Dismiss Notice
You are browsing this site as a guest. It takes 2 minutes to CREATE AN ACCOUNT and less than 1 minute to LOGIN

Holocaust Vs Slavery

Discussion in 'International Forum' started by Paul S.S, Oct 18, 2011.

  1. P

    Paul S.S Verified User

    #1
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Aug 27, 2009
    Messages: 5,841
    Likes Received: 174
    Trophy Points: 160
    Wakuu punde tu nimetoka kuangalia movie ya Schendle's List, na nimevutika kuiangalia baada ya last week kuangalia Escape from sabibor.
    Mwanzo kabisa nilikua naamini hakuna kipindi kibaya sana kwa maisha ya binadamu kama ulivyokuwa wakati wa utumwa
    Lakini sasa baada ya kuangalia hizi movies nashawishika kuamini Jews walipitia kipindi kibaya sana wakati huo.
    What do tou think?
     
  2. Roulette

    Roulette JF-Expert Member

    #2
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Dec 15, 2010
    Messages: 5,618
    Likes Received: 6
    Trophy Points: 0
    I think the Holocaust lasted for a decade (at the most) and that the recognition of their suffering came fast and today the international community (particularly the European countries) are still paying the price of their idleness during the period. Na ndio maana Israel can do whatever they want, in the name of "preventing them selves from a new Holocaust". It is a bit what the current Rwandese government is trying to do for the Tutsies.
    Kumbuka pia kuna other people who went in those camps zaidi ya Jews, kama Jehovah witness, homosexuals, blacks, other semits like Arabs etc, ila havisemwi sana to maximize the guilt of other nations. It happened in few countries (I think 2 or 3), during war time when all actors had something else in mind.
    On the other hand slavery wend on for centuries and has still not been officially recognized, no compensation has ever been paid and even the descendants of the slaves were not given a "special treatment" to facilitate their integration in a society dominated by the descendants of their oppressors who had already good wealth, education and other tools to survive and succeed in a capitalist word. this happened in two continents, everywhere, and was backed by the law, in peaceful and war time.
    Kwa mtazamo wangu the slavery was a greater crime, ingawa hii nayo sio ndogo. I have seen the movie (Schindler's list) and was touched by the scene with the little girl who had a red dress... I hate it when little girls suffer, you know what I mean :)
     
  3. P

    Paul S.S Verified User

    #3
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Aug 27, 2009
    Messages: 5,841
    Likes Received: 174
    Trophy Points: 160
    Ofcoz they were both worse incidents in human history. The slavery went on much longer, and probably more people were enslaved than died in the holocaust.

    However, at least the slavers were not trying to eliminate the black race. They enslaved some black people, but they didn't want to kill them, ilikuwa ni kwa faida yao to keep them alive.
    It was a horrible thing to do, but slaves did not experience the horror of being puting
    on those consentration camps that can killed 10 thousand Jews in one day. They also starved, were burned alive, were victims of crazy test medical experiment, gassed, shot, raped,march to death and the list goes on,
    Some slaves were better treated than others, and although it is true that they were at the mercy of their owners, the fact is that most owners wanted their slaves alive, not dead.

    The Holocaust was a delibrate and coldly caluclated attempt to completely eliminate certain groups of people, particularly the Jews, but many others were targeted as well. There was no hope for those who were sent to the concentration camps, their only purpose was to die.

    ingawaje wakati mwingine Tortures is worse than killing, and i dont means that slavery is not worse, lakini nafikiri holocaust is more worse
     
  4. Roulette

    Roulette JF-Expert Member

    #4
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Dec 15, 2010
    Messages: 5,618
    Likes Received: 6
    Trophy Points: 0
    Ni mtazamo wako... what about the recognition of the crime? mi nadhani wenyewe wameanza healing process baada ya kuommbwa msamaha. sisi je? huoni kama psychologically na statutory tunahitaji recognition pia?
     
  5. MaxShimba

    MaxShimba JF-Expert Member

    #5
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Apr 11, 2008
    Messages: 35,808
    Likes Received: 94
    Trophy Points: 145
  6. U

    Ulimakafu JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Mar 18, 2011
    Messages: 16,534
    Likes Received: 250
    Trophy Points: 180
    Una hoja wewe.
     
