Did Nyerere admit he was a "failure"? Some say "Yes he did"...

He never admitted to failure; the idea that he did is a pure conjugation of the people who hoped that he in fact did. Hajawahi kusema ameshindwa. I can challenge you to find it anywhere and you won't. I guarantee it.
Mwanakijiji, mnavyofanya si vizuri, huku ni kubaka uhuru wa kujieleza, mimi binafsi hii thread sikumbuki kuichangia lakini nashangaa kukuta michango yangu, na kule nilipochangia haipo, hii tabia gani au ndio kuendeleza udikiteta wa nyerere!?
 
Mwanakijiji, mnavyofanya si vizuri, huku ni kubaka uhuru wa kujieleza, mimi binafsi hii thread sikumbuki kuichangia lakini nashangaa kukuta michango yangu, na kule nilipochangia haipo, hii tabia gani au ndio kuendeleza udikiteta wa nyerere!?

Kwenye mada ile kulikuwa na jaribio dhaifu la kupotosha kilichopo kule kwa kuleta hoja ya "failure" ambayo peke yake ni hoja inayojisimamia. Mjadala wa hotuba iliyosahauliwa unahusiana na yale ambayo yalitokana na kitendo cha wanafunzi kugoma na kwenda Ikulu na jinsi Nyerere alivyowapa somo kuhusu uzalendo. Mkitaka kuzungumzia suala la alisema amefeli well.. hapa mahali muafaka.
 
Jasusi na Mwanakijiji. Naona mmepoteza nguvu na muda wenu bure kupingana ombwe. Kuna wachangiaji hapa ambao ni non-existent, hivyo hakuna haja ya kujibizana nao.
 
He never admitted to failure; the idea that he did is a pure conjugation of the people who hoped that he in fact did. Hajawahi kusema ameshindwa. I can challenge you to find it anywhere and you won't. I guarantee it.

Kwa kweli Mwanakijiji, kwa kumpa audience huyu gutter-level, attention-seeking, islamo-fascist female, umejiteremshia hadhi big time ("Thanks" moja tu uliyopata kwenye thread hii, more than speaks for itself). Yaani, she's not at all in your intellectual league. What happened bro? Its nauseating to even imagine how someone of your status could stoop this low!
 
Kama wewe hujasikia ndio hujasikia, itafute utaipata. Kwani wewe Mungu hata uyajuwe yote?
Kwa nn mnahangaika kubishana na huyu mwanamke Mshambenga ambaye si ajabu atakuwa ni hawara wa Fisadi mmoja!! Nyerere may not have been perfect,since he is human we know he is fallible,lakini he still is one of the greatest leaders in Africa,Patriotic and well intentioned!! Tofauti kabisa na Jakaya,Mkapa na Mwinyi,Wezi hawa,oooops,i forgot ur hawara as well!!
 
Kwa hiyo, hiyo ni conclusion ya moja ya muandishi aliyemnukuu nyerere kusema failure? Kama ndio hivyo kuna tatizo lipi hapo?

He simply failed. No one with his right mind can argue with this. Muwandanganye wale ambao hawakuwepo wakayi wake.

Nyerere kaiacha nchi njaa, kiza, hakuna hata mafuta ya taa, foleni ma petrol station, foleni hata sukari, ashaakum si matusi hata pamba zetu za kujistiri tulikuwa hatupati mpaka tuzinunue za magendo, sijui kama wanaume wanalijuwa hilo? ukipita njiani umebeba hata kikapu, kinapekuliwa na mgambo. Vizuizi vimewekwa Tanzania nzima eti vya kuzuia kipindupindu! jamani? mlikuwepo au mnabisha tuu?

