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Kikwete: Nisingepewa Elimu na Kanisa ningekuwa nafanya biashara ndogondogo Chalinze!

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Buchanan, Jul 23, 2009.

  1. Buchanan

    Buchanan JF Diamond Member

    #1
    Jul 23, 2009
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    Wakati anakaribia kugombea urais wa Tanzania, Jakaya Kikwete, alihutubia mkutano wa hadhara pale Bagamoyo, Pwani na kulisifia sana Kanisa Katoliki nchini, akisema wao ndio waliompa elimu na kwamba kama si wao, basi yeye angekuwa kituo cha mabasi Chalinze akiuza biashara ndogondogo. Baadhi ya Waislamu hawakuipenda kauli hiyo......

    Source: Rai, Alhamisi, Julai 23 - 29, 2009, uk. 17.

    ***********************
    My Take:
    Hapa alikuwa anawapumbaza Wakristo ili wasishtukie mpango wake wa Mahakama ya Kadhi? Au alisema kweli yaliyotoka moyoni?

    ===========
    UPDATE:

    Januari 23, 2014:

    Mhadhiri (Dr. Kasoga wa University of Bagamoyo) abainisha Rais Kikwete alisoma Seminari akiwa anajulikana kama "Samwel Luhanga"


     
  2. Lunyungu

    Lunyungu JF-Expert Member

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    Awe ana maanisha ama asimanishe ukweli unakia pale pale kwamba Kanisa limempa Elimu na kumuokoa kwa stand .Full stop .
     
  3. Mtimti

    Mtimti JF-Expert Member

    #3
    Jul 23, 2009
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    Mwanasiasa yeyote unaweza mlinganisha ni mwanamke anayejiuza; kila anapozungumza na watu wa eneo alilotmbelea lazima awasifie, hivyo sishangai kama Kikwete alitoa kauli hiyo kwa wakatoliki.

    Mimi leo siwezi kuishukuru serikali ya uingereza kwa kunikubali kukaa nchini kwao bali nawashukuru wazazi wangu kwa kuniwezesha na kujua umuhimu wa elimu na hivyo kuwa na tamaa ya kujiendeleza

    Je, wazazi wa Jakaya wangekuwa hawajui umuhimu wa elimu na kuamua mtoto wao awe anauza machungwa pale stendi ya Chalinze angeanzia wapi kuipeleka kwenye hizo shule za misheni?

    Kauli za wanasiasa siku zote ni kauli laini zenye lengo la kukuvuta upande wake.
     
  4. G

    Geeque JF-Expert Member

    #4
    Jul 23, 2009
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    Sasa hapa hizi issue mbili za Kikwete kusomeshwa na Kanisa Katoliki na kukubali kwake kujumuishwa kwa muswada wa uanzishwaji wa mahakama ya kadhi kwa waislamu kwenye ilani ya uchaguzi ya CCM zinahusiana vipi?
     
  5. G

    Game Theory JF-Expert Member

    #5
    Jul 23, 2009
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    time for commercial break

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Buchanan

    Buchanan JF Diamond Member

    #6
    Jul 23, 2009
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    If you dont open your mind you can just treat them differently!
     
  7. S

    Shamu JF-Expert Member

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    Waislamu walionewa sana wakati wa Nyerere; lakini sasa hivi mambo yanaanza kuwa mazuri kwa Waislamu. Kusomeshwa na Kanisa imemsaidia JK kuzijua mbinu zote za Kanisa.
     
  8. S

    Shamu JF-Expert Member

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    Nyerere ndiye aliyesababisha Waislamu wasipewe Elimu. Jina lako likiwa la Kiislamu unakatwa ili usiende shule. Waliosoma ni wale tu ambao walitumia majina ya vitu; kama Kikwete, Malima,Kitu, Kigoda nk.
     
