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Electronic or digital voting: Is it possible in poor countries - The Kenya way?

Discussion in 'Uchaguzi Tanzania' started by Phillemon Mikael, Aug 4, 2010.

  1. P

    Phillemon Mikael JF Gold Member

    #1
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    I am watching live as the elections returns are announced and being desplayed on The television and other journalist..its is the first time in East Africa that a country is using these degital or electronic voting system ...it seems that the sytem is encouraging and it minimise riggin in comparison to the accient manual voting which we Tanzanias are expected to use this year...

    With these technological development i expected our National election commission should have considered using these form of voting in this election......if we want the world to respect our democracy .....we are all witness to what has been happening in our country with the size ...its shame that sometimes it takes up to seven days just to compile results which would have been posted live at returning headqouters in dar es salaam as journalists and monitors watch live on the NEC screens......technology!! technology!!!....minimize paper work.....cos what i see here is just very proffessional ....results are posted live from voting centres and everybody see them [provisional results].....tallying officials will have to compare with signed forms which later will be submitted manual and compare with the degital result posted ...later they will compile and simply election commission chairman ,will officially declare the winner.....posibility for riggin is at very minimal...........

    ITS TIME NOW OUR NEC GO ELECTRONIC .......IF NOT THIS 2010 AT LEAST THE NEXT ELECTION WE MUST FIGHT FOR ELECTRONIC VOTE REGISTRATION AND LATER VOTING..TUACHENI USHAMBA.....AU WANAFANYA MAKUSUDI ...ILI WAWEZE KUIBA KURA???
     
  2. Nyambala

    Nyambala JF-Expert Member

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    Mkuu kama bungeni bado kura zinapigwa kwa kunyoosha vidole, utafikiri mnachagua monitor shule ya msingi.................. Do you really think hao wazee wanaona hata umuhimu wa electronic voting????????????
     
  3. P

    Phillemon Mikael JF Gold Member

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    ITS AMAZING NDANI YA ONE HOUR KURA KARIBU milioni TATU ZIMESHAKUWA COMPILED NA KURUSHWA FROM ALL ANGLES OF KENYA.......DU WAKIFANYA HIVYO HAPA HATA MTU AKISHINDA KWA KISHINDO ASILIMIA 80%% KWELI TUTAMUHESHIMU HAKUNA LONGO ....YAANI NAONA DEGITAL COUNTER KWENYE SCREEN INAZUNGUKA TU ..UTAFIKIRI UNITS ZA LUKU. AU WEB COUNTER...SI MCHEZO

    HADI SASA :-

    YES [WANAOTAKA KATIBA MPYA] - 3,337,117 = 66%
    NO [ WASIOTAKA KATIBA] - 1,690,686 = 34%

    kwa kweli upigaji kura wa hivi unatia raha .......wamemaliza kupiga kura saa 12 .....na matokeo yanakuja kwa speed ya ajabu....nadhani hadi asubuhi ni wazi watakuwa wamemaliza kuhesabu.......na kesho watatumia mchana kulinganisha na form zinazotoka vituoni na kusainiwa na wasimamizi ......ni wazi hadi kesho jioni matokeo rasmi yatatoka!!!....sidhani kama NEC yetu wapo kuangalia hiii!!!
     
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    Phillemon Mikael JF Gold Member

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    nadhani zaidi wanaogopa kuadhirika ...maana hapo uwezekano wa kupika matokeo ni none.........!!!!

    lakini kama kenya wameanza kufanya electronic vote registration na voting sijuwi kwanini tumetumia mabilioni mwaka jana kuandikisha watu kwa mfumo wa zamani wakati tayari hii techologia ilishaanza kutumika afrika yetu...nadhani waliikwepa makusudi....na nadhani kina zitto na wenzake wangeishikia bango labda wananchi wa kawaida wangeanza kujua ....

    Lakini si kitu kwa pamoja tuseme kwamba kuanzia chaguzi zitakazofuatia baada ya huu lazima tupige kura a za electroni.......nina hakika uchaguzi wa mwaka 2015 itakuwa mwisho wa kura za wizi!!!...

