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BAE won't refund money back to URT; will give it to charities!

Discussion in 'Jukwaa la Siasa' started by popo, Mar 14, 2010.

  1. p

    popo Member

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    14th March 2010
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    In the wake of British Aerospace Engineering System’s agreement recently to pay $400million(Sh540billion) in fines after admitting that its arms deals, including the controversial radar sold to Tanzania, the UK based company has confirmed that the compensation billions won’t be paid to the government’s coffer.
    In an email sent to this paper on Saturday, BAE confirmed that the $47million which is a penalty for over-pricing the radar price won’t be paid to the government as claimed earlier, insisting that the billions would be given to local charities dealing with humanitarian aid.
    The BAE’s confirmation ends high hopes that Tanzania would finally get its stolen billions which, were swindled by the radar brokers, some government officials as well as BAE officers during the controversial deal.
    “We have decided that the fine for accounting error for Tanzania radar will be paid to selected charities not the government.” Read part of the email sent to The Guardian on Sunday yesterday.
    In January the British arms firm accepted guilt and agreed to pay penalties in the US and the UK totalling several hundred million dollars to settle the long-running corruption allegations against it. Under the deal, announced simultaneously in London and Washington, BAE will pay $400m (£255) in the US and $47m (£30m) in the UK. In its comprehensive investigation, UK’s Serious Fraud Office named Andrew Chenge, Sailesh Vithlani, Tanil Somaiya, and Dr Idris Rashidi as the key suspects linked to suspicious payments amounting to $12million doled out by the BAE System broker in Dar es Salaam.
    The deal with the SFO in the UK covers one arms contract only, under which overpriced military radar was sold to Tanzania. The SFO said some of the cash would become "an ex gratia payment for the benefit of the people of Tanzania".
    According to details from the SFO’s investigation, the actual price of the military radar sold to Tanzania at that time was $12million, but Tanzania paid about $40million with the extra $28million going into the pockets of those involved, both government officials and private individuals.
    Under the new deal between the SFO and BAE System announced on Friday, Tanzania may get a refund of $28 million (Sh37.8 billion)—an amount that could pay for 9,500 students to pursue their undergraduate studies for two years or provide 7.4 million families with treated mosquito nets at a cost of Sh5,000 per net.
    In 2006, the UK investigators established that BAE System had secretly paid a $12m commission into the Swiss bank account of Sailesh Vithlani in a deal that led to Tanzania, one of the world's poorest countries, buying a military radar system with only nominal justification.
    The back-door payment to the Tanzanian middleman represented 30 percent of the contract value. Tanzania had to borrow to finance the deal, which critics said was unnecessary and overpriced.
    Recently, Minister for Foreign Affairs Benard Membe, insisted that the $47 million compensation should be paid to the government’s coffer and not otherwise, but the BAE’s stance confirmed yesterday is expected to create another conflict between Dar es Salaam and London.
    It’s not clear why BAE is not willing to pay $47million directly to the government of Tanzania.
    However, some legal analysts believe that BAE has chosen that path to avoid any legal implications that may arise if Tanzania finally chose to arrest and prosecute the key radar suspects.
    By paying the billions to charity organisations, it would look like donation donated by the company through its corporate social responsibility.
    Suzan Hawley of Corruption Watch, a UK based anti graft watchdog currently pursuing the BAE corruption scandal, said: “This is a trick chosen by BAE to avoid being implicated directly by third party, but it’s an old style that won’t get them off the hook.”
    Corruption Watch has filed an application at UK court seeking the review of the SFO and BAE settlement agreements reached few months ago. The Guardian on Sunday has also learnt that last week the UK court issued an injunction barring BAE from proceeding with any settlement agreements pending the hearing of the main suit.

    SOURCE: GUARDIAN ON SUNDAY
     
  2. p

    popo Member

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    Hii ndio shukurani ya wahindi wa tanzania kutuingiza kwenye balaa hili.Kizazi nz kizazi kitatakiwa kulipa deni hili.Hivi hii serikali yetu na viongozi mafisadi mpaka lini.kwa nini mpaka leo Chenge anakazi bado au ndio uwajibikaji wa pamoja.wameiba wengi na sio chenge peke yake inaonekana mr mkapa anafahamu hilo
     
  3. BAK

    BAK JF-Expert Member

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    Haya ngoja tusikie Siri kali itasema nini kuhusu hili. Walikuwa wanayasubiri hayo mabilioni kwa hamu kuu ili wayaingize kwenye account yao ya mafisadi.
     
  4. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

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    I will write a letter to BAE.. to congratulate them for this incredible good news.. haiwezekani mzembe atuzwe!
     
  5. Bongolander

    Bongolander JF-Expert Member

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    "However, some legal analysts believe that BAE has chosen that path to avoid any legal implications that may arise if Tanzania finally chose to arrest and prosecute the key radar suspects"

    Kuna uwezekano mkubwa tu wezi wataendelea kuwa huru. Na itawezekana wataendelea kuwa kwenye nyadhifa za chama na serikali, na wasio na hatia watawekwa jela.

