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Misri: Maji ya Nile ni haki yetu

Discussion in 'International Forum' started by Ibrah, Apr 20, 2010.

  1. Ibrah

    Ibrah JF-Expert Member

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    :target:


    Source:www.bbc.swahili

    Wadau na WaTanzania na Wana-Afrika Mashariki wote. Hivi hatuna namna ya kuwakomoa hawa Wa-Misri kuhusina na matumizi ya maji ya Ziwa Victoria, Mto Kagera, Mto Mara, na Mto Nile?

    Yaani tunakubali kubanwa na Sheria ambazo Malkia wa Uingereza alitia saini? Kwani tukiyatumia hayo maji wtatufanya nini?

    Mwaka jana nilitembelea Mkoa wa Mara na nikafika WIlaya ya Rorya kando tu ya Mto Mara. Nilisikitika sana kukuta vijiji vya kando ya mto Mara havina maji wakati mto unapiata hapo! Nilichoka zaidi kukuta kijiji kimoja hapo Rorya Shirika la Kimisri -Egypt International Cooperation wamewachimbia kisima na kuwawekea pampu! Wao wanadai kuwa ni msaada wa Misri! Yaani Wa-Misri wanatuchimbia visima tena maji ya chumvi-chumvi ili tusitumie maji ya Ziwa Victoria na Mto Mara halafu tunaona wanatusaidia.

    Wito wangu kwa EAC ni kutoa tamko la pamoja na kuwatangazia Wa-Misri kuwa sasa tumeamua kutumia maji yetu, tuone watatufanya nini.
     
  2. M

    MkamaP JF-Expert Member

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    Ni uzembe tu wa viongozi na kutojiamini.
    Mbona Lowasa alikamatilia bango mpaka kayatoa maji victoria kupeleka shinyanga. Ndio saa nyingine ni vizuri kuwa na viongozi wabishi kama wa IRAN.

    Kama kweli umedhamilia unajenga tu maji yako kwako bwana, harafu mambo mengine baadaye
     
  3. l

    lebabu11 JF-Expert Member

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    Ni umaskini wa akili kuomba haki yako tena ya asili. Maji yaliyo kwenye ardhi yako yatamilikiwa vipi na aliye mbali? Ziwa Victoria na mito yote inayoingiza na kutoa maji katika ardhi yetu ni mali yetu. WAMISRI WASEME TU, HUWEZI KUWAZUIA KUSEMA!

    Lakini tukiongozwa kijinga, tunaweza kuomba haki yetu badala ya kujichukulia.
     
  4. N

    Ngala Senior Member

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    Wa misri wanaota ndoto ya mchana kweupe!!!Mkataba uliosainiwa na malkia unawapa kiburi cha kipuuzi maana l959 afrika mashariki ilikuwa chini ya malkia enzi ya tanganyika. Leo tanzania bado wanaota ndoto hiyo hiyo tu?? Na waende kwa malkia awapatie maji. Nadhani hawajasahau jeuri ya E L alivyowatoa kamasi na kahama shinyanga wanakula maji yao
     
  5. U

    Ubungoubungo JF-Expert Member

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    yaani kama viongozi wetu hawatafanya mkakati kuhakikisha maji mengi ya ziwa victoria yanasambazwa hadi dodoma, hatuwezi kuwaelewa kabisa, tutaona kama waoga, wacha bwana tutumie maji, na kama misri atajaribu kutufanya lolote, tutatoa hadi watoto wadogo wakapigane, kila mtu atakuwa mwanajeshi nakwambia, huu ni moja ya upuuzi mkubwa kuliko wote duniani, na natamani ningekuwa rais, ili nianze mkakati huo hata kesho. misri ni nini kwetu, hana lolote, anataka kutawala maji yetu, KWA WALE AMBAO walishawahi kufika kule, ukiangalia jinsi walivyo weka kilimo cha umwagiliaji, hakika yake utashangaa, wamegeuza jwangwa kuwa uoto, wanatumia vilivyo maji haya. watz tunnang'aa mimacho tu, Mseveni alidharau akapump maji kutengeneza bwawa la kufukuta umeme na hakuna lolote misri atafanya. hivi kweli tz, kenye, uganda, rwanda na burundi tupigwe na misri? sitaki vita ila kwa hili, nitakuwa tayari kuchukua mtutu kuilinda nchi yangu, na itakuwa sahihi tu.

    tatizo ni viongozi wetu, hao wanaokwenda hata kwenye birthday ya Gadafi tu, hao wanaojipendekeza na kuwaabudu waarabu, ndo tatizo tulilonalo. sijui litakwisha lini, hawa viongozi ambao Al bashiri alikuja hadi Arusha wakati tayari ana arrest warrant, lakini hawakumkamata, ndo hawa viongozi wanaotufanya kila siku tuwe nyuma na mashati yao ya kijani.
     
