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Changamoto: Swahili search engine

Discussion in 'Tech, Gadgets & Science Forum' started by Kichakoro, Nov 21, 2008.

  1. K

    Kichakoro JF-Expert Member

    #1
    Nov 21, 2008
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    WanaJF,

    Nimekuwa nawaza ni kwa nini Tanzania bado maentrepreneure bado ni wachache wengi ni watu wa Asia. lakini Pili Jirani zetu wa Kenya kila kukicha wanatupiga bao, na hata hii juzi Microsoft wamezindua OS ya kiswahili nairobi.

    Hivyo basi, mimi sio mtaalamu wa ICT lakini nimewaza tu kama layman. Google, Yahoo, Google, AOL n.k.... zinaendelea hakuna hata moja yenye foot Africa. Na sasa tunayo OS ya kiswahili Je hatuwezi kuwa na search engine ya kiswahili ambayo itasaidia kuitangaza Tz, Kukitangaza kiswahili, kuitangaza Africa, kuindeleza ICT katika nchi zetu za maziwa makuu, na zaidi Naamini kuna hela ya kutosha kwenye hii business ndio maana Google na yahoo wanataka kumerge.

    Je wataalamu wa ICT mnasemaje????? Je what might be the costs (if one has an Idea)???? What might be tha bottleneck ya kuanzisha kwa sasa??????

    Je inawezekana kuunda consotium ya watu wa ICT East African countiries kwa ajili ya kuplan, kufinance na hata kusimimamia????????

    Naomba mawazo, criticism, Rejection zote zinakaribishwa, na tukumbuke tusichangie ili kujaza thread bali tunataka content hata kama ni watu wawili tu.
     
  2. Kang

    Kang JF-Expert Member

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    Nov 22, 2008
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    Hela ipo kwenye search lakini ni ngumu sana kuingia kwenye hiyo market, inabidi ushindane na google,Microsoft, Yahoo etc.

    Pia sina uhakika search engine ya kiswahili itafanya vipi kazi yaani site yake itakua ya kiswahili au italeta results za kiswahili tu?
    Google wana swahili version Google
     
  3. K

    Kichakoro JF-Expert Member

    #3
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    Primary language itakuwa in swahili lakini pia kutakuwa na lugha nyigine. lengo hapa ni kuhamaisha utumiaji wa mtandao kwa watu wetu wa EA.

    Kuhusu ushindani wala usitie shaka hakuna biashara isiyo na ushindani na ndio maana nimepropose consotium kwa legho la kudiversfy risk accross lakini pia kuweza kufanya lobbying kwenye hizo nchi kutumia hiyo site kutoa matangazo.
     
  4. Shy

    Shy JF-Expert Member

    #4
    Nov 22, 2008
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    Tembelea Google hiyo ni officially tanzanian na ndio page inayotembelewa zaidi kuliko zote kwa tanzania kwa kipindi cha mwezo mmoja uliopita kutokana na kujitangaza tanzania kuna search engine iliyotengenezwa na kijana anayeitwa ali adamji inaitwa bongoiza
     
  5. Mshiiri

    Mshiiri JF-Expert Member

    #5
    Nov 22, 2008
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    Tatizo ni programming ya computer ni kiingereza na hata web designing html codes ni kiingereza. Challenge ni kutengeneza programming ya kiswahili katika opearations zote ili ifanye kazi kiswahili na final interface iwe kiswahili. Sijui kama inakuwa clear why watanzania tuna websites za kiswahili lakini programming ni ya kiingereza. With search engines then is the most as well complicated or worth accept a challenge thing as the search engine algorithms in the world is in english. Will need to make our own computer platform and distribute to users worldwide and this is multitrillion dollar project leave alone the intellectual people with such capacity
     
  6. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

    #6
    Nov 22, 2008
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    Swahili search engine haina market ya kutosha, kwa sababu haina market ya kutosha, unless unafanya academic or cultural exercise, inakuwa hailipi na haiko viable as a living tool, both commercially and practically.

    Kuwa na a practicable Swahili search engine you need a demand and content.This demand involve literacy levels, purchasing power and economies of whole regions of Africa.Unless you successfully address these even the Swahili OS is a publicity brownie point but nothing practicable, as say a Mandarin or Korean OS.
     
