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Is Mugabe a hero or a Monster?

Discussion in 'Habari na Hoja mchanganyiko' started by Mtafaruku, Jun 19, 2008.

  1. M

    Mtafaruku Member

    #1
    Jun 19, 2008
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    There has been a lot Mugabe bashing on the news for quite sometimes. Some people feel Mugabe has become a monster and obstacle of development in Zimbabwe, but there are some who feel Mugabe is still an African hero who deserve respects and is a better candidate than his opponent.

    To make reasonable conclusion, proper discussion and review of hard facts about Zimbabwe in terms of current economical, social and political problems need to be conducted. This balanced review of situation and facts may help Zimbabweans and Africans in general to get good picture on what is going on and what can be done.

    For one,in defend of Mugabe record, he does not appear (as himself) to fit category of corrupt leaders like what we have seen in many parts of Africa, like Mobutu, Abacha and others....if Mugabe had assets and money in foreign countries, that would have been primary target of current campaigns.

    Two, most Zimbabweans agreed/agree with his land reform policy which aimed at empowering Africans but at same time this policy has been attribute as a primary cause of current economical crisis, even though some analsysts do not agree.

    As way to participate in this debate, I have put forward a couple of articles which provide some insights on the issues at stakes so that we may be able discuss our matters ( african matters) in a more intelligent way for the interest of Africans.

    Article 1 give some insights causes of Zimbabwe problems
    Article 1a: http://cleveland.indymedia.org/news/2008/06/30586.php
    Article 1b: http://www.talkzimbabwe.com/news/117/ARTICLE/2733/2008-06-19.html

    Artcile 2 shows foreign contributions in African politics, in way guiding Africans in a choices which may not neccesarily serve their interest.
    Article 2 : http://www.medianewsline.com/news/133/ARTICLE/2502/2008-06-17.html

    Articles 3, 4 & 5 cover some additional details
    Article 3 : http://www.talkzimbabwe.com/news/130...008-06-17.html
    Article 4: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle4152337.ece
    Article 5: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/equatorialguinea/2156670/Simon-Mann-names-Mark-Thatcher-in-coup-plot.html


    In my view, there is smell of old British emperial games in pushing Mugabe out ...the history taught us how well they played "Indirect rule" , "Divide and conquer" etc. e.g African leaders ( e.g Mbeki, Mandela etc ) seemed to be pushed to have stands against other elected African leaders ( Mugabe) , religion being utillized as a political tool i.e England's Anglican church recent statements on Zimbabwe seems to suggest Mugabe ( a catholic) is targeting anglicans.

    In short, there is a good chance century old game is back in play Zimbabwe and many parts of Africa.

    I do not think it fair to squarely put blames on Mugabe on what has happened. Is Mugabe really a monster? I would urge No.

    It is almost definite when Tsvangirai wins, sanctions will be lifted but is this not black-mail to Zimbabweans? Why the British and allies want so bad to get rid of Mugabe? Is Tsvangirai going to give back land to whites?, or is he going to cheaply sell industries which failed because of sanctions back to them?

    Everyone want a better Zimbabwe? Probably Zimbabwe will be better when Mugabe is not a president? But is Tsvangirai going to better than him?

    We must be careful with what we cheering/looting for. Wakina Carl Peters walitulaghai miaka 200 iliyopita, tukaingia mkenge....na mbaya zaidi waafrika walitumika kufanikisha ukoloni, tukakandamizwa na kunyonywa miaka nenda rudi!

    Mugabe may be wrong in some aspects, but we should give him respect and dignity as a hero who fight for Africans and he may have a point on current struggle.
     
  2. Mahesabu

    Mahesabu JF-Expert Member

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    Jun 19, 2008
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    Mugabe Is A Hero........!
     
  3. D

    DAR si LAMU JF-Expert Member

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    Jun 19, 2008
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    ..calling him a monster is understating, he's more than that!

    ..wazimbabwe ambao ndugu zao wamekuwa marehemu karibuni wana jibu zuri zaidi.
     
  4. Timtim

    Timtim JF-Expert Member

    #4
    Jun 19, 2008
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    Mugabe was a Hero but he has changed to be a Monster.
     
  5. Mswahilina

    Mswahilina Senior Member

    #5
    Jun 20, 2008
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    Mugabe is an African monster of the first quarter of 21st Century.
     
  6. W

    WembeMkali JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Jun 20, 2008
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    Thanks Mtafaruku!

    Mugabe is a hero and shall remain a hero in African history!

