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    Topic: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

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    1. #1
      Mzee Mwanakijiji's Avatar
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      Default Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!





      My Take:

      Madai ya muda mrefu kuwa muungano haukuridhiwa na Wazanzibari hayana msingi. Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar ni halali kwani vyombo halali viliridhia pande zote za Muungano.

      Uhalali wake hata hivyo hauzuii Wazanzibar kutaka kujitoa kwani hata leo chombo kile kile kilichoridhia Karume atie sahihi makubaliano ya Muungano bado kipo na kinaongozwa na Dr. Shein.

      Wazanzibar wakitaka wakishawishi chombo hicho kuondoa ridhaa yake ili hatimaye Baraza la Wawakilishi lipitishe utaratibu wa Zanzibar kurudi katika status quo ya April 25, 1964.z
      Last edited by Mzee Mwanakijiji; 7th June 2012 at 00:35.
      [email protected]
      Tunapotaka kubadilisha watawala si kwa sababu tunataka kubadilisha sura; bali kubadilisha utawala! Yaani, tunataka kubadilisha jinsi tunavyotawaliwa siyo tu sura za wanao tutawala M. M. Mwanakijiji

    2. RukaaJuu Final

    3. FJM
      #41
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Quote By zomba
      Uhalali wa kutoka kwenye makabrasha ya CIA? tuoneshe uhalali wa kutoka Serikali ya Zanzibar na Tanganyika.

      Kama hauna, kaa kimya. Unajuwa sana kuwa huu ni muungano ulioshadidiwa na Nyerere kwa sababu ya kueneza Ukatoliki Zanzibar.
      zomba, ukatoliki uliingia Zanzibar miaka ya 1870s, tembelea kanisa la Minara miwili mji mkongwe, na Nyerere alizaliwa mwaka 1921. Please tell us something we dont know.
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    4. FJM
      #42
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Quote By Barubaru
      Pasco,

      Hebu tuweke wazi, Tanganyika mnanufaika nini na huu Mvungano?
      Barubaru, labda nikuulize hivi, kwa nini Zanzibar mnakubali kunyonywa na Tanganyika? Kwa nini mmekubali kuiweka nchi yenu yenye neema, iliyojaa maziwa na asali chini ya himaya ya Tanganyika? Kwa nini mmekubali kuwa koloni la Tanganyika?
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    5. #43
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Nadhani kuwa kukosekana kwa nakala ya hati za Muungano leo hakuwezi kufanya muungano huo uwe batili; jambo la maana tu ni kuwa iwapo Muungano huo bado unahitajika au vipi. Kwa hiyo badala ya kuwa tunazungumzia uhalali wa Muungano, ni afdhali tuendelea kuwa na mjadala wa iwapo muungano huo bado tunauhitaji leo. Muungano ulikuwa ni halali kabisa kwa sababu ulifanywa kwa kupitia organ za kihalali. Iwapo nakala halisi za hati zilizosainiwa na Nyerere na Karume zimepotea, tunajua kuwa bado kuna sheria ya Bunge ya mwaka 1964 ambayo pia ilihalalisha kuwapo kwa muungano huo.
      Mzee Mwanakijiji likes this.
      Kichuguuu: Nyumba inayohifadhi mchwa na nguchiro kwa pamoja bila mkwaruzo

    6. #44
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Sidhani kama uamsho wanajua hilo maana wao watoka Muscat na wametumwa na ndugu zao walokuwa watwana enzi hizo kukiteka kisiwa chetu kizuuuurii ili warudishe utawala wao!!

