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Hoja ya Wabunge kuwa Mawaziri

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Sheria (The Law Forum)' started by MwanaFalsafa1, Jun 5, 2009.

  1. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Jamani nina swali. Nime kuwa niki pitia na kuchangia kwenye thread moja hapa ihusuyo Diallo kumjia juu Mkullo. Sasa ika tokea kitu fulani ambayo nimeona yafaa kuanzishiwa thread. Je ni busara mbunge kuwa waziri kwa mfumo wetu wa siasa? Waziri anaweza kutumikia taifa na jimbo kwa wakati mmoja? Kazi ya mbunge ni kuisimamia serikali na kazi ya waziri ni kuitetea serikali sasa waziri ambae ni mbunge afanye lipi? Waziri hawezi kutumia nafasi yake kupendelea jimbo lake? Waziri ana muda gani wa kushugulikia jimbo lake? Mimi naona mfumo huu una walakini wana JF mnaonaje hili? Huu mfumo wetu wa kiasi kikubwa tumeuazima toka Britain, je kwao mfumo huo ume fanikiwa? Mfumo huo kwa kwetu ume fanikiwa? Je mfumo wetu una hitaji kuangaliwa upya ili kwenda na wakati na hali halisi ya nchi yetu?
     
  2. M

    MzalendoHalisi JF-Expert Member

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    Ndo matatizo ya mambo ya kuiga!
     
  3. L

    Limbukeni Senior Member

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    mzalendo embu tujipange upya na mambo yetu tutakoka vipi na tuanzie wapi?
     
  4. deny_all

    deny_all JF-Expert Member

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    Kama tuliweza kuiga kutoka US kuhusu mgombea mwenza mambo ya vyama vingi yalipoingia hata kufikia kukiuka makubaliano ya Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar.....then kwa hili tunaweza pia kulibadilisha.

    Kwa muono wangu linawezwa kufanywa gumu only because linagusa maslahi ya wakubwa wengi na kupelekea kuwaathiri kimapato, hapo ndio penye ugumu mmoja.
     
  5. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Mimi naona cha msingi tuangalia kama mfumo uliopo ya kumpa mbunge uwaziri ni tatizo au la. Kama ni tatizo tuli tatua vipi na mfumo upi na mbadala. Hilo la kuiga haliepukiki kwa maana mfumo wa kisiasa wote uliopo sasa ni wakuigwa. Kama utaangalia kihistoria sisi tulikuwa tunaongozwa na machief wa makabila mbali mbali, huo ndiyo ulikua mfumo wetu. Cha kufanya sasa ni kuangalia mfumo upi una tufaa, kama mtu anadhani ni huu uliopo sasa sawa.
     
  6. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Ukweli jabisa. Wenye mamlaka ya kuubadili mfumo endapo haufi wataangalia mambo kadhaa.

    1. Je mfumo uliopo una tufaidisha vipi?
    2. Je tuki chukua mfumo mpya uta tufaidisha vipi?
    3. Mfumo mwingine utampa nani advantage?
    4. Nita nufaikaje na mfumo mpya na uta nipa nini mimi?

    Kuna maswali mengi sana ya kibinafsi yataulizwa.

    Lazima kutakua na mambo ya kuangalia maslahi yao na hiyo ndiyo ina ponza taifa kwa maana viongozi wetu wana jiangalia wao na si taifa.
     
  7. Mpita Njia

    Mpita Njia JF-Expert Member

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    Je, waongozwa hawana nafasi yoyote ya kushinikiza mabadiliko ya mfumo?
     
  8. Waberoya

    Waberoya JF-Expert Member

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    This is one of the best topics to be discussed! thanks for this

    kwa kifupi hawatakiwi! nadhani hata wao wanajua ila ubinafsi bwana,

    sijui kama kuna chama kina sera kama hii!!!

