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aids huweza ambukizwa na matunda???

Discussion in 'JF Doctor' started by Mtaalam, Dec 19, 2007.

  1. Mtaalam

    Mtaalam JF-Expert Member

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    nimesoma forwarded msg moja kwenye email yangu na nikakuta ina story sijui ni kweli ama nini yasema kuwa kuna mtoto wa miaka 10 alipata ukimwi kupitia tunda nanasi ambapo muuzaji mwenye ukimwi alikata tunda hilo na kwa bahati mbaya akajikata na damu ikapita kwenye tunda lile na huyo kijana akala lile tunda baadae ikaja gundulika alipata kwa njia ile as wote nyumbani hawana ukimwi na ni mtoto wa miaka kumi so hajawahi kuhondomola!!!!

    sasa mimi naamini hapa JF kuna wataalamu wa kila nyenjo naombeni msaada wenu na mchango wenu je ni kweli ukimwi waweza sambaa kwa njia hiyoooo??

    i know even kwangu hiyo story imekaa ki usanii ila nataka nijue kuna possibility za it kusambaa hivyo??

    if so then tumikwishaaaaaaa
     
  2. Mtaalam

    Mtaalam JF-Expert Member

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    n if its possible then why mbu asiweze ambukiza ukimwi na wakati ananyonya damu ya mtu mmoja na kwenda kufyonza kwa mwingine sometimes???

    dah science kweli ni kitu cha ajabu though Mungu ndio genius kushinda woote na vyoote
     
  3. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Story imekaa ki-Thabo Mbeki-Jacob Zuma hivi.

    In theory it is possible for a man to walk through a brick wall (Quantum Theory), although probabilistic equations to reduce Pauli's exclusion principle demand the time for that to take place to be almost infinitely more than the age of the Universe

    What The Bleep Do We Know?
    In short, anything is possible given the right condition.the question is what probability are you talking about?
     
  4. D

    Dotori JF-Expert Member

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    Kwa swali lako la kwanza. UKIMWI hauwezi kwa kula nanasi.

    Pili, Mbu naye haambukizi ukimwi. Soma hapo chini (http://www.galaxygoo.org/biochem/hiv/mosquito.html):

    The simple answer is... NO.

    While it is not completely impossible, getting AIDS from an insect bite is EXTREMELY unlikely.
    Let's Look at what would have to happen:
    How would HIV get into a mosquito?

    First of all, the mosquito would have to bite a person infected with HIV.

    This person would also have to be in a stage of infection when HIV particles are in the blood. The amount of infectious HIV particles found in the blood changes over the course of an infection.

    The blood taken by the mosquito would have to have HIV particles in it.
    How would HIV survive in a mosquito?

    Since the mosquito is NOT part of the HIV “life cycle”, the transfer of the virus would be entirely up to chance events.

    These HIV particles would have to somehow get into the saliva of the mosquito, and then be transferred to a new person.
    How would HIV get from a mosquito to you?

    During a bite, the mosquito injects saliva into your blood. This keeps your blood liquid, and easy for the mosquito to take.

    The mosquito drinks, and leaves. Any mosquito saliva left is all that could contain a possible HIV particle. It looks like a mosquito does not transfer much from “meal to meal”.
    When you account for each step, the odds are extremely minimal of getting AIDS from a mosquito.

    So, you really don't have to worry about getting AIDS from a mosquito bite.

    If you're still worried, remember that not one case has ever been documented.
     
  5. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Lets remember, huko wanako document vitu hawana mbu sana.From the above explanation it is very rare but not impossible to be infected by mosquitoes.

    Once again it is a matter of probability.Anything is possible given time, even the decay of time itself.
     
  6. D

    Dotori JF-Expert Member

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    Mzee kwa high prevalence of HIV nchini kwenu and given the fact kuwa kila mmoja wetu ameshaumwa na mbu at least one, basi wote tungekuwa na HIV.
     
  7. Mtaalam

    Mtaalam JF-Expert Member

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    na vipi kuhusu hilo la tunda wajimini??
     
  8. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Huwezi kufikia hiyo conclusion bila ya kujua kuna probability gani ya maambukizo kwa kupitia mbu, ndiyo maana nikasema it is all in the probability, it is not impossible, but very improbable.I guess for one to be concerned it depends on what level of practicality are you talking about.