Hivi mkiambiwa ukweli wa nyerere kwanini hamuupendi? nyerere alikuwa "orater" mzuri sana. Lakini mama yangu, ikifika kwenye maamuzi ya utendaji, yote bogus, hakuna kilicho fanikiwa.Viwanda vya umma, viko wapi? majumba aliyotaifisha, yako wapi? mabenki aliyotaifisha. yako wapi, shule alizotaifisha, ziko wapi? mashamba aliyotaifisha, yako wapi? vijiji vya ujamaa alivyolazimisha watu wahamie, viko wapi? mashirika umma aliyoanzisha, yako wapi? Hivyo vyote vimeanza kufa kabla yeye haja ng'atuka. Kaondoka benki kuu haina senti tano ya kigeni na ikachowa moto kuficha madudu yake, wizara ya mambo ya ndani ikachomwa moto kuficha madudu yake. Na ndio maana tukasikia mpaka kaburi lake liliwaka moto kwa dhulma alizofanya, siku aliyozikwa mpaka ardhi ikatetemeka kwa dhambi alizonazo.

Hao wanaojidai, oooh kaondoa udini. Ni waongo, kabla ya nyerere kulikuwa hakuna tatizo la udini Tanzania. Kungekuwa kuna tatizo la udini hata yeye asingepokelewa na kufadhiliwa na waIslaam wa Kariakoo. Oooh eti ukabila, ni nani aliyenyanyaswa kwa kabila yake Tanzania kabla ya nyerere? baada ya kuja nyerere ndio tukaona udini unaanza kwa kuwafunga mashekhe wote wwakubwa Tanzania, kuwahamisha makazi yao, kuwakejeli. Ukabila ukaanza alipoanzisha mashirika ya umma.

He was simply a failed dictator.
Ndiyo, Nyerere kaiacha nchi katika hali ya njaa, hata bila mafuta ya taa etc. etc. Lakini Nyerere hajawahi kusema kuwa "yes I failed.
Let us admit it." Hiyo ni concontion ya mwandishi. That is our argument. Yes you are entitled to your opinion that Nyerere failed, lakini tuache nasi tunaoyajua mazuri ya Nyerere tutukuze ufanisi wake. Ukitaka kuniambia mambo ya kukaa gizani mbona Kikwete kaiua Tanesco? Mbona Kikwete, Mkapa na Mwinyi wameiua Air Tanzania? Vipi usafiri wa reli? Lakini usituambie kuwa Nyerere aliadmit kuwa uongozi wake ulikuwa ni failure. Mafailures tunayaona yanazurura duniani kote na kutabasamu tu lakini hamna kitu. Nduhu!
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji,
Ikiwa Nyerere ktk mahojiano ya mwaka 1995 ilikuwa hivi sidhani kama kweli kuna mahala ali adimt failure..but agian, kutokubali makosa ni hulka ya Mtanzania hatukosi sababu hata kama umefumaniwa uchi, na siku zote hatukosi mchawi. farewll speech haina kipande chochote alicho admit hakuna - bofya

Ukweli utabakia kwamba - He failed economically. Lakini wengi wanashindwa kuelewa kwamba Politically jamaa alikuwa mshindi tena labda naweza sema mmoja kati ya viongozi bora duniani.
Kwa mfano, Arap Moi failed, Kenya ilikuwa inakwenda chini vibaya sana kiuchumi, Kina Kaunda na Banda wote hawa kufikia mwisho wa utawala wao walikuwa total failure economically lakini huwezi kusikia wakizungumzwa..Why?
 
Kuwa Nyerere alisema "I failed. Let us admit it" iliandikwa kwa mara ya kwanza na Karl Maier, kwenye kitabu chake kilichokuwa published mwaka 1998 titled "Into the House of the Ancestors. Inside the New Africa". Kwenye ukurasa wa 5 anasema "Even rarer are the leaders who own up to their mistakes in office, such as Nyerere who, when he bowed out gracefully as president of Tanzania in 1985, declared in his farewell speech, "I failed. Let's admit it." (http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/m/maier-house.html , para 13). But the author does not give any source where he got that phase "I failed. Let's admit it". He merely says in 1985 but does not specify if this was said in Nyerere's farewell speech.