    First,Let us ask ourselves why Mugabe? why Zimbabwe? and not Gabon with its leader Omar Bongo who has been in power since 1967? why we don hear UK and America open their mouth on Mr. Bongo? or why we don hear anyone talk about Mr.Theodore Nguema of Equatorial Guinea? why we don hear UK and America talk anything about attrocities happening in the Eastern Congo?
    all these issues are okay with them except Mugabe and Zimbabwe!! Mugabe now is painted as the monster!,a dictactor and so forth! who doesnt know that the British and American governments have and had discriminated,jailed,tortured,and put many innocent black people in their prisons than any other race in this world.
    Africans should understand that, the issue of Mugabe and Zimbabwe involves white people and their interests! thats why UK and America are acting and pushing so hard to ensure that the white people remain superior wherever they go or live!
    Also Africans should understand that UK and America are conveying the message that any African leader who tries to mess up with the white people's interests will end up like Mugabe!
    Unfortunately,nobody is talking about the main cause which led to the current situation in Zimbabwe, economic sanctions.Personally i don think the opposition have the gut to distribute the land back to black Zimbabweans.Even if they will win,they will most likely not touch the white people interests-the land issues and again the black Zimbabweans will have to line up everyday for what is called "a day worker" to white own farm!..what a shame!!! to Africans!

    -Wembe.
     
  7. M

    Mtafaruku Member

    #7
    Jun 20, 2008
    Joined: Jun 18, 2008
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    Zimbabwe minister says UK bribing African leaders
    Fri 20 Jun 2008, 17:56 GMT

    [-] Text [+] HARARE (Reuters) - A Zimbabwean government minister accused Prime Minister Gordon Brown on Friday of trying to bribe African leader to condemn the southern African country's presidential run-off election.

    "True to fashion, Prime Minister Gordon Brown is going back to the old habit of divide and rule," Science and Technology Minister Olivia Muchena, one of President Robert Mugabe's campaign co-ordinators, said on state television.

    "We note with concern the attempt to bribe and coerce African leaders to speak against the results of the presidential run-off before they are even held on the 27th of June."

    Source: http://africa.reuters.com/world/news/usnLA272463.html

    I believe this statement has been made in reference to this

    BRITAIN has provided 1.4 million pounds (about K8.82 billion) to strengthen Zambia's reform programmes designed to improve transparency and enhance democratic processes.

    Full Text: http://www.daily-mail.co.zm/media/news/viewnews.cgi?category=8&id=1213433505
     
  8. M

    Mtafaruku Member

    #8
    Jun 20, 2008
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    UK may be betting on pushing Mugabe aside so that they can share the spoil....made to collapse industries in Zimbabwe.....see this article

    London-listed investment group LonZim plans to raise a further $60 to $100-million through a share sale to purchase assets in Zimbabwe, it said on Friday, betting on the country's recovery despite current turmoil.

    Full text: http://www.miningweekly.com/article.php?a_id=136218
     
  9. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

    #9
    Jun 21, 2008
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    may be he is monstrous hero...
     
  10. Kijakazi

    Kijakazi JF-Expert Member

    #10
    Jun 21, 2008
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    wewe mbona unaandika nusu nusu? mbona hujibu au huongei lelote hoja zilizoandikwa kuhusu watu miliono 5 waliokufa na bado wanakufa kongo, e. guinea, gabon, chad,sudan,uganda, rwanda,

    mbona unakimbilia kutoa majibu mafupi mafupi,?
    Je utaelezea vipi shutuma hizo walizotoa hao ndugu kuhusu ukabaila wakiingereza?
    mbona hutoi maini yako? mbona hukanushi au kukubali zaidi ya kuandika tuu mstari mmoja?
    naomba umjibu huyo bwana aliyeuliza swali kwa nini zimbabwe na kwingineko?
     
  11. M

    Mtafaruku Member

    #11
    Jun 21, 2008
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    Nakubaliana na Kijakazi, inabidi upambanue maelezo yako. Sijaelewa unatoa hoja gani, mambo hayaeleweki kwa maneno nusu nusu
     
  12. W

    WembeMkali JF-Expert Member

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    Jun 21, 2008
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    Kijakazi...

    Waafrika ndiyo tulivyo! tukipewa pilau au kagari au kamshiko kadogo tunauza utu na mali zetu zote!.Hii ndivyo hali halisi inavyojionyesha kule Zimbabwe na Afrika nzima!Tunaliona hili hata nchini mwetu kuanzia mikataba hadi kwenye chaguzi mbalimbali nchini !!

    Hizo vurugu zinazotokea Zimbabwe ni kwa sababu UK na Marekani wanataka kuiangusha serikali ya Mugabe kwa kuwahonga wapinzani mapesa na kuwafanya wakaidi sheria za nchi hiyo na ndiyo maana serikali nayo inachukua tahadhari ili kucontrol the situation.Na hili si jipya kwa serikali nyingi hata Marekani nao wangechukua hatua hizo hizo kama wangesikia wamarekani weusi au revolutionalists wanataka kuiangusha serikali yao au hata ya Uingereza.