    7. #45
      zomba's Avatar
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Quote By SEBM
      Historiainatuambia kuwa ukristo uliingia Afrika katika karne ya kwanza sehemu ya Afrikakaskazini kama Alexandria-Misri, Kartthegi-Tunisia na Libya. Ukristu ulikujakufifia kabisa katika karne ya saba baada ya uvamizi wa Waarabu Waislam kutokaMashariki ya Kati. Ukristu ulikuja tena Barani Afrika mnamo karne ya kumi nasita wakati wa enzi ya uvumbuzi. Wainjilishaji wa kipindi hicho walikuwaWamisionari wa Shirika la Roho Mtakatifu(Holy Ghost/Spiritan Fathers)Mnamomwaka 1597, baadhi ya Wareno na Mapadre wa shirika la Mtakatifu Augustino(Orderof Saint Augustine – OSA) walifika Zanzibar. Hawa walikuja na kikundi cha Wagoaambao walikuwa Wakatoliki. Mnamomwaka 1860, Mapadre watatu wa Shirika la Roho Mtakatifu, Masista sita naDaktari mmoja kutoka Ujerumani walifika Zanzibar. Sultan Sayyid Majidaliwakaribisha baada ya kuhakikishiwa kwamba hawakuja kwa sababu za kisiasa ilasababu za kidini. Wamisionari hao walianzisha shule za ufundi na wakati huo huowalieneza Injili. Baada ya kuona huduma yao kubwa walioitoa kwa watu, Sultanaliwapenda sana na akaahidi kuwalinda na kuwasaidia. Wamisionari hawawaliwakomboa watumwa wengi na wakawajengea nyumba na hatimaye wakawafundishaneno la Mungu na kuwabatiza.
      Kama Ukatoliki ulikuwepo Zanzibar tangu 1600, inakuwaje tena miaka zaidi ya 300 baadaye (1964) useme Nyerere alitaka kuueneza Zanzibar?
      Kwa nini mnawachukia sana wakatoliki?Wamewafanya nini?
      If 83/17 was a norm in Mainland during and after Nyerere's era, the equation do not tally in Zanzibar, what would be the solution? mass invasion of crusaders.

      Did you ever ask yourself why would Nyerere be a "saint"?
      System At Work

      "nimetembea angani na ardhini Tanzania nzima sijaona Rais na serikali iliyotukuka kiutendaji kama hii ya KIKWETE." - Freeman Aikaeli Mbowe

    8. Miaka 50

    9. #46
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Quote By mzaire
      Upotoshaji wako usio na mashiko waambie hao hao vilaza wenzako huko Tanganyika.
      Ikiwa mwanasheria wa Z'bar (Wolfred) wakati ule hakuwa na taarifa wala kutia saini yake na hilo alikiri mwenyewe mara kadhaa sasa huo ni uhalali gani? Usikurupuke na kuandika na kutuletea chiti za zisizo na mashiko.

      Kwa mujibu wa Nassor Moyo "huu muungano haukuwa na mashiko yyte isipokuwa ulikuwa wa kulazimishwa kwa njia ya vtisho kutoka kwa Nyerere (LTULLAAh) na hzo union matters zilikuwa 11 tu

      Hata hivo muungano wenyewe ulikuwa wa muda tu wa miaka 10 na ilipokaribia kuisha ndio huyu adui wetu Nyerere aliopomuita Karume akakataa ndio Nyerere akamuuwa Karume"

      Usipotoshe Mwanakijiji ikiwa unataka ushahidi usituletee cjui intelejensia zako nenda kwa Professor Shivji na Mwanasheria Mkuu wa Z'bar utapata kujua kuwa hata huo muelekeo wa muungano Karume aliambiwa na Nyerere kuwa ni Muungano wa Afrika mashariki na sio Tanganyika Na Z'bar.

      Tena unaiscan ili ionekane kuwa ni ya kweli duh! ama ww huna tofauti na yule mwandishi wa habari wa POLISI wa Z'bar alosema kuwa "MUAMSHO wamesambaratika na Muhadhara umehudhuriwa na watu kdogo tena kwa ajili ya swala ya alghaaswir" na hali watu walijaa mpaka uwanja wa Malindi wote ukafurika na wakaibika siku ya Jumapili.
      Duh.. Yamefika huko ya kuitana laanatullah kweli..? Na ya kumcingizia Nyerere ndie aliemuua Karume..? Ndio maana nimeshajiapiza cintochangia tena post inayohusu muungano humu JF..