  9. Buchanan

    Buchanan JF Diamond Member

    #9
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    Akina Prof Ibrahim Lipumba, Isa Shivji, na labda wewe mwenyewe walisomaje? Uwongo haujengi! Nani aliwaambia mzamie madrasa na kuacha masomo mengine? Shule hamjengi mnasubiri 'Mkapa' mwingine awape Chuo cha umma bure kama Rais mstaafu Mkapa alivyowapa chuo cha TANESCO, chuo cha umma! Mnasubiri mnaowaita makafiri wawaundie mdudu kadhi na wawalipie! Wangepewa wakristo Chuo hicho pangetosha hapo? Si ingetolewa MoU ya kupewa chuo mtandaoni ili watu waijadili na kuona 'uonevu' huo?
     
  10. S

    Shamu JF-Expert Member

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    Ngoja nikuelimshe kwanza: Waislamu hawaiti mtu anayeamini Mungu Kafiri. Huyo Mkapa anaamini Mungu.
     
  11. S

    Shamu JF-Expert Member

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    Hayo majina unayosema hapo yapo pia kwenye dini zengine. Abrahamu (Ibrahimu) Issa (Yesu). Nyerere ndiye aliyeleta upendeleo katika kazi, elimu nk.
     
  12. M

    Mkandara Verified User

    #12
    Jul 24, 2009
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    Kikwete kasoma:-

    1. Karatu Primary School hadi darasa la nne...
    2. Tengelu middle school mwaka 1962 hadi 1965..
    3. Kibaha Secondary School -O level..
    4. Babati Secondary School - A level..
    5. UDSM kwa degree yake ya kwanza.

    Kumbe kanisa Katoliki ndilo lilimsomesha hadi kafika hapo eeeeh ama kweli hii shule nzuri sana inabidi nasi tujipange...
    Sioni historia tofauti ama kitu exceptional ktk elimu yake kiasi kwamba iwe ni sifa kwa kanisa badala ya babu yake chief alomlea na kumpa elimu hiyo..Hawa ndio watu wanaoshindwa kumshukuru Mungu au wazazi wao wakawapa sifa watu wasiostahili..

    Jamani, sisi wote tumepata elimu ktk shule hizi hizi ambazo zilikuwepo katika mazingira tuliyokulia..Kama isingekuwepo shule ya Katoliki ingekuwepo shule ya AgaKhan au mfanyabiashara mwingine. Yaani leo hii Mkandara nende kumsifia Agakhan kuwa ndiye mwokozi wangu badala ya mzazi wangu aliyepiga jembe na kujinyima kihakikisha napata elimu hiyo!..

    Pengine JK angekuwa mbora zaidi kama angekuwa kituo cha mabus ya Chalinze akiuza biashara ndogo ndogo kuliko mtu aliyepata elimu kisha akashindwa kuongoza..Na sidhani kama tutalitendea haki kanisa tukianza kulilaumu kwa shule waliyompa Muislaam huyu..maanake hafai!
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2009
  13. M

    Mkandara Verified User

    #13
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    MIAFRIKA NDIVYO TULIVYO!
    AgaKhan ni Muislaam na alifungua shule kibao Tanzania nzima na tumesoma watu wa makabila na dini tofauti.. haihesabiki kama ziilikuwa shule za Waislaam bali wahindi lakini huyo Mzungu, Mkatoliki akifungua shule zinaitwa shule za Wakristu.

    No wonder Agakhan alikuwa mtu wa kwanza kufungua milango kwa wanafunzi wa makabila, dini na rangi tofauti kupata elimu tena baabu kubwa kuliko shule zote wakati ule, lakini still alionekana hafai na Mhindi!..
     
  14. Sekenke

    Sekenke Senior Member

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    Na akishazijua mbinu? What next? Bring down th church?
     
  15. s

    sharrif2 Member

    #15
    Jul 24, 2009
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    NAMUUNGA mkono kabisa mheshimiwa maana na mimi pia na dada yangu kama sio Kanisa leo, hivi tungelikuwa hai, sidhani. Na kama tungelikuwa hai tungekuwa kijijini tukijiliwaza kwa dadiii, gongo, ulanzi, mbege na kangara saa za kazi maana tusingelikuwa na kazi.

