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    Topic: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

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    1. #1
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      Default Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Wandugu, salam za mida hii.

      Natafuta hotuba ya "SABABU TUNAYO, NIA TUNAYO NA UWEZO TUNAO."


      Nataka kusikia hizo "sababu tunazo" na hoja ya Rais ya kwenda vitani kwa mapana na urefu, badala ya kumbukumbu ya mstari mmoja tuliyokaririshwa toka udogoni.


      Nitangulize ahsante.


    2. #21
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Quote By Zizou View Post
      Nashukuru sana kwa michango hii wandugu.

      Sababu zilizotolewa zinaleta mantiki na baadhi nimewahi kuzisikia.

      Ambacho sijawahi kukisikia, na ambacho nimetaja kuwa nakiomba, kama kipo, ni hoja ya vita kupitia hotuba ya "Sababu Tunazo, Uwezo Tunao" iliyotolewa Agosti 18, 1978, na Hayati J. Kambarage Nyerere.

      Unaposema "sababu ni kuvamiwa, kwani hujui" hainisaidii. Si kila unapovamiwa unaamkia vitani. Yapaswa, katika diplomasia za vita, uonyeshe, kama ambavyo nasikia Rais alifanya, kuwa njia nyingine zimeshindikana.

      Hiyo hoja ya Rais ndio ninayoitafiti. Kuna mtu anayo?
      Mimi sijakuelewa unataka nini, diplomasia gani alifuata??

      hoja ya vita na ambayo watu wamekremishwa ni Idd Amin kuvamia kagera! ndicho alichosema Nyerere!!! haya unayoelezwa ni sababu mficho--hidend reasons which many either they dont know or they are purposely hiding the truth.
      You are not supposed to be so blind with patrotism that you cant face reality. Wrong is wrong no matter who says it. Malcom X

    3. #22
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Vita vya uganda ni vya kirafiki zaidi badala ya uadui

      Nyerere alikuwa rafiki mkubwa wa obote, alipenda kumrudisha madarakani rafiki yake

      Amini alikuwa na mabaya kama nyerere alivyo kuwa na mabaya yake kama mkuu wa nchi yeyote

      Na udini kwa mbali ulimtisha nyerere na westerners, hawakutaka viongozi wa africa wawe muslims ikaongeza kuni kwenye moto

      mengine lugha za kutafuta sababu ya vita..tu

    4. #23
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Waberoya,

      Hapa hata mie nakukubalia wazi kabisa kuwa ndiyo sababu pekee Nyerere alisema.

      Alimwita Idd Amin kuwa ni JOKA na lazima tulifuate huko shimoni na kulitoa.

      Idd Amin ni kweli alivamia nchi yetu. Kama Nyerere alivunja daraja, inawezekana kabisa ili kuwazuia askari wa Amin wasivuke Mpaka kiurahisi kuingia Tanzania. Ni kawaida kabisa wakati wa vita.

      Ila swali jingine hapo linaanza: Kwa nini IDD AMIN alivamia Tanzania?

      Hapo ndipo yatamwagika majibu mia na kidogo. Yote yanaweza kuwa sawa au yasiwe sawa kwani sidhani kama kuna mtu anaweza kutuambia sababu hasa iliyokuwa kwenye ubongo wa Idd wakati anavamia.
      Quote By Waberoya View Post
      Mimi sijakuelewa unataka nini, diplomasia gani alifuata??

      hoja ya vita na ambayo watu wamekremishwa ni Idd Amin kuvamia kagera! ndicho alichosema Nyerere!!! haya unayoelezwa ni sababu mficho--hidend reasons which many either they dont know or they are purposely hiding the truth.
      Nguruwe pita leo sina Mkuki(By Malila wa JF).

    5. #24
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Kwa wale tuliozaliwa miaka mingi baada ya vita tuliaminishwa kuwa sbb ya vita ni kuwa Idd Amini alikuwa na tamaa ya madaraka na alitaka mpaka wa uganda na tanzania uwe mto kagera....wapo wanaosema sbb za udini eti kuwa idd amini alitumia hela za vatican za EAC wakati ule kujengea misikiti.