    Lazima tukubali kuwa kwa sasa kikwete na operators wake wapo busy kufikiria namna ya kuiba kura ...maana sioni kama wana la zaidi ....!!!
     
  5. senator

    senator JF-Expert Member

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    Ni jambo zuri hilo na lenye kuonesha democracy ya kweli ila kwa nchi za Africa viongozi walio wengi wakiwa madarakani kuachia madaraka inakuwa vigumu sana..mfano huko Kenya nadhan kibaki alikuwa ameshindwa pasi na shaka na odinga kama kungekuwa na hiyo electronic voting..hata hapa kwetu it will take time kuja kuwa implemented..Wewe fikiria swala tu la vitambulivyo vya utaifa limekuwa linazungumzwa tu kwa miaka nenda rudi lakin hakuna kipya mpaka sasa..hili wazo la electronic may be 2020 huko wakichukua upinzani ndo kunaweza kuwa na kitu kama hicho ulichosema lakin sio kwa sirikali hii ya chama twawala!
     
  6. Steve Dii

    Steve Dii JF-Expert Member

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    Mkuu PM, sidhani kama hili ni swala la ushamba au umjini. Kwani consideration ya kwanza kabla ya ku-implement kitu kama hiki ni kuhakikisha nchi nzima ina umeme wa uhakika. Unless unaongelea kuwepo kwa electronic voting system kwa baadhi ya majimbo tu na siyo Kitaifa.

    Ya kutilia mkazo kulitangulia swala hili ni:

    --- Umeme: bila umeme kuwa wa uhakika nchini mwetu, hatuchelewi kusikia umeme umekatika siku nzima kwenye majimbo yaliyo stronghold kwa wapinzani siku ya uchaguzi.

    --- Zip Code/Post Code: bila hili tutaendelea kupiga kwata hapa hapa tulipo... kila linapojitokeza swala linalohitaji vitu hivi kama kirahisho cha jambo hilo kufanyika, haswa pale tunapotaka lifanyike kama kwa wenzetu waliotutangulia kimaendeleo. Yaani tumeshindwa hata kufanya pilot scheme kwa sehemu zilizo kaa kimpangilio kama Oysterbay, Masaki, Mikocheni, Kariakoo, na baadhi ya maeneo ya Mbeya, Mwanza, Iringa na Tanga. (Nilichowahi sikia ni kwamba tungelikuwa na zip codes tayari kwa dar, ila kuna mtu wakati huo hawakukubali kumkatia 10% yake hivyo tenda yote ikapigwa chini, mithili ya yale tuliyosikia kuhusiana na ATCL vs Wachina!!)

    --- Miji kupangika: Dar imekaa shaghalabaghala mpaka inatia kinyaa!!! Matokeo yake tunajikuta tunaleta mipango ya dharura yenye gharama ili kukabiliana na mapungufu/uzembe uliofanyika, kama vile ku-register simu za mikoni na kutaka kuleta vitambulisho vya kiraia. Mambo ambayo kama miji na vijiji vyetu vingelikuwa vimepangika na wapanga miji na halimashauri husika kufanya kazi zao pale utaratibu unapokiukwa, basi kuandikisha simu au kuwa na vitambulisho yangelikuwa mambo ya ziada na si ya kulazimishana.

    Steve Dii
     
  7. P

    Phillemon Mikael JF Gold Member

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    diii nimekusoma ..lakini kwa kenya ishu ya umeme ni kama hapa tu...nchi nyingi za ukanda huu zinafanana......coverage ya umeme by percentage haitofautiani sana na Tanzana....hata mjini nairobi kuna sehemu hasa sqouters hakuna umeme .........shirika lao la umeme lina nguvu kuliko letu...lakini linajiendesha kibiashara ....hivyo maeneo ya pembezoni pia kwao hakuna umeme .....ila tofauti ni kuwa maeneo yote yenye fursa ya kiuchumi basi KPLC wamepeleka umeme .......

    walichofanya hawa KENYA ni kuwa maeneo yasiyo na umeme wametumia alternative energy kutuma matokeo....nadhani muhimu hapo ni kuwa na centre angalau kila kata ambako matokeo yanaweza kutumwa makao makuu kwa kutumia mtandao wa compyuta...na baadaye wanatuma manual paper haraka kwa ajili ya udhibitisho ...kumbukeni kuwa siku hizi wireless coverage imeenea nchi nzima .......unaweza kutumia vodacom ,ttcl,celtel modems etc...
     