    Tunamshukuru sana Askofu Moshi wa Moshi sio tu kwa kutupa nafasi kusoma kwenye shule zao bali pia kwa kutulipia ada ya shule. Maana mama yetu alikuwa mjane na hakuna cha huyu wala yule aliyetujali pamona na mimi kuwa mswalihina msikitini toka nikiwa na miaka 5 isipokuwa kwa hayati Sharrif Moudhar [Mungu amuweke pema peponi!]

    Pamoja na yote yaliyosemwa mimi binafsi ninaamini kwamba: 'Aliyenacho huongezewa!'. Ndugu zetu Wakiristo (inauma) wana umoja, wana viongozi waliosoma elimu dunia na dini, waumini wanawashimu viongozi wao, wanatoa zaka na sadaka inavyostahili, wanasimamia mambo yao kisayansi na hawafuji mali ya kanisa ovyoovyo.

    Ninaomba viongozi wa BAKWATA wanionyeshe na kunifahamisha :
    -Angalau shule moja waliyopora na wanayomiliki hivi leo inayoendeshwa vizuri.
    -Shule moja ambayo ada za wanafunzi haziporwi na masheikh wakuu na walimu wanalipwa mishahara yao kwa wakati.
    -Hawajachemsha kwa Chuo Kikuu kimoja tu walichopewa majengo bure na serikali,
    -Shule au vyuo visivyoajiri watoto wa mjomba au shangazi na badala yake vinaajiri watu bila kujali dini zao, rangi, jinsia n.k. ila ubora wao kama walimu tu,
    -Nani anaua Redio Quran kama sio viongozi wenyewe wa Bakwata,
    -Kijihospitali kimoja cha Bakwata kinachoendeshwa na chenye matumaini ya kuwa hospitali kubwa baada ya miaka mitano hivi.
    -Orodha ya viongozi wa juu wa BAKWATA na elimu zao,
    -Kama wana orodha ya juu ya viongozi wa Makanisa na elimu zao na kama wamejifananisha nao?
    -Msikiti hata mmoja unaoendeshwa kwa tija ukawa na manufaa kwa muumini wa kawaida na sio kwa viongozi wao tu,
    -Wilaya yoyote Tanzania yenye mradi wa maana wa Waislamu unaotoa huduma za kijamii kama elimu, afya, mazingira, maji, umeme na kadhalika ?
    -Fedha za majengo ya wakfu zilipo na zinavyotumika ?
    -Orodha ya misikiti, viwanja au ploti zote za misikiti na Waislamu nchini na kama zina title deeds?
    -Mradi wa BAKWATA kuwafundisha Waislamu vijana wanaopenda sana kujifunza masula ya Information, Communication Technology (ICT)
    -Jambo lolote KUBWA NA LA MAANA linalofanywa na Waislamu hapa nchini ukilinganisha na yale yanayofanywa na dini nyingine.

    Majibu ya maswali hayo hapo juu yakipatikana nina hakika yatakionesha kidole pale panapostahili kulaumiwa.

    Uislamu unaweza kweli kusaidiwa kwa dua na kunuti, lakini, kunuti kubwa kuliko zote ni ile ya Waislamu kubadilika na kumgeukia kikwelikweli Mwenyezi Mungu ili awaongoze na wauone udhaifu mkubwa ulio ndani ya dini na imani yao unaotokana na:
    -Kukosa umoja;
    -Kutoshirikiana;
    -Kutokuwa au kutokukubali kuwa na viongozi waliosoma kidunia na wanaoona mbali na mbele,
    -Kutotanguliza ubinafsi mbele,
    -Kujifunza kutoka dini zingine,
    -Kutokuwa na muundo unaowaongoza Waislamu na kukubalika toka chini hadi juu,
    -Kula, kuiba na kutumia vya Beit-ul -Mal,
    -Kutotoa zaka wala michango mingine ya kuendeleza miradi ya Waislamu ili kutoa ushindani wa uhakika unaoweza kutuweka mahala ambapo nasi tunaweza kuandikiana MoU na SMT,

    .....na kuna mambo mengi mengine ambayo nawaachia wenzangu wazinduke na wakatae udaraja la pili wanaojitakia wao wenyewe kwa kukosa umoja na mipango ya kimkakati kujiweka ubavu kwa ubavu na wenzao wa dini nyingine.

