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View Poll Results: TUVUNJE MUUNGANO?
Ndio 164 66.13%
Hapana 85 34.27%
Sijui 0 0%
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Old 26th June 2006, 08:41 PM   #1
Muungano na kero zake: Tuuvunje?
Sam Sam is offline 26th June 2006, 08:41 PM
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Nimevumilia vya kutosha nikidhani kama kuna mtu anayekerwa na fumbuzi wa matatizo ya muungano yaliyotolea kwenye kikao cha pamoja kati ya Mh. Lowassa na Mh. Nahodha.

Kitu kinachonitisha ni kwamba yale mambo waliowaamulia wananchi yatapelekwa bungeni october kwa ajili ya "constitutional reforms".
Kwa upande wangu sikubaliana na ufumbuzi waliofikia kwa 100%
Check this out:

1) mineral and oil exploration be co-opted into the national debate on the future of the political federation.

-debate is good but mineral and oil exploration should not be political.

2)Tanzania Petroleum Development Corporation (TPDC) should have an equal number of representatives from either side.

-Equal number kwa vigezo gani? Idadi ya watu? Tuelezene mlivyokuja na hiyo soultion equal number of people.

3)consultant on the distribution of wealth generated through mining and oil extraction be hired to advise the Union government on how it can be shared equitably.

-Please kama ni hivyo na huo muungano hatuutaki. For what?

4)It was decided that 50 per cent of the income would be used to finance the operations of the authority and the other 50 per cent be distributed on the basis of 60 per cent for the Mainland and 40 per cent for Zanzibar.

-Hivi hizo hesabu mnafanyaje? How did you come up with 60%, ardhi, watu,?????

Najua watanzania hawataki kuongelea muungano wakiogopa mizimu ya Mwalimu. Kwa upande wangu kuna mambo mawili tu hapa ambayo yanaweza kuleta ufumbuzi wa kudumu kwanza kuuvunja muungana na Zanzibar ikawa nchi kama ilivyo Kenya na tutaendelea kushirikian nao kama tunavyoshirikiana na Kenya, au Zanzibar uwe mkoa. zanzibar kuna watu wasiozidi 3 mil wakati mkoa wa Dar tu una watu 4 mil. Hapo utajiuliza ni kivitu tugawane nusu kwa nusu?

Kama watu hamtaki kuongela hili sual basi mwezi October linaingia kwenye katiba.



Mkataba wa makubaliano ya kuanzisha muungano wa Tanganyika na Zanzibar ukisainiwa mwaka 1964.

Mkataba wenyewe (uliosainiwa) umeambatanishwa kama attachment.

Attached Files
File Type: zip Muungano_1964.zip (25.5 KB, 125 views)


Last edited by Silencer; 29th January 2010 at 08:50 PM.. Reason: Title from Tuvunje Muungano to new one!

Sam
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Old 3rd July 2006, 10:35 PM
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Hivi nyie watu humu haya niliyoandika ni upuuzi ama nini? Watanzania tumezoea mpaka kitu kitendeke ndiyo tuanze kulalamika. Haya mambo yataingizwa kwenye katiba ya muungano. Hivi ni kweli watu humu ndani mnayaunga mkono au hamna la kusema. Najua Mkandara unayaunga mkono how about the rest?
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Old 3rd July 2006, 11:34 PM
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Hili suala hata mimi niliwahi kusema si suala la Lowassa na Vuai!

Hivi CCM na viongozi wake ni lini watakubaliana kuwa watanzania wana mawazo nao wanaweza kuchangia?

Kuhusu muungano ninakubaliana na wewe ni vema tuuvunje kwanza au iundwe serikali moja hata ukisoma kitabu cha Mwalimu uongozi na ... alishauri serikali moja kwa sababu alisema muundo wa muungano ni serilaki mbili kuelekea serkali moja baadaye. Lakini zanzibar cini ya CUF na CCM wenye we huko wanataka serikali tatu ili waendelee kutunyonya zaidi!!


Sawa haya ya (Lowaasa na Vuai )yakipelekwa bungeni yakapitishwa yatakuwa mabaya zaidi kuliko hata ya Nyerere na Karume . Hawa watu wa bara wataumia zaidi lakini hao hao wa bara wamekuwa kama

walinyweshwa dawa kuhuu muungano hawataki kabisa kuungolea!!!


Hapa ndipo huwa ninakubaliana na Mtikila!
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Old 4th July 2006, 01:01 AM
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Sam,

Inasikitisha sana kusoma huo mswada unaotegemewa kufanywa sheria katika siku za usoni , swali langu mimi ni moja tuu Watanzania ni nani aliyetuloga ? Kwa nini atufikirii kabla ya kufanya maamuzi ?