    By the way, nani anaamua matumizi ya fedha hizo, Tanzania au BAE? Kupeleka kugharamia malipo ya wanafunzi kwa miaka miwili sio nnjia endelevu, na yenyewe imejaa ufisadi. Vyandarua vya kuzuia Mbu ni ujinga kabisa (ujinga wa mzungu) kudhani ukiwa nacho hutaumwa malaria. still bado tunazugwa.

    Hii ni Tanzania. Inajengwa na wananchi na inaliwa na wenye meno. So hata tupige kelele vipi,mafisadi ndio wana nguvu Tanzania.
     
  6. Tripo9

    Tripo9 JF-Expert Member

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    Silly government, silly Membe, silly.....

    Hivi tutaendelea kutawaliwa kwa remote mpaka lini? Yaani haki yetu tunachaguliwa iende wapi! Kwani ikipewa kwa serekali na sisi kama serekali si ndo tutaangalia wapi ziende hizo pesa?!

    Shame on those who decide on our behalf.
    Membe you suck! Unaishia kutoa tu taarifa kwenye local media eti zile pesa ni zetu na watazileta serikalini tu. Hamna lolote. Upompompo mtupu. Disgusting!

    Shame on Chenge. You are number one betrayor!

    Guys, does any one has chill pills? Coz i dont know what th hell is happening here.
     
  7. HeartBreak

    HeartBreak JF-Expert Member

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    dawa chenge kujongwa live viwanja vya jangwani
     
  8. H

    Hofstede JF-Expert Member

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    I hope hujasahau ny
     
  9. Tripo9

    Tripo9 JF-Expert Member

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    I like this
     
  10. H

    Hofstede JF-Expert Member

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    Serikali kama wanataka hizi Hela waifungulie mashataka BAE na siyo kusubiri serikali za nchi nyingine kufanya hivyo halafu wao wanataka freeride.

    Mkataba kati ya BAE na URT haukuwa na kipengele cha kurudishwa hela zitazozidi serikalini.

    My Take: If BAE are serious they should channel the money to only international charities which are operating in Tanzania like OXFAM, and skip all local non-charities which are calling themselves NGOs. Charities are required by UK law to file their returns annually and be for Public benefits only which most of Tanzanian NGOs doesnot qualify for this. Otherwise the money will go to WAMA, IOTF and the likes if they leave it to URT to decide which charities to receive the money. In the next few weeks lets expect the mushrooming of fake charities in Tanzania with the expectation of receiving the money.
     
  11. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

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    Our government has shown a level of incompetence that can summed up as "colossal"! The did not investigate the allegations when we raised them in 2001, they did not do anything beside justifying the deal just as Sumaye did dhid morning in Dar. That we needed a new radar and it doesn't matter what the cost we were going to purchase it.

    So when they come back and demand payback because they overpaid the radar for almost 2 third of the actual price we ask them on what ground? Why should incompetence and mediocrity be rewarded?

    BAE has made the right decision not to give the money back to the Tanzanian government.
     
  12. Kasheshe

    Kasheshe JF-Expert Member

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    Ooh pole... selected charity organisations zitazirudisha hizo hela huko zilikotoka kwa njia ambazo huwezi ona... sawa na mchina anakuambia nitakupa msaada lakini ajiri mbeba zege mpaka mhandisi kutoka China!!! Yet unakenua meno kwamba umesaidiwa.

    MM, Think Big, acha wivu ....
     
  13. M

    Moelex23 JF-Expert Member

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    Mwanakijiji, I agree with ur sentiments. This is good news indeed.

    Govt of Tanzania is full of crap. The excess money from Tanzania was paid to Vithlani, Idris, Chenge and other people who are known. If the govt is really serious about Tz taxpayers money, they can just arrest those people who have the money and force them to pay back.

    BAE is paying a fine from their own money for their mistake, so to maximize tax benefits the money will go through charity.

    Tz govt should be forced to charge Chenge and others so we can get our money, end of the story.

    Also Rostam should return our money that he took through Kagoda
     
  14. Kiranga

    Kiranga JF-Expert Member

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    Sasa serikali ya Tanzania ndiyo iliyowezesha corruption itokee in the first place, it doesn't make sense to give it back the money, it is a corrupt government after all.

    Hawa jamaa wajanja sana, washajua image yao imeharibika, sasa wanataka kuji redeem, kuonyesha angalau hawataki ku deal na corrupt government ile ile waliyo deal nayo mwanzo. PR tupu.

    Mimi nina mashaka na hizo charities tu, hela shetani.
     