  7. P

    Paul S.S Verified User

    #7
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Aug 27, 2009
    Messages: 5,841
    Likes Received: 174
    Trophy Points: 160
    Kama mnazungumzia aftermath ni kweli Jews wanaonekana kupewa kipaumbele zaidi, lakini ni pengine holocaust imetokea karibuni zaidi na lengo ilikuwa kuwafuta katika uso wa dunia, pia miifumo ya kiutawala ilikua imeisha jijenga vizuri tofauti na enzi za utumwa,
    Mimi nilikua jaribu kuangalia jinsi gani wakati haya yanatokea watu walivyokuwa wanaji feel at that moment, its so bad aisee
     
  8. T

    Topical JF-Expert Member

    #8
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Dec 3, 2010
    Messages: 5,177
    Likes Received: 4
    Trophy Points: 0
    Holocaust is hoax, fabrication and total lie
     
  9. P

    Paul S.S Verified User

    #9
    Oct 18, 2011
    Joined: Aug 27, 2009
    Messages: 5,841
    Likes Received: 174
    Trophy Points: 160
    And what the truth is?
    Come again with full details mkuu
    kuna washiriki wapo hadi leo hii na wanaprove hii maneno
     
  10. jmushi1

    jmushi1 JF-Expert Member

    #10
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Nov 2, 2007
    Messages: 16,047
    Likes Received: 38
    Trophy Points: 145
    Very well said Dada,very very well said!Ntakuwa nazitafuta posts zako nizisome.Umenisuuza moyo wangu!Lol!
     
  11. Roulette

    Roulette JF-Expert Member

    #11
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Dec 15, 2010
    Messages: 5,618
    Likes Received: 6
    Trophy Points: 0
    Asante sana. Kama sikosei nadhani tulisha kutana katika post ilikua inahusu politics and religion, kama sio hiyo basi ni kule wall street protest. I also liked your approach. asante kwa kuni-encourage, kumbe kuna watu wanasoma kweli, ngoja niache ujinga aisee... lol
     
  12. jmushi1

    jmushi1 JF-Expert Member

    #12
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Nov 2, 2007
    Messages: 16,047
    Likes Received: 38
    Trophy Points: 145
    Unasomwa tu Dada.I will be your follower,not like tweeter tho!Lol!But yea,on a serious note.Tunafuatilia wengi wetu.Nimeipenda sana analysis yako.So i like the way you think,and also your eloquency,if i may.
     
  13. Companero

    Companero Platinum Member

    #13
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Jul 12, 2008
    Messages: 5,392
    Likes Received: 56
    Trophy Points: 145
  14. Roulette

    Roulette JF-Expert Member

    #14
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Dec 15, 2010
    Messages: 5,618
    Likes Received: 6
    Trophy Points: 0
    So long as Steven Spielberg hajatoa movie, generation ya leo haita jua hivyo vitu. Kila kitu kimekua entertainement, hawataki kusoma kabisa!
     
  15. SHERRIF ARPAIO

    SHERRIF ARPAIO JF-Expert Member

    #15
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Aug 25, 2010
    Messages: 6,377
    Likes Received: 1,154
    Trophy Points: 280
    Hapo kwenye red, hayo mambo ya kutisha ndio walifanyiwa slaves esp. those who were toiling in N. America.
    Female slaves were raped and sodomized sometimes in front of their husbands and kids on a broad daylight!!
    Speaking of unethical medical experiment, do you remember anything about the Syphilis and the Tuskegee airmen of Alabama?
    Or do you remember about massive sterillization of male slaves who were considered too violent and female slaves who were considered too dumb to conceive?
    Do you remember about lynching in the slavery states?
    In short, Slavery was more of unspeakable evil than Holocaust, may be sababu Steven Spielberg hajatengeneza movie kali ya slavery ndio maana Slavery inakuwa overlooked.
     
  16. Pezzonovante

    Pezzonovante JF-Expert Member

    #16
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: May 1, 2008
    Messages: 643
    Likes Received: 1
    Trophy Points: 0
    ni kweli unakuta watu wapo tu mind za kuserebuka,kujilusha,kuchizika,wakati wenzao wanahamisha utajili kwa simbioni na epa hakuna anye kaa chini na kuona milango ya okampo kuwa sue hawa mamba, wamekalia ku club russiaroulettte uko njema.
     