    CHADEMA AMKENI DESA HILI
     
  9. Recta

    Recta JF-Expert Member

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    Mimi sidhani kuwa ni vyema kwa Mbunge kuwa Waziri au kushika nafasi yoyote katika serikali. Sababu ni nyingi na kati ya hizo ni muingiliano wa kimaslahi.

    Niorodheshe chache ya sababu ninazodhani zinanipelekea kufikiria kuna haja ya kubadilisha utaratibu/sheria/ kanuni hii;
    1. Waziri akiwa Mbunge, anakuwa na shughuli nyingi za kiserikali kuliko za uwakilishi wa wananchi waliomchagua. Hivyo kutowatendea haki kwa ukamilifu
    2. Waziri huyo akiweza kutendea watu wake vyema, basi atanyima wananchi wengine maslahi sawia na kupeleka maendeleo zaidi kwenye jimbo lake (kutegemea na wizara aliyopewa e.g. Fedha, Maji, Umeme, Mawasiliano n.k.) Wizara nyingine zinaweza zisiwe na maslahi kama hayo
    3. Waziri huyo anashikilia nafasi ya watu wawili ambao wangeweza kupata ajira
    4. Rais analazimika kuteua baraza lake kutoka kwenye orodha ya wabunge waliopo. Hii inampa nafasi finyu sana ya kuteua watu wenye uwezo mkubwa wa kufanya kazi kama inavyotakiwa na kuleta tija. Inategemea amepataje Ubunge, ni mwadilifu kiasi gani, ana uwezo gani n.k. Wabunge hawachaguliwi kwa kujali sana elimu yao. Inaweza kuwa kigezo cha ushindani katika kampeni na uchaguzi tu.
    5. Mbunge ni mwanansiasa anaefuata miongozo yote ya kisiasa. Utekelezaji wa kiserikali unahitaji mtu amabe hana mrengo wa moja kwa moja na siasa. Hii inamfanya Waziri kutumia baadhi ya muda wake pia kufanya shughuli za kichama kwa nafasi yake. Ushahidi ni utumikaji wa Mawaziri katika uchaguzi wa Busanda juzijuzi. Hii inanyima vyama vingine fursa sawa ya kusikilizwa na serikali iliyopo madarakani.


    Kwa maelezo ya hapo juu, kuna matatizo yanayoweza kutokea endapo Mbunge huyo atakuwa anawakilisha jimbo lililo mbali sana na mahali anapofanyia kazi kama Waziri. Mfano, endapo Mbunge wa Ujiji akiteuliwa kuwa Waziri, ni dhahiri kuwa atashindwa kwa kiwango kikubwa kutekeleza wajibu wake katika nafasi zote mbili kwa ufasaha.

    Waziri ambae ni Mbunge anatakiwa wakati wote kutekeleza maazimio ya Baraza la Mawaziri hata kama yanapingana na uwakilishi wa wananchi wake ama ni kinyume na matakwa ya wananchi wake. Mfano, endapo serikali inataka/imeamua kuchukua ardhi ya wananchi na kumpa mwekezaji fulani, basi Waziri ambae ni Mbunge hawezi kupinga uamuzi huo na wala kutetea wananchi wake ili wapate kile wananchotaka ambacho labda nacho ni kinyume cha matakwa ya serikali. Labda kama anaweza ku-lobby na kuongea na Waziri mhusika pembeni ili kuona jinsi wanavyoweza kupunguza madhara. Mbunge asie na wizara anaweza kufanya kizaa zaa bila uwoga (akitaka), na hivyo kuwa mwakilishi bora zaidi wa wananchi wake.

    Jibu rahisi ni Hapana. Nadhani matatizo yetu mengi yanatokana na mfumo huu (hasa katika utendaji wa serikali.