    6. #25
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      ..mnaodai ile ilikuwa vita ya kidini mmepotoka.

      ..zipo nchi za Kiislamu ambazo zilikuwa zinaisaidia Tanzania.

      ..msikiti wa Kampala umejengwa kwa msaada wa Gaddafi, tena umefunguliwa miaka siyo mingi iliyopita wakati wa utawala wa Museveni.

      ..hakuna nchi za Magharibi zilizotusaidia ktk vita ile. kama tungesaidiwa basi tusingeporomoka kiuchumi na kufilisika kiasi kile.

      ..kosa kubwa tulilofanya ni kupigana vita kwa muda mrefu kwa kutumia fedha zetu wenyewe.

      ..miaka ya 1970, Tanzania[Nyerere] ilikuwa mwiba kwa interest za nchi za magharibi kuliko Uganda/Amini. kumbukeni kwamba mwaka 1975 Mreno alifukuzwa Msumbiji na Frelimo ambao walipata msaada mkubwa toka Tanzania. baada ya hapo tuliendelea kuwasumbua Waingereza tukipinga utawala wa walowezi wa Zimbabwe.

      ..kwa msingi wa hoja hiyo hapo juu utaona kwamba nchi za magharibi zilikuwa zinaomba dua Amini atupige ktk vita ile.

      ..siyo kweli kwamba Mwalimu alikuwa anataka Obote arudi madarakani. suala la nani atawale Uganda baada ya Amini liliamuliwa na Waganda wenyewe. hata habari za kuanguka kwa utawala wa Amini, baada ya Kampala kutekwa, zilitangazwa na Oyite O'jok. habari hizo zingeweza kabisa kutangazwa na Lt.Col.Ben Msuya aliyekuwa kamanda wa kwanza wa JWTZ kuingia Kampala, au hata na Maj.Gen.Musuguri aliyekuwa divisional commander.

      ..baada ya Amini kukimbia, Waganda walikusanyika Moshi kuchagua serikali ya mpito, kuandika katiba ya muda, na kupanga ni baada ya muda gani uchaguzi ungefanyika. Nyerere hakuwa na leverage yoyote ile katika maamuzi ya vikao vya Waganda vilivyokuwa vikifanyika Moshi.

      ..Obote aliweza kurudi madarakani kwasababu alikuwa na watu wake[Paulo Muwanga,..] ambao aliwatuma kwenda kwenye vikao vilivyofanyika Moshi. chama cha Obote, UPC, kiliweza kupenyeza makada wake ndani ya serikali ya mpito ya Uganda, bila ya Obote kushiriki ktk vikao vya Moshi. vilevile ni yeye pekee aliyekuwa na network ya kisiasa ndani ya Uganda. hawa wakina Museveni etc walikuwa ma-activists na wapiganaji wa msituni, not politicians.

      NB:

      ..Amini alikuwa na haki ya kutushambulia mwaka 1972 au 73 ambapo Tanzania tulikuwa tunawapa silaha waasi wa Uganda.

      ..baada ya hapo Tanzania na Uganda zilisaini mkataba wa amani wa Mogadishu, na Tanzania ilikuwa inauheshimu mkataba huo.

      ..Amini hakuwa na justification yoyote ile ya kutuvamia, kuua raia wa Tanzania, kuharibu mali, na kudai kwamba ardhi ya Tanzania ni sehemu ya Uganda.


    7. #26
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Quote By JokaKuu View Post
      ..mnaodai ile ilikuwa vita ya kidini mmepotoka.

      ..zipo nchi za Kiislamu ambazo zilikuwa zinaisaidia Tanzania.

      ..msikiti wa Kampala umejengwa kwa msaada wa Gaddafi, tena umefunguliwa miaka siyo mingi iliyopita wakati wa utawala wa Museveni.

      ..hakuna nchi za Magharibi zilizotusaidia ktk vita ile. kama tungesaidiwa basi tusingeporomoka kiuchumi na kufilisika kiasi kile.

