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Kaduma apingana na Prof. Shivji: MAADILI vs MIIKO.

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Azimio Jipya, Apr 30, 2011.

  1. Azimio Jipya

    Azimio Jipya JF-Expert Member

    #1
    Apr 30, 2011
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    Kwenye Kongamano lilofanyika Leo Chuo kikuu Dar es salaam Kuhusu ushirikiswhaji wa AZIMIO LA ARUSHA KWENYE MCHAKATO WA KUUNDA KATIBA MPYA , Profesa Shiji alionekana kutilia maanani zaidi MIIKO ya uongozi kuliko MAADILI ya Uongozi.

    Akisema kuwa Maadili hayapimiki wala kufudishika, Ila Miiko ya uongozi inapimika na inapotekelezwa kinachopatikana huwa ndio maadili!

    Kwenye kuchangia Hoja Ibrahim Kaduma alionekana kutokubaliana na dhana ya Prof Shivji ..Akasisitiza kwa dhati kabisa kuwa Maadili yanafundishika..

    Wanatofautina nini kimsingi?

    Na Kipi kati ya MIIKO na MAADILI kinatufaa kwa sasa?

    MY TAKE:

    Nilimuelwa Profesa Shivji zaidi. Kwani MIIKO ni kitu clear and very objective.
     
  2. Endeleaaa

    Endeleaaa JF-Expert Member

    #2
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    Hayo yooote yaabaki kuwa the past that will never come back.

    Kujadili yaliyopita yasiokuwa na future inakuwa ni time wasting. Imaging baada huyo mjadala then what next?
     
  3. only83

    only83 JF-Expert Member

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    .........................My view,yote yanafundishika japo wakati mwingine maadili ni ngumu sana kufundishika,inahitajika nguvu ya ziada kumfundisha mtu maadili....
     
  4. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

    #4
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    Yote yanafundishika na mara nyingi yote mawili huzungumzia mambo yale yale tu. Zaidi ya hapo litakuwa ni suala la lugha tu.
     
  5. Dumelambegu

    Dumelambegu JF-Expert Member

    #5
    Apr 30, 2011
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    Tungekuwa na wapuuzi wa aina yako wawili tu hapa nchini, sijui maisha yangekuwaje!! Wengine humu JF wanadhani kuchangia ni lazima. Kama huna cha kuchangia kwa nini ujishughulishe na jambo jingine?
     
  6. Waberoya

    Waberoya JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Apr 30, 2011
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    Mkuu akina Nyerere walikuwa na tabia nzuri ndio wakaleta AA, tabia nzuri ndio ilianza na kuangaza kwa wengine,

    hamuwezi wote kuwa na tabia mbaya mkasema muweke AA ili liwabadilishe!

    Miiko inasimamiwa kwa sheria AA halikuwa sheria!

    Sheria iko juu sana kuliko issues za AA, kama leo sheria zipo na nothing seem to help the problem then is not because we abandoned AA! funny!!


    Ni mmoja wa waandaaji wa kongamano la leo and real, tutaandaa tena hivi karibuni kwenye greater scale, maana bado hakukuwa na changamoto so what you have just witnessed is a one man show

    Tuelezane ukweli na kujua source ya matatizo!
     
  7. Dumelambegu

    Dumelambegu JF-Expert Member

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    Ifahamike kuwa wote wawili wanauona umuhimu wa taifa kuwa na maadili. Wanachotofautiana ni namna maadili yanavyopatikana. Prof. Shivji anasema lazima uanze na miiko kwanza maana applicability yake ni rahisi ikilinganishwa na maadili ambayo upimaji wake siyo rahisi. Mzee Kaduma anasema maadili ndiyo muhimu na yanafundishika kirahisi.

    Mimi binafsi naunga mkono mtizamo wa Prof. Shivji kwamba uzingatiaji wa muda mrefu wa miiko ndiyo huzaa maadili.
     
  8. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

    #8
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    Mimi nadhani ukiwa na maadili mazuri ni rahisi zaidi kujiwekea miiko na kuifuata.
     
  9. Waberoya

    Waberoya JF-Expert Member

    #9
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    There you are NN,

    Maadili is a basic, miiko inaendana na what you intend to do, kuna miiko ya mapolisi, kuna miiko ya manesi, kuna miiko ya viongozi n.k, huwezi kutengeneza miiko kama huna maadili!

    Akina Nyerere na timu yake walikuwa na maadili mazuri, ndiyo wakapelekea kutengeneza miiko!