Pia ukisoma vitabu vingine vinam-quote Maier akisema kuwa kiongozi pekee wa Kiafrika aliye admit kuwa amefail ni Nyeyere. Ukisearch kwenye google, kama aliyofanya Faiza, utakuta kila mtu anasema kuwa Nyerere once said "I failed. Let us admit it", then hao waandishi wanam-refer Karl Maier as a source, but not the actual Nyerere's speech. Since Maier did not provide any source of the quote, it is difficult to verify because kwenye speeches za Nyerere sijawahi kuona au kusikia akitamka hiyo phrase.

Hapa tujaribu kutofautisha kati ya primary source na secondary source. Kwenye primary source ambayo ni speech yenyewe, there is no such a phrase as "I failed. Let us admit it". Kwenye secondary source ambayo ni Karl Maier, does not provide a source for that phrase. In his last speech as the President, Nyerere said that "You have forgiven, even if perhaps you have not forgotten, my many mistakes of commission and commission." Could this be what Karl Maier was referred to as "I failed. let us admit it"? Hata hivyo itakuwa vingumu b'se kwenye phrase ametumia plural, i.e let's us admit, whilst kwenye speech anasema "my many mistakes of commission and commission."

Ninachojua Nyerere alishasema kwenye moja ya hotuba zake kuwa tusije tukadhani kuwa wakati wa utawala wake palikuwa hapana rushwa. Alisema rushwa ilikuwepo lakini tofauti na sasa wao walikuwa wakali sana na wala rushwa ndani ya serikali (YouTube - ‪Nyerere's Meeting With Tanzania Press Club 1995 Part 4 of 10‬‏). Pia kwenye speech yake ya siku ya Wafanyakazi mwaka 1995 alisema kuwa serikali yake ilifanya mambo mema na ya kijinga. Hilo ali-admit kabisa. Ila alisema kuwa tatizo la utawala uliofuata uliacha yale mema na kuendeleza ya kijinga. Anakubali kuwa katika miaka 23 lazima watakuwa walifanya makosa kwa vile hakuwa malaika. Lakini kilichotakiwa ni serikali ya awamu ya pili kuyasahihisha makosa ambayo utawala wake ulifanya na kuendeleza mema hasa yale ya msingi. Alisema cha ajabu hata yale mazuri na ya msingi tumeshindwa kuyaendeleza (YouTube - ‪Julius Nyerere 's Speech on Workers' Day 1995 Part 6 of 7‬‏) (anzia dakika ya 8.50).
 
Kuwa Nyerere alisema "I failed. Let us admit it" iliandikwa kwa mara ya kwanza na Karl Maier, kwenye kitabu chake kilichokuwa published mwaka 1998 titled "Into the House of the Ancestors. Inside the New Africa". Kwenye ukurasa wa 5 anasema "Even rarer are the leaders who own up to their mistakes in office, such as Nyerere who, when he bowed out gracefully as president of Tanzania in 1985, declared in his farewell speech, "I failed. Let's admit it." (http://www.nytimes.com/books/first/m/maier-house.html , para 13). But the author does not give any source where he got that phase "I failed. Let's admit it". He merely says in 1985 but does not specify if this was said in Nyerere's farewell speech.

Pia ukisoma vitabu vingine vinam-quote Maier akisema kuwa kiongozi pekee wa Kiafrika aliye admit kuwa amefail ni Nyeyere. Ukisearch kwenye google, kama aliyofanya Faiza, utakuta kila mtu anasema kuwa Nyerere once said "I failed. Let us admit it", then hao waandishi wanam-refer Karl Maier as a source, but not the actual Nyerere's speech. Since Maier did not provide any source of the quote, it is difficult to verify because kwenye speeches za Nyerere sijawahi kuona au kusikia akitamka hiyo phrase.