      ..kosa kubwa tulilofanya ni kupigana vita kwa muda mrefu kwa kutumia fedha zetu wenyewe.

      ..miaka ya 1970, Tanzania[Nyerere] ilikuwa mwiba kwa interest za nchi za magharibi kuliko Uganda/Amini. kumbukeni kwamba mwaka 1975 Mreno alifukuzwa Msumbiji na Frelimo ambao walipata msaada mkubwa toka Tanzania. baada ya hapo tuliendelea kuwasumbua Waingereza tukipinga utawala wa walowezi wa Zimbabwe.

      ..kwa msingi wa hoja hiyo hapo juu utaona kwamba nchi za magharibi zilikuwa zinaomba dua Amini atupige ktk vita ile.

      ..siyo kweli kwamba Mwalimu alikuwa anataka Obote arudi madarakani. suala la nani atawale Uganda baada ya Amini liliamuliwa na Waganda wenyewe. hata habari za kuanguka kwa utawala wa Amini, baada ya Kampala kutekwa, zilitangazwa na Oyite O'jok. habari hizo zingeweza kabisa kutangazwa na Lt.Col.Ben Msuya aliyekuwa kamanda wa kwanza wa JWTZ kuingia Kampala, au hata na Maj.Gen.Musuguri aliyekuwa divisional commander.

      ..baada ya Amini kukimbia, Waganda walikusanyika Moshi kuchagua serikali ya mpito, kuandika katiba ya muda, na kupanga ni baada ya muda gani uchaguzi ungefanyika. Nyerere hakuwa na leverage yoyote ile katika maamuzi ya vikao vya Waganda vilivyokuwa vikifanyika Moshi.

      ..Obote aliweza kurudi madarakani kwasababu alikuwa na watu wake[Paulo Muwanga,..] ambao aliwatuma kwenda kwenye vikao vilivyofanyika Moshi. chama cha Obote, UPC, kiliweza kupenyeza makada wake ndani ya serikali ya mpito ya Uganda, bila ya Obote kushiriki ktk vikao vya Moshi. vilevile ni yeye pekee aliyekuwa na network ya kisiasa ndani ya Uganda. hawa wakina Museveni etc walikuwa ma-activists na wapiganaji wa msituni, not politicians.

      NB:

      ..Amini alikuwa na haki ya kutushambulia mwaka 1972 au 73 ambapo Tanzania tulikuwa tunawapa silaha waasi wa Uganda.

      ..baada ya hapo Tanzania na Uganda zilisaini mkataba wa amani wa Mogadishu, na Tanzania ilikuwa inauheshimu mkataba huo.

      ..Amini hakuwa na justification yoyote ile ya kutuvamia, kuua raia wa Tanzania, kuharibu mali, na kudai kwamba ardhi ya Tanzania ni sehemu ya Uganda.
      Kaka mbona haumalizii story yote kuna nini tena, acha nikusaidie kwa same source

      EVENTS LEADING TO WAR



      Relations between Uganda and Tanzania had been strained for several years before the war started. After Amin seized power in a
      , the Tanzanian leader Nyerere
      offered sanctuary to Uganda's ousted president Obote


      Apolo Milton Obote , Prime Minister of Uganda from 1962 to 1966 and President of Uganda from 1966 to 1971, then again from 1980 to 1985. He was an Ugandan political leader who led Uganda towards independence from the British colonial administration in 1962.He was overthrown by Idi Amin in 1971,...

      . Obote was joined by 20,000 refugees fleeing Amin's attempts to wipe out opposition. A year later, a group of exiles based in Tanzania attempted, unsuccessfully, to invade Uganda and remove Amin. Amin blamed Nyerere for backing and arming his enemies. The relationship between Uganda and Tanzania remained strained for many years.