    10. #47
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      Quote By Fredrick Sanga
      Dunia hii ya ajabu kweli, wengine wakipindua wanaitwa wahaini, wangine wanamapinduzi. Wate halali?
      Uhalali Wa mapinduzi na uhaini inategemea Ni nini wananchi wanachotaka ! Hadi sekunde hii kuna kitu Inaitwa baraza la mapinduzi huko Zanzibar , mbona hili halipingwi na Lina kiongozi wake? Kama mmoja wetu akilipinga successful kwa namna yeyote ile basi kila kitu kitakuwa maji kwa glass ! Hakuna haja kwa tanganyika kuumia kichwani wakati Zanzibar wana serikali Yao halali iliyowekwa madarakani kihakali

    11. #48
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Na serikali hiyo ya SMZ inayatambua na Kulibariki baraza la mapinduzi na serikali yake
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    12. #49
      Tume ya Katiba's Avatar
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Breaking News: Hatimaye mwanzilishi wa uzi huu kakimbia uzi wake! Anyway huenda anatafuta reference kwenye maktaba za marekeni! kkkkkkkkkkk
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    13. #50
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Quote By mzaire
      Unaonekana huu muungano ulikuwa ni wa Tangayika tu maana kila ushahidi wa muungano uko Tanganyika!!! Basi cjui kama Tanganyika Ulijiunga na kujichukulia kila kitu cha muungano au vp?

      Maana likitokea suala la ushahidi wa muungano Tanganyika ndio hujitutumua kutoa maelezo lakini kule Zenji wanakwambia ss hatuna waraka huo na wala hatuwahi kuuona na wala hatuna uhakiaka na waraka huo kw7bu hakuna maelezo kuhusiana na waraka huo.


      Mfano hakuna mwanasheria hata mmoja wa Z'bar alokiri kuwepo kwa waraka wa muungano alafu leo wee Mwanakijiji watuletea siasa za kizushi kwa kuuhalalisha upuuzi huu naona kwa Wazanzibari huna cha kuwaeleza maana wako tayari kwa llte hata kifo ni bora kuliko kutawaliwa na Watanganyika na soon utasikia khabari mzito wakati hilo Tume la Katiba likijaribu kuingia kule Zenji.
      Sasa jamani kwani tabu nini? Kama hivi ndivyo mnavyoamini na ikiwa haya ndiyo maoni ya wazanzibari wengi, kwa nini basi msiliombe/petition Baraza la Wawakilishi na au Baraza la Mapinduzi kuhusu kuvunja muungano?

      Maana kwa mfano rahisi tu, kama ndoa iliyofungwa kihalali baada ya maridhiano ya wanandoa na wazazi wao na mbele ya sheikh yaweza kuvunjwa (kwa mwanamke kupewa talaq), kwa nini nanyi Zanzibar msifanye hivyo? Kulialia na kulalama bila kufanya chochote hakuwezi kuwasaidieni... na mbaya zaidi hata njia hiyo ya Uamsho bado haiwezi kuwasaidieni!

    14. #51
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      Quote By zomba
      Uhalali wa kutoka kwenye makabrasha ya CIA? tuoneshe uhalali wa kutoka Serikali ya Zanzibar na Tanganyika.

      Kama hauna, kaa kimya. Unajuwa sana kuwa huu ni muungano ulioshadidiwa na Nyerere kwa sababu ya kueneza Ukatoliki Zanzibar.
      si kaka zako Magamba wameuficha ikulu. Anastahili pongezi, kama vipi jibebe

    15. #52
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      Quote By Tume ya katiba
      Breaking News: Hatimaye mwanzilishi wa uzi huu kakimbia uzi wake! Anyway huenda anatafuta reference kwenye maktaba za marekeni! kkkkkkkkkkk
      Kama yupo USA kwa sasa Ni asubuhi ya alfajili labda amelala! Au labda amechoshwa na malalamiko yanayotolewa na vijana Wa nyumba nyingine wakati hayo Ni matatizo Yao Kama wali-ratify au la! Cha msingi inabidi baraza la mapinduzi liulizwe Kama bado linautambua au kutaka muungano maana Ni lenyewe lililokubali kuungana kwa niaba ya watu Wa Zanzibar na baraza hili mi chombo cha juu zaidi kuliko hata bunge la wawakilishi!
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    16. #53
      zomba's Avatar
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Quote By lutamyo
      Wasiwasi upo kwa sababu kama Wazenji wanadai muungano makanisa kwanini yachomwe..... ndiyo maana wasiwasi unawaingia watu wa kutoka bara. Cha muhimu kwasababu ndugu zetu hawataki muungano basi uvunjwe tuu. Huwezi kukaa na mtu ilhali hataki maelewano wala kurekebisha kasoro zilizopo. Hii italeta heshima kwa Watanganyika vunja muungano waanze kulipuana maana wamezoea hawa
      Jee, unawajua waliochoma makanisa?