Hapa tujaribu kutofautisha kati ya primary source na secondary source. Kwenye primary source ambayo ni speech yenyewe, there is no such a phrase as "I failed. Let us admit it". Kwenye secondary source ambayo ni Karl Maier, does not provide a source for that phrase. In his last speech as the President, Nyerere said that "You have forgiven, even if perhaps you have not forgotten, my many mistakes of commission and commission." Could this be what Karl Maier was referred to as "I failed. let us admit it"? Hata hivyo itakuwa vingumu b'se kwenye phrase ametumia plural, i.e let's us admit, whilst kwenye speech anasema "my many mistakes of commission and commission."

Ninachojua Nyerere alishasema kwenye moja ya hotuba zake kuwa tusije tukadhani kuwa wakati wa utawala wake palikuwa hapana rushwa. Alisema rushwa ilikuwepo lakini tofauti na sasa wao walikuwa wakali sana na wala rushwa ndani ya serikali (YouTube - ‪Nyerere's Meeting With Tanzania Press Club 1995 Part 4 of 10‬‏). Pia kwenye speech yake ya siku ya Wafanyakazi mwaka 1995 alisema kuwa serikali yake ilifanya mambo mema na ya kijinga. Hilo ali-admit kabisa. Ila alisema kuwa tatizo la utawala uliofuata uliacha yale mema na kuendeleza ya kijinga. Anakubali kuwa katika miaka 23 lazima watakuwa walifanya makosa kwa vile hakuwa malaika. Lakini kilichotakiwa ni serikali ya awamu ya pili kuyasahihisha makosa ambayo utawala wake ulifanya na kuendeleza mema hasa yale ya msingi. Alisema cha ajabu hata yale mazuri na ya msingi tumeshindwa kuyaendeleza (YouTube - ‪Julius Nyerere 's Speech on Workers' Day 1995 Part 6 of 7‬‏) (anzia dakika ya 8.50).

EMT, thank you so very much. Hakuna mtu hata mmoja ambaye amewahi kusimama (mimi nikiwa mmojawapo) kusema kuwa Nyerere hajawahi kukosea. Kuna watu ambao wamekuwa wakijaribu sana kutufanya mashabiki wa Nyerere kana kwamba hatujui historia yetu kiasi kwamba tuna"mtukuza" Nyerere kuwa hakuwahi kukosea. Yawezekana kabisa watu wanaojua makosa ya Nyerere ni mashabiki wake - kama mimi.

Mara kadhaa Nyerere amekubali makosa yake na hakuna wakati aliofanya hivyo waziwazi na kuyaanisha kama alipoandika "TUJISAHIHISHE" waraka pekee tangu uhuru hadi leo ambao umewahi kuangalia matatizo ya utawaala na changamoto zake na kutaka taifa lijirekebishe. Kikwete amekuwa madarakani kwa miaka mitano - hata siku moja hajawahi kusema amekosea kwa lolote! Mkapa alikuwa madarakani na hajawahi kukubali makosa yoyote wala kufanya reflection ya kina isipokuwa pale alipokubali "regrets" baada ya mauaji ya Pemba. Mwinyi hadi leo hajawahi kusema yeye kama kiongozi alikosea wapi wala kutupa nafasi wakati wa utawala wake kufanya national reflection.