      In early October 1978, dissident troops ambushed Amin at the presidential lodge in Kampala

      ,but he escaped with his family in a helicopter. This was during a period when the number of Amin’s close associates had shrunk significantly, and he faced increasing dissent from within Uganda. When General Mustafa Adrisi

      Mustafa Adrisi
      General Mustafa Adrisi was Vice President of Uganda , and one of president Idi Amin's closest associates. In 1978, after Adrisi was injured in a suspicious auto accident, troops loyal to him mutinied. Amin sent troops against the mutineers, some of whom had fled across the Tanzanian border,...

      , Amin's Vice President, was injured in a suspicious car accident, troops loyal to Adrisi (and other soldiers who were disgruntled for other reasons)

      Amin sent troops against the mutineers (which included members of the elite Simba Battalion), some of whom had fled across the Tanzanian border. The rebellion spilled over into Tanzania, where Tanzania-based anti-Amin exiles joined the fighting against Amin's troops.Amin declared war against Tanzania, and sent troops to invade and

      Ukisoma hapa at a glance utagundua Nyerere alificha mambo mengi sana

      si vita ya kidini wala watu wa westenr hawahusiki hapa! ukumbuke kuwa USA walikuwa wanunuzi wakubwa wa kahawa ya Uganda nyakati za Amin.

      Kumbuka vita hii iliicost Tanzania USD 1 Million per day!!!! 1.5Tsh Billion per day!! more than any EPA or dowans

      Kumbuka mataifa ya magharibi walivijoki sana hivi vita kuwa HAIWEZEKANI NCHI MBILI MASKINI ZIKAPIGANA they did nothing!

      KUMBUKA KUWA

      Tanzania, on the other hand, received no help from other countries in the Organization of African Unity, which had denounced Tanzania's invasion (and for its role as a backer of the 1977 coup in the Seychelles
      Seychelles

      Seychelles , officially the Republic of Seychelles , is an island country spanning an archipelago of 115 islands in the Indian Ocean, some east of mainland Africa, northeast of the island of Madagascar....

      which brought France-Albert René
      France-Albert René

      France-Albert René was the long-time socialist President of Seychelles from 1977 to 2004. He is known by government officials and party members as "the Boss." His name is often given as simply Albert René or F.A...

      to power) as a breach of respect for national sovereignty. As a result, the government in Dar es Salaam had to foot the bill for the invasion and subsequent peacekeeping role from its own coffers, further driving the country into poverty; Tanzania would not fully recover from the cost of the war until the early 21st century.

      Swali hivi kweli hatujui maana ya invasion?? who was nani alikuwepo kagera aseme nani alilivunja lile daraja?? kwa influence ya Nyerere OAU wakatae kumsaidia?? history need to be challenged here!!
      You are not supposed to be so blind with patrotism that you cant face reality. Wrong is wrong no matter who says it. Malcom X

    8. #27
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Waberoya,

      ..mbona kipande ulichokileta kinatetea hoja yangu kuliko kuipinga?

      ..Amini alikuwa na haki ya kutuvamia kabla ya mwaka 72. hakuwa na haki ya kutuvamia mwaka 78.

      ..baada ya 1972 tulisaini mkataba wa amani wa Mogadishu ambapo kila upande ulielekezwa kutosaidia vikundi vya waasi.

      ..soma kitabu cha Museveni utaelewa kwamba Waganda[baada ya mkataba wa Mogadishu] walishakata tamaa ya kumuondoa Amini walikuwa wanasubiri afe tu.

      ..kipande chako kinaelekeza kwamba Amini alivamia Tanzania kufuatilia waasi wa jeshi lake waliokimbilia Tanzania. hawa walikuwa waasi waliotoka Uganda kumbilia Tanzania. hawakuwa kikundi kilichovamia Uganda kutokea Tanzania.

      ..kuna omission ktk article uliyoleta, ambapo inaeleza kwamba Amini aliamua kuficha uasi ktk jeshi lake na kuzua madai kwamba eneo la Kagera ni sehemu ya Uganda.

      ..huo ulikuwa ni UJINGA wa AMINI kwasababu alikuwa na haki ya ku-invoke Mogadishu accord na kuilazimisha Tanzania kumsaidia kuwa-disarm waasi wa jeshi lake waliokimbilia Tanzania.