    Kwa hiyo hapa suala la ardhi kwa weusi limebadilishwa na kuwa issue ya human rights abuse na violence in Zimbabwe!!! na tazama waafrika kama kawaida yao wameshaingizwa kwenye mtego huo na wameukubali,na siyo siri hivi ndivyo Godon Brown na Marekani wanataka iwe ili waweze kumshutumu Mugabe kirahisi.

    Hivi kweli unafikiri mtu kama Godon Brown anapenda kuona ardhi ya wazungu kule Zimbabwe ikigawanywa kwa wazimbabwe weusi?? Kwa kifupi tu ni kuwa UK ilikuwa inanufaika sana na ardhi ile kwa kupitia wazungu wale,na kamwe ndiyo maana haitaki kuona mtu kama Mugabe anaongoza Zimbabwe! hata huyo Tsvangirai mwenyewe kamwe hataweza kuigawa ile ardhi kwa wazimbabwe weusi hata akishinda uchaguzi.

    Sasa tukikubali ya akina Godon Brown na Marekani kuhusu Zimbabwe, tusikatae ya nchini mwetu siku wazungu na makumpuni ya nje yanapokuja kutunyonya na kutuacha masikini wa kutupwa!!

    -Wembe
     
  13. Kijakazi

    Kijakazi JF-Expert Member

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    Jun 21, 2008
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    yaani hapo umemaliza kila kitu na utaona hamna atayekujibu kazi yao ni kuangalia bbc na cnn na wanachokiona wanakikubali na kuanza kuropoka...
    umeongea jambo la maana sana ndugu yangu na hapo akina mwanakijiji na jopo lake hawathubutu kusema kitu ila watahamia sehemu nyingine na kuchukua picha kutoka bbc na cnn na kuzibandika humu ili tuu kuonyesha jinsi Mugabe alivyokuwa mbaya, halafu kutw nzima wanapiga zoga jinsi wanavyotaka kuikomboa nchi yetu sasa tukiwapa uongozi si ndio watarudisha wakoloni kabisa....
    Hawa watu humu wana matatizo huku wanapinga mikataba ya madini kama ulivyosema hapo hapo wanataka changarai awe raisi zimbabwe wakati dunia nzima inajua kwamba anapata pesa kutoka uingereza na marekani...
    mimi nawauliza humu kama mugabe angekuwa kweli ni dikteta mkubwa kiasi hicho Je inakuwaje asilimia 50 ya bunge la zimbabwe ni wapinzan?
    Je tanzania niwangapi? au nitajie nchi ngapi za afrika kuna hiyo idadi?
    kama kweli ni muuaji hivyo huyo changarai kweli angeweza kuishi na kufanya kampeni zimbabwe?
    kama ni kweli ni dikteta hivi wanajua kama zimbabwe kuna wakulima wakizungu zaidi ya 400 bado wanaishi?
    Na swali langu la mwisho kwa Je ni kwa nini humu wanaleta habari za zimbabwe na sio kongo au chad au sudani?
    kama isingekuwa kwa hao wanafki bbc kuogelea kuhusu zimbabwe hawa wanafki wa kiafrika wasingeongea kitu na hoja za zimbabwe zisingetawala humu....
    kwa hiyo kazi bado kubwa bado tunayo ni mpaka tuweze kufanya mapinduzi ya kifikra kwa watu kama akina mwanakiji na wenzao wanofikiri kwamba ni mzungu tuu ndio aliye sahihi na chechote anchosema mzungu basi ni ukweli hata kama anambaka dada yake bado ni mzungu na atatafuta njia ya kumtetea na kuanza kumgeuzia kibao dsada yake anayebakwa badala ya kumtetea.....
    tunaona humu ni hivi majuzi tuu mwanakijiji alilaani kitendo cha serikali kuleta wamarekani weusi arusha na SI WAINGEREZA?
     
  14. R

    Rodelite JF-Expert Member

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    Jun 22, 2008
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    Mugabe is still a Hero as far as "Indepenence for Zimbabwe"is concerned. Right now he is becoming a Monster because......He is being selfish especially when he said in one of his speeches that "only God will remove him from power".
    In other words....Mugabe amepitwa na wakati. Kwanini asing'atuke na kuwaachia wenye mawazo ya maendeleo ya kuwanufaisha waZimbabwe wachukue uongozi?
    Akubalikwamba....hapa mwishoni amevurunda.....kwa hiyo....aachie ngazi.
     
  15. Mtu wa Pwani

    Mtu wa Pwani JF-Expert Member

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    Jun 22, 2008
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    mwanakijiji si mamluki bali ni shujaa na mpiganaji mwenye mawazo ya kibepari
     
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