Kweli , kuna haja ya kuwa rocket scientist kujua ya kuwa huo mswada ni ujinga na ni kuwatukana wazalendo ? Yaani mapato ya madini yagawanywe katika uwiano wa 60% bara na 40 % zanzibar ....Ni vigezo gani wametumia kupata hizi figure ? kwanza zanzibar ina population ya watu wangapi .

Sam , naona utakuwa unaumiza kichwa tuu . Hawa viongozi awajali watu wa kawaida wanachodai ni masilahi yao binafsi ! siasa za bongo ni upotevu wa muda kwani wananchi wako so dormant na mara nyingi wanaishia kulalamika tuu .kikifika kipindi cha uchaguzi wanapitishiwa mswada wa kuwapa pilau " wanahongwa pilau " then wanawachagua kwa asilimia 80%.
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Old 4th July 2006, 01:30 AM
Ogah Ogah is offline
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sam,

si kweli kwamba watu wanapenda hayo makubaliano kati ya EL na SVN.

Hapa wengi wetu tumeshikwa na butwaa, maana pa kusemea hatuna zaidi ya hapa TEF.

Hii ni chokochoko ambayo nahisi Wabara wakishtuka na kupiga kelele tu Zenji nao watadai kwa NGUVU ZOTE kuwa VUNJA MUUNGANO, kwani wanajua (wazenji) fika kuwa wao ndio wanafaidika zaidi na hayo makubaliano, tena kuliko hata ilivyokuwa mwanzo. Na Wazanzibari wao wanatumia UDHAIFU wa Wabara (wapenda Muungano) KUFAIDIKA. In short kama mifano ya Mh Mkandara, Wabara sasa tunampenda sana MWALI na inabidi MLIPE MAHARI ZAIDI, KAMA HAMTAKI, MWALI NAYE ANASEMA BASI.

Whether we like it or not, this is very serious issue na very sensitive

sam, maswali yako ni ya msingi kabisa, sasa basi

1.Ni nani atakayejitokeza kwa nguvu zote na kusikika KUPINGA HAYO MAKUBALIANO beyond hapa TEF?
2.Hizi ni kampeni za kisiasa ndani ya CCM, naanza kuamini kuwa EL anaandaliwa kuchukua nafasi ya JM. hivyo basi hiyo ni kampeni ya EL kupata kura toka CCM ZNZ
3.Inabidi tuendelee kupiga kelele, ili uelekeo wa maamuzi ya Muungano uwe zaidi kutokea kwa WANANCHI WA PANDE ZOTE na si watu wawili
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Old 4th July 2006, 02:24 AM
Mkandara Mkandara is offline
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Sam,
Acha uhuni weee! sema umetaka kusikia comment zangu kuhusu swala hili.
Kumbuka mshikaji mimi hutazama shilingi kwa vigezo vya reality kisha correct way ya kumaliza tatizo bila kuingia mkenge. What's right or wrong haiwezi kusaidia kitu kwani dunia hii haina sheria za kanisani wala msikitini.

Kwanza kabisa lazima tukubali kwamba nchi yetu tunatawaliwa. Hilo nawaunga mkono sana Chadema, na Kama alivyodai Mbowe tunahitaji viongozi wa kutuongoza kulinda uhuru wetu na kutupeleka mbele kufikia kujitegemea... Hizi ni nyayo za Nyerere ambazo hata mimi nazikubali.

Swala la Muungano ni zito sana. Sipendi kuona muungano umevunjika kwa sababu ya mirathi na kubwa zaidi - eti sababu Zanzibar ni mtoto wa nje.

Nadhani Zanzibar wana kila haki ya mirathi hiyo ndani ya muungano lakini sio kwa kipimo ambacho kimetumika. Pili, sikubaliani na mirathi yeyote iliyokuwa sawa ikiwa mtoto huyu bado anadai mirathi toka kwa baba yake mzazi (Uchumi wa serikali ya Zanzibar), hali Bara hatuna serikali ndogo isipokuwa Federal. Hapa zilitakiwa serikali tatu kuweka mgao na serikali ndogo zote ziwe na mapato yake yatakayokuwa yakilipa kodi kwa serikali kuu.

Utoaji wa fedha zaidi kwa seikali moja Utakubalika tu pale penye miradi ya kitaifa. Mathlan, Ujenzi kwa uwanja wa ndege wa kimataifa Zanzibar.

Tatu na kibaya zaidi sikubaliani na hatua hii kwa sababu Zanzibar wanaamini kabisa ni nchi inayohitaji kujitenga. kwa hiyo hatua ya kwanza ni kufanyika kwa referendum ifahamike wazi wananchi wanapendekeza kitu gani. Wakichagua kijitenga hakuna haja ya muswada huu kupelekwa bungeni. Wakichagua kuendeleza Muungano basi, muswada huu ufikishwe bungeni pamoja na ule utakao unda serikali ya tatu bara. Na sheria ipitishwe swala hili la muungano halitazungumziwa tena na jina Wazanzibar lifutike ktk kamusi... sote Watanzania.