  7. K

    Kichakoro JF-Expert Member

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    Nov 22, 2008
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    Pundit Na Mshiiri,

    nashukuru kwa michango yenu mizuri, lakini kiswahili sio static kinakua tena kwa kasi kubwa sana. Na acceptance yake kwa mataifa mengine ya Africa na hata hapa ulaya watu wanashauku kuona hii lugha inakuwa kuwaunganisha waafrica wote. But nani aendeleze???? Technologia ndio powerfully tools ya kuindeleza na hata kufikia huko kutumia kiswahili kwenye programming(will come back to this).

    Back to the Issue ya literacy, kwa kiassi kikubwa iliteracy inapungua na dotcom generation is growing(at what rate sijui) lakini unaweza kuona kuna mabadiliko makubwa sana kwenye jamii zetu, kwenye vyuo vyetu, kwenye sehemu za kazi, ebanking, ecommerce, marketing, n.k hivi ni vitu ambavyo ni potential market for the engine.

    Kama nilivyosema hapo mwanzo sio lazima iwe ni kiswahili tu bali inaweza kuwa dual(multilingual), lakini kikubwa iwe na footing Africa particularly EA.

    Naweza kuuliza maswali makubwa mawili (how much does it cost to broadcast 30seconds adv. in CNN or BBC), Naamini Tangazo moja la biashara CNN la 1minute linaweza kujenga at least one local TV station.........

    Ukija kwenye Yahoo na other searching engine mtu ukiclick tangazo tu uliloweka kwenye website yako kutokea yahoo unapewa 0.001USD for just clicking, aliyeclick kwenye tangazo akinunua unapata 0.5USD..... Je how much these people are geting as revenue from the companies?????? angalia ni matangazo mangapi kwenye website yanahusu Tanzania, kenya, Uganda .n.k.... ni millions.

    Hivyo suala la hiyo search engine kuwa commercially viable mimi bado mimi naamini ni viable business kama itatengenezwa business model nzuri.

    Kuhusu kufanya programming in swahili in the short run nasema no, but in the longrun YES inawezekana. Mfano kwani wakorea wako wangapi??????? Mbona wameendelea sana kwa muda wa 20yrs kumekuwa na tremendous changes kwenye ICT yote ni kutokana na kuimaster lugha yao na kuitumia kwenye ICT.

    Angalia nchi zilizombele kwenye ICT sasa wanatumia zaidi yagha yao kwenye kila kitu (JAPAN, KOREA, CHINA, INDIA, USA n.k) Je ni lini sisi tutaanza kujitutumua??????????
     
  8. K

    Kichakoro JF-Expert Member

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    Nov 22, 2008
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    Pundit Celtel walitoa simucard zenye menu ya kiswahili, watu wengi sana wasiojua lugha ya wenzetu wamezikimbilia na kuzifurahia. Ila mimi na wewe simu zetu ziko kwa kiingereza ingawa sio kwamba tunajua saaaaaaana kingereza kuliko kiswahili Bali :::::::::BRAIN WASHED::::::::::: na Tunadharau ya kwetu na kukumbatia ya wenyeji
     
  9. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Nov 22, 2008
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    Bado tunarudi pale pale, kama unataka kufanya academic na cultural experiment sawa, lakini ushajiuliza kuna watumiaji wangapi wa internet watakaoitaka na kuitumia service hii?

    Labda unaweza kupata picha ukiwa na cost benefit analysis nzuri pamoja na reliable projections, kitu ambacho kinahitaji reliable data, kitu ambacho kwetu hatuna.

    Kwa hiyo unaona jinsi gani uta gamble hapo?

    Mimi hapa naangalia a business plan pamoja na financial plan ya jamaa mmoja alikuwa aide wa Hillary Clinton, cousin wake tunafanya naye kazi ameniomba niipitie.Jamaa wanatak kuanzia some sort of socio-politico portal for young people especially African Americans, plan iko so impressive kwa sababu jamaa kafanya homework yake vizuri ana data zote na trends zote.Now this does not guarantee success, but it puts him in a good position to get a good headstart, sasa sisi tutataka kuanzisha a Swahili search engine, tunajua market yetu ni watu wangapi? Wangapi wataihitaji na wangapi wataitumia kama curiosity tu? Tunawezaje ku project growth kama hatuna reliable data za internet usage? et cetera et cetera.
     
  10. Zakumi

    Zakumi JF-Expert Member

    #10
    Dec 21, 2008
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    Mshihiri:

    Unayozungumza hayana ukweli kamili. Programming languages zina syntax za kiingereza la semantics zake bado ni programming languages zinazojitegemea. Hivyo computer languages ni lugha kamili zinazojitegemea

    Lugha iwe ya kiingereza, kifaransa au kiswahili ni commands tu ambazo zinamfanya mtumiaji aweze ku-interact vizuri na applications. Hivyo lugha zinakuwa implemented katika interface au skin layer. Lakini engine ya application inabaki palepale kama ilivyo.

