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If Nyerere was alive...

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by Rev. Kishoka, Dec 27, 2007.

  1. Rev. Kishoka

    Rev. Kishoka JF-Expert Member

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    Dec 27, 2007
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    1. Mkapa would not have had a second term in 2000!
    2. A Zanzibari would have succeded Mkapa (Salim or Sheni)
    3. Lowassa would have been gone out of picture completely and his attempts to Join Upinzani in 1998-99 that led to Mkapa handing him Uwaziri would not have worked machoni na puani mwa Mwalimu
    4. RA, JK would have had to wait until 2010 to make their move and by that time, none of them would have had any political capital.
    5. Funny names like Karamagi or Msabaha would have been Majina ya Vijiweni and so is Chenge!
    6. Malecela would have retired ealier from CCM
    7. Upinzani would have had at least 30% seats in the parliament, due to msukumo wa kuboresha upinzai na si kukandamiza
    8. Sitta would never had been a speaker
    9. Sinclair, Andrew Young, Barrick, ABSA, SAA, and all wawekezaji haramu would not have been holding 99% control of their investments!
    10. Takrima would have been banned
    11. Emmanuel Nchimbi would have been a nobody!
    12. No talk of Muafaka would have been in place, Serikali of Mseto would have been in existance in Zanzibar!
    13. We would not have seen continuation or Radar, Ndege or IPTL saga. RDC, Kiwira would have been ndoto mbovu. Mikopo for Meremeta, Mwananchi Green and Tangold would not have been sign. Balali would have been in Dar working dilligently and not laying on death bed!
    14. Simba would have lost every game to Yanga :)
     
  2. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

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    kama hayo yote yangetokea, Mwalimu angeiacha CCM kwani alisema siyo mama yake!
     
  3. Rev. Kishoka

    Rev. Kishoka JF-Expert Member

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    Lakini angeiacha salama na si mahututi!
     
  4. Mwiba

    Mwiba JF-Expert Member

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    Mi naona atajiona luzah ,kwani ameikosesha familia yake mtaji japo wa kumiliki mgodi wa madini ,hivi mnataka kusema hakuwa na ubabaishaji wowote yaani tuanze kumwita Mr Clean au ?
     
  5. S

    S. S. Phares JF-Expert Member

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    Too bad..time can only go forward.
     
  6. Bongolander

    Bongolander JF-Expert Member

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    The question would have been what would he do if he come back today? Would he be mad at JK or Benjamin? For sure he would beat EL.
     
  7. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Out of 40 million people, why only Nyerere? Couldn't they or can't they happen without him...?
     
  8. Bin Maryam

    Bin Maryam JF-Expert Member

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    Mnachosahau ni kuwa angekuwa na miaka 85. Mzee na aliyepitwa na wakati.
     
  9. Bongolander

    Bongolander JF-Expert Member

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    That is a very good question. He was able to let Ben and Stop JK/EL team to take the reigns of the country. And these 40 Milion you are talking are the ones who gave JK/EL team what Nyerere did not, can you see that?
     
  10. Alnadaby

    Alnadaby JF-Expert Member

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    I don't think he would have done anything because:
    1.He was the one who literally forced Mkapa to stand for the presidency.
    2.No way could a Zanzibari become The President! Nyerere could have done so ,he was not trusting any.
    3.For Lowassa..you are right.He was not in his favour.
    4.For JK you are wrong! Nyerere was guilty of the 1995 CCM presidential election intervention for his favourite candidate Ben and had to correct his judgement.
    5.The new names yes.Don't expect Vingunge forever....the names would have worried the late Mwalimu.
    6.Malecela would still be the Vice Chairman.It didn't matter for Mwalimu for Malecela to be a party leader as long as he was not The President of The United Republic.
    7.Nyerere had no msukumo kwa upinzani to flourish otherwise he would have proposed a new constitution when he was around.
    8.Sitta was his Minister and could have been a Speaker too.
    9.He would have probably come up with a better deal but where was he when the mining bill was tabled?
    10.Takrima would have been renamed rushwa.Warioba would have cried a lot.
    11.Emmanuel Nchimbi would have been a full fledged Minister for the honour of his late Daddy cool like Dr.Hussein Mwinyi.
    12.All the sagas are the continuation of old sagas since the Nyerere to date unless an angel comes to the rescue.
    12.Muafaka is eternal as long as CCM riggs elections and CUF have nothing to do about it.
    13.Simba and Yanga have a history of win and lose.Simply wait and see!
     
  11. R

    Rwabugiri JF-Expert Member

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    ooops,
    Hewould not be alive anyway because hewould have died of the shock from biashara ndani ya ikulu (lol!)
     
  12. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Wabongo tuna "Big Man mentality"!

    Nyerere, however influential, ni mtu tu. Inabidi tu focus kwenye institutions na kuacha kuwa-deitize watu.Ona sasa mpaka wanataka kumfanaya "mwenye heri" na "mtakatifu" ndiyo hapo sasa watu watakapoanza ku-air his dirty laundry alivyoua watu wa kuwafungia watu wasitoke vijijini mwao.
     
  13. Rev. Kishoka

    Rev. Kishoka JF-Expert Member

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    I am not trying to exault Nyerere here, but to inspire a healthy conversation which is reflection of his absence in Tanzania.

    Yes Nyerere had his mistakes and he admitted. However he had "universal" power that CCM people listened to him and feared him. These people are now the monkeys runing our country. Kaondoka Paka, Panya wanasherehekea.

    He was for the country even though he man handled the party, millitary and Wananchi!
     
