Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma - Page 2 - JamiiForums |The Home of Great Thinkers

Go Back   JamiiForums |The Home of Great Thinkers > Public Forums > Jamii Intelligence


Jamii Intelligence Serious reports & Discussions on Corruption, Politics etc recommended to our clients! Detailed discussions which you need not to miss


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 4th July 2007, 05:10 PM  
Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma
Morani75 Morani75 is offline 4th July 2007, 05:10 PM

Salaaam wana Jamii Forums...

Ni majuzi nilipita pale kwenye barabara mpya ya Sam Nujoma. Kwa kweli barabara hii imejengwa/inaendelea kujengwa vizuri sana. Lakini kuna baadhi ya mambo ambayo kwa kuangalia inaonekana kama kuna mtabaruku kidogo. Suala lenyewe ni kwamaba inaonekana mjenzi (Chinese company) wameamua kujenga kile tunachokiita lami nene (minimum 10cm thick, single lift). Tatizo lenyewe ni kwamba kwa wale amabao tumeweza kufanya kazi hizi za lami (asphalt concrete, both AC and AG), njia hii sio nzuri na ina madhara makubwa kwa ufanisi (life span) and utendaji (performance) ya barabara hii. Cha ajabu ni kwamba mheshimiwa huyu contractor na consultant wake hawajui vifuatavyo:

1. Hali ya hewa ya joto (temperate climate) inahitaji lami hii iwe kwenye unene mdogo kuzuia kiitwacho temperature softening ya lami. Hii itasababisha barabara yetu kubomoka kabla ya wakati na kuzuia ni labda kama wameweka/wametumia ile inayoitwa teknolojia ya kutumia "high performance binders"

2. Vifaa wanavyotumia siku nilipopita pale (na siku nyingine mbili tatu zaidi ni kandamizo yenye matairi laini (pneumatic roller) moja na kandamizo gumu (steel drum roller) moja. Kwa unene wa layer kwa kweli vifaa hivi ni vidogo/vichache kwa kutimiza mkandamizo unatakiwa kabla lami haijapoa na kuanza kuwa "rigid" na hivyo kuna uwezekano kukawa na "under compaction" itakayoelekea kuruhusu maji kuingia na kusababisha "premature failure"

3. Kiutendaji, barabara ya lami inatakiwa kutokuwa na migongo au miyumbo. Kwa unene wa layer uliowekwa tayari barabara imeanza kuwa na miyumbo. Mara nyingi hii inatokana na lami labda kutoshindiliwa vizuri (traffic indiced consolidation/compaction), layer kuwa nene sana na vifaa kushindwa kupata "even compaction/smoothness" kutokana na kuwa na uwezo mdogo, paver kuwa na "poor sensors". Kwa harakaharaka kwa ule upande ambao tayari wameshamwaga lami kwa kweli inaonekana kuna mapungufu sababu tayari barabara ina miyumbo hata kabla ya barabara kufunguliwa.

Sasa mimi nashangaa ina maana walivyoshinda kazi hii serikali haina wataalamu ambao wangeweza kuona mambo haya?? Na hii kampuni ya China iliyoshinda mradi huu ina maana waliweka vifaa vichache (walipataje kazi??) au ni kwamba hawajaleta vifaa vyote?? Mwisho, ina maana tunachohitaji ni kuona barabara mpya au tunahitaji pia kupata "quality of work worth of our money invested??".

Kwa habari tuzipatazo kutoka mikoani ikiwemo Singida - Manyoni amabapo kampuni nyingine ya Kichina imeshindwa kutimiza mkataba na malalamiko ya wananchi kuhusu utendaji kazi wa makampuni haya inakuwaje bado tunaendelea kuyaona yakipata kazi hapa nyumbani?? Kibaya zaidi barabara hii ipo mbele ya macho ya watu wengi vikiwemo vyombo vya kusimamia wahandisi, makampuni na vinginevyo vingi??

Tumsaidie mheshimiwa Rais kataka kutimiza miradi na vilevile tujionee huruma sisi walipa kodi.

Naomba kuwasilisha...