    Kama mtu anaweza kupita through a brick wall hata tunda laweza kumpa mtu ukimwi, lakini itabidi uende na scenario kama hiyo ya mbu walivyotoa breakdown hapo juu kuanzia level za virusi kwenye damu, exposure ya virusi kwenye hewa, virusi vimekaa muda gani kwenye tunda na vimeweza ku survive, mlaji amevipata kutoka kwenye tunda, almost impossible but there is nothing that outright prohibits this in the little science I know.
     
  9. D

    Dotori JF-Expert Member

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    Mtaalam kula nanasi hakusambazi Virusi vya UKIMWI.
    Probability of getting infected when eating a fruit is extremely rare. Inabidi damu nyingi imemwagike kwenye nanasi halafu mlaji awe na vidonda mdomoni. Sidhani hatakula nanasi ililojaa damu.
     
  10. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    There are two answers, the academic and the practical.The academic answer is YES (almost impossible or improbable is NOT impossible)

    But if you drop the academics unakuja kujikuta na hizo gigantic odds, for all practical purposes inakuwa NO.
     
  11. D

    Dotori JF-Expert Member

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    Shukurani kwa maelezo ya ziada
     
  12. Mtaalam

    Mtaalam JF-Expert Member

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    sasa hapo ndo sijui niseme debate yataka shika kasi ama?
    kwani pindi mtu akitumia kiwembe au kisu chenye damu ya mgonjwa,for him to get aids yambidi imwagike damu nyingi sana kwenye kidonda chake?si ni kiasi kidoog tu chaweza mpaka ugonjwa??sasa tuachane na hilo tunda nanasi ambalo likiwa na damu it is easy to b traced sasa liwe tunda kama tikitimaji rangi yake kidoogo yafanana na damu so it means mwenye ukimwi bahati mbaaya damu yake ikamwagika ndani ya tunda na wewe mteja ukaja ukalila tunda nawe mdomoni labda una kidonda it means ndo ushakwenda na majiii???
     
  13. D

    Dotori JF-Expert Member

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    That is very very hypothetical! Hapa mzee itabidi tuingie ndani sana kwenye HIV virus dynamics and its modes of transmission.
     
  14. K

    Kithuku JF-Expert Member

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    Dotori (or doctor) you are confusing us. We have been reading in the media about viral diseases that are spread by mosquitoes, actually it is said even ebola and some related viral diseases are spread by some types of mosquitoes. And in your reply in one post on this forum you said "Viruses have to strictly depend on living cells for replication". Based on this, what will stop HIV surviving in the cells of a mosquito? Why wouldn't these viruses develop in the mosquitoes' bodies? What makes HIV different from these other viruses that are trasmitted by mosquitoes? It appears to me that medics are afraid of telling us everything about HIV, especially when it is too scary (like the possibility of HIV spread through mosquito bites or caring for an HIV patient at home), or perhaps they haven't done sufficient research in the area (as the saying goes "no research, no right to speak").
     
  15. D

    Dotori JF-Expert Member

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  16. K

    Kithuku JF-Expert Member

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    Ndugu Dotori,

    Asante kwa reference hii. Sijapata muda wa kuisoma yote, lakini niliyoyapata kwenye abstract yamenipa mwanga mkubwa tu. Kwanza kwamba tafiti zinaonesha kwamba uwezekano (probability) ya insects (sio wadudu maana kiswahili wadudu ni zaidi ya "insects") kueneza HIV ni ndogo sana. Hiyo inatia moyo sana, na ninaamini wengi watakaojipa muda kusoma ripoti hiyo watafurahi kupungukiwa na mashaka. Lakini la pili, nimeelewa kwamba probability hiyo ya kuambukizwa HIV, japo ni ndogo sana, sio zero, na kimahesabu bado hii ni muhimu (hasa katika ngazi ya individual). Kitakwimu, ni sahihi kuiacha hii, na kuelekeza nguvu za kupambana na UKIMWI katika zile njia zinazoeneza zaidi, ambazo ndio hizo zilizotajwa ngono, kujidunga masindano ya kushea nk. Kwa msingi wa hiyo article uliyoniwekea hapo (naomba uniwekee printable format kama unayo, nimeipenda sana), bado ninazo sababu (kama individual, si kama advocate wa large scale intervention) ya kuwaogopa sana mbu katika suala la UKIMWI hasa nikiwa mazingira fulani nitakayoyaeleza.