Sasa kuna tofauti ya mtu kusema "I have made some mistakes" na mtu kusema "I was a failure, or I failed". The implication of the former ni kuwa katika utumishi wa miaka 22 (na hii ndio ilikuwa reasoning ya Nyerere) ingekuwa ajabu sana kama wasingefanya makosa. Mwenyewe alisema "kwani sisi malaika sisi hata tusifanya makosa"? The implication ya kauli ya pili ( ambayo Nyerere hajawahi kuitoa) ni kuwa hakukuuwa na mafanikio yoyote. Kusema mtu kafeli maana yake alijaribu akashindwa. Well, unaweza vipi kusema mtu kashinddwa wakati aliweza kuondoa Polio na magonjwa mengi yaliyotusumbua? Unaweza vipi kusema mtu kashindwa wakati alisimamia ujenzi wa reli mpya ya Uhuru, bandari, viwanja vya ndege, mitambo ya kuzalisha umeme, kufuta ujinga na pamoja na matatizo ya ukame Tanzania hatujawahi kuwa na watu wanakufa kwa njaa ati kwa kukosa chakula! Unaweza vipi kusema mtu alishindwa kama aliweza kuingiza taifa lake vitani na kushinda kulanzia Mutukula hadi Jinja? Alishindwa vipi kama literacy level ilipanda hadi kuwa kwenye upper 90s leo ikiwa chini ya 70 huku tuna maintaneti, video, simu za mkononi n.k?

Wanaotaka Nyerere aseme kuwa alishindwa wanataka kuhalalisha kitu ambacho hakiwezeni; kwanini wao wameshindwa pamoja na faida nyingi ambazo Nyerere hakuwa nazo. Nyerere (kama alivyosema Kikwete kwenye mkutano wa ILO jana) alianza na madaktari 2 na mainjia 12 wazalendo? Na wapo watu wanaotamani kuwa angeweza kujenga barabara za lami, mahospitali makubwa n.k! Lakini leo wana wahandishi na madaktari bwelele jiji la Dar miundo mbinu yake ikoje?

Wanatafuta kushindwa kwa Nyerere ili wahalalishe kushindwa kwao. Bahati mbaya sana walifanikiwa kuteka akili za baadhi ya watu hasa ambao hawajui historia yao na kuwafanya wamchukie Nyerere bila kuwa na sababu ya kisayansi ya kufanya hivyo isipokuwa chuki tu. Lakini ukweli wote ukiwekwaa wazi Nyerere anang'ara kati yao kama taa gizani na kama radi anapasua wingu la giza la kushindwa kwao.
 
Mnabishana na non-existent entity ff

Mwalimu unadhani basi tunawafikiria hawa non-entity? they are irrelevant. Tunawafikiria vijana wetu ambao leo wakiingia JF ndio kwa mara ya kwanza wanapewa shule ya kweli ya historia yao badala ya maneno ya vijiweni. Hawa wengine tumewazoea tumekuwa nao tangu kuanza kwa forum hii na pole pole tumeweza kuwafungua watu wengine waweze kuona kile ambacho kilifichwa mbele yao. Lakini zaidi tunajaribu kugeuza juhudi zinazofanya na Kikwete na watendaji wake na masshabiki wake kujaribu kufuta historia na mchango wa Nyerere kwa Taifa kiasi cha kuireduce to absurdity.
 
Mimi nimemsikiliza Nyerere katika hotuba zake nyingi na pia katika mahojiano yake na waandishi wa habari. Nyerere amewahi kukiri kwamba katika uongozi wake kuna makosa waliyafanya maana yeye hakuwa malaika, alikuwa binadamu kama binadamu wengine. Moja ya makosa ambayo alikiri kuwa walifanya ilikuwa ni kutaifisha mashamba ya mkonge ambayo walipowakabidhi wazalendo hayakufanya vizuri tofauti na yale machache waliyoyabakiza kwa wamiliki wa awali. Jingine alilokiri walifanya makosa ni kuvifuta vyama vya ushirika. Ukisikiliza mahojiano hayo anaeleza yeye mwenyewe kwanini anadhani walifanya makosa. Hata vivyo, kusema kwamba alifanya makosa sio kusema kwama "was a failed leader". Hapa lazima kutofautisha "between doing mistake", and "to be a failed leader". Clip ya mahojiano hayo nadhani imo humu kuna mtu mmoja alliweka.
 
Viongozi wote waliopita Tanzania wali fail including Nyerere mwenyewe.