Morani75
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 212,316, Level: 100 Points: 212,316, Level: 100 Points: 212,316, Level: 100
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
Join Date: Thu Mar 2007
Location: Duniani
Posts: 662
Thanks: 6
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Views: 3344
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 1st December 2007, 08:36 AM
DAR si LAMU DAR si LAMU is offline
DAR si LAMU has no status.
JF Premium Member
Points: 176,724, Level: 100 Points: 176,724, Level: 100 Points: 176,724, Level: 100
Activity: 1% Activity: 1% Activity: 1%
 
Join Date: Sat Mar 2007
Posts: 2,520
Thanks: 0
Thanked 8 Times in 6 Posts
Rep Power: 28
DAR si LAMU will become famous soon enoughDAR si LAMU will become famous soon enoughDAR si LAMU will become famous soon enoughDAR si LAMU will become famous soon enoughDAR si LAMU will become famous soon enoughDAR si LAMU will become famous soon enoughDAR si LAMU will become famous soon enoughDAR si LAMU will become famous soon enough
Default below bottom line!

Quote:
View Post
Bottom line, we are not serious!
..we are also hopeless!
__________________
Dar na Lamu yote ni miji ya pwani,lakini haifanani!
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 1st December 2007, 02:55 PM
Pdidy's Avatar
Pdidy Pdidy is offline
Pdidy has no status.
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 1,945,626, Level: 100 Points: 1,945,626, Level: 100 Points: 1,945,626, Level: 100
Activity: 9% Activity: 9% Activity: 9%
 
Join Date: Thu Nov 2007
Posts: 2,056
Thanks: 185
Thanked 186 Times in 122 Posts
Rep Power: 27
Pdidy will become famous soon enoughPdidy will become famous soon enoughPdidy will become famous soon enoughPdidy will become famous soon enoughPdidy will become famous soon enoughPdidy will become famous soon enoughPdidy will become famous soon enoughPdidy will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa Barabara ya Sam Nujoma, Dar

We Roy Siku Nyingine Usiandike Hivyo Jamii Itakukimbia,,unaposign Mkataba Kama Ndugu Yangu Aliposema Unaeleza Kila Kitu Unchokwendakufanya,,,natumaini Haata Wewe
Unaposhona Nguo Hapo Buguruni Ukimpa Mtu Muda Unamjumuisha Na Muda Wa Mapindo Wa Kuweka Mifuko,,si Anakuja Ulivyosema Unajibu Bado Mfuko Mmoja Sikujumuisha Uda Wake Watakukimbia Utabaki Kutengeneza Mabegi Ya Manesi,,haya Ni Hayo ,,hapa Cha Maana Ni Ten Percent Tuulize Ina Madhara Gani Katika Jamii,,pili
Kwenye Swala La Kuulza Maendeleo Ya Site,,ndugu Yangu Mmoja Hapo Juu Alidai Akaulizwe Site Manager,,ok Ila Kama Manager Wake Kanyimwa Na Wizara Unafikri Sitemanager Atakujibu,,,ni Sawa Na Kumuuliza Zitokwenye Vikao Vya Kamati Za Madini Wanakatiwa Ngapi Na Wanabarrick Kwa Ujumla,,utapata Jibu Mpaka Aingie Kwa Mola Wake
Tumuombe Mungu Iishe Salama,lingine Wale Wachina Hawafanyi Kazi Kabisa Hivi Sasa Mnaopita Usiku Mnaona Wana Vyojivinjari Na Wabongo Uciku Mzima Kama Wako Club,,aah Tuanaingilia Interest Za Watu
Kwa Herini Wekeendo Njema Wadau
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 17th December 2007, 09:36 AM
Morani75 Morani75 is offline
Morani75 has no status.
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 212,316, Level: 100 Points: 212,316, Level: 100 Points: 212,316, Level: 100
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Thu Mar 2007
Location: Duniani
Posts: 662
Thanks: 6
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 25
Morani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa Barabara ya Sam Nujoma, Dar

Salaamu kwa Wana Jambo wenzangu.

Haya leo kwenye magazeti naona Serikali inasema yule Mchina hataondolewa sababu wataingia cost zaidi... Haya wale wenzetu mnaojua mambo ya Contract Management, hivi kweli hii ni sawa. Kichwa changu kinasema si sawa lakini ninaweza nkawa sipo sahihi...

Ninaochoka ni kama ifuatavyo:

1. Waziri anasema hatutamfukuza ili kutokuvunja mkataba na wakati huohuo anasema WaChina wameshindwa kuleta watu na vifaa muhimu... Sasa kwanza Mchina kisha "Breach Contract" hapo, lakini kibaya ni kwamba tunamruhusu kuendelea vivyo hivyo?? Jamani are we serious in this?