      Kwa muono wangu, kuna kila sababu ya kuwa makanisa wameyachoma wenye makanisa ili kutengeneza fedha za michango. Wameona fursa na wakati muafaka umejitokeza wakautumia. Makanisa yanajulikana kwa kuwa na wachungaji wenye kutengeneza fedha kwa njia zisizo halali hapa Tanzania, kuna m/wachungaji waliokwisha shikwa na unga kwa jina la kanisa, kuna m/wachungaji waliokwisha shikwa na vipande vya albino. Kwanini isiwe na hiyo ya Zanzibar ni fursa iliyojitokeza na wachungaji na wana kanisa wakaona ndio fursa ya kujipatia michango ya wasamaria wema haraka haraka?

      Haiingii akilini lichomwe kanisa awachwe mwenye kanisa akijinafasi.

      Kwenye kuchomwa makanisa kuna kila "elements" za "conspiracy". Ingekuwa waliochoma ni Waislaam basi yangechomwa makanisa yale ambayo wako nayo mjini Unguja kwa zaidi ya karne na yenye hadhi. Kwa nini vikachomwe vile vikanisa ambavyo havina hata hadhi? Fikiri.
      System At Work

      "nimetembea angani na ardhini Tanzania nzima sijaona Rais na serikali iliyotukuka kiutendaji kama hii ya KIKWETE." - Freeman Aikaeli Mbowe

    17. #54
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      Quote By Tume ya katiba
      Breaking News: Hatimaye mwanzilishi wa uzi huu kakimbia uzi wake! Anyway huenda anatafuta reference kwenye maktaba za marekeni! kkkkkkkkkkk
      unajua kuna kitu kinaitwa time zone? unafikiri dunia nzima jua linazama muda huohuo kama wa makunduchi au mchambawima?
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    18. #55
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      Quote By mzaire
      Unaonekana huu muungano ulikuwa ni wa Tangayika tu maana kila ushahidi wa muungano uko Tanganyika!!! Basi cjui kama Tanganyika Ulijiunga na kujichukulia kila kitu cha muungano au vp?

      Maana likitokea suala la ushahidi wa muungano Tanganyika ndio hujitutumua kutoa maelezo lakini kule Zenji wanakwambia ss hatuna waraka huo na wala hatuwahi kuuona na wala hatuna uhakiaka na waraka huo kw7bu hakuna maelezo kuhusiana na waraka huo.

      Mfano hakuna mwanasheria hata mmoja wa Z'bar alokiri kuwepo kwa waraka wa muungano alafu leo wee Mwanakijiji watuletea siasa za kizushi kwa kuuhalalisha upuuzi huu naona kwa Wazanzibari huna cha kuwaeleza maana wako tayari kwa llte hata kifo ni bora kuliko kutawaliwa na Watanganyika na soon utasikia khabari mzito wakati hilo Tume la Katiba likijaribu kuingia kule Zenji.
      msimamo wa mwanakijiji ni mpate nchi yenu! Acha ujinga na porojo
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    19. #56
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Zanzibar wanatumia vibaya uhuru uliokidhiri waliopewa kujiita bado Nchi ambayo haipo.
      Mzee Mwanakijiji likes this.

    20. #57
      zomba's Avatar
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Madudu ya CIA haya hapa: Nancy Pelosi: CIA Lies to Everyone, Duh!

      Hawana zaidi ya uongo.
      System At Work

      "nimetembea angani na ardhini Tanzania nzima sijaona Rais na serikali iliyotukuka kiutendaji kama hii ya KIKWETE." - Freeman Aikaeli Mbowe

    21. #58
      Mzee Mwanakijiji's Avatar
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Quote By Pasco
      Mzee Mwanakijiji, nakuheshimu sana, kuniina mimi nilichoandika kuwa hakukufanyika any "ratification" ni ubunifu tuu wa fikra zangu, sio kunitendea haki, ila nakuuliza hicho walichoandika hao majasusi unao washadidia, ndio ratification?.
      Pasco ulitaka nani aratify kama siyo Baraza la Mapinduzi?
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      [email protected]
      Tunapotaka kubadilisha watawala si kwa sababu tunataka kubadilisha sura; bali kubadilisha utawala! Yaani, tunataka kubadilisha jinsi tunavyotawaliwa siyo tu sura za wanao tutawala M. M. Mwanakijiji

    22. #59
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Mzee MM

      heshima kwako !