  6. U

    Ubungoubungo JF-Expert Member

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    jeuri ile ya Edward Lowasa ndo ilimfanya atolewe, kwasababu aliwagusa waabudiwa. tungekuwa na kiongozi mfano wake, hata kama si yeye, tungesambaza maji singida hadi dodoma watu waache kunywa maji ya tope. hivi jamani, ni kweli mtu yuko mbali kote huku halafu anajifanya kututawala na maji ambayo yapo hapahapa nchini kwetu? uwoga wa aina gani huu tz, umbumbumbu wa aina gani, mbwa koko au kunguru wa pemba? uwoga tuuuu, kwanini tusitumie haya maji, kwanini tuwe chini ya utumwa wa nchi ya misri?mimi inaniuma sana kwasababu sipendi kutawaliwa mimi. hivi tz haiko huru? mkataba ambao aliusaini mkoloni ambaye alikuwa mwizi, tunatakiwa kuufuata hata baada ya kumtimua mkoloni/mwizi wetu? waarabu wana faida gani kwetu enyi watanzania?
     
  7. M

    Mzee2000 JF-Expert Member

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    May 14 mwaka huu kenya tz na nchi nyingine za eastafrika zzitasaini mkataba wa kutumia maji ya nile,
    Egypt wanatishia vita, sijui arrogance wanaitoa wapi hawa, maji ni yetu kwanini tusiyatumie?halafu ushamba wa viongozi wetu, muda wote huu walikuwa wanasubiri nini?
     
  8. bona

    bona JF-Expert Member

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    wajinga ndio waliwao, tulitakiwa tutumie maji ya nile without anybody concent or any country for that matter, they should be begging for us for mercy not by command, they should come with a polite way and call for dialogue on how best we can all benefit for the water not by some stupid comments of justification from old colonial era laws.

    kwa mfano, china analaumiwa kutumia na kuhold kwenye reserve maji ya mto mekong upstream na nchi za downstream kama thailand, cambodia etc kiasi hadi mto kwnye nchi zao maji yameanza kukauka, nchi hizo hazikutoa vitisho badala yake wamewaita wachina wakae chini wazungumze kwani china amekwenda mbali zaidi kwa kujenga hadi vyanzo vya umeme, kudivert maji ktk matumizi ya domestic, na kuonyesha wako serious wamedivert hadi kwenye reserves for emergency uses later on.

    uo ndio mfano tulitakiwa tuweke kwa awa waarabu, tu assume the case was reversed??????????? tungepata maji?
     
  9. m

    mtoto wa mjini JF-Expert Member

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    Mtamkumbuka Ed.
     
  10. Safari_ni_Safari

    Safari_ni_Safari JF-Expert Member

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    Kwa hili moja tu?..........bado
     
  11. U

    Ubungoubungo JF-Expert Member

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    Lowasa mbona atakumbukwa kwa mengi tuuu, angekuwa Lowasa unafikiri angesikiliza upuuzi wa wamisri? sasa utaona Kikwete atakavyofanya, si unajua watu wengine wanavyopiga magoti kwa waarabu....miungu yao. Lowasa alikuwa far away better of than Kikwete, na alimsaidia sana kuiongoza nchi na kufanya mambo ya haraka. actually, asingepata ile kashfa, alikuwa mtu muhimu sana katika nchi hii, isipokuwa tu, aligusa sehemu mbaya, alipotoa matamshi ya kutumiam aji ya Nile bila wota wowote, maskini Lowasa hakujua kama anaongea wakati wamisri wameweka mashushushu na maajenti kibao hapa nchini kuhakikisha kuwa yeyote mwenye kidomodomo kuhusu maji ya ziwa victoria, atawindwa kwa namna yoyote.