Sam,
Nilikaa kimya kwa sababu nyingine ya reality!

Toka lini sisi wananchi tukawa na sauti ktk maamuzi ya mikataba?.. Hiyo Gas, Petrol, Madini na mengineyo tunapokea ruzuku tu na hakuna kati yetu anayefahamu mikataba hii.

Unajua hivi majuzi nilishangaa sana nilipoona kuwa mwaka 2003 Songas imeuzwa kwa Mu-ingereza toka Kwa Mu-Australia baada ya miaka mitano ya uuzalishaji.... mmhhh! kuna harufu mbaya hapa lakini ukweli umesimama Songos imeuzwa na leo hii soko lake limehamia Uingereza toka Ausie sio DSE.

Umesikia mwenyewe walivyomsimamisha Zitto kuhusu mikataba kwahiyo hata hili halina maana kwani bungeni wamejaa CCM. Upinzani mkubwa bado upo Zanzibar na ndio pekee wanaoweza kuwaharibia jina kwa sababu ya KULA.
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Old 4th July 2006, 05:35 PM
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Mzee Mkandara,
Mimi naamini hakuna kitu kitachotutengenisha kati yenu na Zanzibar kijamii, sisi ni wamoja na tunashirikiana vizuri sana kijamii. Muungano wa kiuchumi na kisiasa unaturudisha nyuma sana kimaendeleo. Ni kitu ambacho hakiingii akilini kwa nini Zanzibar iwe na serikali yake ndani yamuungano wakati Dar es Salaam ambayo wakati wake ni mara mbili ya wakazi wa visiwani na bado wanataka wachukua 40% for what. Kama hawataki Zanzibar uwe mkoa basi muungano wa kisisa na uchumi ufe, ni gharama kubwa kwa serikali ya Muungano.
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Old 4th July 2006, 11:57 PM
Jasusi Jasusi is offline
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Sam,
Unajua Wamarekani walivamia Hawaii, wakamwua mfalme wake, wakaiburuza katika USA, mambo kwisha. Hakuna hata siku moja unasikia Hawaii wanapiga kelele hiki au kile. Mwalimu alikuwa mwuungana sana. Angekuwa Nkrumah, Zanzibar hivi sasa ingekuwa mkoa tu. Hakuna kelele. Chagueni gavana wenu, mbunge wenu lakini katika Federal govenment kura yenu inalingana na idadi ya watu wenu. We should have done the same.
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Old 5th July 2006, 03:05 AM
Mkandara Mkandara is offline
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Sam,

Maneno ya Jasusi ndiyo yangefunga kazi, lakini ndo...YANGE!

Zanzibar hatukumzaa sisi ni nchi ambayo inatakiwa kutambulika ndani ya muungano. Swala la Siasa lazima liongozane na Uchumi ktk muungano wowote wa nchi mbili, hii ni ndoa na huwezi kuleta mpango wa kienyeji. Tumeisha kula Yamin na haivunjiki bila kuwekwa ubani. Na ubani wenyewe ndio hiyo referendum. Kama bwana tunaweza kuwa na matumizi zaidi lakini haiwezekani tuseme hawana sauti kabisa. Tumefunga ndoa wenyewe tena kanisani ama msikitini, kilichotakiwa kilikuwa kuvuta ndani tu huku wake wa ndoa (mikoa) wakiwa na madaraka yao ya kiuchumi toka enzi zile za madaraka mikoani. Kwa hiyo Kisiasa ingejulikana tofauti na nje ya madaraka ya kiuchumi.

Nadhani swala hapa ni njia gani bora ktk muungano huu inapofikia kugawana mali. Kama ulivyosema asilimia 40.... toka wapi?.. hatuna serikali tatu. Mshikaji CCM sasa wanachemsha bara! Kama wanataka JM aonekane bingwa wa utawala basi hii ndiyo kaburi lao na kusema kweli nimepata habari za ndani kwamba wanaodai hasa kuwepo na wagombea binafsi wanatoka ndani ya CCM, hao mnaowasikia nje ni watu waliopandikizwa tu. Sii kazi mkasikia uchaguzi Ujao JM, Salim na Sumaye wanapigania kiti nje ya CCM kama wagombea binafsi. Kazi ipo na cheche za moto wanazianzisha wao wenyewe CCM. Habari hii ya 60 kwa 40 haikubaliki katu na vumbi litatoka bara.....Hiyo mikataba wananchi wapo radhi kuifumbia macho kwa sababu hawana elimu ya kufahamu hiyo mikataba lakini Mpango wa bara na visiwani hili swala jingine kabisa!
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Old 6th July 2006, 03:21 PM
Jasusi Jasusi is offline
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Mkandara,
Aaah! ndiyo maana Sumaye anakwenda Harvard, ili arejee na digrii ya utawala bora akijiweka sawa kwa 2010 au 2015? Kweli ndani ya CCM kuna mengi.
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