  8. Steve Dii

    Steve Dii JF-Expert Member

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    Kwa jinsi ulivyoelezea hapo juu, hilo nakubaliana nawe linawezekana. Lakini msisitizo bado upo palepale; swala la umeme ni mhimu! Maana kukiwepo na umeme, mambo kama haya yatajileta yenyewe tu bila hata kuhangaika. Lakini pale tunapokuwa na umeme wa kusuasua na mgao kila leo hii, complications zinaongezeka na maswala yanaanza kuwa magumu.
     
  9. Gelange Vidunda

    Gelange Vidunda JF-Expert Member

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    Steve Dii, beleive it or not ipo solution ya hii electronic voting system and it is quite fool proof, na pale ambapo hakua umeme the voting unit inaweza chajiwa na betri ya gari fasta! At the end of the voting process unit inatoa hesabu palepale na haifutiki kwenye chip yake kwa muda wa miezi 6! This unit is currently being used in India and other south east Asian countries.

    Nilikwenda NEC 2 years before kuangalia kama wataweza kuinstall hii kitu lakini jibu nililopata eti ni too close to uchagusi na eti ni nani mwingine anayetumia hii Africa? Jibu ni India huko wanatumia, wakasema thats not good enough, na sababu nyingine nyiiiingi, umeme, mara vyama vitakataa, hatuna uhakika kama kweli ni tamper proof etc (hapa nikawaomba tujaribu kwenye ile chaguzi ndogo ya madiwani nafikiri ambayo haitkei wakati mmoja na uchaguzi mkuu lakini walikataa kwani nanai atailipia hayo majaribio etc. Nikataka nilipie mimi lakini nikaona itakula kwangu kama hawataichukua!!)

    Hii solution is perfect, I tell you for countries like ours! Big ups to Kenya kama waliitumia manake haiongopi hata kidogo!!
     
  10. P

    Phillemon Mikael JF Gold Member

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    ..HATA KENYA kabla ya ku adopt hii system ...waliijaribisha kwenye by elections za mwaka juzi..ikawapa positive results ......so mwaka jana wakati wanaandikisha kupiga kura ...wakaamua kuandikisha kwa kutumia mfumo mpya.......majibu yake ni ya haraka hadi raha.....na ukitaka kuvuruga labda uvuruge uchaguzi wote ,,,maana kila kitu kipo kwennye servers.........hata mtoto mdogo atajuwa!!..its time sasa na sisi tuupigie chapue mfumo huu na hapa kwetu ,ili tupondokaane na aibu za wizi wa kura!!
     
  11. MchunguZI

    MchunguZI JF-Expert Member

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    Sikiliza, maana wewe ni mmoja wa watu wasioitakia mema nchi yetu. Huna upendo kwa viongozi wako.

    Mara nyingi tunamaliza kupiga kura jioni ya saa 12. Hapo sasa tunaanza kukusanya ma-box ya kura kwa kutumia watumishi maalumu wakisindikizwa na askari waliopewa maelezo maalumu kutoka vijijini kuja wilayani kwenye kumbi za kuhesabia kura, ndo tunapata nafasi ya kubadilisha au kuweka kura ili wapendwa viongozi wetu wasiangushwe na maadui wa maendeleo yetu.

    Hiyo ya elektroniki ni mbaya saaana! maana inatoa matokea kwa haraka lakini yasiyozingatia uzalendo kwa viongozi wetu.