2. Waziri pia amesema "delay" pia imechangiwa na "fact" kwamba "Rapid Bu System" imekuwa "Integrated" ndani ya "design"... Sasa swali langu hapa ni moja, "Je hii issue ya Rapid Transit System ilikuwepo toka mwanzo au iliingizwa "Re-designed" wakati tayari contract imeshatiwa saihihi?? Kama ni kabla, then lazima ilikuwa considered in the Engineers estimates for both time and costs; lakini kama haikuwa considered mwanzoni je, wakati inaingizwa kulikuwa na any "Contractual Agreement" ya kuongeza muda?? Kama hii ya pili ni sawa je, muda ulioongezwa ulikuwa ni kiasi gani sababu item ya mwanzo wa thread hii ilionekana kuna mushekeli na sio "eti Rapid Transist System imesababisha kucheleweshwa kwa kazi".... Waziri, Wizara na TANROADS lets stop blah blah blah and be serious and professional atleast once in our lifetime!!

3. Serikali imepania kujenga barabara zote nchini kwenda kwenye "Tarmac standard"... Wow, Tarmac, nilidhani hii ni jina la kampuni flani limekuwa extended unofficially to represent black topped road... Hilo sio muhimu muhimu ni kwamba tunataka kuweka lami lakini lami hii itakuwa ya kiwango gani?? Manake kuna baadhi ya barabara tumeweka lami zikaishi kwa miezi (kama sio miaka michache mno) na nyingine (kama hii ya Sam Nujoma) zinawezekana zisiishe kabisa... Sasa imefika wakati Serikali itambue kwamba ukubwa wa pua sio wingi wa makamasi... "We need quality and NOT Quantity" kama ambavyo wamekuwa wanatujengea barabara wanapata kura na barabara inakufa after few months!!!

4. Mwisho ni hili swala la US $33M for Former TRC (au ni TAZARA) manake kama ni TRC ambayo tumeshaibinafsisha na sasa tunapewa pesa na WB... Sasa pesa hizo atapewa "MUWEKEZAJI" au?? Manake isije ikawa ndio unampa jamaa shirika kama "MUWEKEZAJI" kisha unampa na pesa akusaidie kuwekeza!!! Hapa mimi kidoogo naona sipaelewi elewi flani!!!!

Haya jamani inatosha kuanzia wiki, siku njema na wiki njema tukielekea kwenye "Idd-El-Adha"!!


Govt says it won`t kick at road contractor

2007-12-17 08:34:12
By Felister Peter

The government has said it will not chase M/S China Henan International Group currently constructing the 4km stretch of Sam Nujoma Road in Dar es Salaam.

This was said at a press conference towards the week end by the Minister for Infrastructure Development, Andrew Chenge, when speaking to journalists on infrastructure development in the country.

Chenge said that if it would chase away the contractor would incur more.

He said the government has decided to leave the same contractor continue with the work though it would take longer for the road to complete.

``Chasing away a contractor is more costly because we have entered into a contract with him. We have to adhere to the agreement as we carefully watch the situation till the work is complete.``
He said M/S China Henan International Group was yet to fulfill some of the things he promised to avail at the site like specialist personnel, who were very important in road construction.

The minister said the contractor failed to bring some of the important equipment to the site until after the government had strongly insisted.

He said another reason that had caused the delay was the design of the road whereby it has been designed to serve both the Rapid Transit Buses and the normal ones, adding that that is why the road was too wide.

Meanwhile the government planned to construct all the major roads in the country to tarmac level by 2017.

So far 257 kilometers were ready, while the government was targeting to tarmac about 527.5 kilometers in this year?s budget, he said.

The government had already received from donors a total of 42bn/- for the construction of Chalinze ? Kitumbi road.

He called upon Tanzanians to be patients while waiting for the new operator Rites Consortium of India to improve the railway services as they promised.

The new operator promised to bring new locomotive engines and other machines by March 2008.

So far the government has received USD33m from the World Bank for improving the former Tanzania Railways system.