    Kwa mfano kazi ya kuibadilisha interface au skin ya JF kuwa ya kiswahili ni kazi ya siku moja tu.

    Vilevile unaweza kuifanya Linux kuwa ya kiswahili bila ya matatizo yoyote.

    Matatizo yanayokuja ni effort unazotumia na audiance wako. Hakuna maana ya kuifanya interface ya JF kuwa ya kiswahili wakati audiance wenyewe wanatwanga SWANGLISH.
     
  11. Susuviri

    Susuviri JF-Expert Member

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    Dec 21, 2008
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    Google iko kwa Kiswahili. How about that?
     
  12. Maxence Melo

    Maxence Melo JF Founder Staff Member

    #12
    Dec 21, 2008
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    Ukweli unauma, binafsi siku nilipokuta Google inanihamisha na kunipeleka google.co.tz ambayo ni swahili version nilijisikia kukereka (nahisi ni wengi wetu) na kuitafutia dawa ambapo niliiondosha haraka sana na kuweka Google na kurejea kwenye Google ya kiingereza tu.

    Ninachokiona ni kuwa wengi hatukiwezi kiswahili kwa undani haswa japo ni waswahili, tunachanganya lugha mbili kiswahili na kiingereza kuweza kuwasilisha tunachohitaji kukiongea. Najitahidi kila niandikapo kutumia kiswahili muda mrefu lakini huwa najisikia kushindwa kwani kuna maneno imekwisha kuwa kawaida kuyachanganya ili kufikisha ujumbe.
     
  13. K

    Kichakoro JF-Expert Member

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    Dec 21, 2008
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    Mkuu nashukuru kwa kuwa genuine

    lakini ungeendelea kuitumia ndio pale utakapokuwa makini zaid kwenye kiswahili. Ukikuta mchina, mjapani, Mjerumani, mfaransa na mataifa mengine kama hajui kiingereza hajisikii vibaya kwa kutoifahamu hiyo lugha.

    But kwa nini sisi tunajisikia vibaya?????????? Tujivunie kiswahili

    Pamoja na kwamba Google na search Engine inaweza kuwa za kiswahili lakini tunataka yenye chimbuko lake Africa(Iwe yetu sio ya kina....) Ni mtazamo wangu tu
     
  14. JuaKali

    JuaKali JF-Expert Member

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    Dec 21, 2008
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    Mkuu, computer haijui English/swahili au vinginevyo. Inachojua ni binary digits tuu!! hivyo ni juu yako kuzimanupulate hizo binary kwa language uijuavyo. Kwa mfano Compiler za C++ hutafsiri high level language kupeleka kwenye low level language ambayo computer inaweza elewa. Hivyo basi tukitengeneza Compiler ya swahili mambo yote yatakuwa swahili!!!!!!
     
  15. P

    PanguPakavu Amy Senior Member

    #15
    Dec 21, 2008
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    u haven't been 2 Jap,China,Korea do you?!
    or if u hav been,may be it was only for a minute..,
    anyways,asians..,germans and many other non-english speaking countries people..,i mean common people,those local people you would work with,have big regrets for not being able 2 speak english,by the way.english centers and other english learning facilities are the biggest source of income for foreigners in ASIA.be it in a proffessional environment or any other.i personally was once paid 3 times more than my peers at work just for a mere fact that..,i could speak english!!and they were way qualified academically than i was.

    go 2 any asian country.u would see how much normal people spends just 2 learn english.

    THEY FEEL really BAD and incompetent.in todays globalized world,speaking English is almost a necessity.

    the only difference btn them and us is they are hardworking.hence english factor gets canceled of.

    back 2 the topic,GUI and USER nterface have much influence in the way people interact with the internet.

    BUT,since internet in TZ is use by high class citizens,then it doesn't really matter if its all english.since high income translates to good..,english education at least for now in TZ.

    when reaches a time that internet is not only available in offices and internet cafes,when Bi-mkubwa can buy lingerie's from a vendor online,pay her utility bills over the internet.THATS WHEN EVERYTHING NEEDS to BE IN PLAIN SWAHILI!!would even incourage it to be in SUKUMA if that serves the purpose.OTHERWISE its waste of resources.

