

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    Japo binafsi si shabiki wa Kiula,naendelea kuaini kuwa alichosema ni kile ambacho wengi tumekuwa tukikisema hapa au kingestahili kuswemwa na watu kama akina Kingunge na wengineo,ambao so far wameendelea kukaa kimya.Whether ametumwa,anajikomba aua anaendekeza chuki zake kwa Warioba,la muhimu hapa ni substance ktk hoja zake (with exception na hilo personal beef na Warioba).
     
  15. Majita

    Majita JF-Expert Member

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    Huwa simkubali Nyerere lakini kwa matukio kama haya nashawishika kumkubali.Wewe fikiria uwepo wa Nyerere uliweza kuzuia ama kuficha tabia ya warioba hadi watu tufikirie kuwa warioba alikuwa mtu safi.Hii tabia inayojitokeza sasa ya warioba baada ya Nyerere kufariki ndo tabia yake halisi.Ile ya zamani ilikuwa zuga tu kumbe alimwogopa mchonga.Ananikera kweli siku hizi na vijimaneno vyake.
     
  16. SYLLOGIST!

    SYLLOGIST! JF-Expert Member

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    Feb 28, 2008
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    Wakuu,
    Naila Kiula ni Fisadi.
    Ameula sasa anataka nini?
    Mimi nafikiri itakuwa vizuri huu mjadala wa Warioba ufunguliwe tena! Kwani amekuwa na maduku-duku Labda antaka tuwafichue Mafisadi kama huyu anayelilia kula sasa. Manake hapo imerime!
    Shabash!

    Chagua Kambi lakini wakati ukifika utarudi mahakamani na utatueleza ni nini ambacho hukuweza kusema...nitahakikisha hivyo!

    By the way kwanini husemi yaliyokukuta? Naila Kiula! Mwaga hizo data hapa Naila Kiula tutachambua. Otherwise mwache Warioba!!!!

    Asante.
     
  17. Gaijin

    Gaijin JF-Expert Member

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    hata kama ana makosa lukuki, kiula amesema maneno ya msingi kuwa Lowassa asijifananishe na mwinyi.
    hayo mengine namwachia mwenyewe na warioba
     
  18. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #18
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    Warioba naye kamjibu Kiula anasema eti halumbani naye na yeye (Kiula) anakumbushia mambo ya zamani.
     
  19. Shukurani

    Shukurani JF-Expert Member

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    Watakuja wengi waliofifia kwa njia hizi za migongo ya watu hili nao wapate credit,ingekuwa kule kwenye maandiko matakatifu basi ule msemo wa wengi watakuja kwa jina langu na kutenda matendo yanayofanana na yangu lakini msiwaamini.
     
  20. K

    Keil JF-Expert Member

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    Wana siasa wengi ni ma-opportunists na siku zote wanapenda wawe kwenye ulaji na hivyo inapotokea ulaji wa mmoja ukatiwa mchanga basi hapo ndipo utakapoona jinsi wanavyojua kuongea na kujitetea ama kutetea maslahi yao.

    Warioba ana mengi ya kutuambia kuhusu ile miradi ambayo inasemekana ni ya CCM - Mwananchi Gold Mine na Meremeta. Zile hela za BoT zilienda wapi na zilifanyiwa nini kwenye hiyo miradi maana na yeye ni mmoja wa wahusika. Anajifanya ni kamanda wa kupiga vita rushwa na kumbe na yeye ni kinara wa ufisadi. Jamaa alikurupuka haraka haraka hata bila kujiandaa kutetea ile orodha ya aibu ya Mzee Slaa. Alifanya hivyo akijua wazi kwamba zile tuhuma zilikuwa na ukweli kwa 100% na ndiyo maana wenye akili zao timamu walishauri watu wasiende mahakamani.

    Mzee Kiula naye ana msalaba wake wa ufisadi aliofanya pale Wizara ya Ujenzi. Kama kupona amepona kwa bahati sana, tatizo ni kwamba rushwa kubwa huwa hazina ushahidi wa kutosha kumtia mtu hatiani labda itumike sheria ya uhujumu uchumi.

    Lakini pamoja na makosa yao yote, bado pale wanapoongea yale ambayo yana make sense tunahitaji kuwapa credit na wakitoa pumba tutawazomea. Mzee Warioba alipofuka mvuka wakati wa list ya Slaa tulimpa kavu kavu hapa hapa JF kwa kuwa ndumila kuwili. Mzee Kiula nae anahitaji kupewa credit yake kwa kutoa hoja nzuri na yenye mantiki.

    Hizo ndiyo siasa za Bongo, maslahi mbele na lawama nyuma!
     
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