  14. H

    HAM Member

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    Jamani ata Nyerer kuna mambo alifanya yalikuwa mabaya na hayakuwa na Maslahi kwa Taifa.Fikiria babu yangu aliambiwa kuvunja nyumba yake mzuri ya bati na kuhama sehemu yenye mashamba yao na kwenda ishi mahali kame kisa operation vijiji na vijiji vya ujamaa.
    Amefanya mambo mengi na mabaya lakini tulikuwa hatuyajui kwa sababu hakukuwa na uhuru wa vyombo vya habari kama ilivyo sasa.nI YEYE ALIYEKUWA NA SIASA ZA UKANDAMIZAJI NA KUFIKIRI ALIKUWA SAHIHI MUDA WOTE LA HASHA NI BINADAMU NA AKIFANYA MAMBO MAZURI NA MABAYA PIA KAMA BINADAMU WENGINE AKINA mKAPA,Mwinyi na hivi sasa JK.
     
  15. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

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    HAm wenzio walijaribu wakashindwa... na kwanini unafikiri ni babu yako tu alikutana na uhamisho huo na kuacha nyumba yake? Kati ya hayo mabaya ambayo Nyerere aliyafanya ambayo yanajulikana kuna mambo yoyote mazuri unayoweza kufikiria kuwa Nyerere aliyafanya?
     
  16. J

    JokaKuu Platinum Member

    #16
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    Rev.Kishoka,

    ..mbona Kawawa aliendelea kupeta hata baada ya kuboronga ktk operesheni vijiji?

    ..mbona Sokoine aliendelea kupeta hata baada ya kumpa Mwalimu ushauri mbaya kuhusu matatizo ya uchumi/wahujumu uchumi? Waliompa ushauri mzuri wakina Mtei wakafukuzwa kazi?

    ..mbona yule Mkuu wa Mkoa aliyeshtakiwa na wananchi kwa kuzini na watoto wa shule hakufukuzwa kazi na Baba wa Taifa? halafu mnashangaa ya babu seya.

    ..mbona yule Afisa wa Polisi alipelekwa Ubalozini baada ya kubainika kwamba alikanyaga na kuua mtu kwa gari? leo mnashangaa ya Ditopile.

    ..Kassim Hanga alionekana kwa mara ya mwisho akiwa hai ktk mkutano wa hadhara ambapo Mwalimu alimtukana kama mtoto mdogo. Hanga ametoweka, inasemekana aliuawa. Kaburi lake liko wapi? Katika watu wote "waliopotelea" Zenj nadhani Mwalimu had to account for Kassim Hanga.

    ..Labda Kanisa Katoliki watueleze alipozikwa Kassim Hanga kabla ya kumsimika Utakatifu Mwalimu Nyerere.
     
  17. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Nilijua tu hii huwezi kuiachia.....Lol
     
  18. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

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    of course, Nyani.. kwa sababu wengi wanaosema mabaya ya Nyerere ni wale ambao wanafikiri ni familia zao tu ziliguswa na maamuzi magumu ya wakati ule na labda ni wao tu ambao walijikuta kwenye upande mbaya wa maamuzi ya Nyerere. "mara babu yangu alifanyiwa hivi, mara baba yangu alipoteza hiki, mara familia yangu ilihamishwa hapa".. so hawazungumzi wakiwa objective kwa sababu ya personal attachment.
     
  19. Nyani Ngabu

    Nyani Ngabu Platinum Member

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    Kule kwenye vibweka vya wakubwa SteveD ameuliza swali kuhusu kile kifimbo. Kapige chabo basi labda unaweza ukamsaidia kujibu swali lake...
     
  20. BAK

    BAK JF-Expert Member

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    Dec 29, 2007
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    Nyerere alikuwa na makosa yake pia. Sera za vijiji vya ujamaa ilikuwa ni sera nzuri tu ili kuhakikisha kuwapatia watu huduma muhimu kama shule, zahanati, maji na hata umeme. Utekelezaji wake ndio ulikuwa mbovu, lakini pamoja na hayo kamwe huwezi kuyalinganisha mabaya aliyoyafanya Nyerere na mabaya aliyoyafanya Mkapa na anayoendelea kuyafanya Kikwete.

    Nyerere pia aliwapa msamaha watu wengi tu wakiwamo wahaini waliotaka kumpindua (akina Bibi Titi and company). Tunajua katika nchi nyingi Kiongozi anayepinduliwa aidha huuawa au hufungwa kwa maisha. Kwa hiyo Nyerere kama angepinduliwa angeweza kabisa kuuwawa au kufungwa maisha, lakini pamoja na hayo bado aliweza kuwasamehe wabaya wake wakati akiwa Rais.

    Mazuri aliyoyafanya Nyerere siku zote yatashinda mabaya kwa kiasi kukubwa sana. Hata hii leo ukikutana na wananchi wa nchi nyingine mbali mbali duniani wakijua kama wewe ni Mtanzania basi watakuuliza kuhusu Nyerere pamoja na kuwa aling'atuka miaka 22 iliyopita. Utamuelezea kwamba alishastaafu tangu 1985 na alifariki 1999. Siku zote hawa wanaouliza kuhusu Nyerere humalizia kwa kusema he was a good leader, hakuna hata siku moja nimepewa comments za 'he was a bad leader'

    Mumseme vibaya Nyerere lakini wakati huo huo mkumbuke mazuri mengi aliyoyafanya kwa nchi yetu ambayo hawa mafisadi na wasanii kamwe hawawezi kuyafikia. As a human being he was not perfect, but most of the time if not always, before making any big decision he thought about the negative/positive impact of that decision.
     
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