    Tanzania tusahau tu. Kama kikwete anao uwezo wa kutumia hela ya watz, kozi zetu kwenda kwenye birthday ya Gadafi, hivi mnafikiri atafanya chochote ambacho wamisri hawapendi kifanyike hapa tz? atapiga magoti siku zote, hakika yake nawaambia, kama kikwete ana ujanja wowote kwa waarabu hasa wa kaskazini ya africa, mtamuona kwneye hili. hana ujanja wowote. tutamkumbuka lowasa sana, tena sana. bila lowasa hata yale maji yaliyopelekwa sijui singida sijui shinyanga, yasingeenda kule. huu ni ukoloni mwingine watz tuko chini yake. sijui tutakombolewa lini.

    nenda dodoma, nenda singida na maeneo mengine ukaona namna watu wanavyokunywa maji ya tope, tope kabisa wanaliacha lituame na hata likutuama bado maji siyo clear. wakati wamisri wanatajirika kwa umwagiliaji wa kufa mtu kule kwao. nafikiri wabunge wetu wanahitaji kuliongelea hili bungeni,tunawatuma wafanye hivyo. tulikuwa tuuwe tumefanya kilimo cha umwagiliaji hata wa mchicha tu watu wa maeneo kame wale wapate afya, lakini ukienda mikoa hiyo, utaona namna watu wanavyokufa mapema kwasababu ya matatizo ya umasikini.
     
  12. M

    MpendaTz JF-Expert Member

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    Kwanza walitakiwa watulipe fidia! wapuuzi wakubwa hawa. Eti watapigana vita? Hivi kuna nchi inawaogopa hawa wamisri? Viongozi tu hatuna ndiyo shida.
     
  13. m_kishuri

    m_kishuri JF-Expert Member

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    Jamani hakuna wana Diplomasia humu watusaidie kuhusu hili suala. Kwanza tuelewe kwamba, kuna debate kubwa inayoendelea Dunia kuhusu tatizo la maji, sasa haya mambo ya kusema kwamba kila serikali ijichotee bila mpango kwa sababu wananchi wake wanamatatizo ya maji, basi tutarudi kulekule kwenye vita ya wenyewe kwa wenyewe. "The war Over Water is coming," tujue hivyo, lakini nadhani hizi hatua za kidiplomasia ndio suluhisho, na sio ubabe.

    Kwa wale waliosoma Geography high school na University watakumbuka hii statement, " Egypt is nothing Without the Nile." Bila Diplomasia hapa, itakuwa ni vita kubwa sana, na ambayo kwa kweli bara la Africa halihitaji kwa sasa hivi. Kwa sababu, japo nchi nyingi zinashida ya maji, Egypt haiwezi kumaliza hata siku moja ikiwa mto Nile utafungwa au kukauka. Zaida ni kwamba, Tanzania ikianza, basi Uganda, Sudan, Ethiopia, na Burundi zitafuata, sasa hapa sijui itakuwaje, kama sio mwanzo wa masumbwi.

    Lililopo hapa, ni kwamba Egypt waendelee kuambiwa kwamba haya maji ni haki ya kila nchi, ili ufanyike utaratibu maalum wa kuwawezesha wote kunufaika. Ikumbukwe kwamba Egypt na Sudan karibia waingie vitani in 1958 kwa sababu ya Nile, halafu mwaka 1978, ilikuwa ni Egypt na Ethiopia kwa sababu ya Blue Nile. Na huu hautakuwa mwisho.

    Hili ni suala tata sana. Egypt wapo tayari kuingia vitani anytime na nchi yoyoyte inapokuja kwenye suala hili. Songombingo hii halihitaji ubabe hata kidogo, ni Diplomasia peke yake itakayoepusha balaa.
     
  14. M

    MpendaTz JF-Expert Member

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    Hiyo iko wazi Mkuu, lakini jamaa wanatumia lugha za vitisho! wanatakiwa sasa waeleweshwe kuwa ile sheria iliyosainiwa na Malkia "its not binding anymore!" Tulikuwa hatujaelimika eti! huu ni wakati mwingine tunahitaji fidia mpaka sasa.
     
