Poor people are more taxed

Generally poor people are more taxed.
The tax systems contribute directly to peoples' poor conditions.
When basic human needs like foods, fuel and soft drinks are taxed,
the effect go directly to the poor class.
How can poor people be rescued from these killing taxes?

[Exaud J. Makyao]

	Quote:	Lole Gwakisa
	Mkuu Exaud Makyao, ungepost hii thread kwa kiswahili ungeeleweka zaidi. Ilivo andikwa haileweki-POOR PEOPLE ARE MORE TAX! maana yake nini hasa! Umefikiri kwa kiswahili na umeandika a direct translation kwa kiingereza! watch your language.

LOLE,
Nadhani umekosa mawazo au wewe ni mpenzi sana wa kiswahili..
Kama ungekuwa na wazo la kuchangia ungegundua kwamba kichwa cha habari hii kinajitosheleza badala ya kujishika na kosa la maandishi.
Nilipaswa kuandika POOR PEOPLE ARE MORE TAXED, kama kichwa kinavyosema.
Ehe, nini mawazo yako sasa?

[Next Level]

[QUOTE=Jafar;369153]Next Level:
Tatizo langu kubwa ni kwamba wafanyabiashara/matajiri wanalipa kodi baada ya kupata faida baada ya kutoa gharama za uendeshaji. Hivyo basi mambo yao yooote ya matumizi au gharama zao za maisha (kibiashara) pia ni gharama za biashara.

Kuna concept ya kibiashara inaitwa ''separate legal entity'' kwamba mmiliki wa biashara fulani huwa ni tofauti na biashara yenyewe, biashara inakuwa mtu kivyake kisheria! Kwa maana hiyo, hao wamiliki wa hizo biashara kama wanajilipa mishahara, nasi nao wanapaswa kuilipia kodi i.e PAYE, kama wanajilipa directors fees /management fees wanatakiwa walipie kodi ya biashara as individuals na wafile return za directors TRA na BRELA, kama wanapata gawio(dividend) at end of the year, basi hiyo nayo hupigwa kodi ya zuio ya kati ya 5 to 15%, na kwa vyovyote kama ni wamiliki wa biashara/ company watalipa kodi ya mashirika (corporate tax) at 30% of taxable profits, pia kuna kodi kama za SDL (Skills Development Levy) ambayo huilipa at 6% ya Gross salaries, achilia mbali contributions to Security Funds na Municipal/Council/Village Levies etc

Lakini huyu mnyonge/mfanyakazi anapolipa PAYE etc hawamuulizi matumizi yake ni kiasi gani ili wakate kile kinachobakia, huwa anakatwa kodi hata kabla hajashika hiyo hela. Kwa maana hiyo maskini ndio wanaolipa kodi kubwa (relatively to their incomes).[/QUOTE].

Tena unapozungumzia PAYE, kwanza kirefu chake ni PAY AS YOU EARN which means kadiri unavyopata zaidi ndivyo unatakiwa kulipa zaidi na viceversa is true, so hoja yako utaona hapa haihold water, kwasababu inakuwa ni kinyume....higher income earners pay more tax compared to low income earners!

[Kiranga]

When you say more, you have to define what do you mean, do you mean more as a percentage of their total income or more in terms of the absolute amount of money.

Comparing the amount of money two people pay as taxes, with one having an annual income of $ 500 and another $ 500, 000,000 would be ridiculous. A more meaningful way would be to compare the percentage of income paid as taxes.

Hence the relevancy of my above post.

[Lole Gwakisa]

	Quote:	EXAUD J. MAKYAO
	LOLE, Nadhani umekosa mawazo au wewe ni mpenzi sana wa kiswahili.. Kama ungekuwa na wazo la kuchangia ungegundua kwamba kichwa cha habari hii kinajitosheleza badala ya kujishika na kosa la maandishi. Nilipaswa kuandika POOR PEOPLE ARE MORE TAXED, kama kichwa kinavyosema. Ehe, nini mawazo yako sasa?

Sawa kabisa Mzee Exaud Makyao,Mimi si mpenzi tu wa kiswahili sanifu lakini vilevile kiingereza fasaha.
Correct self expression is halfway to getting your message across!
Turudi kwenye mada.
Mtu masikini, anayetegemea kila kitu dukani ndiye mlipakodi mkuu nchini.
Kodi zode zinakuwa zime pandikizwa kwenye bidhaa hizo.
Mfanya biashara ana leeway katika kodi.Administration ya kodi ina mbinu nyingi na mfanya biashara anuwezo wa kukwepa kodi myingine.
Mfanya kazi hawezi kuingia katika kundi masikini kabisa kutokana na ukweli kuwa yeye vile vile anauwezo wa kukwepa kodi kwa kuto lipia kodi allowances nyingine anazopewa.

[Next Level]

	Quote:	Lole Gwakisa
	Sawa kabisa Mzee Exaud Makyao,Mimi si mpenzi tu wa kiswahili sanifu lakini vilevile kiingereza fasaha. Correct self expression is halfway to getting your message across! Turudi kwenye mada. Mtu masikini, anayetegemea kila kitu dukani ndiye mlipakodi mkuu nchini. Kodi zode zinakuwa zime pandikizwa kwenye bidhaa hizo. Mfanya biashara ana leeway katika kodi.Administration ya kodi ina mbinu nyingi na mfanya biashara anuwezo wa kukwepa kodi myingine.Mfanya kazi hawezi kuingia katika kundi masikini kabisa kutokana na ukweli kuwa yeye vile vile anauwezo wa kukwepa kodi kwa kuto lipia kodi allowances nyingine anazopewa.