    Kwa mtazamo mwingine, Waziri atawajibika kwa Bunge. Swali la kujiuliza atawezaje kuiwakilisha serikali Bungeni bila kuwa Mbunge? Kwa mtazamo wangu, Bunge hutoa nafasi kwa yeyote kuingia Bungeni kwa kuomba ruhusa kwa Wabunge, nao wakiazimia, mtu huyo huingia Bungeni. Ndivyo inavyofanywa kwa viongozi wengi wasio wabunge. Kwahiyo Waziri huyo angetakiwa apate ruhusa hiyo, akimaliza kuwasilishwa na kuulizwa maswali, anarudi ofisini kwake na kuendelea na kazi za ujenzi wa Taifa badala ya Mawaziri wote kujaa Bungeni kwa miezi kadhaa wakipiga meza.
    Nadhani hatua zinahitajika za kubadilisha Katiba ili iruhusu Mawaziri kuteuliwa kutoka katika sehemu yoyote ya jamii ya Watanzania. Inatakiwa Waziri mteule, akishateuliwa, apitie Bungeni, wamsaili (interview) kuona kama ni msafi, ana uwezo na anajua mwelekeo wa nchi katika kipindi kinachofuata. Utaratibu huu ungetuondolea uwezekano wa kuteuliwa Mawaziri kwa kuzingatia urafiki, wasio na uwezo (ili mradi ni wenzetu) na wenye tabia njema (si mafisadi, wezi, wavivu n.k.)
     
  10. Bluray

    Bluray JF-Expert Member

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    On the one hand collective responsibility demands a unison standing on the part of ministers, as government representatives.

    On the other, the same ministers are answerable to their constituencies, as members of parliament.

    The apparent reconciliation of the two is the fallacious assumption that the government will always act in the interest of all constituencies.

    The supposed merit of having all ministers from the pool of MPs is the confidence of selection from a group that is already approved democratically by the electorate, in such a way that whatever happens after the ministerial appointment, the president will have the confidence of saying that I did not just pick any Tom, Dick or Harry, I selected among elected parliamentarians.The fallacy of this position is that too much stock is invested in electrocracy without actually vetting the validity of the other dynamics of democracy.Elected officials are not possesing unimpeachable integrity just because they are elected. One has to only revisit the fall of fromer PM Edward Lowassa from grace to appreciate how illusive the sanctification of elected officials can prove.Some would even go as far as saying elected officials do not posses unimpeachable integrity BECAUSE they are elected, their election being in a system that is full of corruption in which nobody can rise up the political ranks without shameful conducts, from nepotism to grand corruption.

    The danger of a non-parliament based cabinet is real, in that all types of political payola schemes from simple quid pro quo to elaborate campaign finance misconduct will be at the mercy of the president.

    The folly of the parliamentaly based cabinet is, it does not stop the very things it was supposed to stop, i.e it does not stop people of questionable integrity to get in the cabinet (How did Emmanuel Nchimbi and Nazir Karamagi get in the cabinet?). we have to chart a system to weigh the two in a comparative way to determine which is less injurious, which most benefial, by how much, and if a hybrid of the two with "best of both worlds" scenario is possible.

    So in esence we now have the worst of both worlds.

    On one hand the president is not free to choose people outside of parliament (Technically he has ten seats he can bestow on any Tom, Dick or Harry but in principle and fact they will become parliamentalians first before ever being able to become ministers, and even that laxity is limited, used sparingly and reserved for the likes of Kingunge, a few up and coming party stars and the odd disabled/ special interest person)

    So on the one hand the president is limited to this pool of parliamentalians, mostly politicians and retired bureaucrats.He is missing out on a lot of talent from outside the parliament.

    On the other hand the principle behind this scheme aimed at having a group of people that is already vetted and passed by the people.This vetting process and the whole idea is a big sham, it is as if the people are vetting on who is the most corrupt.

    So that is how we end up with mostly bad apples, the Diallos of this world, the Nchimbis, Mkullos, The Mama Simbas and Hawa Ghasias, the Batildas and a host of other funny characters who would not pass an oral interview to be a CEO of a multinational's Tanzanian branch.

    I say we remove this requirement, allow the president to pick anyone for the cabinet, but each selection be confirmed by the parliament.This way no one can say the people (or their representative at least) did not approve.