      Yoote yamesemwa na mengi tuu yameandikwa.
      Ila mimi mpaka leo najiuliza swali hili:

      Kama muungano ulipata ridhaa ya wazanzibari kwa nini mwalimu aliupigania sana ?
      Na kwa nini alimshughuki Jumbe kiasi kile kama muungano ulikuwa ni wa ridhaa ya pande zote mbili ?

      Na kwa nini mpaka leo Jumbe yupo kama hayupo ? Kuna nini hapa ?

      Wakati wa uhai wake mwalimu mambo mengi tuu asiyokubaliana nayo yalifanyika, mfano kuuuliwa kwa azimio la arusha. Inaonekana alikubali matokeo, ila kwa nini hili la muungano alilipigania sana ? kuliko yote ? (Kumbukeni G55 na malechela kama mfano tuu).
      Kuna siri gani kati ya Mwalimu Nyerere na muungano ?

      Na swali lingine la mwisho linaloniumiza kichwa, Mwalimu alikuwa kiongozi wa kisiasa, sio wa kidini, kwa nini kanisa katoliki limwingize kwenye mchakato wa kupata utakatifu ?

      Hayo tuu mkuu kwa sasa

      Respect !
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    23. #60
      Mzee Mwanakijiji's Avatar
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      Default Re: Kinyume na Ulaghai: Muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar uliridhiwa na chombo halali cha Zanzibar!

      Quote By MILKYWAY GALAXY
      Mzee MM

      heshima kwako !

      Yoote yamesemwa na mengi tuu yameandikwa.
      Ila mimi mpaka leo najiuliza swali hili:

      Kama muungano ulipata ridhaa ya wazanzibari kwa nini mwalimu aliupigania sana ?
      Na kwa nini alimshughuki Jumbe kiasi kile kama muungano ulikuwa ni wa ridhaa ya pande zote mbili ?

      Na kwa nini mpaka leo Jumbe yupo kama hayupo ? Kuna nini hapa ?

      Wakati wa uhai wake mwalimu mambo mengi tuu asiyokubaliana nayo yalifanyika, mfano kuuuliwa kwa azimio la arusha. Inaonekana alikubali matokeo, ila kwa nini hili la muungano alilipigania sana ? kuliko yote ? (Kumbukeni G55 na malechela kama mfano tuu).
      Kuna siri gani kati ya Mwalimu Nyerere na muungano ?

      Na swali lingine la mwisho linaloniumiza kichwa, Mwalimu alikuwa kiongozi wa kisiasa, sio wa kidini, kwa nini kanisa katoliki limwingize kwenye mchakato wa kupata utakatifu ?

      Hayo tuu mkuu kwa sasa

      Respect !
      Mbona jibu ni rahisi sana; Nyerere na wengine hawakuwa na tatizo na uhalali wa Muungano. Kwa muda wote toka mwanzo kabisa issue ya 'legitimacy' haikuwepo. Jumbe alijaribu kuhoji legitimacy na kujaribu kufanya kitu ambacho hakikuwezekana. Tatizo ni kuwa watu wengine wana assume "jumbe was right" na siyo kwabma yawezekana alikuwa amekosea.


      Kumbuka kuwa tatizo la Muungano limekujwa baada ya 1977 siyo baada ya 1964 wakati Muungano umefanyika. Mjiulize mabadiliko gani yalitokea Zanzibar 1977 chini ya Jumbe?
      [email protected]
      Tunapotaka kubadilisha watawala si kwa sababu tunataka kubadilisha sura; bali kubadilisha utawala! Yaani, tunataka kubadilisha jinsi tunavyotawaliwa siyo tu sura za wanao tutawala M. M. Mwanakijiji

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