  15. M

    Mzee2000 JF-Expert Member

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    Sasa hata Egypt wakiamua kwenda vitani wanaweza wakapigana na ethiopia, kenya Tanzania, Congo,Uganda, South sudan?Offcourse hawawezi, hawa jamaa wana umasikini wa kutupwa halafu hawana demokrasia.Mubarak amewekwa na anakuwa maintained na mmarekani(uliza egypt inapata misaada kiasi gani kwa mwaka kutoka amerika) bila hii Egypt itaanguka ni misaada ya mmarekani anayeogopa islamic fundamentalism inayompa kichwa.

    Egypt haiwezi kustahimili vita, yenyewe ni nyumba ya kioo tu..... vitisho havifai, kama watanzania wanakos maji, naona ni ujinga wa viongozi wetu kutotumia maji ya ziwa victoria.Lakini nasikia sababu kubwa ni kwamba benki za dunia zilikataa kufund miradi ya maji ziwa victoria kutokana na presha ya egypt.

    Serikari yetu inabidi sasa itafute fund humu humu nchini kuendeleza umwagiliaji, sio za huyu mkwere kutafuta misaada muda wote kama ombaomba.

    Hivi ni vitisho tu
     
  16. Ibrah

    Ibrah JF-Expert Member

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    Acha woga, Maji ya Lake Victoria ni ya East Africa, hao Wamisri wakija na ubabe wao tutazipiga tu; Viongozi wetu wakivimba hao Wamisri wataufyata mkia, viongozi wetu wakiwa waoga na kubebmbeleza diplomasia Wamisri watatucheka na kutuvimbia. Dawa ni kukomaa tu, yaani hatuna hata haja ya kuwatangazia kuwa tunatumia maji yetu, huo ni ubwege!


    Hakuna utata wowote kwa sisi kuamua kutumia maji yetu wenyewe, yaani Watanzania wakose maji ya kunywa kwa ajili ya kuwaneemesha Wamisri! Kama wanataka vita waje tu, tena anyatime. Huku kubembelezana-bebelezana ndiko kunaigharimu nchi yetu. Suluhisho ni kukomaa nao tu tuone kama hawatanywea. Mbona Lowasa aliwakomalia kuhusu Mradi wa Maji ya Shinyanga na wakanywea? Jamaa wanatupima tu; after all, whod do they have compared ti Tanzania? Ni uzembe wetu na viongozi wetu ndio uliotufanya tuwe nyuma tunajikongoja. Natural Resources tunazo nyingi mno kuliko hao Wamisri lakini ati leo Wamisri ni watu wa kutusaidia sisi! Aibu tupu.
     
  17. m_kishuri

    m_kishuri JF-Expert Member

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    "Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it"
    Jamani tujaribu kuwa serious kidogo. Watanzania tunaweza kwenda kuanzisha vita na Egypt? haa aaa aaa aaa! Hebu malizeni kwanza vita ya UFISADI nchini mwenu ndio mkatafute ugomvi nje. Uchaguzi ndio huo unakuja, Hakiyanani vile, mtawachaguwa walewale viongozi wanoendeleza MLUNGULA, and you all know it! halafu tunaongelea suala vita. let us be serious jamani.

    Vita uisikie hivyo hivyo kwa jirani yako, lakini uombe mungu isiingie kwako. Labda wengi tumesahau ile vita yetu na NDULI, na ambayo haikufika hata miaka miwili, lakini MZIKI wake Watanzania wameucheza kwa miaka 20. Wulizeni waliokuepo, kipindi hicho; Watanzania waliambia wafunge mkanda kwa miezi 18, ikageuka kuwa miaka miaka 18. Kila kitu, yaani chumvi, Sukari, Mchele, Unga wa Sembe na Ngano vilikuwa vinapatikana kwa foleni, tena unalazimishwa kununua kila kitu, hadi betri na sigara ili upate bidhaa zako, leo watu wanaongelea habari ya vita-By the way, hii vita iliishia Mkoa wa Kagera peke yake.

    Pigeni rushwa kwanza November, halafu ndio mkaanzishe vita ya maji na Mwarabu. kuna kanga za zamani zilikuwa zinasema, "VITA SI LELE MAMA." Enzi hizo watu tulisahau hata ladha ya CHAI. Anzeni na madiliko nchini mwenu, ndio muwafuate maadui wa nje; badilisheni viongozi wenu wabovuuuu kwanza, ndio vita muhimu inayowakabili.
     