    Tutumie mathematical expressions, ndizo ninazozielewa vizuri zaidi:

    Let P=probability of acquiring HIV from a mosquito
    P1=probability that a mosquito will be interrupted during feeding
    P2=probability that a mosquito will feed on an HIV infected person
    P3=probability that a mosquito will carry an infective dose in its feed

    Sasa article uliyoniwekea hapo imetamka kwamba (nafupisha sasa ki-hesabu): P=P1xP2xP3
    Magnitude ya overall probability (P) itategemea mambo yanayoathiri (kuongeza au kupunguza) hizo probability nyingine(P1, P2, na P3).

    P1 itategemea movements zilizoko (kama feni), muwasho, watu wengine kuona ukiumwa mbu(wanamfukuza, tunafanya hivyo sana). Hizi zitatoa probabilities nyingine P1a,P1b, P1c nk. Na kwa kuwa probabilities hizi kila moja inaweza kusababisha interruption of feeding hata kama itatokea yenyewe, overall effect yake inapatikana kwa kujumlisha.

    Kwa hiyo P1=P1a+P1b+P1c+.......+P1n (where n is the number of all the possible factors that can cause interruption to feeding).

    P2 itategemea mambo mawili: idadi ya watu wenye HIV katika eneo husika ambalo mbu wanaweza kuhama kwa mmoja hadi mwingine, na idadi ya mbu katika hiyo "system". Probability kwamba mbu a atamuuma mtu mwenye HIV kati yetu inategemea tuko wangapi jumla, tunavyozidi kuwa wachache, probability hiyo inazidi kuwa kubwa. Probability kwamba mbu b,c,d,e nk watamuuma huyo mgonjwa ni kama hiyo ya mwanzo. Kwa hiyo probability kwamba mbu a au b au c au d nk watamuuma huyo mgonjwa ni sum ya hizo probabilities, kwa hiyo jinsi mbu wanavyozidi kuwa wengi chumbani hapo ndipo probability ya kuchukua damu ya huyo mgonjwa inayozidi kuwa kubwa.

    P3 inahusu infective dose, na hii kwenye article hiyo ime-consider tu ile mbu anayobeba kwenye kile kisindano chake cha kufonzea watu.

    Lakini mpaka hapa tunaona kuwa hii equation P= P1 x P2 x P3 inaanza kutisha kama mko wachache chumbani, au kama wenye HIV ni wengi (kwa mfano kwenye nursing home).

    Sasa kuna moja ambalo sijalisoma kwenye hiyo article lakini huwa naliona. Huko kwetu Bongo tukiona mwenzetu anaumwa na mbu huwa tunampiga kofi yule mbu, tunafurahia anavyopasuka a kutoa damu, halafu tunashabikia "alikuwa ameshiba kweli". Halafu tuajifutafuta hiyo damu kwenye kiganja, "imetoka"! Hii ndio modification ya ile P3, volume hii ya damu ni nyingi kuliko ile ilioko kwenye kidomo cha mbu, tena ni vividly noticeable. Ukiweka hii kwenye hiyo equation, risk inazidi kuwa kubwa.

    Kwa hiyo Dotori nashukuru kwa article hii, umenipa sababu ya kuendelea kuwaogopa mbu na wadudu wengine wafyonzao damu!
     
  17. Mtaalam

    Mtaalam JF-Expert Member

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    duh yaani hapo hata kama ni daktari kumuelezea mgonjwa wake matiababu nina uhakika hapa kwa mjadala huu mgonjwa atakuwa kachanganyikiwa now...mmake it simple wajimini
     
  18. Pundit

    Pundit JF-Expert Member

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    Mtaalam, in simple terms the probability is negligible.Ukitaka kuleta specifics unakutana na all the "known unknowns". Ni rahisi zaidi ku-calculate uwezekano wa intelligent beings kuwako outer space (kwa kutumia Drake's equation which has a similar probabilistic concept) kuliko kujua probability ya kuambukizwa ukimwi na mbu.
     
  19. B

    Boney E.M. JF-Expert Member

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    Bwana "Mtaalam" unaweza kutupatia maana ya neno "kuhondomola" ili tukuze lugha yetu je asili yake ni wapi? Itatusaidia kushiriki vyema katika mjadala.
     
  20. Mtaalam

    Mtaalam JF-Expert Member

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    kuhondomola bana mkuu ni lile tendo la ndoa likifanywa!as tendo la ndoa lawa la ndoa kama likifanywa na watu wa ndani ya ndoa!
     
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