    Ni ushindani wa kweli tu kati yetu katika masuala ya imani, uchumi, siasa, huduma na maendeleo ya jamii, utamaduni, lugha, biashara, michezo, sanaa na kadhalika ndiko kutakatusaidia kuendelea na sio kulalamika siku zote eti tunaonewa, wenzetu wanapendelewa na mambo kama hayo. Kwani nyie wapi mlikwishaona mkono mtupu ukilambwa. Chakarikeni mfanye vitu vyenu na wananchi wataviona na mtajijengea sio tu heshima hapa nchini bali pia hata huko nchi za nje kwamba Waislamu Tanzania ni moto wa kuotea mbali. Maneno na hutuba peke yake havitatusaidia. Sasa umefika wakati wa kuhamasishana nyumba kwa nyumba, mtaa kwa mtaa, kijiji kwa kijiji, mji kwa mji, wilaya kwa wilaya, mkoa kwa mkoa na KAULI MBINU ya: " TUSIKUBALI KUBAKI NYUMA, TUJIKUSURU TWENDE MBELE NA ALLAH atakuwa nasi daima. Uislamu sio imani na amani tu bali Uislamu wa leo sio umasikini na ufukara bali neema na baraka zinazotokana na Waislamu kuwa kitu kimoja na kuwa na viongozi waadilifu, waliosoma dini na elimu ya Kizungu na mabingwa katika maeneo wanayoyasimamia. Linawezekana hili. Na wakati ni kuanzia jana!"
     
  16. Tangawizi

    Tangawizi JF-Expert Member

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    Tusisahau kuwa kikulacho ki nguoni mwako...The moment we stop accusing others for our failures and take proper strides to address them is the moment we will get true liberation.
    Kwa mfano, Mkapa aliwapa waislamu chuo cha Tanesco Morogoro. Mbona hakisikiki? Kinaendeleaje maana vyuo vingine vinasonga mbele. Na kuwapa kile chuo nayo ilikuwa hila ya wakristu? Tusipofika mahala kujaribu kuwa wakweli na nafsi zetu huyu shetani wa kwanini hataisha kutuandama, na hatutakuja pata ushindi wowote kwenye chokochoko za kidini zaidi ya kuzihujumu familia, jamii na nafsi zetu. Nyerere hakuwaonea waislamu...wenye evidence za kutosha ambazo sio za kuzushazusha tu wazilete zieleweke bayana.Vinginevyo ni kelele za debe tupu.
     
  17. M

    Magezi JF-Expert Member

    #17
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    Msingi wa dini ya kiislamu ni uarabuni na kawaida ya waarabu ni wavivu labda ugaidi wanaweza sana kwani hauhitaji long term planning.
     
  18. Z

    Zhule JF-Expert Member

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    Nyerere alisababisha lini waislamu wasipate elimu.Toka mwanzo wamissionary walijenga shule.Nyie uislamu ulileta nini kama siyo madrassa.Kwanza nyerere aliwasaidia alipo taifisha shule za wamissionary ili ziwe za umma hata waislamu wasome ama kweli Shukrani za punda ni mateke
     
  19. Edson

    Edson JF-Expert Member

    #19
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    waislam waengi walikuwa wanashinda madrasa, hawataki kusoma
    na hata wazazi wao walisisitiza washinde madrasa
     
  20. M

    MtazamoWangu JF-Expert Member

    #20
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    hizi mada za udini mi naona zinatupeleka pabaya...mbona mnakuwa wadini mno??? tunalipeleka wapi taifa hili???
    are now showing our true colour??? JK kusema vile suala lile lilikuwa linahusiana na misamaha ya kodi wala si suala la kadhi....f##@@$%$%^&&*...
     
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