  15. Mzee Mwanakijiji

    Mzee Mwanakijiji Platinum Member

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    Kasheshe.. you need to think bigger.. kwa mfano;

    BAE kwa kutumia charities au taasisi huru (isiyo na kucha za serikali) ina channels fedha hizo:

    a. Kwenye Vyuo Vikuu binafsi vya Tanzania kuvipa uwezo zaidi wa kitaalamu, miundo mbinu na vifaa pamoja na kutoa scholarships

    b. Fedha hizo kiasi kinapelekwa kwenye kuinua hospitali za rufaa nchini na hasa kuanzisha ujenzi wa hospitali ya Taifa ya Watoto au kuanzisha kitendo cha Trauma Dar.

    c. Kusaidia kuwezesha kwa kununua vifaa vya uokoaji na ujenzi wa vituo vipya vya zima moto hapo Dar, kwa msaada wa moja kwa moja kwenda kwenye Halmashauri (serikali itatakiwa kuanza kulipa mishahara tu).

    Je haya yakitekelezwa yatarudisha fedha huko huko UK?

    Katika mapendekezo yangu haya matatu tu hapo juu ya kutaka fedha za BAE zitumike ni lipi baya, lisilofaa na lenye kuonesha wivu uliokithiri?
     
  16. Kiby

    Kiby JF-Expert Member

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    BAE wamefanya maamuzi mazuri kutowarudishia serikali pesa direct. BAE wanafahamu fika kwamba nzama za wizi huo walizifanya na waandamizi wa serikali. Waandamizi wale wale bado wapo madarakani na bakshishi waliyochukua bado ipo kibindoni. Hakuna mantiki ya kuwakabizi wezi pesa, kwanza kama wanazitaka mbona bado zimo mikononi mwa kina chenge? Nini kimewazuia kuzichukua huko. Wenzenu wamepanbana kwa mujibu wa sheria zao na kufanikiwa kulazimisha BAE warudishe pesa, sisi tumengangania kilichokwenda kwa mganga hakirudi. Kwanza serikali inabidi itueleze pesa za import support zitarudi je, kagoda nk. MWKJJ ukifanikisha azma yako ya kuwaandikia BAE waombe zoezi la mazungumzo ya urejeshaji yaahirishwe mpaka baada ya uchaguzi. Hizo pesa zisije kufanya kazi kama ya EPA.
     
  17. Kichuguu

    Kichuguu Platinum Member

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    Usiwalaumu wahindi wewe; hawakuilazimisha serikali kuingia mikataba hiyo mibovu. Jilaumu wewe mwenyewe kwa kuchagua serikali mbovu iliyotekeleza hayo.
     
  18. Masanja

    Masanja JF-Expert Member

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    People wait a minute,

    Hivi BAE hiyo hela ambayo wamelipa US wameilipa serikali ya Obama au wamewapa "charity dealing in humanitarian aid"?

    Nevertheless, I fully support this stance of BAE ya ku "donate" hii hela kwa NGOs! Its painful and humiliation to Tanzania and its people, but I guess this is what we DESERVE as a country. Why do I say this? We have ABSOLUTELY done nothing to punish those who borrowed to enrich their pockets through this corrupt deal. Hivi kweli Serikali inaweza kuwa na audacity ya kudai hizi pesa? Wazifanyie nini? Yet they have shown us that they are complicit to all those who reap our country with impunity?

    What has it done to punish those who masterminded the deal?

    People, I think, with all honesty, TANZANIA tumefika pabaya! Hivi kweli..Membe anaweza kwenda na miwani yake kudai hela ya BAE wakati Chenge na wenzake waliofanya huu uharifu wakiwa High table ya maamuzi ya nchi yetu?

    No wonder..BAE wants to use the money to buy mosquito nets!
     
  19. Masanja

    Masanja JF-Expert Member

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    Kasheshe,

    SASA si mara mia mbili hawa watazirudisha kwao, lakini through hizo NGOs (whether international or national) atleast hata wafagizi wa ofisi na madereva wataambulia kiduchu? Je hizo hela zingekaa huko ulaya kwenye account za akina Chenge na Vithlan tungeambulia nini? By the way hizo hela walizoiba akina Chenge kununua rada.... tulizikopa..so..whatever happens. Tutazilipa. na interest rate inapanda kila siku. Ama kweli maskini ni maskini tuu!

    Simply put, the buck stops with WE. We should stop blame game! Ni UZEMBE wetu kama taifa. Mwenye macho ya kuona anaona.
     
  20. Kichuguu

    Kichuguu Platinum Member

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    Ninadhani katika kuchagua hizo NGO's pia wawe makini kwa sababu kuna NGO's nyingine hapa kwetu ambazo kazi yake ni kukamua tu. Mimi ninakubaliana na MKJJ kwenye mfano aliutumia kuwa pesa hiyo ipelekwe kwenye vyuo mbalimbali hapa nchini na itumike kama skolaship kwa wanafunzi wa kitanzania, halafu vyuo vinavyopewa pesa ile viwe accountable kuonyesha wanafunzi wangapi wamefaidika na kwa kiwango kipi, wasijegeuka na kudai kuwa gharama ya kusomesha mwanafunzi mmoja ilikuwa dola milioni moja .
     
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