    Of course the most important thing would be to go even one step further and have a balanced, active and progressive parliament.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2009
  11. Recta

    Recta JF-Expert Member

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    Tatizo letu ni kujifananisha na nchi nyingine, kuiga taratibu zao nusu nusu bila hata kuzingatia hali halisi ya nchi yetu.

    Mfano uliouchukulia wa Muungano, nadhani una maana kubwa sana. Tulipobadili Katiba yetu na kuweka Mgombea mwenza, hatukuzingatia makubaliano ya Muungano na hasa nafasi ya Rais wa Zanzibar. Tulidhani tu kuwa kama tukiwa na Rais wa Muungano kutoka bara/Zanzibar na kuchukua mgombea mwenza kutoka upande wa pili tutakuwa tumemaliza matatizo yanayoweza kujitokeza. Kumbe ndio tumeyaanzisha.

    Sasa Rais wa Zanzibar hana nafasi yoyote katika Muungano zaidi ya kuwa kwenye Baraza la Mawaziri (bila kuwa Waziri). Matatizo mengi ya Muungano yanaanzia hapo. Nadhani hofu ilikuwa kama Rais wa Zanzibar au Muungano akitoka chama tofauti na mwenzake wa upande wa pili inaweza kuwa vigumu kifanya kazi pamoja. Lakini hii haiwezi kuwa tatizo. Kwa maana kinachotakiwa ni kuweka bayana wajibu wa viongozi hao wawili katika kutekeleza majukumu yao.

    Inatakiwa kubadilisha Katiba na kurudisha nafasi ya Rais wa Zanzibar kwenye serikali ya Muungano. Kama ni lazima kuwa na mgombea mwenza, basi kuwe na Makamu wa Rais wawili (Rais wa Zanzibar akiwa Makamu wa pili wa Rais).
     
  12. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Mboye alikua ana taka mfumo wa majimbo "federalism" kwa mfano Marekani. Jani nchi itengwe kwa majimbo na kuwe na magavana. Pia alitaka wanufaika wakuu wa jimbo fulani iwe wananchi wa hilo jimbo na si kama ilivyo sasa ambao rasilimali nyingi za sehemu fulani lina gawanywa kwa taifa zima. Nimemtaja Mbowe badala ya Chadema kwa sababu sina uhakika kama hilo lilikua wazo lake tu au ndiyo msimamo wa Chadema.
     
  13. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Waongozwa wanao nafasi katika nchi ambayo viongozi wana heshimu matakwa ya wananchi yao na siyo kuendekeza maslahi binafsi. Swali la kujiuliza ni je Tanzania tuna viongozi wanao jali maslahi ya taifa hata kama yana pingana na maslahi yao wenyewe? Ukipata jibu la hilo moja kwa moja una pata jibu la swali lako.
     
  14. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Je una dhani wakati waanzilishi wa taifa letu walipo kaa na kutafakari katiba ya nchi walikaa waka tulia au ili kuwa kufanya mambo haraka haraka ili mradi tu nchi iwe na katiba?
     
  15. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    I like your argument. I only have two question though. Like one of the contributors said, don't you think just picking from MP's limits the president choice? In fact to be more specific he/she picks only from the MP's of his/her own party. That means the president is not choosing from the best of the best rather he is choosing from the best of who is available.

    the second question is. Do you think ministers of a certain ministries should be people with some expertise of a given ministry? Meaning that not just anybody is given any ministry to run.
     
  16. Bluray

    Bluray JF-Expert Member

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    I addressed this concern above. It is a shame that we have such a self imposed limitation.

    I pointed out

    So on the one hand the president is limited to this pool of parliamentalians, mostly politicians and retired bureaucrats.He is missing out on a lot of talent from outside the parliament.