Hakuwa malaika kwahiyo nitashangaa kama haku admit kwamba ali fail

Yes he was a failure just like others ,We expected a lot from him but we ended up in dissapointments akatuachia nchi ambayo hoi bin taaban.
 
Mzee Mwanakijiji,
Ikiwa Nyerere ktk mahojiano ya mwaka 1995 ilikuwa hivi sidhani kama kweli kuna mahala ali adimt failure..but agian, kutokubali makosa ni hulka ya Mtanzania hatukosi sababu hata kama umefumaniwa uchi, na siku zote hatukosi mchawi. farewll speech haina kipande chochote alicho admit hakuna - bofya


Hilo linatakiwa kumaliza mjadala.

Ukweli utabakia kwamba - He failed economically. Lakini wengi wanashindwa kuelewa kwamba Politically jamaa alikuwa mshindi tena labda naweza sema mmoja kati ya viongozi bora duniani.

Sasa hii ni hoja nzuri tu; he failed economically compared to what other country's economy? Are there any rational and scientific reasons why our economy failed beside blaming it on Nyerere as a person - we will have to compare with the economy of other nations at the same time. If Our economy was the only one that didn't do well (compared to other nations similar to ours) then Nyerere should be blamed for it.

Kwa mfano, Arap Moi failed, Kenya ilikuwa inakwenda chini vibaya sana kiuchumi, Kina Kaunda na Banda wote hawa kufikia mwisho wa utawala wao walikuwa total failure economically lakini huwezi kusikia wakizungumzwa..Why?

Well.. hapa unaleta proposition nzuri - yawezekana kulikuwa na matatizo zaidi ya watu waliokuwa juu - maana Nyerere tunaambiwa ni sababu ya Ujamaa lakini Moi alikuwa anafuata Ubepari! Banda alikuwa anafuata Ubepari na Kaunda Ujamaa wa aina yake? Mobutu alikuwa anafuata ubepari na per capita ilionekana kubwa - was it a success? Yawezekana kulikuwa na factors nyingine zilizochangia kuvurugika kwa uchumi?

Ukisoma huu Mpango wa Maendeleo wa miaka mitano uliopitishwa na Kikwete juzi hakuna sehemu yoyote ambayo wanaseema uchumi wetu ulianguka kwa sababu ya Nyerere na wanataja sababu mbalimbali zilizokabili uchumi wetu.
 
very interesting arguments! FF and mwanakijiji mnyukano wenu umekuwa faida kubwa kwa vijana wa leo,tena wengine ndio viongozi wetu sasa!
 
Unlike these leaders we have today Nyerere was not a failure. Failure started with Mwinyi to be precise and others all along. In fact if it wasn't Nyerere you would have no guts to point fingers at him that he was a failure. Only if he were alive seeing this mess going on............
 
Viongozi wote waliopita Tanzania failure mkubwa zaidi ni Nyerere. Alipewa nchi kwa ubwete badala ya kuanza pilika za kufanya maendeleo ya nchi yake akaanza kujiweka bize na ukombozi wa Mozambique, South Africa, Namibia , Angola n.k he even went further akatupeleka hadi Uganda pale tukaweka rais. Kama hiyo haitoshi hadi pale Congo DRC akaweka mkono wake. Huku wananchi wake wanakufa njaa, wanavaa midabwada 'kaa chonjo saa mbaya'.Alisahau 'charity' inaanzia nyumbani leo tumejichokea nchi zote hizi wametupita masikini ya mungu.

Huyu mzee ndio alikuwa mchawi wetu namba 1 haya madeni tunayodaiwa na Urusi na Iraq leo hii ni matokeo ya harakati zake za kutaka ujiko usio na manufaa.
 
Mh wish some of our "leaders" today would admit even a few mistakes. Our waheshimiwa this days get so defensive over their mistakes. Dah R.I.P. Nyerere. Wish you had taken some of these hooligans with you.
 
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