    Najua unaweza ukalazimisha mbinu hiyo lakini najua tu. mukilazimisha au mukituletea kwa tishio la wafadhili, tutatumia shu-shu-shu wetu ili kuvuruga mitambo maana nasikia huko Kenya wametumia GSM system.
     
  12. Steve Dii

    Steve Dii JF-Expert Member

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    MchunguZI, kwa kauli yako mwenywe, wewe ndiye msaliti na mtu aliyetayari kuona maovu yanatendeka na ukiweza kuchochea vurugu nchini mwetu ili mradi tu uliyemtaka ashinde aweze kushinda.
     
  13. Steve Dii

    Steve Dii JF-Expert Member

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    Mkuu Gelange, kwa maelezo yako na yale ya mkulu PM, naweza kusema kwa dhati kabisa kuwa nimekubaliana na hoja zenu na ninakubaliana na mchakato wa kuleta facility kama hizo. Kutokana na mifano mliyoitoa na maelezo yenu napenda kuunga mkono majaribio ya vitu kama hivi walau basi kwenye by-elections zijazo . Pingamizi yangu ilielekezwa kwenye sera za muda mrefu zaidi na kulalamikia uzembe uliopo hadi hivi sasa. Hata hivyo hoja yangu ya kuwepo umeme, na hata hizo nyingine bado nazisimamia katika mipango ya muda mrefu ya Taifa letu. Kwani kuwepo kwa umeme wa uhakika, hili swala linaongeleka katika mandhari tofauti kabisa kuliko ilivyo sasa.
     
  14. Richard

    Richard JF-Expert Member

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    Electronic voting is not bad but put together all concerns laid out by Steve Diii the assuarance is needed as it involves transmission of ballots through computer networks over the internet. So there things like security and expertise which are much needed to insure the intergrity of the system is protected.

    It is straightforward and can speed up the counting and everyone will participate.

    The only worry for me will be when some people facilitate electronic fraud.
     
  15. P

    Phillemon Mikael JF Gold Member

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    ......kwa wasimuelewa mushunguzi ,,,,anaunga mkono ila anatumia falsafa ya picha kuenesha kwa nini huu mfumo hautakubalika hapa.....

    By the way matokeo ya Kenya ...nchi ambayo infrastructure zake hazina tofauti saana na zetu......yametangazwa within 48 hours............badala ya wiki 1 au 2 kama ilivyo kawaida ya ukanda huu..

    Muchunguzi umeniacha hoi na ile kawaida yao ya kusafirisha kura wakahesabie wilayani....zikifikaga wilayani za kijani huwa zinaongezeka kweli ..........na sometimes mambo yakiwaga magumu huwa wanasemaga masanduku yanatakiwa dar es salaam.....
     
  16. Steve Dii

    Steve Dii JF-Expert Member

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    Damn, am too slow! lol
    my bad Mchunguzi ...falsafa yako haikuniingia kichwani mara moja. Ahsante PM kwa ufafanuzi.
     
  17. MchunguZI

    MchunguZI JF-Expert Member

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    Steve,
    Binafsi baada ya haya, sasa nauona mwisho wa CCM. Kama kweli tukiamua kutumia elektronic voting hata kama siyo kwa 100% yaani kwamba kila kura iingie mitamboni moja kwa moja bali kila kituo kuhesabu kura zake hapo hapo na kuzituma kwenye central system, hapo kweli mambo ya kuongeza kura za bandia hayatafanikiwa.

    Udanganyifu mkubwa ktk kura wakati mwingine hufanyika kwa nguvu. So called FFU wanaamua kufukuza wananchi eti ukisha piga kura, ondoka! Baadaye magari ya 'serikali' yanatembea usiku kucha yakikusanya mabox yenye kura.

    Kila mtu mzima anafahamu hapo ndo mabo machafu hufanyika.
     
  18. O

    Ogah JF-Expert Member

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    .......tukitaka hii system ya elektroniki.............tunaweza hata kwenye uchaguzi wa mwaka huu
     
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