    Managing content online is a costly process,that requires knowledgeable individuals.i wouldn't waste them preparing TOS for bi-mkubwa,so that she understands every single detail etc..,

    what TZ needs is a set of tailor made websites..,tailor made content & resources made by TZ entrepreneurs.

    what are people going to google in SWAHILI anyways?nothn..,several websites that are updated once in a year?nope..,

    the truth is,dyanmic content is only available through blogs in TZ(which is still subpar).the rest is sighs..,

    we need time...,or we need to chase time.we kinda lag behind.
     
  16. M

    Mwanjelwa JF-Expert Member

    #16
    Dec 21, 2008
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    Hiyo ni tatizo kwa watu wengi sana na si wewe peke yako. Nadhani wewe unaweza kwenda kijijini kwenu ukaanza kuongea kiswanglishi ukitegemea ndugu zako wakuelewe!

    Ni lazima ulazimishe kujifunza mambo yako ndipo utayajua. Lakini ukiona kiingereza ndiyo muhimu, inakuja tatizo hapo. Ni tatizo kubwa sana. Kiingereza hakikufika hapo kilipo kwa watu wa nje kama wewe kukishabikia. Waliaanza wenyewe then wakashawishi Dunia kwa namna tofauti ikiwemo colonization.

    Tunahitaji kukienzi kiswahili na si kukipiga kumbo. Watu wa kukienzi ni sisi wenyewe hapa hapa. Nzuri ni kwamba sasa hivi lugha ya pili au ya tatu kwa kasi ya kukua Duniani, nafahamu Spanish ndiyo first
     
  17. C

    CottonEyeJoe JF-Expert Member

    #17
    Jan 3, 2009
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    1) There seems to be a problem with the aims and objectives of this kiswahili search engine that is being proposed and I think these need to be careful thought out as i don't think that simply making a Swahili search engine will automatically promote the use of kiswahili around the world. Promoting a specific language take more than that, it may even involve policy changes and higher level regional collaboration.

    2) If you want to make a Swahili search engine that can allow swahili speakers and and users an option to search the world wide web in kiswahili; I am afraid to tell you that you are fighting a losing battle. Google has about 80% of what is indexed out there on the WWW and has an option for Swahili speakers or Tanzanians to access. The reason why Google have become so successful in indexing is because of their highly protected and top secret algorithms for both indexing and information retrieval which has been developed by 100s of the smartest coders in the world and millions of dollars have been spent to run their operation. The storage databases alone will run into the millions of dollars for the magnitude of indexing needed. bottom line is we don't have the resources to do that.

    3) If you want to allow users to only search Swahili, Tanzanian or east African content you will have to define what is Tanzanian, Swahili or East African Content and categorize it. This will prove very interesting for many reasons which we can go into detail on. Even then the volume of usage may not be sufficient enough to convince advertisers to pay enough money to run this regional operation.

    4) The Cost of running such a business are very high contrary to popular belief that "its just a web application" trust me google are not running their operation from a basement or kitchen in silicon valley.

    MY TAKE:

    A localized search engine as opposed to a translated one is more viable but the emphasis should be on localization rather then language promotion. Promoting the Swahili Language can not be achieved through this website if that was the objective, there should be options for both English and Swahili. I also think people will be more interested in useful local information and directories. Before anything can be done though a thorough and realistic Cost Volume Profit Analysis has to be done so that there is a clear business sense otherwise this may have to be regionally subsidized.
     
  18. M

    Manitoba JF-Expert Member

    #18
    Jan 7, 2009
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    Great points mwanawane!

    If it was my money, I wouldn't bother puting it on a swahili seaech engine. I would put it into primary school mathematics that the kids seem to be failing more and more each year ... :)

    Just one thing thought: there is nothing top secret about what google is doing with searching ... it is just a different and a very well thought-out way ...
     
  19. SamJet

    SamJet Senior Member

    #19
    Apr 2, 2011
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    Iam in this thing now,
    Sam Inc inatazamia kuzindua search engine yake 2012 mwanzoni.
    Lugha yake itakua kiswahili, jina lake bado hatuliweki bayana kwasababu tunayo majina kadhaa tunayochagua.
    Itakua by default ya kiswahili lakini kuna option ya kubadili lugha.
    Tuna tazamia baadae kuzungumza na bongoza networks, find.co.tz na wengine ili kuruhusu meta search engine yetu kupekua na database zao.

    Bado tunaruhusu mapendekezo ya jina la search engine yetu, tuma suggestions seotanzania [at] gmail.com au sam[at]sam.co.tz
     
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