  17. Pezzonovante

    Pezzonovante JF-Expert Member

    #17
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: May 1, 2008
    Messages: 643
    Likes Received: 1
    Trophy Points: 0
    Slavery is a system under which people are treated as property and are forced to work Slaves can be held against their will from the time of their capture, purchase or birth, and deprived of the right to leave, to refuse to work, or to demand compensation. Conditions that can be considered slavery include debt bondage, indentured servitude, serfdom, domestic servants kept in captivity, adoption in which children are effectively forced to work as slaves, child soldiers, and forced marriage.
    There are more slaves today than at any point in history, remaining as high as 12 million to 27 million,even though slavery is now outlawed in all countries. Several estimates of the number of slaves in the world have been provided. According to a broad definition of slavery used by Kevin Bales of Free the Slaves (FTS), an advocacy group linked with Anti-Slavery International, there were 27 million people in slavery in 1999, spread all over the world. In 2005, the International Labour Organization provided an estimate of 12.3 million forced labourers in the world,.Thanks to the ILO Special Action Programme to Combat Forced Labour
    Chattel slavery
    Chattel slavery, so named because people are treated as the personal property of an owner and are bought and sold as commodities, is the traditional form of slavery. It is the least prevalent form of slavery today.
    Bonded labor
    Debt bondage or bonded labor is when a person pledges themselves against a loan. In debt bondage, the services required to repay the debt may be undefined, and the services' duration may be undefined.Debt bondage can be passed on from generation to generation.It is the most widespread form of slavery today.
    Human trafficking
    Human trafficking is the illegal trade in human beings to work as slaves.
    Forced labor
    Forced labor is when an individual is forced to work against their will, under threat of violence or other punishment, with restrictions on their freedom. It is also used to describe all types of slavery and may also include institutions not commonly classified as slavery, such as serfdom, conscription and penal labor.
     
  18. TIMING

    TIMING JF-Expert Member

    #18
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Apr 12, 2008
    Messages: 21,797
    Likes Received: 53
    Trophy Points: 145
    Paul... utumwa ni soo kiasi kwamba huwezi hata kutengenezea movie mkuu whatever you see in movie kuhusu slavery is not even 1% of the torture

    babu yangu alinisimulia in teh late seventies story moja walikua wanaenda kufungulia watu in the twenties waliokua bado watumwa anakwambia mtu anakaa na maiti ya ndugu yake hadi inabaki fuvu wanachukua wanafanya kuni........... cant even comprehend and that old man (my name sake) died a very distressed man.... unaambiwa haya ya kugeuzwa kinyume, wanawake kufanyiwa kila kitu na kila kibaya unachojua kipo kule kwani during slavery hapakua na rules or regulations kama enzi za hitler

    CAN EVEN COMPARE
     
  19. TIMING

    TIMING JF-Expert Member

    #19
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Apr 12, 2008
    Messages: 21,797
    Likes Received: 53
    Trophy Points: 145
    mkuu umeniliza na hizi nyimbo... I am far far from my family and these were the songs our mom use to sing for us when we were kids

    i dont know whether to thank you or to blame you

    dah
     
  20. P

    Paul S.S Verified User

    #20
    Oct 19, 2011
    Joined: Aug 27, 2009
    Messages: 5,841
    Likes Received: 174
    Trophy Points: 160
    Guyz naona kumtaja steve imekuwa nongwa

    Anyway I was trying to rise this worse events just to see how other people think about it, its a part of learning
    Naujua utumwa kwa kuusoma zaidi but i was not aware about what exactly happens during Holocaust until I watch those movies
    Kusema ukweli I was shocked na kujua kumbe sio mababu zetu waliopitia kipindi kibaya cha utumwa, wapo na wengine pia.
    Najua zipo movies kadhaa za utumwa lakini kwakuwa wao ndio watendaji wakuu hivyo hawawezi kuonyesha uhalisia wa kilichojiri wakati wa utumwa
    Na pengine kuna watu wanadhania namaanisha Utumwa haukuwa mbaya kiasi hicho, nope.
    Holocaust ilikuwa ni mpango wa kuwauwa tabaka fullani la jamii
    Slavery ilikuwa ni kutumikisha tabaka fulani la jamii kama wanyama(its a kind o torturing, na kama nilivyosema sometimes Tortures is worse than killing)
    Ukizingatia wengi wa watumwa ni babu zetu basi wengi wanaweza ona kama sina uzalendo, najaribu tu ku compare hayo mapitio na kuona wengine wanasemaje juu ya hili ,thats all
     
Loading...