Unamaanisha nini unaposema ...ana leeway ktk kodi? Halafu sina uhakika kama mtoa thread hii alikuwa anazungumzia wafanyabiashara kukwepa kodi kama sababu mojawapo ya kulipa kidogo....nafikiri assumption hapa ni kuwa ikiwa kila moja (businessman or tajiri na masikini /fukara)anafuata sheria za kodi, nani analipa zaidi?

[Orkesumet]

What makyao says does hold water coz the issue here it is not the amount of money corporates remit to the TRA from their taxable incomes. It is all on the proportion of tax deducted to the taxable income. Consider an employee who earns say Shs 5m pm and a well established business entity. The PAYE deducted from this employee on a monthly basis will be 28% whereas the business entity corporate tax will be subject to a number of factors - which influence the bottom figure - taxable profit. and in some cases may result to losses and for that case no tax payable to the TRA. From the a simple scenario you may see that middle class suffer most %wise than the established entities. And according to world bank reports employee taxes from our economy is over 30%. Still not conviced?

[Next Level]

	Quote:	Orkesumet
	What makyao says does hold water coz the issue here it is not the amount of money corporates remit to the TRA from their taxable incomes. It is all on the proportion of tax deducted to the taxable income. Consider an employee who earns say Shs 5m pm and a well established business entity. The PAYE deducted from this employee on a monthly basis will be 28% whereas the business entity corporate tax will be subject to a number of factors - which influence the bottom figure - taxable profit. and in some cases may result to losses and for that case no tax payable to the TRA. From the a simple scenario you may see that middle class suffer most %wise than the established entities. And according to world bank reports employee taxes from our economy is over 30%. Still not conviced?

Employee getting 5m pm will pay 1.254mil as PAYE which is 25% of the total income! Well establishe business will pay 30% of their taxable profits! Mind you there a lot of business risks that are born by companies, wht is the risk the employee bear here?
After all I thought we are comparing, the rich and the poor as opposed to Company vs poor people!

My argument will still be, if all persons (natural & legal) are to follow the taxation laws, high income earners are more payers of tax than low income earners!

[Orkesumet]

High income earners pay higher taxes.. in principle yes! but in world of ours where there are no better ways of tracking people, where people can easily defraud the TRA and stow away unpunished...are you staying in a rented house? have you asked yourself how much taxes - withholding taxes not collected from the landlords?...No wonder, the government focus on places where they can easily fetch kodi without sweat and it is through PAYE, the middle class! How many businesses running in the streets are without registration, proper books of records or not filing returns? Is this tax avoidance or evasion? Either way the truth remain, as far as TZ is concerned the wrath of tax regime fall heavily on middle class as opposed to the higher income earners (ie legal entities).

[Next Level]

	Quote:	Orkesumet
	High income earners pay higher taxes.. in principle yes! but in world of ours where there are no better ways of tracking people, where people can easily defraud the TRA and stow away unpunished...are you staying in a rented house? have you asked yourself how much taxes - withholding taxes not collected from the landlords?...No wonder, the government focus on places where they can easily fetch kodi without sweat and it is through PAYE, the middle class! How many businesses running in the streets are without registration, proper books of records or not filing returns? Is this tax avoidance or evasion? Either way the truth remain, as far as TZ is concerned the wrath of tax regime fall heavily on middle class as opposed to the higher income earners (ie legal entities).

I said in my statement ''My argument will still be, if all persons (natural & legal) are to follow the taxation laws, high income earners are more payers of tax than low income earners!'', ur correct on the fact that, the tax base in TZ is not wider enough to catch all fishes (small&bigger), there is a lot of income that goes untaxed because of inefficincies in administration of the available taxation laws!

All my arguments here, have the assumption that, we have efficient taxation systems and administration, there is no tax evasion, there is a wider tax base etc.

You are talking about middle class...I am not sure, if the thread starter was referring them as ''poor people'', I thought he was referring to unskilled labourer, wage earners, subsistance farmers who we say they live below a dollar per day.......!

If you want to compare employees vs business persons (informal ones), I would agreed 100% with you that, we employees suffer a lot cause every thing we get is taxed, while people working in the informal sector, if they pay tax is just a mere estimate, most of them don't pay! For your information, by 2006 the Registered Tax payers in Tanzania (excluding employees) were just 250,000! The rest of businesses you know, just envading tax!

So the point here is to assume all factors are constant (ceteris paribus), then rich people pay higher tax than poorer ones!

Cheers

[Lole Gwakisa]

	Quote:	Next Level
	Unamaanisha nini unaposema ...ana leeway ktk kodi? Halafu sina uhakika kama mtoa thread hii alikuwa anazungumzia wafanyabiashara kukwepa kodi kama sababu mojawapo ya kulipa kidogo....nafikiri assumption hapa ni kuwa ikiwa kila moja (businessman or tajiri na masikini /fukara)anafuata sheria za kodi, nani analipa zaidi?

Nafikiri ,nasema nafikiri, mtoa hoja alikuwa akimfananisha mtu masikini kwa maana ya mtu mwenye kipato kidogo kulinganisha na makundi mengine katika jamii.
Mtu wa aina hii atakuwa mkulima mdogo kabisa(subsistence peasant), na katika kundi hili wanaingia zaidi ya waTanzania 95%
Suala la kodi kwa kweli ni subjective from ones point of view.Mtu mdogo,masikini analipa kodi zote kutokana na kuwa yeye ni end user.Kwa kulinganisha tu mfanya biashara ana njia nyingi sana za si tu kutolipa kodi shihi lakini hata kuikwepa kabisa, kibiashara.