    Maadili ni natured thing, inakuja automatic kutoka kwenye jamii inayokuzunguka, ndani ya maadili tunapata miiko ambayo ukishindwa kuifuata unaonekana huna maadili
     
  10. Kichuguu

    Kichuguu Platinum Member

    #10
    Apr 30, 2011
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    Nadhani profesa yuko sahihi mia kwa mia na huenda huyo mwanasiasa aliyempinga hajui anachoongea. Maadili ni kipimo cha tabia ya mtu, na miiko ni amri inayoweza kuwa dhidi ya utashi wao. Hatuwezi kumfundisha mtu tabia, ila tunaweza kumwamrisha jambo hata kama halipendi. Ndiyo maana watu wenye maadili ya wizi tunawafunga wanapoiba kwa vile sheria inawaamuru wasiibe
     
  11. Ta Muganyizi

    Ta Muganyizi JF Gold Member

    #11
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  12. M

    Mghaka JF-Expert Member

    #12
    Apr 30, 2011
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    Tukubaliane kuwa miiko na maadili kwa pamoja vinaaweza kuwa nyenzo ya kujenga taifa lenye viongozi nadhifu kiroho na wenye upendo na nidhamu kubwa ya kazi. Maadili yanaweza kuwa vitu kama vile kuazimia kujenga taifa na serikali yenye viongozi na watumishi waadilifu, wenye uwajibikaji, heshima, upendo, nidhamu, hodari na tija kazini. Lakini ili tufikie ujenzi wa taifa lenye kiwango cha utumishi huu ni lazima tuweke makatazo yafuatayo hatutaruhusu mtumishi wetu kuwa mwanachamawa chama cha siasa, viongozi wa kisiasa na waserikali hawatakiwi kuwa wakurugenzi wa mashirika binafsi nk. Kama alivyosema professa hivi unapimaje kwa ufanisi na kumpa alama mtu mwenye upendo? uadilifu nk bila miiko huwezi kupima angalau hata kwa kiwango cha unafiki wa kiutumishi kujua anagalau mtumishi fulani hakuvunja miiko ya utumishi. Ili kuwa na miiko safi tunahitaji maadili ya taifa na wale ambao watapata dhamana ya kututumikia wawekwe katika mipaka ya kiutumishi lakini ndani ya mipaka hiyo tuwasaidia kuwawekea measurable indicators ndani ya makatazo hayo, tofauti na makatazo ya kisheria makatazo ya miiko wasimamizi watumiaji wake ni umma na wanaweza kukuambia umevunja mwiko fulani hustahili kuwa kiongozi. miko ilirudisha mamlaka ya kiutekelezaji kuhusu utendaji wa viongozi wa kisiasa na serikali kwa mwajili ambaye ni mwananchi. BRAVO UDSM tunanza kuona yale tuliyoyazoea kuona wakati wa harakati za ukombozi wa Afrika. changamoto kwa viongozi wanaokuja kutumia majukwaa hayo kujumuika na ummma naomba mwaka elfu mbili na kumi na tano wanaotaka kukaa kwenye kiti cha enzi waanzie hapo kwanza na waulizwe maswali na watanzania watakaoalikwa kuhudhuria mikutano hiyo. kila chama kilete timu yake hapo na watueleze wanataka kuifanyia nini tanzania
     
  13. Juma Contena

    Juma Contena JF-Expert Member

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  14. Kichuguu

    Kichuguu Platinum Member

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  15. Azimio Jipya

    Azimio Jipya JF-Expert Member

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    Mkuu kuwa makini hii ni seriuos issue. Maneno mawili hayo lakini yanaweza kubadili mustakabali wa Taifa kabisa!!
     
  16. Azimio Jipya

    Azimio Jipya JF-Expert Member

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  17. Azimio Jipya

    Azimio Jipya JF-Expert Member

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  18. Leonard Robert

    Leonard Robert JF-Expert Member

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    Prof yuko sawa miiko iko ni objective lakini maadili inategemea anayejaji kama akiwa bias,maadili yatapotoshwa.ila naomba maelezo kuhusu azimio la Zanziber silijui.
     
  19. Juma Contena

    Juma Contena JF-Expert Member

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  20. Azimio Jipya

    Azimio Jipya JF-Expert Member

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    Kamati kuu ya ccm ilakaa Zanzibar wakati fulani ... na KUONDOA MIIKO YOTE YA AZIMIO LA ARUSHA!! Na tafsri ya wengi baada ya kuondolewa kwa MIIKO hiyo ni kuwa AZIMIO LA ARUSHA LILIZIKWA pale zanzibar na likatokea azimio ambalo lilipewa utambulisho wa AZIMIO LA ZANZIBAR!... ambalo ndilo limukuwa chimbuko la kila aina ya ufisadi unaotokea nchini kwa sasa.

    Ni vizuri kuona umuhimu wa MIIKO na si MAADILI! Kilichofanyika zanzibar kiligusa MIIKO ...ambayo sasa inabidi kufanyaiwa kazi kwa kipindi cha nyakati zetu... na kurudishwa kama sehemu ya Katiba mpya!!

    KWA HIYO TUONGELEE MIIKO NA SI MAADILI!

    Kila Fisadi anaweza kudai kuwa ana MAADILI lakini si kila FISADI anaweza kudhihirisha kafuatia MIIKO!!!
     
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