SOURCE: Guardian
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 24th January 2008, 12:17 PM
Idimi Idimi is offline
Idimi a hydropower specialist
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 579,683, Level: 100 Points: 579,683, Level: 100 Points: 579,683, Level: 100
Activity: 6% Activity: 6% Activity: 6%
 
Join Date: Sun Mar 2007
Location: Bremen
Posts: 1,707
Thanks: 114
Thanked 138 Times in 91 Posts
Rep Power: 27
Idimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma

Quote:
View Post
tuanahitaji ufafanuzi kama huo kwa maendeleo ya nchi yetu!


Huu mjadala umeishia wapi? Hii barabara imekamilika ama bado?
__________________
Help make the world a better place.
Idimi@jamiiforums.com
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 24th January 2008, 12:42 PM
Morani75 Morani75 is offline
Morani75 has no status.
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 212,316, Level: 100 Points: 212,316, Level: 100 Points: 212,316, Level: 100
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Thu Mar 2007
Location: Duniani
Posts: 662
Thanks: 6
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 25
Morani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma

Idimi, barabara haijaisha na leo kwenye "NIPASHE" imeandikwa kuwa EL aliemlalamikia balozi wa China na akaitaja barabara hiyo.... Nakumbuka mzee Bukuku akiwa Ujenzi pale alianza na cheche lakini sijui mambo yatakuwaje sababu ujenzi unaendelea na spidi ya konokono.....

http://www.ippmedia.com/ipp/nipashe/...24/106937.html
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 24th January 2008, 01:20 PM
Idimi Idimi is offline
Idimi a hydropower specialist
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 579,683, Level: 100 Points: 579,683, Level: 100 Points: 579,683, Level: 100
Activity: 6% Activity: 6% Activity: 6%
 
Join Date: Sun Mar 2007
Location: Bremen
Posts: 1,707
Thanks: 114
Thanked 138 Times in 91 Posts
Rep Power: 27
Idimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma

Quote:
View Post
Idimi, barabara haijaisha na leo kwenye "NIPASHE" imeandikwa kuwa EL aliemlalamikia balozi wa China na akaitaja barabara hiyo.... Nakumbuka mzee Bukuku akiwa Ujenzi pale alianza na cheche lakini sijui mambo yatakuwaje sababu ujenzi unaendelea na spidi ya konokono.....

http://www.ippmedia.com/ipp/nipashe/...24/106937.html
Kama hawawezi kazi basi si wakabidhi kwa mtu mwingine amalizie?
Ni upumbavu kutengeneza kilometa zisizozidi nne kwa miaka mitatu!
Hapa lazima mtu awajibishwe!
__________________
Help make the world a better place.
Idimi@jamiiforums.com
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 24th January 2008, 01:23 PM
Mtaalam's Avatar
Mtaalam Mtaalam is offline
Mtaalam has no status.
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 197,543, Level: 100 Points: 197,543, Level: 100 Points: 197,543, Level: 100
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Mon Oct 2007
Posts: 1,147
Thanks: 0
Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 25
Mtaalam will become famous soon enoughMtaalam will become famous soon enoughMtaalam will become famous soon enoughMtaalam will become famous soon enoughMtaalam will become famous soon enoughMtaalam will become famous soon enoughMtaalam will become famous soon enoughMtaalam will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma

heheheee another ufisadi wa li serikali letu yaani kumbe fungu ni kuuuubwa from european union halafu wametafuta kampuni cheap??no wonder kama ndugu yeetu morani ameweza kutoa makosa kwao mengi ikiwemo kuwa na vifaa duni compared to the job if not utani wanaofanya...serikali ipate ujumbe huu na i jibu vyema wa TZ kweli Jf ni moto
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 24th January 2008, 01:34 PM
Idimi Idimi is offline
Idimi a hydropower specialist
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 579,683, Level: 100 Points: 579,683, Level: 100 Points: 579,683, Level: 100
Activity: 6% Activity: 6% Activity: 6%
 
Join Date: Sun Mar 2007
Location: Bremen
Posts: 1,707
Thanks: 114
Thanked 138 Times in 91 Posts
Rep Power: 27
Idimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enoughIdimi will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma

Quote:
View Post
heheheee another ufisadi wa li serikali letu yaani kumbe fungu ni kuuuubwa from european union halafu wametafuta kampuni cheap??no wonder kama ndugu yeetu morani ameweza kutoa makosa kwao mengi ikiwemo kuwa na vifaa duni compared to the job if not utani wanaofanya...serikali ipate ujumbe huu na i jibu vyema wa TZ kweli Jf ni moto
Ndio maana katika posti fulani niliuliza kwamba "Kwa nini kazi hiyo wasingepewa Konoike ambao utundu wao katika barabara hauna mawaa"? Wametengeneza ile barabara ya kutoka pale kituo cha mafuta karibu na kwa Kakobe kupitia chuo kikuu hadi Ubungo maji kwa muda mfupi sana, wangeshindwaje ile ya Mwenge-Ubungo?
Another 10% inatuua hapa!
__________________
Help make the world a better place.
Idimi@jamiiforums.com
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 24th January 2008, 01:50 PM
Semanao Semanao is offline
Semanao has no status.
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 169,461, Level: 100 Points: 169,461, Level: 100 Points: 169,461, Level: 100
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Wed Jul 2007
Posts: 271
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Rep Power: 23
Semanao will become famous soon enoughSemanao will become famous soon enoughSemanao will become famous soon enoughSemanao will become famous soon enoughSemanao will become famous soon enoughSemanao will become famous soon enoughSemanao will become famous soon enoughSemanao will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma

Waziri mwenyewe ni CHENGE unategemea nini, kumbuka alipokuwa mshauri mkuu wa serikali na miradi ya kibwege ambayo serikali iliingia. Ili ndo tatizo la ku-recycle leaders wakati wana rekodi ya ku-fail kudeliver.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 24th January 2008, 01:58 PM
Morani75 Morani75 is offline
Morani75 has no status.
JF Senior Expert Member
Points: 212,316, Level: 100 Points: 212,316, Level: 100 Points: 212,316, Level: 100
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Thu Mar 2007
Location: Duniani
Posts: 662
Thanks: 6
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Rep Power: 25
Morani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enoughMorani75 will become famous soon enough
Default Re: Ujenzi wa barabara ya Sam Nujoma

Idimi, hapo ndipo haswa kwenye matatizo, 10%. KONOIKE wana kazi wanafanya lakini kwa haraka haraka nimegundua kwamba wao wanafanya kazi zile ambazo ni mikopo au misaada ya Serikali ya Japan. Wajepu nasikia siku hizi wakitoa mapesa yao hata tenda hawatuachii tusimamie kila kitu chafanywa kule kwao na kutuletea kandarasi... Hizi waChina walizopata nyingi ni zile za EU, pesa zetu au "donors" ambao hawana haja ya kujua tumejenga kwa kiwango gani.... Kumbuka Chalinze-Segera-Tanga, Dar-Mlandizi, Chalinze-Melela (zote hizi walikuwa makandarasi wa Scandinavian countries sababu naskia kuna mafungu majamaa walietenga/saidia katiak barabara hizo.....

Inasikitisha sana kuona kwamba uozo kwenye "construction industry" ni mkubwa kiasi kwamba mhisani anakusaidia lakini anajua akikupa pesa utatapanya bure hivyo anahakikisha anatupa na kandarasi anayejua kazi manake tukiachiwa ni utumbo mtupu kuanzia bidding mpaka ujenzi wenyewe; hii inanikumbusha tukiwa wadogo tulikuwa tunaambiwa "ukikutana na mtu anakuomba pesa mpe chakula sababu ukimpa pesa ataenda kunywa pombe na mabangi".......

Ina maana waTanzania tumefikia hatua hii kwa wahisani jamani?? Ni kitu gani tulichomkosea Mola?? Najua sio umasikini lakini nini hasa, "njaa ya wachache" au "kutokujua kwa wengi??"
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
barabara, nujoma, sam, ujenzi


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ukabila IKULU, UJENZI, MAMBO YA NJE, MIPANGO, TRA, BoT + OFISI NYETI ZA SERIKALI Samvulachole Jamii Intelligence 1548 24th February 2010 05:46 PM
Barabara ya Morogoro yawa kero kwa watumiaji MziziMkavu Habari na Hoja mchanganyiko 21 27th October 2009 10:30 AM
Wafundisheni CHADEMA balance & separation of powers Kulikoni Jukwaa la Siasa 24 26th June 2009 07:42 PM
Mimi ninadhani Lowasa anakurupuka mno bila ya kufikiria wewe unasemaje? tibwilitibwili Jukwaa la Siasa 24 17th October 2006 09:28 PM

Tuma Ukurasa huu kwa rafiki yako!


All times are GMT +3. The time now is 06:33 AM.

Powered by JamiiForums.com
Copyrights reserved to JamiiForums.com