      NB:

      ..madai kwamba JWTZ walipata ushindi kwasababu walikuwa wanasaidiwa na satellite nimeyasikia hapa JF kwa mara ya kwanza.

      ..kwa mtizamo wangu Tanzania tulishinda vita ile kwasababu jeshi la Amini tayari lilikuwa limegawanyika kutokana na uasi uliotokea.

      ..pia kulikuwa na raia kibao wa Uganda waliokuwa wanapinga utawala huo. wanajeshi wa Tanzania walikuwa wanapokelewa kama mashujaa ktk miji mingi ndani ya Uganda.

      ..nina rafiki yangu mganda amenipachika jina la utani "MKOMBOZI", akikumbuka jina WAKOMBOZI walilopewa wanajeshi wa Tanzania walipoingia Uganda.

      ..Amini alikuwa hapendwi na wananchi wake na hiyo ilisaidia kufanya kazi ya kumuondoa kuwa rahisi.

    9. #28
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Quote By Waberoya View Post
      ... hoja ya vita na ambayo watu wamekremishwa ni Idd Amin kuvamia kagera! ndicho alichosema Nyerere!!!
      Hicho tu?

      Huwezi kusema "tumevamiwa na kwa hiyo keshokutwa tunaenda vitani." Hata wababe wa Marekani na NATO hawajiamulii vita kirahisi hivyo. Lazima ujaribu kushawishi dunia.

      Rais Nyerere alisema mapana zaidi. Katika vipande vipande vya rekodi za video nilizoziona, Rais anawalaani Waafrika wa OAU na jumuiya ya kimataifa kwa ujumla kwa mambo kadhaa yaliyotufikisha pale tulipokuwa. Na hoja ya vita anayoijenga ni nzito zaidi ya makaririsho ya "Sababu Tunayo, Uwezo Tunao."

      Ila sijabahatika kusoma au kusikia hotuba nzima, na kama mwanafunzi wa historia ya marais wa Tanzania, sitaki kujinyima tunu ya historia ya hoja ya vita ya J. Kambarage Nyerere. Kuna mtu anayo tafadhali?

    10. #29
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Quote By Wa Ndima View Post
      Nyerere alikuwa mkorofi, ni yeye mwenyewe aliyebomoa daraja la Kagera kutafuta chokochoko za kumpiga Idd Amini. Alifanya hivi kumuingiza rafiki yake Obote madarakani kama mnakumbuka kipindi kile Obote alikuwa Dar. Ametuingiza kwenye umasikini wa kutosha kwa kutufungisha mkanda mpaka leo. Nachukia sana vita vile....
      YouTube - kagera war nyerere

    11. #30
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Duh raha kweli nilikuwa nafyonza elmu adimu sana siku hizi JF.Wakuu JokaKuu,Waberoya,Sikonge na wachangiaji wengine tafadhali sana muendelee kutupa darsa.
      jouneGwalu likes this.

    12. #31
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      naomba kuwashauri ndugu zangu wana jf,kuhusu source za matukio muhim ya africa tusipende sana kuamini yalio andikwa na wazungu ktk internent, kuna uongo mwingi na huandika kulinda maslahi flani, nashauri tufanye tafiti hasa kuongea na wazee pamoja na kupitia achieves mbalimbali then hatua muhim kabisa ni kutumia creative imagination na kutafakari kwa kina then ndio tuamini.

    13. #32
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Sehemu ya speech ya Mwalimu ipo katika mkanda huu:


    14. #33
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Kuna kitu nimewai kusikia kwamba Mwalimu alinunua baadhi ya silaha kwa kutumia line of credit kutoka kwa baadhi ya Indian-Tanzania family. Jee hili lina ukweli gani? Nimewai kusikia kwamba watoto wa hizi familia wana simamia kesi mahakamani au wameshakwenda ICC concern malipo ya fedha hizo ambazo zilitumika kununulia silaha wakati wa vita vya amini.