  18. m_kishuri

    m_kishuri JF-Expert Member

    #18
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    "Through Diplomacy, states comminicate to one another such things as a shift in their foreign policy, their unhappyness with the behavior of another state, and their resolve in an international crisis," Donald M. Snow, 2000.

    We'll Sign New Treaty - Nile States
    Nairobi - Upstream countries that share resources of the River Nile have resolved to move forward and sign an agreement on equitable utilisation of the world's longest river without necessarily involving Egypt and Sudan.
    Water Affairs ministers from the nine-member states that share the Nile resources failed to strike an inclusive deal at an extraordinary meeting in Sharm el Sheikh, Egypt, last week, dogged by intrigues and claims of bias.


    After 18 hours of meeting interspersed with walkouts and consultations, the seven upstream countries set May 14 as the beginning of the signing process that will be left open until April 2011.
    But Egypt and Sudan are not expected at the signing ceremony in Entebbe after they objected calling for more talks until consensus is reached on the controversial Article 14 (b) of the proposed Co-operative Framework Agreement (CFA) which relates to historical water rights and uses.
    During the extraordinary NileCom meeting, Burundi, the Democratic Republic of Congo, Ethiopia, Kenya, Rwanda, Tanzania and Uganda agreed that "with regard to the signing procedure, we should open the CFA from May 14 and it shall remain open for not more than one year," said a statement by the Nile Basin Initiative secretariat.


    Egypt and Sudan rejected the position, saying that the proposal "reflects only the views of the seven states."Egypt, which currently holds the rotating Nile Council of Ministers chairmanship, had introduced a new proposal seeking to establish the Nile River Basin Commission before concluding negotiations on the Agreement, in a move that could be described as putting the cart before the horse.
    In their latest proposal, Egypt and Sudan wanted all the Nile Basin countries to issue a presidential declaration to launch the commission as negotiations to reach a comprehensive agreement continue.
    "They also proposed that modalities of the commission be elaborated by the Nile Basin countries, taking into consideration the relevant provisions in the draft CFA," the NBI statement added.
    More negotiation
    The commission is anticipated to replace the legally fragile Nile Basin Initiative which is based in Entebbe, Uganda.
    The two downstream states had initially opposed the establishment of the commission until the latest meeting when they suddenly changed tack and demanded the countries establish the commission ahead of the signing of the CFA.
    The change of tack by Egypt and Sudan is attributed to the realisation that the NBI expires in 2012 and a new framework needs to be in place before then to replace it.
    The upstream countries will have Tanzania Water Affairs Minister Prof Mark Mwandosya to thank for staying awake late into the negotiations to notice insertions that Egyptian negotiators were attempting to introduce in their favour while the rest of the room drifted off the pace as the night wore on.
    The establishment of the commission outside of the agreement, Prof Mwandosya noted, would mean creating a hollow institution less effective than NBI.
    An official of NBI who attended the closed door meeting later told the press of the lack of impartiality by the NileCom chair and Egyptian Water Minister Nasr Eddin Allam.

    Speaking to the press at the end of the meeting, Egyptian Vice-Foreign Minister for Nile Basin affairs Reda Bibars said that Egypt would not be affected by upstream states signing a final agreement. Her Irrigation colleague added that more negotiations would follow to settle the outstanding issue.
    The North African state banks on the international law that protects it in this context, especially with respect to prior agreements signed in 1929 and 1959 that preserve the country's current water quota.
    Speaking at the meeting, Kenya's Assistant Water Minister Mwangi Kiunjuri said citizens of the riparian states were becoming worried about the inability to make the Nile River Basin Commission a reality.
    However, he stated that the Commission's establishment must be done within the Framework and not outside as proposed by the downstream states.

    Click the link below to read the original post from All Africa.com
    http://allafrica.com/stories/201004260011.html
     
  19. m

    moyo JF-Expert Member

    #19
    Apr 27, 2010
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    The Nile treaty was made in bad taste without consideration of countries whose rivers feed Lake Victoria.Their is nothing Egypt can do if all countries in Nile river basin decide to use this valuable resource within their reach.It is fear that drives us us from daring to use the waters in Lake Victoria
     
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