    It helps a lot, I would be more comfortable with Professor Mwakyusa representing Tanzania abroad, advising the president or laying down policy matters on, for example, stem cell research than Edgar Maokola Majogo. the concern has been that we are taking the best professionals and making them politicians (The Ministry of Health is a vivid example, with the likes of Mwakyusa and Sarungi) But I believe the cost of not having a Sarungi in the operating room is negligible compared with the cost of having a Sarungi in the Operating room and an Edgar Maokola Majogo authorizing medical policies that a minister with expertise in the field should be able to spot right away.

    It should be pointed out that some ministries are more technical than other and flexibility should be allowed accordingly.I do not necessarily want a Juma Ikangaa to head the Ministry of Sports, although if one is available, that would be good too.
     
  17. TIMING

    TIMING JF-Expert Member

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    MwanaFA,

    Umegonga ikulu..... Kuna mtu mmoja aliwahi kusema, Tanzania ni moja ya nchi that are highly governed more than most of developed countries, but they lack good governance and administration.

    we have created a very expensive administration system with multiple actors with nothing to do.. Wabunge wengi hawana sifa kwani hutoka kwenye siasa, na mawaziri hutoka kwenye wabunge, which means we peak leaders from already weak pool; na hao mawaziri pia hutegemea karata ya miaka mitano kuweza kurudi au la nk. hapo bado hujagusa wakuu wa wilaya, makatibu,

    Inaonekana kuna tatizo katika mfumo wa commonwealth kwa nchi zetu... naona na ngoma imefika mpaka Uk kwenyewe wanahangaika nao
     
  18. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Unajua mimi nadhani kwa sababu tuli tawaliwa na Uingereza baada ya uhuru tuka kimbilia kuazima mfumo wao tu bila kutafakari ni mfumo upi haswa ungetufaa. Ukiangalia mambo mengi kama ulivyo sema ni gharama za bure. Kwa mfano kuwa na raisi, makamu halafu pia na waziri mkuu ambao kwanza ofisi zao ni gharama na wao wenyewe ni gharama na tuna wahudumia mpaka kufa. Pili, hili swala la serikali mbili. Mimi naona hata katika kuunganisha watu kiundugu zaidi inge make sense kuwa na serikali moja tu. Lakini sasa sisi tumeazima azima mifumo ambayo tunai tumia vibaya na kuishia kutengeneza nafasi za ulaji ulaji tu. Mfano ni serikali za mikoa na wilaya, kila siku zina chipuka mpya bila idadi ya watu kuongezeka significantly. Mimi naona sasa siyo huo ubunge na uwaziri tu bali mfumo wetu wote una walakini mkubwa. A bad system encourages but leadership. Hakuna mfumo 100% lakini tunge kua na mfumo mzuri unge punguza matatizo mengi tunayo yaona sasa.
     
  19. TIMING

    TIMING JF-Expert Member

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    Mjomba huko ndio usifike, tuna serikali kuu ikiwakilishwa na local government.. kamati mbalimbali za jamii, nk.

    Haya yote ni madhara ya copy and paste, uki-copy na kupaste from vairous sources bila kureview kazi mara nyingi unaishia kuwa na output inayorukaruka bila flow---and that's where we are now

    We need to overhaul the system.. ila huko kwenye local government ndio balaa, kuna ma-DT, DED, DA, watendaji, kamati etc.etc. na wote serikali inawagharimia hadi fenicha --- tenda njenje ijekuwa wabengu na mawaziri!!
     
  20. MwanaFalsafa1

    MwanaFalsafa1 JF-Expert Member

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    Mkuu ukisema hayo mtu atakuja na kusema ni ajira na ukiziondoa wengine wata kosa ajira. Lakini sioni maana ya ajira kama ina ongeza hasara tu. kama baraza la mawaziri la kwanza la JK mawaziri kibao halafu baadhi ya wizara zina sijui manaibu wangapi. Tatizo ni uongozi wetu. Nafasi zingine zina wekwa tu ili watu wapachikwe lakini hazina maana yoyote. Serikali zetu(kuu na za mikoa) ni kubwa mno bila mpangilio wowote. Wizara zingine hazi fai kuwa wizara bali ni departments tu.
     
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