      Hizi ndio mada ambazo zilikuwa zinasisimua JF, naombeni ziwe zinarudi mara kwa mara ili wengi tufaidike.
      If a free society cannot help the many who are poor, it cannot save the few who are rich.

    15. #34
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      Default re: Vita vya Kagera: Nini chanzo? Kulikuwa na ulazima?

      Quote By JokaKuu View Post
      Waberoya,

      ..mbona kipande ulichokileta kinatetea hoja yangu kuliko kuipinga?

      ..Amini alikuwa na haki ya kutuvamia kabla ya mwaka 72. hakuwa na haki ya kutuvamia mwaka 78.

      ..baada ya 1972 tulisaini mkataba wa amani wa Mogadishu ambapo kila upande ulielekezwa kutosaidia vikundi vya waasi.

      ..soma kitabu cha Museveni utaelewa kwamba Waganda[baada ya mkataba wa Mogadishu] walishakata tamaa ya kumuondoa Amini walikuwa wanasubiri afe tu.

      ..kipande chako kinaelekeza kwamba Amini alivamia Tanzania kufuatilia waasi wa jeshi lake waliokimbilia Tanzania. hawa walikuwa waasi waliotoka Uganda kumbilia Tanzania. hawakuwa kikundi kilichovamia Uganda kutokea Tanzania.

      ..kuna omission ktk article uliyoleta, ambapo inaeleza kwamba Amini aliamua kuficha uasi ktk jeshi lake na kuzua madai kwamba eneo la Kagera ni sehemu ya Uganda.

      ..huo ulikuwa ni UJINGA wa AMINI kwasababu alikuwa na haki ya ku-invoke Mogadishu accord na kuilazimisha Tanzania kumsaidia kuwa-disarm waasi wa jeshi lake waliokimbilia Tanzania.

      NB:

      ..madai kwamba JWTZ walipata ushindi kwasababu walikuwa wanasaidiwa na satellite nimeyasikia hapa JF kwa mara ya kwanza.

      ..kwa mtizamo wangu Tanzania tulishinda vita ile kwasababu jeshi la Amini tayari lilikuwa limegawanyika kutokana na uasi uliotokea.

      ..pia kulikuwa na raia kibao wa Uganda waliokuwa wanapinga utawala huo. wanajeshi wa Tanzania walikuwa wanapokelewa kama mashujaa ktk miji mingi ndani ya Uganda.

      ..nina rafiki yangu mganda amenipachika jina la utani "MKOMBOZI", akikumbuka jina WAKOMBOZI walilopewa wanajeshi wa Tanzania walipoingia Uganda.

      ..Amini alikuwa hapendwi na wananchi wake na hiyo ilisaidia kufanya kazi ya kumuondoa kuwa rahisi.
      Got u, so tunaweza kusema Nyerere alikuwwa mkorofi kwanza na Idd Amin alikuwa mkorofi baadae!

      what Nyerere did? alichukua hatua gani kuzuia hili swala ? maana OAU walikuwa against naye! any info please. I mean, je bunge lilihusika kusema JWTZ waende Kagera?
      You are not supposed to be so blind with patrotism that you cant face reality. Wrong is wrong no matter who says it. Malcom X

    16. #35
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      Hidi Idi Amin alichaguliwa kwenye uchaguzi gani kuingia madarakani uliompa uhalali wa kuwa Rais wa nchi huru?
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    17. #36
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      Quote By Waberoya View Post
      Got u, so tunaweza kusema Nyerere alikuwwa mkorofi kwanza na Idd Amin alikuwa mkorofi baadae!
      Labda tunasahau, Idi Amin aliweza vipi kuwa rais mara ya kwanza, tusije kuwa tunaruka ssehemu ya historia. Maana watu wanazungumzia Nyerere alitaka kumrudisha Obote lakini hawatuambii kwa misingi gani au Obote alikuwa na haki gani ya kurudishwa madarakani.

      what Nyerere did? alichukua hatua gani kuzuia hili swala ? maana OAU walikuwa against naye! any info please. I mean, je bunge lilihusika kusema JWTZ waende Kagera?
      Sijui kama umepata nafasi ya kusoma hotuba ile ya kutangaza vita. Watu wengi wanakumbuka maneno ya "nia tunayo" lakini hawakumbuki sababu zilizotolewa.
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    18. #37
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      Quote By Mzee Mbegu View Post
      Sehemu ya speech ya Mwalimu ipo katika mkanda huu: YouTube - Vita vya Kagera (Kagera War) - Part 1 of 4
      Mzee Mbegu nashukuru sana kwa kuleta hili kwa sababu nadhani tunaanza kupata revisionist wa historia yetu.
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    19. #38
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      Quote By Mzee Mwanakijiji View Post
      Labda tunasahau, Idi Amin aliweza vipi kuwa rais mara ya kwanza, tusije kuwa tunaruka ssehemu ya historia. Maana watu wanazungumzia Nyerere alitaka kumrudisha Obote lakini hawatuambii kwa misingi gani au Obote alikuwa na haki gani ya kurudishwa madarakani.

      Sijui kama umepata nafasi ya kusoma hotuba ile ya kutangaza vita. Watu wengi wanakumbuka maneno ya "nia tunayo" lakini hawakumbuki sababu zilizotolewa.
      Mwanakijiji, vita vya Kagera vimetokea wengine wetu tukiwa tu ni watu wazima lakini kuna mambo yanaongelewa humu hata sijui wanaoyasema wana lengo gani. Baada ya Idi Amin kuvamia ardhi yetu hatukukurupuka tu tukaanza kupambana naye. Kuna kipindi Mwalimu aliyaomba siyo tu mataifa ya nje, umoja wa mataifa hadi umoja wa nchi za kiafrika kulaani uvamizi huo lakini ni kama vile kuna mataifa yalifurahia kitendo cha Amin. Tukumbuke kuwa wakati huo Mwalimu alikuwa kama adui wa mataifa ya magharibi kwani alikuwa kikwazo sana kwa maslahi yao sehemu hii ya Afrika.

      Pia wanaojaribu kuingiza Udini ni lazima wafahamu kuwa katika kipindi hicho Mwalimu alikuwa mstari wa mbele kuwatetea Wapalestina katika harakati zao dhidi ya Israel. Ni sababu hiyo iliyopelekea Tanzania kuvunja mahusiano ya kibalozi na Israel na Mwalimu alikuwa rafiki mkubwa wa Gadafi wa Libya. Tendo la Gadafi na Wapalestina kutuma majeshi kuja kumsaidia Idi Amin dhidi ya Tanzania lilimshtua sana na kumhuzunisha Mwalimu.

      Mwalimu hakupenda mapinduzi ya kijeshi na ndiyo sababu kubwa sana ya kukataa kumtambua Idi Amin toka mwanzo kabisa na hili hakulificha hata siku moja. Nawashauri wenye nia ya kweli ya kutaka kujua historia ya vita vya Kagera waachane na malimbukeni wanaojitokeza kujaribu kupindisha historia kwa sababu za wivu na ujinga. Bahati mbaya kumejitokeza watu ambao hukesha wakipanga kumkebehi Hayati Mwalimu asiyeweza kujitetea.

      Ilichukuwa kipindi cha miezi kadhaa kuwahamasisha Watanzania kuwa tayari kupambana na adui aliyevamia ardhi yetu - kumtoa nyoka pangoni na tulifanikiwa.
      The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination.
      Education is what remains after one has forgotten what one has learned in School
      -Albert Einstein.


    20. #39
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      Mag3, ndio maana mimi nashangaa na hata sitaki kuchangia sana hii kwa sababu mtu yeyote anaweza kufanya karesearch ka dakika 30 na akapata picha. Siyo kwa sababu wa Tanzania walikuwa wanamsingizia Idi Amin lakini rekodi ipo iko wazi. Watu wanataka tuone hatia kumng'oa Idi Amin kutoka ardhi yetu. Wanataka Nyerere angeenda Kampala na kuwasiliana na Amin na kumuomba airudishe Kagera. Hawataki kusikia maneno yaliyotoka kwa kinywa chake Idi Amini mwenyewe kuwa kama kungetokea majibu toka kwa Tanzania (ya kijeshi) basi majeshi yake yangeweza kusafisha hadi "Dar-es-Salaam"!

      Hawataki kuamini hilo. Kwamba Nyerere alimuonea Idi Amin, ati Tanzania ingekaa na kuomba kina US na UK (hawa wamesahau hata vita baridi) watusaidie; ati tungekubali kuachia Kagera iwe sehemu ya Uganda (hawajui Idi Amin hadi alitangaza mkuu wa Wilaya hiyo mpya). Jamani, angalau hii historia mpya iandikwe wakati tuliokuwa hai wakati yanatukia hatupo.

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    21. #40
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      Quote By Mzee Mwanakijiji View Post
      Mag3, ndio maana mimi nashangaa na hata sitaki kuchangia sana hii kwa sababu mtu yeyote anaweza kufanya karesearch ka dakika 30 na akapata picha. Siyo kwa sababu wa Tanzania walikuwa wanamsingizia Idi Amin lakini rekodi ipo iko wazi. Watu wanataka tuone hatia kumng'oa Idi Amin kutoka ardhi yetu. Wanataka Nyerere angeenda Kampala na kuwasiliana na Amin na kumuomba airudishe Kagera. Hawataki kusikia maneno yaliyotoka kwa kinywa chake Idi Amini mwenyewe kuwa kama kungetokea majibu toka kwa Tanzania (ya kijeshi) basi majeshi yake yangeweza kusafisha hadi "Dar-es-Salaam"!

      Hawataki kuamini hilo. Kwamba Nyerere alimuonea Idi Amin, ati Tanzania ingekaa na kuomba kina US na UK (hawa wamesahau hata vita baridi) watusaidie; ati tungekubali kuachia Kagera iwe sehemu ya Uganda (hawajui Idi Amin hadi alitangaza mkuu wa Wilaya hiyo mpya). Jamani, angalau hii historia mpya iandikwe wakati tuliokuwa hai wakati yanatukia hatupo.




      Mzee Mwanakijiji!
      Ninaweza kukuchukia kwasababu zangu binafsi au hata kwa vile nina hisia kuwa wewe ndio umesababisha matatizo yangu fulani. Sasa ninapokuchukia, halafu kulia na kushoto watu wanakufagilia, nitajitahidi kuku-discredit katika yote uliyowahi kufanya. Kimsingi, nitajitahidi nigeuze hata mazuri uliyofanya yaonekane mabaya.

      Hiki ndicho kinachoendelea kuhusu Nyerere.
      Na kwa vile watu wengine wakiwa wana-conclusion zao wanataka kulazimisha ndio iwe ukweli, basi tunawaacha tu. Lakini ukweli utabaki pale pale. Ukorofi wa Amini unafahamika, nani alianzisha vita, inafahamika.

      Hivi umeishawahi kufika pale Butimba TTC, Mwanza? Mpaka leo yapo mabaki ya kombora lilotupwa na Idd amini miaka ya 70 akiwa na nia ya kuua Marais waliokuwa wanakutana pale. Alikuwa na ndoto sio tu ya kuchukua Kagera, bali eneo lote la kanda ya ziwa. Na alituchokoza. Tulikuwa hatuna njia nyingine mbali na kumtwanga tu.

      Umasikini wetu wa sasa hivi hautokani na ile vita tu ni mambo mengi ikiwa ni pamoja na utawala mbovu, na sera mbaya za kiuchumi, na ufisadi, uvivu, kudhibitiwa kwenye masoko ya kimataifa, ubinafsi n.k. Kuna likelihood kubwa tu kuwa hata tusingepigana vita (ambapo ardhi yetu ingeenda uganda) bado tungeendelea tu kuwa masikini kama tulivyo.
      Ngongo likes this.

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